Lonzo Ball

[Chuck Everett]

Ball's gifts are in his ability to hopefully run a prolific offense. Let's say he has the ability to be a bigger version of Steve Nash do not simply dwell on the MVP years, because those are sort of anomaly years) with defensive ability. Well, Steve Nash, knowing what we know now, probably goes top 5 in any draft in the last 25 years.

Hard to compare folks with Nash, he had truly genius-level coordination--he was able to command his body to do incredibly difficult things with pinpoint accuracy (shooting and passing). I've never seen any bball player with his level of coordination and command (maybe Curry's closest), and nothing about Ball suggests that to me. Still seems more like a guy with solid vision and motor who right now is killing guys who are relatively small--lack of quicks, strength, and half-court game hasn't mattered yet.

We got the rest of the season to see if he's gone something like Nash's skill level/command. As a Sixers fan I'd love it if he did, just not seeing it yet.

This is true, but which Nash are you talking about, the Phoenix Nash or the Mavs Nash, because he didn't show any of that in Dallas (at least to a HOF degree). In D'Antoni's offense he was a monster. Lonzo doesn't have to be Nash or Kidd, he's bigger than both. And we're never going to see if Ball has that Nash like ability until he's in the NBA anyway. Cause like I said, Nash didn't show that until he got with D'Antoni in Phoenix.

[Kolkmania]

2 3s a game = 6 points + 4 easy 2s = 8 points + 1 tough bucket = 2 points + 4 freethrows a game = 17-18 points. Doesn't sound hard to think when broken down like that. Remember Jason Kidd was able to score more with less scoring abilities. Truth is when you can pass like they do you'll find scoring opportunities. Rubio can't shoot or finish like Ball and he scored 13 points per 36 last year.

I don't think playmaking like his can be overlooked. These PGs are going to be crazy though. People are sleeping on Dennis too. His team is bad but he's showing some amazing talent coming off a major injury.

Kinda scary that Dennis has gotten lost in the shuffle a bit. He still should be the first PG off the board if a team needs a franchise PG (pun intended). I'm ignoring all numbers with Dennis this year. I know what he brings to the table. I just wanted to see him to finish the season healthy. His injury takes a full two years before he's one hundred percent meaning he'll be entering the draft at full strength and that's when it's scary for the league because he looks good now.

See that dunk he made yesterday to end the game? He's healthy. Only issue I see is he's 25% on his jumpers. Still his comparison was Rose, Franchise (who could shoot at an average levels), and Westbrook so what you really want to see is his explosiveness and its there. .512 freethrow rate and 8 FTA a game.

That dunk doesn't show he's healthy. Running in a straight line and dunk is completely different than twisting and turning close corners coming back from an ACL injury. Defensively I've been a little disappointed in Smith's effort and ability to fight through screens. Didn't watch the game against Tennessee State, but I can imagine that their little break helped him to regain some energy, mentally and physically. Potential wise I absolutely love Dennis Smith jr, his game translates perfectly to the NBA. Which brings us to Lonzo.

The sum you're making is quite ridiculous in my opinion haha. If you state it like that, every NBA starter would average 18 points. Lonzo Ball is averaging 3.4 FTA per game in 34 MPG, while converting 66.7%. Maintaining that percentage he would need 6 FTA per game to make 4 points per game from the line. Let's say that Ball will shoot three pointers at a NBA average clip, making 2 three pointers per game would result in almost 6 three point attempts. That's a lot and I don't expect him to make 35% in the NBA if he doesn't drive to the rim.

I'm not saying that he can't average 18 points per game, but it's a lot harder than you make it sound. Jason Kidd averaged 12.6 points per game with a career high of 18.7, so Kidd wasn't able to score more consistently.

