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Mavericks 2017 Draft #9

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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#81 » by Jinra » Tue Dec 13, 2016 5:07 pm

2011Champs wrote:
Jinra wrote:
I feel the same way about Curry. Nothing special right now. He has the pedigree, but cannot maximize the potential.

I have already stated that everyone on this roster, except Harrison Barnes, is available for trade talk.

If a team made an offer too good to refuse I'd trade Barnes. He isn't on prime Dirk level.


I guess you right. But 22ppg\8rpg+A-defense is hella-close to untouchable for me.

PS- Then again, if somebody offered too-good-to-refuse offer for Dirk, he would be packing right now. Still love you Dirk, but... ah...
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#82 » by Dirk » Wed Dec 14, 2016 1:54 pm

2011Champs wrote:
Jinra wrote:
I feel the same way about Curry. Nothing special right now. He has the pedigree, but cannot maximize the potential.

I have already stated that everyone on this roster, except Harrison Barnes, is available for trade talk.

If a team made an offer too good to refuse I'd trade Barnes. He isn't on prime Dirk level.


No way you trade Barnes. The Mavs became a laughing stock for missing out on their top free agents.

With the help of Durant, Barnes falls on their lap (although he did have other options, but he wanted to come to Dallas). And now they'd go around and trade him?

Yes, Barnes is not on "prime Dirk level". Look around the league and tell me... who is? Dirk is one of the best players of all time. Franchises will go decades without having a Dirk. If we hold Barnes (or any other player) to that standard, we'll likely always be really really disappointed.

With that said, while Barnes has looked good, he has ways to go as a player, he has to work with the goal of being compared with Hayward, George... Kawhi. At the moment he is probably just below Rudy Gay's level.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#83 » by Hadley » Thu Dec 15, 2016 1:48 am

Everyone is tradeable for the right offer. Its harrison barnes we are talking about, not Towns or LeBron :p
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#84 » by 2011Champs » Fri Dec 16, 2016 2:25 pm

Hypothetical example: Anthony Davis demands a trade away from the Pelicans, Dallas would be stupid not to at least offer Barnes + 1st round pick for him.
Barnes is good but far from untouchable in certain scenarios. The scenarios are almost completely unlikely to happen, but there would be a list of players that would be crazy to pass up if they became available and Barnes was the price.
We already have Finney Smith that can play the exact same position and role as Barnes but with less scoring should that unlikely situation ever happen.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#85 » by JamesConway » Fri Dec 16, 2016 8:33 pm

The FIBA U18-European Championship started today in Turkey with a bunch of projected first round picks playing it including Isiaiah Hartenstein and Kostja Mushidi from GER and Frank Ntilikina from France. The games can be watched on the FIBA-yt channel (live or later on).

I just finished watchin the GER vs FIN-game: GER ran them off the court, with Mushidi and Hartenstein even throwing down a bunch of alley oops and converting threes to run up the score even more in the 4th. Mushidi looked great, scored very efficient 18 points (7/10 FGs, 3/4 from three) in 21 minutes, shot the ball well from the outside, made some fancy passes (6 assists) & rarely played out of himself. On a few occasions he went 1-on-1 too much late in the shotclock and got himself into trouble (4 TOs), although those were situations where they mostly just dumped the ball to him after the play had broken down. He can create some, I think, but it's not like he's crazy good in that department so I'm not surprised to see him struggle there a bit. Overall he looked like the best player on the court to me though. Hartenstein struggled a bit at the beginning, but ultimately had a good performance as well putting up 9 points (3/5 FGs, 3/4 FTs), 5 rebounds, 5 assists, 4 blocks and 1 steal in 21 minutes. The passing really stood out today as he had multiple of those highlight-reel type of ones where he just whips the ball across the floor Kevin Love-style. He also had a few very bright moments in the halfcourt where he put the ball on the deck and ran some big to big-action and dumped the ball inside. I've also seen him bring up the ball on a bunch of occasions when the guards couldn't get open, he looks very good in those moment. TO-wise he had a few too many of them (3), but two where on travels in traffic iirc while he somehow he managed to get most of his passes -- even the really funky ones -- to his teammates. He didn't connect on both his three point-attempts. GER was a whooping +30 with him on the court and I think he even talked some trash to one of the finnish big men after one of his alley oop-dunks in the 4th.

