Official Trade Thread - Part XXXII

[J-Ves]

What would it take for Denver to get Oubre from you guys? Any realistic trade where we don't give up any of Jokic, Mudiay, Murray, Harris? We kinda need young SF to pair with those guys.

Don't see them trading Oubre. I really like Chandler as a small ball 4, Nurkic makes sense but unless we send Gortat or Morris there, the salaries won't match.

I'd say Oubre and Nicholson for Barton and Nurkic.

That's an interesting start to a deal. I'd still like a little more from Denver to help us win now while still giving us enough cap flexibility to sign Porter this offseason.

[gambitx777]

What would it take for Denver to get Oubre from you guys? Any realistic trade where we don't give up any of Jokic, Mudiay, Murray, Harris? We kinda need young SF to pair with those guys.

Oubre is not available. Now, we would probably give you an first and some seconds. depending on the deal.
Ive mentioned before that.
here are deals I would do.
Nicholson and a 2017 and 2018 second round pick for Barton and Nurkic
Nicholson and a 2019 protected first and a 2017 second for barton and nurkic
nicholson and a 2017 protected first for barton and nurkic.
Mahinmi and Nicholson and an unprotected 2017 first and 2017 and 2018 seconds for Barton, nurkic, nealson, and chandler.

[skywalker33]

What would it take for Denver to get Oubre from you guys? Any realistic trade where we don't give up any of Jokic, Mudiay, Murray, Harris? We kinda need young SF to pair with those guys.

Oubre is not available. Now, we would probably give you an first and some seconds. depending on the deal.
Ive mentioned before that.
here are deals I would do.
Nicholson and a 2017 and 2018 second round pick for Barton and Nurkic
Nicholson and a 2019 protected first and a 2017 second for barton and nurkic
nicholson and a 2017 protected first for barton and nurkic.
Mahinmi and Nicholson and an unprotected 2017 first and 2017 and 2018 seconds for Barton, nurkic, nealson, and chandler.

Not even close, on any of those "offers"

[skywalker33]

What would it take for Denver to get Oubre from you guys? Any realistic trade where we don't give up any of Jokic, Mudiay, Murray, Harris? We kinda need young SF to pair with those guys.

Don't see them trading Oubre. I really like Chandler as a small ball 4, Nurkic makes sense but unless we send Gortat or Morris there, the salaries won't match.

I'd say Oubre and Nicholson for Barton and Nurkic.

Nicholson is under-producing for the contract he's on and really is negative value here and I don't see Oubre is worth Barton + Nurkic even if you already have two C. Denver wouldn't accept that, sorry to say.

[Dat2U]

Man this thread has been a complete train wreck lately. I think any deal attempting to dump Mahinmi (which is basically impossible - he's making $16 mil and can't pass a physical yet!) or Nicholson with an asset only significantly devalues the asset your trying to move. I'd want more than marginal/rotation level talent for Oubre and/or our 1st round pick. Barton, Chandler, Nurkic... these are role players off the bench. Same with Temple & Casspi. Ditto with Bogdanovic.

Nicholson is terrible but at $6 mil, his deal is not a big enough anchor to be pawning off with a 1st round pick.

Secondly I seriously doubt Oubre gets moved. He's shown signs of growth, is only 20 and is arguably the only hope we have as far as untapped upside.

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return. I would be open to moving Gortat/Morris in this scenario even though Morris has played much better as of late. If we trade for a guy on his rookie deal, Sato seems like a contract that could be moved.

[gambitx777]

What would it take for Denver to get Oubre from you guys? Any realistic trade where we don't give up any of Jokic, Mudiay, Murray, Harris? We kinda need young SF to pair with those guys.

Don't see them trading Oubre. I really like Chandler as a small ball 4, Nurkic makes sense but unless we send Gortat or Morris there, the salaries won't match.

I'd say Oubre and Nicholson for Barton and Nurkic.

Nicholson is under-producing for the contract he's on and really is negative value here and I don't see Oubre is worth Barton + Nurkic even if you already have two C. Denver wouldn't accept that, sorry to say.

Not even close, on any of those "offers"

We shall see what your guys go for at the deadline. I definitely think you are over valuing your guys a little bit. Barton is on a good contract and he is young, but he is a bench player, Chandler is not over paid but he is at the top of what he is worth and 29 and injury prone. nealson, is an over the hill back up. Nurkic, has potential but he loses value because he is in a log jam and on a short deal teams can just wait it out and he also has some defencive deficiencies and right now and probably for the next few years, is going to be a bench player. That offer is what they are worth to us, I won't blame you for turning it down, but I'm not in the business of over paying. I would toss in a second first onto the last deal, making it 2 firsts, and 2 seconds to get it done, but it has to be mahinmi and nicholson. That's what makes it worth giving up so many draft picks. I think you guys are definitely going to move Nurkic and barton by the deadline. and someone in a play off race will call about nealson. But I doubt you will get what you are looking for, out of them.

