Is this team really that flawed?

magickingdom · Post #1 » by **magickingdom** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 3:08 pm

I read how flawed that this team is? Really?
We can easily see how good it can be when shots are falling and how bad it can be when they are not.
That seems to be the issue to me. If the offense is working the defense is great.
If the offense is not working, then the defense seems to suffer too.
It seems that when the ball is not falling they tend to let that effect them on the defensive end.
So since we have seen how good this team can be, what's the answer?
To me at least, it seems that we just need a consistent scorer. Maybe not a superstar, but someone who can score consistently ..
Then when the offense gets bound up, the team will not start to focus on the ball not falling and can stay focused on both ends.
Because they will know that there is at least one player that can get a shot and that will open it up for all the rest of the team.
Then they can stay focused on and even pick up the defense on the other end.
Could we use better players? Sure every team could. But I don't think that this team is that flawed.
They are just one consistent player away from playing their best more of the time on both ends.

Edual · Post #2 » by **Edual** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 4:15 pm

I think we are pretty bad, watching the miami game looked to me like miami coach tried to do everything he could to lose the game ( I mean plays for winslow? dragic not looking to score in OT?) and yet we barely won.

When offense looks great.... well it tends to only look great vs bad teams, I mean if you look, most of our high scoring games/wins are vs bad teams.

magickingdom · Post #3 » by **magickingdom** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 4:23 pm

Not true. We beat some good teams on their home court and looked good doing it.

Mc-o · Post #4 » by **Mc-o** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 4:25 pm

magickingdom wrote:I read how flawed that this team is? Really?
We can easily see how good it can be when shots are falling and how bad it can be when they are not.
That seems to be the issue to me. If the offense is working the defense is great.
If the offense is not working, then the defense seems to suffer too.
It seems that when the ball is not falling they tend to let that effect them on the defensive end.
So since we have seen how good this team can be, what's the answer?
To me at least, it seems that we just need a consistent scorer. Maybe not a superstar, but someone who can score consistently ..
Then when the offense gets bound up, the team will not start to focus on the ball not falling and can stay focused on both ends.
Because they will know that there is at least one player that can get a shot and that will open it up for all the rest of the team.
Then they can stay focused on and even pick up the defense on the other end.
Could we use better players? Sure every team could. But I don't think that this team is that flawed.
They are just one consistent player away from playing their best more of the time on both ends.

We have lost while playing good defense and while scoring alot . we have good players but the players just dont fit . hence the roster is flawed. Also our fron office has been really open about trying to make a trade which tells me that they also think the roster is. Flawed

Max Power · Post #5 » by **Max Power** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 4:30 pm

This team is 14-18. It's flawed. There's no really scary shooting threat on this team, so the point about needing a scorer is spot on. We've put a lot of stock in players with limited upside over the years, Payton and Gordon are both glaring proof of this. Both can improve, but I don't see Dwight Howard Year 3 improvements from either. They're solid role players at best.

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Bergmaniac · Post #6 » by **Bergmaniac** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 5:01 pm

magickingdom wrote: If the offense is working the defense is great.

Not really, lately there have been quite a few games where the offense has been very good while the defence has been quite bad. Last night was the only game since the 4th of December where we had a defensive rating lower than 106 but in six of the games in that period we had offensive rating of over 114.

If the offense is not working, then the defense seems to suffer too.

Most of the time it's not really the case. There has been quite a few games where we struggled mightily on offense but played very good D.

Post #7 » by **Knightro** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 5:12 pm

The team desperately needs more shooting, basically everywhere.

Five of the nine guys in the rotation are poor shooters.

VFX · Post #8 » by **VFX** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 5:43 pm

No starting SF
Inconsistent play from most players.
Arguably two starting Centers with opposing skill sets.
Not enough shooters.
We are a 'defense first' built team that gives up 112 points a game.

Yeah we are flawed..

magickingdom · Post #9 » by **magickingdom** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 8:06 pm

That's what I love about this board, you guys make so much sense!

MagicFan101 · Post #10 » by **MagicFan101** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 9:48 pm

We lack a superstar in a super team league.

Simple as that.

We have fantastic pieces to surround a superstar with to immediately catapault us to the top of the league. This is opposite from the Pelicans or T-Wolves who have found their star(s) but don't have the pieces around them to win now.

But how the we find that star?

The new CBA makes it harder for stars to move around in free agency. So that route would be tough. However, most GMs agree that this draft is as good as it has been in a decade. That is good for us if we start tanking but if we lock into a guy and need to trade up it will cost us a few of these valuable pieces.

This will be a very interesting trade deadline / summer.

SHAQ32 · Post #11 » by **SHAQ32** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 10:16 pm

Of course we are

We have the guy with the most potential on our team playing out of position

Skin · Post #12 » by **Skin** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 10:22 pm

Too much youth and cap flexibility to be a flawed team. When those 2 things are maxed out and we are in the same position, then we will be flawed. But right now we are simply a young developing team in transition under a new head coach.

You guys are evaluating us as a finished product. Why?

Statlanta · Post #13 » by **Statlanta** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:20 pm

Yes, we are flawed but I agree that we aren't a finished product. We are a bad shooting team(bottom 6 in 3P%, FG%, FT%, ftR) but good at defending the rim and not fouling(top 10 in fouls committed and blocks). I think we just need to add to the asset base and improve the future potential of the team as we already have the vets in Fournier, Vucevic, Biyombo(maybe Ibaka). Nobody on the team is without reprieve including AG so the guys and the coaching staff just need to figure out how to mask each others' flaws and promote the strengths.