I also looked into the FRA vs RUS-game for a while, bc of Ntilikina but he got into foul trouble early and therefore had to sit most of the second quarter. From what I've seen he was relatively passive on offense so I stopped watching somewhen through the third (was a tough game to watch all around, neither team ended up scoring much, lots of calls from the refs, too, little flow in the game). He had two chase down-blocks that stood out, but offensively he didn't look very impressive. Didn't really get into the paint, took a few too many contested threes and wasn't very efficient on those (1/4). Hopefully he'll be able to show more over the next days.

Both teams play again tomorrow.

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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#86 » by Lord Cuban » Fri Dec 16, 2016 8:35 pm

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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#87 » by JamesConway » Fri Dec 16, 2016 11:44 pm

YT-highligths of Hartenstein's performance today:

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Re: RE: Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#88 » by janmagn » Sat Dec 17, 2016 12:01 am

JamesConway wrote:I just finished watchin the GER vs FIN-game

Anyone from Finland impress you?

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Re: RE: Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#89 » by JamesConway » Sat Dec 17, 2016 12:12 am

janmagn wrote:Anyone from Finland impress you?

I don't know a single player of their team so Ididn't really look at them :lol: sry. I was mainly focused on the two german kids (I'm from there). The game being so one-sided also didn't help in that regard.

You're from FIN, right? You guys will be fine, you have Lauri. He'll be absolutely amazing, definetely a top 10 pick Imo. I absolutely love his game :nod:
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#90 » by janmagn » Sat Dec 17, 2016 12:15 am

JamesConway wrote:
janmagn wrote:Anyone from Finland impress you?

I don't know a single player of their team so Ididn't really look at them sry. I was mainly focused on the two german kids (I'm from there). The game being so one-sided also didn't help in that regard.

You're from FIN, right? You guys will be fine, you have Lauri. He'll be absolutely amazing, definetely a top 10 pick Imo. I absolutely love his game :nod:


Yep, right here in the cold. Lauri will be amazing, just watch. I think the Finnish NT coach said Lauri was one of the best players of the team this past summer in our friendlies. Looking forward what he can do in the NBA

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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#91 » by Instinctive » Sat Dec 17, 2016 12:40 am

Why are we so high on Fultz here, instead of Ball? I'm pulling all the available possession/assist films to really go through it, but Ball looks like the NBA guy to me.

Does Fultz really have the skillset to translate as an NBA 1? He kind of seems more like an undersized 2/wing.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#92 » by The Sparest » Sun Dec 18, 2016 3:49 am

janmagn wrote:
JamesConway wrote:
janmagn wrote:Anyone from Finland impress you?

I don't know a single player of their team so Ididn't really look at them sry. I was mainly focused on the two german kids (I'm from there). The game being so one-sided also didn't help in that regard.

You're from FIN, right? You guys will be fine, you have Lauri. He'll be absolutely amazing, definetely a top 10 pick Imo. I absolutely love his game :nod:


Yep, right here in the cold. Lauri will be amazing, just watch. I think the Finnish NT coach said Lauri was one of the best players of the team this past summer in our friendlies. Looking forward what he can do in the NBA

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My draft fantasy is for the Mavs to get Fultz or Ball, and trade back up in the draft to get Lauri as well. I know every foreign stretch 4 type of player gets compared to Dirk, but he really does remind me of a young Dirk. I think he could learn a lot from Dirk next season, and Dirk would probably enjoy passing on what he has learned over his career.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#93 » by The Sparest » Sun Dec 18, 2016 4:01 am

Instinctive wrote:Why are we so high on Fultz here, instead of Ball? I'm pulling all the available possession/assist films to really go through it, but Ball looks like the NBA guy to me.