[gambitx777]

Man this thread has been a complete train wreck lately. I think any deal attempting to dump Mahinmi (which is basically impossible - he's making $16 mil and can't pass a physical yet!) or Nicholson with an asset only significantly devalues the asset your trying to move. I'd want more than marginal/rotation level talent for Oubre and/or our 1st round pick. Barton, Chandler, Nurkic... these are role players off the bench. Same with Temple & Casspi. Ditto with Bogdanovic.

Nicholson is terrible but at $6 mil, his deal is not a big enough anchor to be pawning off with a 1st round pick.

Secondly I seriously doubt Oubre gets moved. He's shown signs of growth, is only 20 and is arguably the only hope we have as far as untapped upside.

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return. I would be open to moving Gortat/Morris in this scenario even though Morris has played much better as of late. If we trade for a guy on his rookie deal, Sato seems like a contract that could be moved.

I think I've said it about a billion times. Trading a starter for a slight up grade in that position does not help the team. (im not getting back in to the morris debate again) but out starting 5 is not the main issue. What is the bench. If we can haul in 2-4 upgrades on the bench its worth some picks because that puts us into contention in the east. hands down. I'm not willing to dump Kelley. But **** Nurkic, chandler and barton nelson, fixes the bench hands down.

[skywalker33]

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return.

Right now your 1st rd pick is slotted at #19, do you believe that pick will turn into a starter for you, and in how many years ?

[Dat2U]

Man this thread has been a complete train wreck lately. I think any deal attempting to dump Mahinmi (which is basically impossible - he's making $16 mil and can't pass a physical yet!) or Nicholson with an asset only significantly devalues the asset your trying to move. I'd want more than marginal/rotation level talent for Oubre and/or our 1st round pick. Barton, Chandler, Nurkic... these are role players off the bench. Same with Temple & Casspi. Ditto with Bogdanovic.

Nicholson is terrible but at $6 mil, his deal is not a big enough anchor to be pawning off with a 1st round pick.

Secondly I seriously doubt Oubre gets moved. He's shown signs of growth, is only 20 and is arguably the only hope we have as far as untapped upside.

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return. I would be open to moving Gortat/Morris in this scenario even though Morris has played much better as of late. If we trade for a guy on his rookie deal, Sato seems like a contract that could be moved.

I think I've said it about a billion times. Trading a starter for a slight up grade in that position does not help the team. (im not getting back in to the morris debate again) but out starting 5 is not the main issue. What is the bench. If we can haul in 2-4 upgrades on the bench its worth some picks because that puts us into contention in the east. hands down. I'm not willing to dump Kelley. But **** Nurkic, chandler and barton nelson, fixes the bench hands down.

I'm not willing to sacrifice future assets to fix a problem that normally shouldn't require the sacrificing of assets to fix. Just because Ernie crapped the bed in the worst possible way last off-season doesn't mean we should create more problems trying to address it.

Additionally I still say an upgrade on the front line is the quickest way to make us a legitimate challenger as the 2nd best team in the East. Our starting 5 may not be a main issue but if we ever want more than just being playoff fodder for Cleveland, we'll probably need more than Morris/Gortat upfront.

The guys you suggest aren't so hot either. Nelson is just terrible. He's been terrible for years. You could probably get him for Burke without any additional incentive. Nurkic may have the proverbial "upside" but he's been a disaster offensively. He's not been a good NBA player and he seems in no position to help a playoff team win games, especially considering he can't help Denver win games which is why Denver is anxiously trying to deal him.

Also with Denver making a playoff push your suggesting they are somehow willing to trade 4 rotation guys in exchange for a bad contract and a pick. I seriously doubt that. We know Nurkic is available and they'd probably have no problem dealing Nelson but Chandler/Barton are guys they'd likely hold onto as they try to make the playoffs.

[Dat2U]

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return.

Right now your 1st rd pick is slotted at #19, do you believe that pick will turn into a starter for you, and in how many years ?

I personally have little interest in trading it. Mainly because of the unique strength of this draft. Good players are likely to slip down that far. Moreso, potentially having a quality player on a rookie contract is invaluable nowadays. My argument is unless were getting a starting quality player, I see no reason for us to move it.

