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Butler trade rumor - KC Johnson update: pg 63

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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#941 » by chrispatrick » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:10 pm

Chitownbulls wrote:If you trade Jimmy to LA for Julius Randle DAngelo Russell and Brandon Ingram the Bulls did a great job. I would do the Boston trade as well....Jimmy for Chowder an the top 2 picks


Problem with the lakers pu pu platter of players is none of these guys (barring Ingram as a longshot) are going to outperform their 2nd contracts. I think that's a terrible deal for the Bulls because by the time they're on their 2nd contracts they are commanding big money and none of them appear to be true difference makers.

The mystery of the Nets picks is far more appealing because it offers at least the chance that you get a player good enough to be a star you can build around.
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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#942 » by Bomba Navarro » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:11 pm

Jimako10 wrote:
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Seems like a lot of teams are deciding whether to be buyers or seller at this point. Wonder what Gar is doing right now.......

He's probably checking everybody's background to see if anybody has a New Mexico or Iowa connection.
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Re: RE: Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#943 » by JordansBulls » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:12 pm

Ctownbulls wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:Think of it this way. Reggie Miller was the best player on the Pacers for over a decade. They never traded him. How is Jimmy much different then him as a star? Same for Paul Pierce or Vince Carter. Jimmy is that level of player.

Name me one team that had a Vince Carter/Reggie Miller level player that traded that player and turned those assets into a championship caliber team.

None that is why you keep them. Pierce eventually got a KG on his team but had they traded him they never would have for awhile gottena star.
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Re: RE: Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#944 » by Jimako10 » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:16 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
Ctownbulls wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:Think of it this way. Reggie Miller was the best player on the Pacers for over a decade. They never traded him. How is Jimmy much different then him as a star? Same for Paul Pierce or Vince Carter. Jimmy is that level of player.

Name me one team that had a Vince Carter/Reggie Miller level player that traded that player and turned those assets into a championship caliber team.

None that is why you keep them. Pierce eventually got a KG on his team but had they traded him they never would have for awhile gottena star.


But Boston tanked the year before they traded for KG, and KG never wanted to go to Boston. It was only when Boston traded their #5 pick to Seattle/OKC for Ray Allen that enticed KG to come (because he only had 1 year left on his contract and stated he would not resign with Boston before the Allen trade).
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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#945 » by NecessaryEvil » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:16 pm

MrSparkle wrote:Taj/Niko/Rondo/Sac 1st/Chi 1st to DEN for Gallo, Chandler and Faried.

Ziiing


I wish.
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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#946 » by NecessaryEvil » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:18 pm

biggestbullsfan wrote:
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I doubt they would shop him thru the season. But of course you listen to any potential deal. He isnt untouchable. Only about 5 of those around the league. Bron, Curry, KD, Westbrook, Harden. I think anyone else could be had for a price.


Add kristaps, giannnis and the brow to that list. Embiid too.
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Re: RE: Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#947 » by the ultimates » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:27 pm

Jimako10 wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:
Ctownbulls wrote:Name me one team that had a Vince Carter/Reggie Miller level player that traded that player and turned those assets into a championship caliber team.

None that is why you keep them. Pierce eventually got a KG on his team but had they traded him they never would have for awhile gottena star.


But Boston tanked the year before they traded for KG, and KG never wanted to go to Boston. It was only when Boston traded their #5 pick to Seattle/OKC for Ray Allen that enticed KG to come (because he only had 1 year left on his contract and stated he would not resign with Boston before the Allen trade).


I don't think they tanked they were just bad. They had two straight years of missing the playoffs winning only 33 and 24 games. That was after making the playoffs four straight seasons including a 45 win season in Doc Rivers first year.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/BOS/
Losing to get high draft picks and hoping they turn into franchise players is not some next level, genius move. That's what teams want to happen in any rebuild/tank or whatever you want to market it as.
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Re: RE: Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#948 » by Rerisen » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:50 pm

Stratmaster wrote:We need more movement from McD and Niko.


