Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion 2: End This Knightmare!

[bwgood77]

I'm in the camp that thinks Len's absolute ceiling is an average starter in the NBA. I truly don't even think he'll get that far.

Still, it would be a dumb move to trade him now. Moving a restricted free agent before the market has been set for their services is just bad business.

The Suns are in no rush with Len and we have all the leverage in the world.

To have an avg starting center who is way above avg in blocks per 36 and opponent fg% at the rim, as well as a great rebounder per 36, are worth good money. We have rarely EVER had a center even as good as he is. As many who want to get rid of him either haven't been fans for long, forgot how we got out rebounded by a large margin every year, could never defend the rim, or just simply have made up their minds they don't like him.

[bwgood77]

I do agree we need something to provide us some hope to the season....just need some meat to chew on you know...like this..

[/quote]

[thamadkant]

Using 36 minute stats on Len is futile. He will foul out way before then. Looking at that list by gaspar.

All those players ahead of Len... And heck even the ones below him... Are so much more smarter defensively and offensively than Len... maybe Biyombo is the only one really comparable.

Gobert and Bogut... You see them play in control and intentional on the court. Len looks like a headless chicken next to them. Len is 7'1 with long arms, very athletic and energetic... Its a no brainer he'd post good blocks and rebounds... But he will neutralize his production by dumb fouls and shot attempts.

Maybe on the suns he looks bad because he isnt used properly... Because i can see him on a good passing team and get open dunks all game...


Anyways... I dont mind if suns sign him... But not at near max... Maybe 12 million.

[TeamTragic]

Using 36 minute stats on Len is futile. He will foul out way before then. Looking at that list by gaspar.

All those players ahead of Len... And heck even the ones below him... Are so much more smarter defensively and offensively than Len... maybe Biyombo is the only one really comparable.

Gobert and Bogut... You see them play in control and intentional on the court. Len looks like a headless chicken next to them. Len is 7'1 with long arms, very athletic and energetic... Its a no brainer he'd post good blocks and rebounds... But he will neutralize his production by dumb fouls and shot attempts.

Maybe on the suns he looks bad because he isnt used properly... Because i can see him on a good passing team and get open dunks all game...

Anyways... I dont mind if suns sign him... But not at near max... Maybe 12 million.

Bogut has had injury issues. Gobert is the gold standard IMO.

[Mulhollanddrive]

I believe our Plan A is to trade the pick for a star SF or C.

Reason being is if we get best case scenario in the draft, the best 3 players in the draft are PGs, and we'd have to trade either Bledsoe or that guy at some stage and it'd be Thomas / Dragic / Bledsoe / McDonough all over again.

The next best players after that I wouldn't even almost trade Booker or Bledsoe for, so if those 2 guys can only get the team to 25 wins, a lesser prospect is not going to change the team.

Compare that with the strategy of targetting Butler, George, Cousins it's instant and simplier.

I personally don't think we will land any of them, as they would be passing up a $210m SuperMax Contract to move teams, so I think we may end up reaching for Josh Jackson in the draft with a top 4 pick as a position of need selection, which is not ideal.

TLDR: Draft could add elite talent but create team balance issues, easier to target star but unlikely to land one, so may end up picking for need in draft.

[asudevil]

And with a trade with us moving our Top3 pick:

Suns trade: Suns 2017 First #2/Suns 2017 Second/Knight
Suns get: Heat #7//Plumlee/Brogdan/Bucks 2017 First

Suns essentially go 1for2. The cream of the crop is PG which we do not need. We eat Plumlee's terrible contract for Brogdan and turn our #2 to a later lotto and a potential mid first.

Heat trade: Dragic/Heat 2017 First #7
Heat get: Suns #2/Knight/Suns 2017 Second

Heat tank for a franchise player. Knight becomes the SG next to their lotto and Winslow.

Bucks trade: Brogdan/Plumlee/Bucks 2017 First
Bucks get: Dragic

Bucks need a PG for a playoff push. They give up a young stud and a first, while relieving one of the worst contract in the NBA.

[Mulhollanddrive]

If we have pick 2, I'd want pick 5 and 10 at minimum to deal 2 for 1.

I like the concept though in this draft 3-12 very even.

[carey]

Not going to direct this at any one person but some of these trade proposals are down right crazy. We are likely to see a move or two before the 23rd but I don't think they will be major moves like you guys are predicting. We'll see.

[TOO]

The idea that we dont need a PG is crazy to me. Bledsoe is ok, he's our best player, but we're the worst team in the league in assists, thats a problem. His knees are a ticking time bomb, we absolutely need a franchise PG.

[jcsunsfan]

The idea that we dont need a PG is crazy to me. Bledsoe is ok, he's our best player, but we're the worst team in the league in assists, thats a problem. His knees are a ticking time bomb, we absolutely need a franchise PG.

That's not all on Bledsoe. We are a horrible passing team across the board. To me, that is an offensive system. Look at the assist to turnover ratio's of everyone on this roster vs those on the Celtics roster. I happen to think the talent levels of those two rosters are similar.