Mc-o · Post #14 » by **Mc-o** » Sat Dec 24, 2016 11:28 pm

Skin wrote:Too much youth and cap flexibility to be a flawed team. When those 2 things are maxed out and we are in the same position, then we will be flawed. But right now we are simply a young developing team in transition under a new head coach.

You guys are evaluating us as a finished product. Why?

I agree we have room to make some changes but we are really not that young of a team , we are middle of the league when it comes to age of our players. If we resign Ibaka to the max , we really don't have much cap flexibility outside Meeks and greens contract coming off the books. These next 2 months are critical for our team , I hope heniggan proves me wrong

EAS Law · Post #15 » by **EAS Law** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 6:13 am

We need one guy, that is even a fringe all star wing player that can draw a double and hit an open shot at a low 40% clip. That's all we need.

MagicFan32 · Post #16 » by **MagicFan32** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 6:15 am

it's very flawed, the defense has been garbage for 3 weeks and we're supposed to be good at it knowing that the offense is mediocre at best

Skin · Post #17 » by **Skin** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 7:24 am

Mc-o wrote:
Skin wrote:Too much youth and cap flexibility to be a flawed team. When those 2 things are maxed out and we are in the same position, then we will be flawed. But right now we are simply a young developing team in transition under a new head coach.

You guys are evaluating us as a finished product. Why?

I agree we have room to make some changes but we are really not that young of a team , we are middle of the league when it comes to age of our players. If we resign Ibaka to the max , we really don't have much cap flexibility outside Meeks and greens contract coming off the books. These next 2 months are critical for our team , I hope heniggan proves me wrong

This team's rebuild has always been banked on our lottery picks and long term re-signings. Our main players are all youthful. ...and we aren't really middle of the pack. We're in the top 10 of the youngest teams. ie. There's a reason we chose a 23 year old Biyombo over 30 year old Noah.

cedric76 · Post #18 » by **cedric76** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 8:09 am

Not flawed at all, I love this team. Go magic

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pepe1991 · Post #19 » by **pepe1991** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 9:24 am

magickingdom wrote:I read how flawed that this team is? Really?
We can easily see how good it can be when shots are falling and how bad it can be when they are not.
That seems to be the issue to me. If the offense is working the defense is great.
If the offense is not working, then the defense seems to suffer too.
It seems that when the ball is not falling they tend to let that effect them on the defensive end.
So since we have seen how good this team can be, what's the answer?
To me at least, it seems that we just need a consistent scorer. Maybe not a superstar, but someone who can score consistently ..
Then when the offense gets bound up, the team will not start to focus on the ball not falling and can stay focused on both ends.
Because they will know that there is at least one player that can get a shot and that will open it up for all the rest of the team.
Then they can stay focused on and even pick up the defense on the other end.
Could we use better players? Sure every team could. But I don't think that this team is that flawed.
They are just one consistent player away from playing their best more of the time on both ends.

We can easily see how good it can be when shots are falling and how bad it can be when they are not.

Nets and 76ers also tend to look good when their shots are going into a hoop. That's how basketball works.

It seems that when the ball is not falling they tend to let that effect them on the defensive end.

This is definition of bad team. When they don't have results they don't trust process and follow coach game plan. Good teams stick to game plan no matter are they down by 30 or up by 40.

To me at least, it seems that we just need a consistent scorer. Maybe not a superstar, but someone who can score consistently

Who? Rudy Gay? Monta Elise? Most of guys who are "flat out scorers" and not allstars are onedimensional shotjackers that shoot you out of more games than they help you win. That's why every single Rudy Gay team got better once he left. That's why Monta never was able to translate his fat ppg into over .500 teams.

By offensive and defensive metrics, this team is bottom 10 in both categories. They are awful defensive team that , if pace of other team is faster, will score, just not in effective way. Literally they play however opponents wants them to play. They play slow grit and grind style against teams like Utah and Memphis, fast against teams like Blazers or Warriors. Because they don't have talent level high enough to make teams play in their own pace ( and not having clear idea what and who they are also hurts ).

Post #20 » by **Bensational** » Sun Dec 25, 2016 10:27 am

pepe1991 wrote:Who? Rudy Gay? Monta Elise? Most of guys who are "flat out scorers" and not allstars are onedimensional shotjackers that shoot you out of more games than they help you win. That's why every single Rudy Gay team got better once he left. That's why Monta never was able to translate his fat ppg into over .500 teams.

By offensive and defensive metrics, this team is bottom 10 in both categories. They are awful defensive team that , if pace of other team is faster, will score, just not in effective way. Literally they play however opponents wants them to play. They play slow grit and grind style against teams like Utah and Memphis, fast against teams like Blazers or Warriors. Because they don't have talent level high enough to make teams play in their own pace ( and not having clear idea what and who they are also hurts ).

I agree with your first point about bad offensive players. I think Gay is possibly having an efficient enough season that he'd be like Green on steroids. He wouldn't shoot you out of a game, but he probably won't carry you through one, either.

But I think your second point is a really interesting observation. I hadn't thought of that before. Good thinking.