I think we need them to start passing and playmaking once in a while. And its not that they never get the ball to do it, their shot attempts are in line with a Korver or Dunleavy, they just aren't good passers/creators.
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Re: RE: Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#949 » by Leslie Forman » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:50 pm

Ctownbulls wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:Think of it this way. Reggie Miller was the best player on the Pacers for over a decade. They never traded him. How is Jimmy much different then him as a star? Same for Paul Pierce or Vince Carter. Jimmy is that level of player.

Name me one team that had a Vince Carter/Reggie Miller level player that traded that player and turned those assets into a championship caliber team.

Well…Detroit got Ben Wallace for Grant Hill and then built their entire defense around him.

But I don't see why any of this matters. There is no set plan on how to build a team. The West/Wilt Lakers weren't built like the Kobe/Shaq Lakers, who weren't built like the Kobe/Gasol Lakers, which weren't built like the Magic/Worthy Lakers, which weren't built like the Magic/Kareem Lakers…
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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#950 » by RakimAbdulJabar » Sat Jan 7, 2017 6:55 pm

NecessaryEvil wrote:
MrSparkle wrote:Taj/Niko/Rondo/Sac 1st/Chi 1st to DEN for Gallo, Chandler and Faried.

Ziiing


I wish.



That's way too much to give up for those guys and I'm a fan of both Chandler and Faried

I'd offer Rondo, Lopez and McDermott a future 1st and next years 2nd round pick for Chandler, Nelson and Faried

In the current NBA I'm fine with someone like Taj playing C and having Felicio back him up

Gibson/Felicio
Faried/Mirotic/Portis
Butler/Chandler/Zipser
Wade/Valentine
MCW/Nelson/Grant/Canaan

The Bulls would still need to add some 3 point shooting through another trade maybe Portis for Muscala as well look into guys that might be available like Nick Young or James Johnson, to only lose Doug in that regard and Chandler is a decent 3 point shooter while playing better defense would give the balls a faster team albeit with some of the same problems
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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#951 » by Rerisen » Sat Jan 7, 2017 7:12 pm

Read as "Ainge offered garbage."

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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#952 » by Hangtime84 » Sat Jan 7, 2017 7:14 pm

Rerisen wrote:Read as "Ainge offered garbage."

Bomba Navarro wrote:
Read on Twitter


Yup
Jcool0 wrote:
aguifs wrote:Do we have a friggin plan?


If the Bulls do, you would be complaining to much to ever hear it.


NBA fan logic we need to trade one of two best players because (Player X) one needs to shine more.
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Re: Butler trade rumor - Marc Stein PG: 47, Bulls not shopping Butler 

Post#953 » by Payt10 » Sat Jan 7, 2017 7:37 pm

What would it take to get Gallinari or Wilson Chandler here?
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Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#954 » by AirP. » Sat Jan 7, 2017 7:54 pm

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Right, they're not shopping Butler, they've just let it be known they'll listen to offers and it'll have to be a big one to make them move him. It's what I expected and I don't think he'll get moved during the season, too much to give up if you're a contender(as in having to make a drastic shift in your current team.

The problem with this... the FO won't go forward building around Butler if there's thoughts or expectations that he isn't going to be on the roster in a season or 2.
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Re: RE: Re: Butler trade rumor - PG: 24 - KC, FO rebuffed calls - asking price high 

Post#955 » by The Box Office » Sat Jan 7, 2017 9:28 pm

JordansBulls wrote:
Ctownbulls wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:Think of it this way. Reggie Miller was the best player on the Pacers for over a decade. They never traded him. How is Jimmy much different then him as a star? Same for Paul Pierce or Vince Carter. Jimmy is that level of player.

Name me one team that had a Vince Carter/Reggie Miller level player that traded that player and turned those assets into a championship caliber team.

None that is why you keep them. Pierce eventually got a KG on his team but had they traded him they never would have for awhile gottena star.


Easy easy. Reggie Miller became a damn good player in his third year averaging 24.6 points per game and proved to be a great reliable shooter. I wouldn't effin' trade him either. Like I said, if the Bulls can get a Chris Paul/Blake Griffin type player here or be bad enough to get a top 3 pick then keeping Jimmy Butler makes complete sense.

