Stanley played for 3 minutes in this game

[Pharaoh]

2 players miss assignments but you have to play one. you go with the player that has earned your trust through out training camp, presesaon and regular season. That player is not SJ

You don't have to only play one - that's a choice

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if your playing both then obviously your taking someones minutes, thats either RB,TH, Mook, or Leur who again have proven to SVG he can trust them. Also in the few minutes that SVG went to a 10 man rotation, we lost our lead in less than a minute. While yes most would like to see SVG "try it out again", the reality of the game in which we started trailing would dictate that would be risky and put us in a hole we couldn't climb out of.

Yeah but instead of playing our last Lotto pick and losing we sit him and lose anyway!

That's a lose/lose option SVG took

Your letting 3-4 good games by SJ make you forget about 20+ games of inconsistent bone headed plays and attitude etc. mind you other than games, SVG see's and makes his decisions based on practices. obviously SJ's focus still needs work

No, I'm letting the potential of SJ override everything.

This team needs some grunt - other than KCP no one brings more fire than SJ

You want our guys to be passionate and get after it? Play the guy who is!

You can spend countless hours talking about practice & focus & **** and SJ will learn eventually but sometimes you just gotta unleash a guy and see what happens


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[Blkbrd671]

You don't have to only play one - that's a choice

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if your playing both then obviously your taking someones minutes, thats either RB,TH, Mook, or Leur who again have proven to SVG he can trust them. Also in the few minutes that SVG went to a 10 man rotation, we lost our lead in less than a minute. While yes most would like to see SVG "try it out again", the reality of the game in which we started trailing would dictate that would be risky and put us in a hole we couldn't climb out of.

Yeah but instead of playing our last Lotto pick and losing we sit him and lose anyway!

That's a lose/lose option SVG took

thats very shortsided stance. It was a 2 possession game with 2 minutes left. we didn't lose because sj didn't play. We lost because we wasted possessions.

Also "play him because he's a lotto pick" is also very short sided and sends the wrong message to a team.

No, I'm letting the potential of SJ override everything.

This team needs some grunt - other than KCP no one brings more fire than SJ

You want our guys to be passionate and get after it? Play the guy who is!

You can spend countless hours talking about practice & focus & **** and SJ will learn eventually but sometimes you just gotta unleash a guy and see what happens


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In reality that doesn't win us games , ask Minny. and if SJ's 3 minutes were any indication of his focus, then we'd probably have lost by more by playing SJ or as you say unleashing. Your really reaching here. Its really quite simple. For a player that has been lackluster most of this season and has had trouble with preparation and focus, giving up easy buckets and missing assignments From the get go, is not the way to get minutes or earn your coaches trust. SJ obviously has a problem with being over confident by evidence of his regression from SL to the season and most recently last game.

[Pharaoh]

if your playing both then obviously your taking someones minutes, thats either RB,TH, Mook, or Leur who again have proven to SVG he can trust them. Also in the few minutes that SVG went to a 10 man rotation, we lost our lead in less than a minute. While yes most would like to see SVG "try it out again", the reality of the game in which we started trailing would dictate that would be risky and put us in a hole we couldn't climb out of.

Yeah but instead of playing our last Lotto pick and losing we sit him and lose anyway!

That's a lose/lose option SVG took

thats very shortsided stance. It was a 2 possession game with 2 minutes left. we didn't lose because sj didn't play. We lost because we wasted possessions.

Also "play him because he's a lotto pick" is also very short sided and sends the wrong message to a team.

No, I'm letting the potential of SJ override everything.

This team needs some grunt - other than KCP no one brings more fire than SJ

You want our guys to be passionate and get after it? Play the guy who is!

You can spend countless hours talking about practice & focus & **** and SJ will learn eventually but sometimes you just gotta unleash a guy and see what happens


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In reality that doesn't win us games , ask Minny. and if SJ's 3 minutes were any indication of his focus, then we'd probably have lost by more by playing SJ or as you say unleashing. Your really reaching here. Its really quite simple. For a player that has been lackluster most of this season and has had trouble with preparation and focus, giving up easy buckets and missing assignments From the get go, is not the way to get minutes or earn your coaches trust. SJ obviously has a problem with being over confident by evidence of his regression from SL to the season and most recently last game.

What's his incentive to be focused?

Dre & RJ aren't every night. Mook just had a horrible month offensively. Baynes has issues, Tobias has issues on D...

But apparently we hold SJ to this insane standard!