Does Fultz really have the skillset to translate as an NBA 1? He kind of seems more like an undersized 2/wing.


Fultz isn't a traditional PG, but he does fit the mold of guys like Wade and Harden who have a score first mentality, while being quite capable of making plays for others too.

Ball is the prototypical pass first point guard, who is always looking to set up others to score. If Ball was a more consistent threat to score himself, he would be rated as high or higher than Fultz.

I like both of them, but right now Fultz looks like the more NBA ready player.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#94 » by Pointguard01 » Sun Dec 18, 2016 2:44 pm

The Sparest wrote:
Instinctive wrote:Why are we so high on Fultz here, instead of Ball? I'm pulling all the available possession/assist films to really go through it, but Ball looks like the NBA guy to me.

Does Fultz really have the skillset to translate as an NBA 1? He kind of seems more like an undersized 2/wing.


Fultz isn't a traditional PG, but he does fit the mold of guys like Wade and Harden who have a score first mentality, while being quite capable of making plays for others too.

Ball is the prototypical pass first point guard, who is always looking to set up others to score. If Ball was a more consistent threat to score himself, he would be rated as high or higher than Fultz.

I like both of them, but right now Fultz looks like the more NBA ready player.


What scares me most about Fultz is if he is a winner. I have little doubt that the guy can play and will be a 15+ PPG scorer in the NBA, but does he do the things that translate to winning basketball. Granted, I need to watch a full game of his but all the reports seem to beg this question. As much as we do need talent, I also want to build a team that can win a championship in 3-5 years. I would hate to become the Timberwolves, full of talent but still one of the worst teams in the NBA.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#95 » by Dirk » Sun Dec 18, 2016 2:55 pm

Pointguard01 wrote:What scares me most about Fultz is if he is a winner. I have little doubt that the guy can play and will be a 15+ PPG scorer in the NBA, but does he do the things that translate to winning basketball. Granted, I need to watch a full game of his but all the reports seem to beg this question. As much as we do need talent, I also want to build a team that can win a championship in 3-5 years. I would hate to become the Timberwolves, full of talent but still one of the worst teams in the NBA.


The Timberwolves were very overrated coming into this year, but they are still 'on schedule' to develop into a great team. If you look back at OKC with Durant, they also had losing years. They won 20 in his rookie year. 23 with Durant + Westbrook. And then finally 50 with Durant + Westbrook + Ibaka. I doubt their young guys are at this level, but still, it's still early to judge them - Towns is in his 2nd year.

If we're realistic, there are more chances of the Mavs being a treadmill team in 3-5 years than being a title contender - we just have to look around and see bad teams who have been bad for years despite high picks. So in that sense, I would definitely settle for "becoming the current Wolves", with hopes of course that the organization would be able to make the most of 'our Towns'.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#96 » by Pointguard01 » Sun Dec 18, 2016 9:03 pm

Dirk Nowitzki wrote:
Pointguard01 wrote:What scares me most about Fultz is if he is a winner. I have little doubt that the guy can play and will be a 15+ PPG scorer in the NBA, but does he do the things that translate to winning basketball. Granted, I need to watch a full game of his but all the reports seem to beg this question. As much as we do need talent, I also want to build a team that can win a championship in 3-5 years. I would hate to become the Timberwolves, full of talent but still one of the worst teams in the NBA.


The Timberwolves were very overrated coming into this year, but they are still 'on schedule' to develop into a great team. If you look back at OKC with Durant, they also had losing years. They won 20 in his rookie year. 23 with Durant + Westbrook. And then finally 50 with Durant + Westbrook + Ibaka. I doubt their young guys are at this level, but still, it's still early to judge them - Towns is in his 2nd year.