I don't see him as a franchise player, but a super sidekick, like Kobe was to Shaq, is great.
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Re: Butler trade rumor - Marc Stein PG: 47, Bulls not shopping Butler 

Post#956 » by Chitownbulls » Sat Jan 7, 2017 9:47 pm

If we trade Butler...I want Julius "The Next Draymond Green/Zach Randolph" Randle, DAngelo "20yrs old, Superstar Upside" Russell and Brandon "#2 pick" Ingram. These guys will be running the league in 2-3 years when THEY ARE STILL ONLY 23-24 YEARS OLD. Plus with the NEW CBA, its easier to keep your players.


Ill take the Boston trade too....give me those too picks and Chowda!
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Re: Butler trade rumor - Marc Stein PG: 47, Bulls not shopping Butler 

Post#957 » by Red Larrivee » Sat Jan 7, 2017 11:32 pm

Chitownbulls wrote:If we trade Butler...I want Julius "The Next Draymond Green/Zach Randolph" Randle, DAngelo "20yrs old, Superstar Upside" Russell and Brandon "#2 pick" Ingram. These guys will be running the league in 2-3 years when THEY ARE STILL ONLY 23-24 YEARS OLD. Plus with the NEW CBA, its easier to keep your players.


Ill take the Boston trade too....give me those too picks and Chowda!


I don't know why you think the Lakers are trading their last 3 number 1 picks for Butler, so he can play with Deng and Mozgov. It's not happening.
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Re: Butler trade rumor - Marc Stein PG: 47, Bulls not shopping Butler 

Post#958 » by RedBulls23 » Sat Jan 7, 2017 11:56 pm

I'm trying to think if a top 10 player in the modern salary/lux cap era that has ever been traded, when he didn't even want to be traded? Like when he's committed to the franchise and wants to win here.

Leave it to our FO to let something like this keep lingering too. :noway:
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Re: Butler trade rumor - Marc Stein PG: 47, Bulls not shopping Butler 

Post#959 » by JerrySloan » Sun Jan 8, 2017 12:27 am

NecessaryEvil wrote:

MrSparkle wrote:
Taj/Niko/Rondo/Sac 1st/Chi 1st to DEN for Gallo, Chandler and Faried.

Ziiing
I wish.


That's way too much to give up for those guys and I'm a fan of both Chandler and Faried

I'd offer Rondo, Lopez and McDermott a future 1st and next years 2nd round pick for Chandler, Nelson and Faried

In the current NBA I'm fine with someone like Taj playing C and having Felicio back him up

Gibson/Felicio
Faried/Mirotic/Portis
Butler/Chandler/Zipser
Wade/Valentine
MCW/Nelson/Grant/Canaan

The Bulls would still need to add some 3 point shooting through another trade maybe Portis for Muscala as well look into guys that might be available like Nick Young or James Johnson, to only lose Doug in that regard and Chandler is a decent 3 point shooter while playing better defense would give the balls a faster team albeit with some of the same problems



Sorry, but you are WAY off.

Living the first half of my life in Chicago and most of the rest here in Denver, I follow, like and know both teams.

Denver would have zero interest in Rondo or Lopez, period. If they wanted McD, they would have kept him rather than making the good trade they did with the Bulls.

For the Bulls, it is even sillier. You might be fine with Taj as your starting center but nobody else, FO, players or fans would be. Even if you go with that fantasy, you'd now have the same problem that is going on here, namely that Faried wants to be a minimum 30 MPG starter and, as much as I like him, he sucks on man-to-man D against any talented PF 6'9" or more and he has not developed any range beyond 12-14 feet on his J. You'd also have the same problem with Nelson who was very unhappy when the boy wonder named Mudiay was just handed the starting PG job last year at 20, with no college or pro experience.

Finally, with Jimmy at 35+ MPG at SF, WTF are you going to do with Chandler?

Answer: You would end up with 3 unhappy new veterans.
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Re: Butler trade rumor - Marc Stein PG: 47, Bulls not shopping Butler 

Post#960 » by Leslie Forman » Sun Jan 8, 2017 12:30 am

RedBulls83 wrote:I'm trying to think if a top 10 player in the modern salary/lux cap era that has ever been traded, when he didn't even want to be traded? Like when he's committed to the franchise and wants to win here.

Leave it to our FO to let something like this keep lingering too. :noway:

Kevin Garnett. Jason Kidd.

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