[madmaxmedia]

For now, I think he is or will prove out to be a great college PG and a high lottery pick. What happens after that is too hard to project, considering we are still largely projecting his college 'career'. When I compare him to Jason Kidd in terms of on-court vision and awareness, I am still largely thinking in terms of a college PG. A great college PG may be an average NBA PG, or could be a great NBA PG and ultimately reach an even higher ceiling later in the NBA (like Nash.)

We may not get a great sense of his pro potential until Pac-10 and NCAA tournaments, when we'll see how he does in a run of important/competitive games.

[Supreme-]

did someone just compare him to a poormans rajon rondo?? LOL

he has steph curry range, can play defense, B+ athleticism, and his bb iq is off the charts.

yes, his numbers didnt look great against kentucky, but he outplayed fox down the stretch. huge steal followed by a dagger three.

havent seen him really attack the basket, but i have no qualms that he will be able to at the next level

[Ruzious]

did someone just compare him to a poormans rajon rondo?? LOL

he has steph curry range, can play defense, B+ athleticism, and his bb iq is off the charts.

yes, his numbers didnt look great against kentucky, but he outplayed fox down the stretch. huge steal followed by a dagger three.

havent seen him really attack the basket, but i have no qualms that he will be able to at the next level

So you're saying we shouldn't lowball Lo Ball?

He's doing much better with the 3 ball than I thought he would, but I wouldn't say his range is comparable to Steph Curry's.

[lilojmayo]

Future NBA #1 Pick this upcoming draft. The Next Jason Kidd

[E-Balla]

One major thing I have noticed about Ball is the offense doesn't play to his strengths much. How often do you see them run the PNR? Not much. Its mostly dribble handoffs. I think his biggest stretch will come late season when defenses crack down on them and they're forced to run more PNRs because he's the perfect player to run them.

[EMG518]

Starting to think he may wind up going #1.

[Supreme-]

did someone just compare him to a poormans rajon rondo?? LOL

he has steph curry range, can play defense, B+ athleticism, and his bb iq is off the charts.

yes, his numbers didnt look great against kentucky, but he outplayed fox down the stretch. huge steal followed by a dagger three.

havent seen him really attack the basket, but i have no qualms that he will be able to at the next level

So you're saying we shouldn't lowball Lo Ball?

He's doing much better with the 3 ball than I thought he would, but I wouldn't say his range is comparable to Steph Curry's.

why not?

Watch on YouTube

[Marcus]

Starting to think he may wind up going #1.

the hype is real enough for that to happen but i think there are too many kids this year that can make the claim for the top spot for it to just stay that way throughout.

[Upperclass]

Balls shot is a lot like Kevin Martin's.. looks like he'll be just fine. Kid definitely is looking like #1 or 2 with DSJ sliding down to 3

[Mulhollanddrive]

I think Dallas is in the box seat, they've had Nash, Kidd, Rondo, Williams as high IQ PGs under their current management.

And you know Cuban loves a winner, Ball has won every game in the past 18 months IIRC.

I don't see Philadelphia, Phoenix, Boston taking him though, different drafting model and positional fit.

[No-Man]

Starting to think he may wind up going #1.

There is literally no way he goes ahead of Fultz.

[Kolkmania]

One major thing I have noticed about Ball is the offense doesn't play to his strengths much. How often do you see them run the PNR? Not much. Its mostly dribble handoffs. I think his biggest stretch will come late season when defenses crack down on them and they're forced to run more PNRs because he's the perfect player to run them.

Why do you think that more P&R's will benefit Ball? The few occasions I've seen him do it he nearly lost his handle and his lack of a pull-up jumper makes him easier to defend. Don't think that UCLA will change their playstyle this season, they will continue to outrun their opponents and use off-ball screens to score in the half court.