If we're realistic, there are more chances of the Mavs being a treadmill team in 3-5 years than being a title contender - we just have to look around and see bad teams who have been bad for years despite high picks. So in that sense, I would definitely settle for "becoming the current Wolves", with hopes of course that the organization would be able to make the most of 'our Towns'.


Right. There are many worse positions to be in than the Timberwolves (Orlando, New Jersey, etc) as far as a rebuilding team. However, we know that with Rick + Cuban, we aren't going to 5 straight top 5 picks. Dallas will add a top 5 talent this summer (fingers crossed) and then we are going to try and win again. So, my concern is that we have to hit a homerun with the pick --- where I think a team like the Timberwolves could strike out and miss, and still be on schedule to go for the homerun again next year.

Maybe that doesn't change much and comparing the situation to Minnesota is probably not the right way to look at it. But, I assume that Dallas will go after another top free agent or two next offseason, in which we are back in the middle-of-the-pack hunt (with no chance of another top 5 pick). At the end of the day, to be a good team, you need a game changer and it's hard to get that outside the top 5. We need to take full advantage of this opportunity.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#97 » by 2011Champs » Sun Dec 18, 2016 9:26 pm

The Sparest wrote:
janmagn wrote:
JamesConway wrote:I don't know a single player of their team so Ididn't really look at them sry. I was mainly focused on the two german kids (I'm from there). The game being so one-sided also didn't help in that regard.

You're from FIN, right? You guys will be fine, you have Lauri. He'll be absolutely amazing, definetely a top 10 pick Imo. I absolutely love his game :nod:


Yep, right here in the cold. Lauri will be amazing, just watch. I think the Finnish NT coach said Lauri was one of the best players of the team this past summer in our friendlies. Looking forward what he can do in the NBA

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My draft fantasy is for the Mavs to get Fultz or Ball, and trade back up in the draft to get Lauri as well. I know every foreign stretch 4 type of player gets compared to Dirk, but he really does remind me of a young Dirk. I think he could learn a lot from Dirk next season, and Dirk would probably enjoy passing on what he has learned over his career.
Exactly! This would be a tough feat to pull off but if we could find some way to get another pick and draft both Fultz or Ball and Lauri I'd be ecstatic.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#98 » by Dirk » Sun Dec 18, 2016 9:45 pm

Pointguard01 wrote:Right. There are many worse positions to be in than the Timberwolves (Orlando, New Jersey, etc) as far as a rebuilding team. However, we know that with Rick + Cuban, we aren't going to 5 straight top 5 picks. Dallas will add a top 5 talent this summer (fingers crossed) and then we are going to try and win again. So, my concern is that we have to hit a homerun with the pick --- where I think a team like the Timberwolves could strike out and miss, and still be on schedule to go for the homerun again next year.

Maybe that doesn't change much and comparing the situation to Minnesota is probably not the right way to look at it. But, I assume that Dallas will go after another top free agent or two next offseason, in which we are back in the middle-of-the-pack hunt (with no chance of another top 5 pick). At the end of the day, to be a good team, you need a game changer and it's hard to get that outside the top 5. We need to take full advantage of this opportunity.


Got it now. Thing is... in most drafts you don't come away with a superstar... even if you're drafting #1, but I see what you meant and yeah... if I had to bet... I'd bet that next year the Mavs would be trying to win games again. Of course, in that case I also think they will be retaining a couple of the 'vets' who have broken down... so we may again lose a ton of games to injury. I also think it's unlikely that the Mavs will make any significant moves in free agency - just looking at the free agents, it doesnt look like a year where you'd be able to get a "Harrison Barnes". All rfas will be matched most likely. The top UFA aren't coming here.
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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#99 » by Lord Cuban » Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:33 am

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Re: Dallas Mavericks 2017 Draft 

Post#100 » by Lord Cuban » Mon Dec 19, 2016 8:38 am

Fultz is Highly skilled...
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