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[Blkbrd671]

Yeah but instead of playing our last Lotto pick and losing we sit him and lose anyway!

That's a lose/lose option SVG took

thats very shortsided stance. It was a 2 possession game with 2 minutes left. we didn't lose because sj didn't play. We lost because we wasted possessions.

Also "play him because he's a lotto pick" is also very short sided and sends the wrong message to a team.

No, I'm letting the potential of SJ override everything.

This team needs some grunt - other than KCP no one brings more fire than SJ

You want our guys to be passionate and get after it? Play the guy who is!

You can spend countless hours talking about practice & focus & **** and SJ will learn eventually but sometimes you just gotta unleash a guy and see what happens


Sent from my SM-J110F using RealGM mobile app

In reality that doesn't win us games , ask Minny. and if SJ's 3 minutes were any indication of his focus, then we'd probably have lost by more by playing SJ or as you say unleashing. Your really reaching here. Its really quite simple. For a player that has been lackluster most of this season and has had trouble with preparation and focus, giving up easy buckets and missing assignments From the get go, is not the way to get minutes or earn your coaches trust. SJ obviously has a problem with being over confident by evidence of his regression from SL to the season and most recently last game.

What's his incentive to be focused?

Dre & RJ aren't every night. Mook just had a horrible month offensively. Baynes has issues, Tobias has issues on D...

But apparently we hold SJ to this insane standard!

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Essentially the same argument, all those players mentioned have at least a track record and earned SVG trust. Your just jumping from excuse to excuse but in reality SJ's not playing because there are players that are playing much better than him and done it more consistently.

I find it hilarious SJ has 3 decent games and all of sudden SVG's the one holding him back , lets just forget everything else thats happen this season and focus just on his decent games. BTW how does a player have decent games if the same coach ISN'T PLAYING HIM.

As i said, SJ wants minutes, show up to the f* game and show coach you deserve more minutes in game and in practice, instead of boneheaded plays not even 3 minutes into the game.

[Pharaoh]

thats very shortsided stance. It was a 2 possession game with 2 minutes left. we didn't lose because sj didn't play. We lost because we wasted possessions.

Also "play him because he's a lotto pick" is also very short sided and sends the wrong message to a team.



In reality that doesn't win us games , ask Minny. and if SJ's 3 minutes were any indication of his focus, then we'd probably have lost by more by playing SJ or as you say unleashing. Your really reaching here. Its really quite simple. For a player that has been lackluster most of this season and has had trouble with preparation and focus, giving up easy buckets and missing assignments From the get go, is not the way to get minutes or earn your coaches trust. SJ obviously has a problem with being over confident by evidence of his regression from SL to the season and most recently last game.

What's his incentive to be focused?

Dre & RJ aren't every night. Mook just had a horrible month offensively. Baynes has issues, Tobias has issues on D...

But apparently we hold SJ to this insane standard!

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Essentially the same argument, all those players mentioned have at least a track record and earned SVG trust. Your just jumping from excuse to excuse but in reality SJ's not playing because there are players that are playing much better than him and done it more consistently.

I find it hilarious SJ has 3 decent games and all of sudden SVG's the one holding him back , lets just forget everything else thats happen this season and focus just on his decent games. BTW how does a player have decent games if the same coach ISN'T PLAYING HIM.

As i said, SJ wants minutes, show up to the f* game and show coach you deserve more minutes in game and in practice, instead of boneheaded plays not even 3 minutes into the game.

I'm of the opinion we need to have patience dude so it's not about forgetting anything

It's about teaching & developing SJ and I personally think SVG made the wrong choice.

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[Blkbrd671]

What's his incentive to be focused?

Dre & RJ aren't every night. Mook just had a horrible month offensively. Baynes has issues, Tobias has issues on D...

But apparently we hold SJ to this insane standard!

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Essentially the same argument, all those players mentioned have at least a track record and earned SVG trust. Your just jumping from excuse to excuse but in reality SJ's not playing because there are players that are playing much better than him and done it more consistently.

I find it hilarious SJ has 3 decent games and all of sudden SVG's the one holding him back , lets just forget everything else thats happen this season and focus just on his decent games. BTW how does a player have decent games if the same coach ISN'T PLAYING HIM.

As i said, SJ wants minutes, show up to the f* game and show coach you deserve more minutes in game and in practice, instead of boneheaded plays not even 3 minutes into the game.

