Mudiay - What's his role?

[GlenRiceARoni]

Mudiay supposedly on the block. I think thats a good move. Try to get something for him while he still has potential to improve.

Hes just too awful for a team ready to take that step into a legitimate Western Conference playoff team.

They can live with the playmaking of Murray/Jokic/Barton/Gallo.

Mudiay isnt the right fit on this team with his high turnovers.

I do think he has one offseason of serious improvement this year but hes so far off track of being a productive player and there is so much young talent coming in the league at the position...

-----------------------------------------------------------------------Hinkie has created a monster that will awaken in 2018 precisely 200 years after Mary Shelley published Frankenstein in 1818 A.D.
I don't think for a second this is coincidental as Hinkie is well educated and a fan of Classic British Lit

[ball teacher]

Hey guys, I occasionally lurk on this thread specifically to see what you guys think about Mudiay cause I am a fan of his game. If you don't mind I wanted to chime in with my opinion on this topic.
First I think his biggest problem is the coach, I don't think the coach has done a good job of installing a system that caters to his, or your other players style of play. Mudiay would be very good in a up tempo offense where he leads the break because he has good vision and play making ability. I think the pick and roll offense was difficult to run early on, he would often just get trapped, or over think and make the wrong play. To me, it seemed as if running the pick and roll was just a chance for the defense to attack Mudiay when they had the chance send the extra help defender to trap him and it was a struggle for him which was all mental. Mudiay should have had a more traditional offensive set that gave him more space to actually see the floor and control the tempo.

I think a good point guard turned coach would do wonders for him, someone who knows the game and who can groom him correctly. I think one area of play Mudiay can fix also is his hitch in that jumper, he doesn't seem to release the ball on the top of his shot. He jumps and tends to release while descending which can make his shot off. Mudiay's problem is mental, I honestly just don't think the coach has developed him properly and he may have hurt his psyche and confidence. Malone has played Mudiay at SG with Nelson running point for crying out loud! why, when Mudiay seems to be the better natural playmaker while Nelson seems to have a more fluid jumper, but go figure. Mudiay should be playing with the rookie Murray as starters and you guys should be running and gunning. This team really has talent from PG to center, and on the bench, it's just bad coaching that has yet to get the most out of the talent, IMO of course.

[bwgood77]

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[NuggetsWY]

An interesting article about Mudiay; among other things, he points out that many of Mudiay's minutes came with Nurkic on the floor and maintains they were a bad fit together, making both of them look bad. (Sort of a coaching issue there in my mind.)

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2017/4/17/15332438/why-the-denver-nuggets-should-not-give-up-on-emmanuel-mudiay

[The Rebel]

An interesting article about Mudiay; among other things, he points out that many of Mudiay's minutes came with Nurkic on the floor and maintains they were a bad fit together, making both of them look bad. (Sort of a coaching issue there in my mind.)

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2017/4/17/15332438/why-the-denver-nuggets-should-not-give-up-on-emmanuel-mudiay

I thought Mares was a better writer than to do an obvious hit piece pushing the Nuggets agenda instead of dealing with all the facts.

I am sorry but it reads like something the front office directly fed him and ignores many things.

Here are my problems with the article.

Nurkic supposedly only liked playing in the low post every possession while Malone was coach, under Shaw he was a pick and roll guy, with the Trailblazers he is a pick and roll big, under Malone he was sent to the low post. Tells me he was being told to go to the low post by our coaches.

Nurkic has no control over the lineups ran, you mentioned yourself that to start the season the Nuggets ran a more traditional offense, that is not going to help the team by ignoring their strengths and emphasizing their weaknesses. Jokic was not allowed to play his game, Nurkic was sent to the low post, and it was a disaster especially considering that Harris was out many of those games and there was no outside shooting to speak of since Barton is not a shooter. Again that is on the coach.

The part that almost made me bust out laughing is when he says that Plumlee keeps the lane clear by playing out of the paint, I mean does the guy even watch the Nuggets? Defenses do not cover Plumlee outside of the paint when he does not have the ball, part of the reason the Blazers lost in the playoffs last year is that the Clippers kept Jordan in the paint. Plumlee has no outside shot, funny thing is that Nurkic does, so once again it is a coaching issue as the only person Plumlee keeps out of the paint is himself and anybody on the court can do that.

I am too lazy this morning to go look at the numbers today, but the difference between when Mudiay was starting with Harris and when he was starting with Barton was crazy midway through the season, and to end the season Mudiay was on the court without Barton and played well, why ignore that fact?

Calling Arthur a below average stretch 4 that shoots 40% from 3 but does not stretch the floor is ignoring the fact the Nuggets are not using him enough. If teams are not covering your spot up shooters, then you pass the shooters the ball and let them shoot their shots, we did not pass him the ball enough to stretch the floor that is not his fault.

Those of us that post or even just read this board should know that Mudiay needs spacing on the court, he needs to be with at least 3 guys who defenses have to cover outside of the paint, there is no denying it. However I think it is wrong to try to push that all onto Nurkic and to a much lesser extent Faried and Arthur. If your stretch bigs are not stretching the floor than it is up to the ballhandlers to get them the ball so they can make their shots and spread the floor. It is up to the coaching staff to find lineups that work together, and Malone has not done that.