[Kolkmania]

did someone just compare him to a poormans rajon rondo?? LOL

he has steph curry range, can play defense, B+ athleticism, and his bb iq is off the charts.

yes, his numbers didnt look great against kentucky, but he outplayed fox down the stretch. huge steal followed by a dagger three.

havent seen him really attack the basket, but i have no qualms that he will be able to at the next level

So we should ignore the entire game and state that Ball outplayed Fox down the stretch because Malik Monk threw a ball at his leg and he hit a three? I'm not saying that De'Aaron Fox is better than Lonzo Ball, but Hamilton and Leaf won that game for UCLA.

[E-Balla]

One major thing I have noticed about Ball is the offense doesn't play to his strengths much. How often do you see them run the PNR? Not much. Its mostly dribble handoffs. I think his biggest stretch will come late season when defenses crack down on them and they're forced to run more PNRs because he's the perfect player to run them.

Why do you think that more P&R's will benefit Ball? The few occasions I've seen him do it he nearly lost his handle and his lack of a pull-up jumper makes him easier to defend. Don't think that UCLA will change their playstyle this season, they will continue to outrun their opponents and use off-ball screens to score in the half court.

Lack of a pull up jumper? Maybe from midrange but he's money from deep. And I think the PNR will benefit him because his biggest positive is the angles he sees on his passes. Here's the closest I can find to stats about his PNR possessions:

Paired with Leaf, UCLA can either pick and pop (50 percent on 18 attempts), or let Leaf roll to the rim (1.18 points per roll, according to Synergy Sports).

I'm not sure exactly what his overall numbers are but it fit what I've seen - mainly that the Ball-Leaf PNR is nasty even though it's not ran often.

[Marcus]

did someone just compare him to a poormans rajon rondo?? LOL

he has steph curry range, can play defense, B+ athleticism, and his bb iq is off the charts.

yes, his numbers didnt look great against kentucky, but he outplayed fox down the stretch. huge steal followed by a dagger three.

havent seen him really attack the basket, but i have no qualms that he will be able to at the next level

So we should ignore the entire game and state that Ball outplayed Fox down the stretch because Malik Monk threw a ball at his leg and he hit a three? I'm not saying that De'Aaron Fox is better than Lonzo Ball, but Hamilton and Leaf won that game for UCLA.

Bad first half, forced a few shots, missed some that he normally hits, didn't attack the bigs on the switch like he maybe should have, shown up by Fox on a couple of plays.

Turned the tables in the second half as Fox was basically absent, took himself off the ball, forced Briscoe into 3 turnovers, hit a big bucket down the stretch.

No credit for adjusting and not caving under the pressure after a bad first half on the road at Rupp?

Hamilton in the first. Holiday and Leaf in the second but with his shot not going Lonzo did other things to help his team throughout. It's not like he played himself out of the game.

[E-Balla]

did someone just compare him to a poormans rajon rondo?? LOL

he has steph curry range, can play defense, B+ athleticism, and his bb iq is off the charts.

yes, his numbers didnt look great against kentucky, but he outplayed fox down the stretch. huge steal followed by a dagger three.

havent seen him really attack the basket, but i have no qualms that he will be able to at the next level

So we should ignore the entire game and state that Ball outplayed Fox down the stretch because Malik Monk threw a ball at his leg and he hit a three? I'm not saying that De'Aaron Fox is better than Lonzo Ball, but Hamilton and Leaf won that game for UCLA.

No one will deny he started out bad. 0-4 with 2 assists and 5 turnovers is ugly. But what you want to see is if he can adjust and his numbers the rest of the way (5-8 with 5 assists and 1 turnover) were pretty damn good. These are prospects we're trying to see improvement or if they can adjust to playing a level of opponent they never saw before.

[Chi town]

Starting to think he may wind up going #1.

There is literally no way he goes ahead of Fultz.

I would agree with that unless Cuban is drafting for the Mavs. I could see him wanting his future Kidd.

I think Lonzo will be #2 behind Fultz if Mavs don't get the top pick though.

[Chi town]

His D will be a + in the pros. Versatile too.

His 3 ball is better than expected and whoever said Kevin Martin is spot on.... ugly but effective.