[gaspar]

The idea that we dont need a PG is crazy to me. Bledsoe is ok, he's our best player, but we're the worst team in the league in assists, thats a problem. His knees are a ticking time bomb, we absolutely need a franchise PG.

That's not all on Bledsoe. We are a horrible passing team across the board. To me, that is an offensive system. Look at the assist to turnover ratio's of everyone on this roster vs those on the Celtics roster. I happen to think the talent levels of those two rosters are similar.

We have the worst passing frontcourt in the league. PJ, TJ, Chriss, Bender, Chandler and Len average 4.1 assists per game combined and I doubt they would average significantly more assists in any system. They are just not good at it.

[jcsunsfan]

The idea that we dont need a PG is crazy to me. Bledsoe is ok, he's our best player, but we're the worst team in the league in assists, thats a problem. His knees are a ticking time bomb, we absolutely need a franchise PG.

That's not all on Bledsoe. We are a horrible passing team across the board. To me, that is an offensive system. Look at the assist to turnover ratio's of everyone on this roster vs those on the Celtics roster. I happen to think the talent levels of those two rosters are similar.

We have the worst passing frontcourt in the league. PJ, TJ, Chriss, Bender, Chandler and Len average 4.1 assists per game combined and I doubt they would average significantly more assists in any system. They are just not good at it.

Bender is a very good passer. PJ is a black hole. The only time Chandler gets a pass is when he is open to dunk it. Same with Chriss. The only times he gets passes is when he has a dunk or wide open three. TJ passes on occasion.

[gaspar]

That's not all on Bledsoe. We are a horrible passing team across the board. To me, that is an offensive system. Look at the assist to turnover ratio's of everyone on this roster vs those on the Celtics roster. I happen to think the talent levels of those two rosters are similar.

We have the worst passing frontcourt in the league. PJ, TJ, Chriss, Bender, Chandler and Len average 4.1 assists per game combined and I doubt they would average significantly more assists in any system. They are just not good at it.

Bender is a very good passer. PJ is a black hole. The only time Chandler gets a pass is when he is open to dunk it. Same with Chriss. The only times he gets passes is when he has a dunk or wide open three. TJ passes on occasion.

Bender sees the floor very well but I wouldn't call him a "very good passer" yet. Not at the NBA level. His passes get deflected/stolen a lot.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Suns would have more assists if they weren't such a poor shooting team and if they had anyone that could score in the post efficiently. They really dont get any easy assists.

Sent from my SM-G930V using RealGM mobile app

[suns91fan]

That's not all on Bledsoe. We are a horrible passing team across the board. To me, that is an offensive system. Look at the assist to turnover ratio's of everyone on this roster vs those on the Celtics roster. I happen to think the talent levels of those two rosters are similar.

We have the worst passing frontcourt in the league. PJ, TJ, Chriss, Bender, Chandler and Len average 4.1 assists per game combined and I doubt they would average significantly more assists in any system. They are just not good at it.

Bender is a very good passer. PJ is a black hole. The only time Chandler gets a pass is when he is open to dunk it. Same with Chriss. The only times he gets passes is when he has a dunk or wide open three. TJ passes on occasion.

Warren is even less willing passer than Tucker in my opinion. Also, Warren's assist ratio is considerably worse (among the worst in the league). It's one of the reasons why i see him more as a 6th man type of player instead of a starter.

[Blackification]

Suns would have more assists if they weren't such a poor shooting team and if they had anyone that could score in the post efficiently. They really dont get any easy assists.

Sent from my SM-G930V using RealGM mobile app

This a good point, our frontcourt players provide nothing offensively outside of a point blank layup or dunk, none of them can create their own shot yet or even do a simple post up(lookin at you Len)

[Jarlaxle0204]

I think Len is an underrated passer and I think Bender has the potential to be a good passer but otherwise I agree. The other problem is there's not a lot of movement overall in the offense which leads to a lot of 1 on 1 basketball, whether that be Bledsoe, Booker, Warren, etc. Everyone seems to take turns and then no one moves. Warren is probably our best cutter and I don't even see him doing that very often anymore. This type of offense won't lead to assists.

[sunsbum]

Not going to direct this at any one person but some of these trade proposals are down right crazy. We are likely to see a move or two before the 23rd but I don't think they will be major moves like you guys are predicting. We'll see.

Welcome to RealGM where the trade proposals are anything but.

[Zelaznyrules]

Not going to direct this at any one person but some of these trade proposals are down right crazy. We are likely to see a move or two before the 23rd but I don't think they will be major moves like you guys are predicting. We'll see.

I don't think we'll see a major acquisition this February but I wouldn't be surprised to see almost any combination of Bledsoe, Knight, Warren, Chriss, Tucker, Chandler or Len moved. In the end, it will probably just be Tucker or Tucker and Chandler although I'm sure we'll try our best to move Knight also.

[Qwigglez]

Not going to direct this at any one person but some of these trade proposals are down right crazy. We are likely to see a move or two before the 23rd but I don't think they will be major moves like you guys are predicting. We'll see.

It really just gives us something to talk about and it's fun IMO to predict what trades are going to happen. Realistically, I don't see us making any trades. Not PJ Tucker, not Brandon Knight. I think we might actually stand pat this year.