I'm of the opinion we need to have patience dude so it's not about forgetting anything

It's about teaching & developing SJ and I personally think SVG made the wrong choice.

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and my point is saying "f* everyone else and lets just focus soley on SJ's development is very shortsided and not realistic.

[Pharaoh]

Essentially the same argument, all those players mentioned have at least a track record and earned SVG trust. Your just jumping from excuse to excuse but in reality SJ's not playing because there are players that are playing much better than him and done it more consistently.

I find it hilarious SJ has 3 decent games and all of sudden SVG's the one holding him back , lets just forget everything else thats happen this season and focus just on his decent games. BTW how does a player have decent games if the same coach ISN'T PLAYING HIM.

As i said, SJ wants minutes, show up to the f* game and show coach you deserve more minutes in game and in practice, instead of boneheaded plays not even 3 minutes into the game.

I'm of the opinion we need to have patience dude so it's not about forgetting anything

It's about teaching & developing SJ and I personally think SVG made the wrong choice.

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and my point is saying "f* everyone else and lets just focus soley on SJ's development is very shortsided and not realistic.

**** everyone else? I didn't say that lol

What I'm saying is we've got a guy with potential who is locked up on a team friendly deal who has fire and we keep him on the shortest of short leashes

Meanwhile other dudes sleepwalk through games and suffer no consequences

It's inconsistent

We're just gonna have to agree to disagree cause IMO it's short sighted to yank SJ after 3 minutes and not put him back in and IYO it's short sighted to put him back in the game

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[hoophabit]

I had been thinking SJ was looking a little more svelte, and according to this article that is the case. I don't see how it can help but improve his agility and lift.
http://www.mlive.com/pistons/index.ssf/2017/01/leaner_faster_pistons_stanley_1.html#incart_river_index

[Billl]

Obviously, getting in better shape will help any player, but....

I don't think 99% of SJ's problems have been physical. He's routinely checked in and just not been ready to play right away. I think it's pretty obvious that SVG will play SJ when he brings it and will sit him when he doesn't. He's had quite a few games a +20 minutes and even some at +30 minutes. If SJ is locked in, he has no problem getting minutes. It's entirely up to him to bring that level every night now.

My only complaint is that EVERYONE should follow that rule. The only way to build a championship level team is if you have that culture. If only some guys are held accountable, it will eventually rip apart the team.

[El Chivo]

Obviously, getting in better shape will help any player, but....

I don't think 99% of SJ's problems have been physical. He's routinely checked in and just not been ready to play right away. I think it's pretty obvious that SVG will play SJ when he brings it and will sit him when he doesn't. He's had quite a few games a +20 minutes and even some at +30 minutes. If SJ is locked in, he has no problem getting minutes. It's entirely up to him to bring that level every night now.

My only complaint is that EVERYONE should follow that rule. The only way to build a championship level team is if you have that culture. If only some guys are held accountable, it will eventually rip apart the team.

the problem, as you said, is SVG doesn't apply the same yardstick with every player. someone can jack shots at will, someone else can avoid to play defense, Johnson makes a mistake and then is buried.

[Redeemed]

I'm thrilled to see he's putting in the hard work and transforming his body. I still believe he's a special talent who will eventually start to demonstrate it.

[Pharaoh]

Obviously, getting in better shape will help any player, but....

I don't think 99% of SJ's problems have been physical. He's routinely checked in and just not been ready to play right away. I think it's pretty obvious that SVG will play SJ when he brings it and will sit him when he doesn't. He's had quite a few games a +20 minutes and even some at +30 minutes. If SJ is locked in, he has no problem getting minutes. It's entirely up to him to bring that level every night now.

My only complaint is that EVERYONE should follow that rule. The only way to build a championship level team is if you have that culture. If only some guys are held accountable, it will eventually rip apart the team.

THIS!!!!!!!!!

RJ can play hero ball with bugger all D and it's fine with SVG

Mook can go iso crazy and that's fine with SVG

Dre can get caught in no man's land repeatedly and chuck up hooks from everywhere and that's fine with SVG

SJ doesn't enter the game and hit the ground running SVG yanks him!

WTF?

Of all our guys now SJs development is the key - IF he becomes a bench role player then we're lucky to be a playoff team.

IF he becomes a quality starter then we could be so much more than that.

For me though everything starts with RJ

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[mattao313]

SVG pulls both Reggie and Andre all the time...the thing is Stanley isn't as good as the other guys, so he needs to work harder to stay on the floor.