[NatP4]

I would never even consider trading Kelly Oubre for anything less than an all star or future all star. This dude has a ridiculous ceiling, a dirt cheap contract also. Fits our core perfectly

[NatP4]

It's Alec Burks or Tyreke Evans at the deadline for me. Don't really care which one. Need a combo guard that can score and handle the ball enough to play Satoransky next to. No more Trey Burke.

[deneem4]

I would never even consider trading Kelly Oubre for anything less than an all star or future all star. This dude has a ridiculous ceiling, a dirt cheap contract also. Fits our core perfectly

Kelly oubre is our most consistent defender...every game he brings it on that end...
That's the way kwahi Butler george started...
I wouldn't trade him at all...

The playoffs will show jus how good this kid is...

[NatP4]

I would never even consider trading Kelly Oubre for anything less than an all star or future all star. This dude has a ridiculous ceiling, a dirt cheap contract also. Fits our core perfectly

Kelly oubre is our most consistent defender...every game he brings it on that end...
That's the way kwahi Butler george started...
I wouldn't trade him at all...

The playoffs will show jus how good this kid is...

Everything scouts and experts said about those players early on, are things said currently about Oubre. Think about how effortlessly he can score 18 or so points or pull down 8 rebounds. He's starting to play lockdown defense for entire games consistently now.

Seriously, when's the last time Oubre made one of those dumbass mistakes where he gets lost on defense? It doesn't happen anymore. Wait till he develops his right hand, he already has a good ball handling foundation and the ability to drive right. Has the most important thing also, the willingness to drive to the basket and not settle.

As the game continues to slow down for him, he will continue to get better and better. Like you said, wait till you see what he looks like in the playoffs.

Baby Paul George, remember this

[gambitx777]

Kelley is one of those guys I consider off limits because you can't really move him and make the situation better. Too much of a net loss. No offence to those denver guys but they don't really know how to value players very well. I would make an offer for Evans all day if we would somehow get him for picks and mahinmi. Mahinmi would fit on that team as a defencive anchor. A 2018 first and a second or two with mahinmi for Evans and ajenca might move the needle

[pcbothwel]

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return.

Right now your 1st rd pick is slotted at #19, do you believe that pick will turn into a starter for you, and in how many years ?

We dont need that player to be a starter, especially in the first couple years. We need the next Kelly Oubre. A 6th/7th man that makes 3-4% of the cap and grow into something more.

In fact, the 2015 draft is a good data point. Look at all the 1st round picks outside the top 10, as that should be about the quality of talent available to the Wiz in the late teens in this draft.

11 - Myles Turner: One of the best Centers in Basketball and starts for a playoff team.
12 - Trey Lyles: Plays 20MPG for one of the best teams and basketball.
13 - Devin Booker: Would probably be better if he didnt play so many minutes and have such a high usage, but the Suns suck, so...
15 - Oubre: Plays 20 MPG for a top 4 team in the East. 108/109 ORtg/DRtg, 54%TS
16 - Rozier: Plays 18 MPG for a top 4 team in the East.
18 - Dekker: Plays 20 MPG for a top 5 team the NBA. 117/110 ORtg/DRtg, 55%TS
24 - Tyus Jones: Plays 10 MPG for a team with two top 5 picks at his position(Should play more). 121/110 ORtg/DRtg, 58%TS
27 - Nance Jr.: Plays 22 MPG for a bad LAL team, but still has a 121/109 ORtg/DRtg, 61%TS
30 - Looney: Only plays 8 MPG, but he plays for the best team in Basketball, possibly ever. has a 127/102 ORtg/DRtg, 60%TS

So we'll sit back and hope Giles, Rabb, Leaf, Adebayo, Hartenstein, Patton, Jeanne, or Hart are available and hope we make the right choice. They can play spot up minutes their rookie year, and then hopefully contribute the way some of the above players have and become another piece, or in Myles Turner's case... a star.

[skywalker33]

Don't see them trading Oubre. I really like Chandler as a small ball 4, Nurkic makes sense but unless we send Gortat or Morris there, the salaries won't match.

I'd say Oubre and Nicholson for Barton and Nurkic.

Nicholson is under-producing for the contract he's on and really is negative value here and I don't see Oubre is worth Barton + Nurkic even if you already have two C. Denver wouldn't accept that, sorry to say.

Not even close, on any of those "offers"

We shall see what your guys go for at the deadline. I definitely think you are over valuing your guys a little bit. Barton is on a good contract and he is young, but he is a bench player, Chandler is not over paid but he is at the top of what he is worth and 29 and injury prone. nealson, is an over the hill back up. Nurkic, has potential but he loses value because he is in a log jam and on a short deal teams can just wait it out and he also has some defencive deficiencies and right now and probably for the next few years, is going to be a bench player. That offer is what they are worth to us, I won't blame you for turning it down, but I'm not in the business of over paying. I would toss in a second first onto the last deal, making it 2 firsts, and 2 seconds to get it done, but it has to be mahinmi and nicholson. That's what makes it worth giving up so many draft picks. I think you guys are definitely going to move Nurkic and barton by the deadline. and someone in a play off race will call about nealson. But I doubt you will get what you are looking for, out of them.