[ImHeisenberg]

I think it's pretty well established that SVG doesn't like Stanley Johnson and wants to ruin him.

Not saying he's some superstar that's being held back, but he definitely isn't getting a fair shot this season.

[Pharaoh]

SVG pulls both Reggie and Andre all the time...the thing is Stanley isn't as good as the other guys, so he needs to work harder to stay on the floor.

There's a difference between pulling them off the floor and "teaching" them and then putting them back in and yanking them!

SJ getting 3 minutes is a joke

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[Pharaoh]

I think it's pretty well established that SVG doesn't like Stanley Johnson and wants to ruin him.

Not saying he's some superstar that's being held back, but he definitely isn't getting a fair shot this season.

Breaking him down in order to build something special...though you can only pull the leash so tight before it chokes the life outta the dog!

From all reports once SJ gets Ion the floor and into rhythm he's as competitive as they come...not allowing that to happen is the crime here.

Maybe SVG is smarter than all of us and has been stealthily tanking for ages

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[mattao313]

SVG pulls both Reggie and Andre all the time...the thing is Stanley isn't as good as the other guys, so he needs to work harder to stay on the floor.

There's a difference between pulling them off the floor and "teaching" them and then putting them back in and yanking them!

SJ getting 3 minutes is a joke

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Stanley has a lot of good players in front of him Morris, Harris, KCP, Bullock. I don't see the point in pulling one of them JUST to play Stanley. Its not like Stanley has been playing out his mind and still not getting minutes, he just started to play half way decent about 10 games ago, before that he was god awful.

[Pharaoh]

SVG pulls both Reggie and Andre all the time...the thing is Stanley isn't as good as the other guys, so he needs to work harder to stay on the floor.

There's a difference between pulling them off the floor and "teaching" them and then putting them back in and yanking them!

SJ getting 3 minutes is a joke

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Stanley has a lot of good players in front of him Morris, Harris, KCP, Bullock. I don't see the point in pulling one of them JUST to play Stanley. Its not like Stanley has been playing out his mind and still not getting minutes, he just started to play half way decent about 10 games ago, before that he was god awful.

Mook & Harris can both get minutes at the 4

Bullock is a free agent to be - might not even be here next season.

At some point you gotta realise **** ain't working and change things:

Dre 30 - Jon 18
Mook 30 - King 12 - Harris 6
SJ 24 - Harris 24
KCP 30 - Bull 18
RJ 26 - Ish 22

What's wrong with that? If we lose we lose but at least you're playing young guys

Trade Baynes for whatever you can get

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[Blkbrd671]

SVG pulls both Reggie and Andre all the time...the thing is Stanley isn't as good as the other guys, so he needs to work harder to stay on the floor.

There's a difference between pulling them off the floor and "teaching" them and then putting them back in and yanking them!

SJ getting 3 minutes is a joke

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Stanley has a lot of good players in front of him Morris, Harris, KCP, Bullock. I don't see the point in pulling one of them JUST to play Stanley. Its not like Stanley has been playing out his mind and still not getting minutes, he just started to play half way decent about 10 games ago, before that he was god awful.

exactly, RJ and DRe play despite sh* performance because no one is in front of them and lets face it, both have "proven" they can bounce back. SJ hasn't seperated himself from any of the forwards and in fact has made the case many times that he's not ready or deserves minutes and this pertains to on and off the court. I am not for force feeding him minutes just simply because he's a lotto pick. It sends the wrong message to the team , to him and more than likely leads to losing by even worst.

[Canadafan]

There's a difference between pulling them off the floor and "teaching" them and then putting them back in and yanking them!

SJ getting 3 minutes is a joke

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Stanley has a lot of good players in front of him Morris, Harris, KCP, Bullock. I don't see the point in pulling one of them JUST to play Stanley. Its not like Stanley has been playing out his mind and still not getting minutes, he just started to play half way decent about 10 games ago, before that he was god awful.

Mook & Harris can both get minutes at the 4

Bullock is a free agent to be - might not even be here next season.

At some point you gotta realise **** ain't working and change things:

Dre 30 - Jon 18
Mook 30 - King 12 - Harris 6
SJ 24 - Harris 24
KCP 30 - Bull 18
RJ 26 - Ish 22

What's wrong with that? If we lose we lose but at least you're playing young guys

Trade Baynes for whatever you can get

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Looks great to me. Kinda what I've been saying except put Boban in for 6-12 minutes at center and Leuer more at PF