Sorry dude, Denver is not in a desperate mode, WAS seems to be in need of a trade to prevent them from becoming a treadmill team. Their draft slots are now in the 18-23 range and that's those bench role player range IMO. Keep believing Den will cave, just don't hold your breath

[payitforward]

Man this thread has been a complete train wreck lately. I think any deal attempting to dump Mahinmi (which is basically impossible - he's making $16 mil and can't pass a physical yet!) or Nicholson with an asset only significantly devalues the asset your trying to move. I'd want more than marginal/rotation level talent for Oubre and/or our 1st round pick. Barton, Chandler, Nurkic... these are role players off the bench. Same with Temple & Casspi. Ditto with Bogdanovic.

Nicholson is terrible but at $6 mil, his deal is not a big enough anchor to be pawning off with a 1st round pick.

Secondly I seriously doubt Oubre gets moved. He's shown signs of growth, is only 20 and is arguably the only hope we have as far as untapped upside.

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return. I would be open to moving Gortat/Morris in this scenario even though Morris has played much better as of late. If we trade for a guy on his rookie deal, Sato seems like a contract that could be moved.

Agree 100%. Mostly the deals overvalue our players. Often the deals undervalue our 2017 R1 pick.

But... Oubre turned 21 in December.

[payitforward]

Finally, I would only trade the 1st round pick if we were getting a starting quality player in return.

Right now your 1st rd pick is slotted at #19, do you believe that pick will turn into a starter for you, and in how many years ?

I personally have little interest in trading it. Mainly because of the unique strength of this draft. Good players are likely to slip down that far. Moreso, potentially having a quality player on a rookie contract is invaluable nowadays. My argument is unless were getting a starting quality player, I see no reason for us to move it.

First off, there are good players throughout both rounds in nearly every draft. In the first 35-40 picks in absolutely every draft. So our slotting at 19 is irrelevant. Moreover, I think it's unlikely we'll still be at 19 on draft day.

Dat's other point is good as well -- a rookie contract is one of the 2 contracts in this league likely to be a bargain (the other being a max contract for a true superstar).

[payitforward]

I would never even consider trading Kelly Oubre for anything less than an all star or future all star. This dude has a ridiculous ceiling, a dirt cheap contract also. Fits our core perfectly

Kelly oubre is our most consistent defender...every game he brings it on that end...
That's the way kwahi Butler george started...
I wouldn't trade him at all...

The playoffs will show jus how good this kid is...

Everything scouts and experts said about those players early on, are things said currently about Oubre. Think about how effortlessly he can score 18 or so points or pull down 8 rebounds. He's starting to play lockdown defense for entire games consistently now.

Seriously, when's the last time Oubre made one of those dumbass mistakes where he gets lost on defense? It doesn't happen anymore. Wait till he develops his right hand, he already has a good ball handling foundation and the ability to drive right. Has the most important thing also, the willingness to drive to the basket and not settle.

As the game continues to slow down for him, he will continue to get better and better. Like you said, wait till you see what he looks like in the playoffs.

Baby Paul George, remember this

Nat/deneem -- I agree 100% w/ unwillingness to trade Oubre. I can't imagine a reason to do that.

But, he's nothing at all like Paul George -- the comparison can only mean that you are too young to have seen Paul George when he was a college player. He had all those things Oubre still has to develop. & if he still needs to develop them, that means it's not certain he will.

IOW, he's a different kind of player from PG -- not "Baby Paul George" in the slightest. OTOH, the kind of player he is, his ceiling is at least as high as Paul George & might be higher!

As to Kawhi, get real. He was better than Oubre in college (plus he had way more experience in high-level organized ball, given 2 college years). As an NBA rookie he played 1500 minutes at an extremely high level -- a zillion times better than Kelly did last year or this year. Kawhi was one of the best 3s in the league as a rookie. What makes him a truly great player is that he only got better when he played more minutes a game, teams had scouted him, etc. I like Kelly a lot, but don't saddle him with comparison to a guy who should be a leading MVP candidate!

"Think about how effortlessly he can score 18 or so points or pull down 8 rebounds." Well, tell me, Nat -- how effortlessly can he do that? How many games has he scored 18 points? How many has he gotten 8 boards? Kelly Oubre is a terrific prospect & shouldn't be traded, but this statement is ridiculous.