If anything this brings up another reason why the finger should be pointing at Malone and the coaching staff than anything, in his 2nd year, with most of the same players, Malone struggled to find lineups that worked together. He only figured out a few through injuries that allowed the team to look better towards the end of the year than at the beginning. Why can we see that the offense should be run through Jokic over a year ago, and it took Malone 1/3rd of this season to figure that out? Why is it obvious to many of us that Barton, Mudiay, and Gallo do not work together as they all need the ball in their hands to be effective and none are spot up shooters? Add Faried to that lineup and it is a disaster yet Malone did it more than once. Why is our coach not pounding the idea of passing to Arthur and Hernangomez when their defenders leave them out at the 3 point line to make defenders pay? Why was our head coach sending a pick and roll big into the low post and then getting pissed when he was not as good in the low post? Why did this team almost always play better when several of the more popular options were out injured and the healthy players end up in a lineup that works due to Malone not having enough choices to screw it up?

I have been very clear, and made no secret of the fact that I do not want to see Mudiay traded or written off, I think he still has plenty of potential. but this roster needs to be adjusted and our coach needs to figure out that Mudiay has to be on the court with a couple of spot up shooters at all times to be effective. Put him in a lineup with Jokic, Harris, Hernangomez, and Arthur and watch how good he looks, but you cannot put him on the court with Barton, Gallo, Faried, and Plumlee and then complain when he is not effective.

[MidMountain]

An interesting article about Mudiay; among other things, he points out that many of Mudiay's minutes came with Nurkic on the floor and maintains they were a bad fit together, making both of them look bad. (Sort of a coaching issue there in my mind.)

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2017/4/17/15332438/why-the-denver-nuggets-should-not-give-up-on-emmanuel-mudiay

The article is spot on, well researched, and well-written. I don't get the impression that he is blaming Nurkic for Mudiay's struggles. The two players don't play well together, that's not either player's nor the coach's fault. Nurkic has done well in Portland because they have the personnel that complement him. Mudiay has holes in his game that were exposed when trying to play with Nurkic, which left both players underachieving.

[NuggetsWY]

Gotta say, I totally agree with The Rebel on this one. I didn't comment much because sometimes I bash the coach/front office too much IMO. I did spend some time looking at some of those numbers, not enough, but a little - I think you hit the nail on the head here. I truly love Barton & Chandler as players but just don't see them fitting on the Nuggets with their style. Gallinari fits better than Melo, but not much. As for Plumlee "not clogging the lane", it reminds me of Sampson last year where he'd sit out in the corner and his defender would be one inch from the lane. Plumlee's defender never follows him out of the lane and if Plumlee does shot, the other coach just smiles. Plumlee's great on a pick-n-roll in the manner of Capella or Jordan, but shooting from distance is not his forte'.

Nurkic on offense wasn't used right here but his defense in Portland has been impressive. Must be they taught him defense in the 48 hours after the trade, before his first game. They LOVE his defense.

[RRFB]

In my opinion, Mares is easily one of the best and most knowledgeable Nuggets writers out there (his podcasts are really great too). I don't think he was blaming Mudiay's stagnant development on Nurkic, but rather suggesting that he's struggled from factors outside of his control (lineups). The Nuggets haven't exactly put Mudiay in the best position to succeed (he says the same thing about Nurkic), and that's indirectly an indictment of the coach. I've been less critical of Malone than most here, but I think we all agree that he single-handedly botched the first third of the season. The lack of spacing in those Mudiay/Faried/Nurkic lineups was glaringly obvious.

I'd like to give Mudiay another chance in a backup role, but lineups and everything else aside, he'll never be an NBA point guard until he improves his decision making and learns to finish at the rim.

[NuggetsWY]

I have been very clear, and made no secret of the fact that I do not want to see Mudiay traded or written off, I think he still has plenty of potential. but this roster needs to be adjusted and our coach needs to figure out that Mudiay has to be on the court with a couple of spot up shooters at all times to be effective. Put him in a lineup with Jokic, Harris, Hernangomez, and Arthur and watch how good he looks, but you cannot put him on the court with Barton, Gallo, Faried, and Plumlee and then complain when he is not effective.

In my opinion, Mares is easily one of the best and most knowledgeable Nuggets writers out there (his podcasts are really great too). I don't think he was blaming Mudiay's stagnant development on Nurkic, but rather suggesting that he's struggled from factors outside of his control (lineups). The Nuggets haven't exactly put Mudiay in the best position to succeed (he says the same thing about Nurkic), and that's indirectly an indictment of the coach. I've been less critical of Malone than most here, but I think we all agree that he single-handedly botched the first third of the season. The lack of spacing in those Mudiay/Faried/Nurkic lineups was glaringly obvious.

I'd like to give Mudiay another chance in a backup role, but lineups and everything else aside, he'll never be an NBA point guard until he improves his decision making and learns to finish at the rim.

We'll have to disagree on Mares. I think some of his stuff is good and some is not. I'm OK with that. He probably doesn't always agree with me either.

I agree that we should keep Mudiay. I do not believe he has been put in a position to succeed. I do believe he still has the potential to become, at the very least, an excellent starting PG. Will he? I don't know but I do believe we can not get decent value for him because of his ineffectiveness in the insanity we call "Malone's Rotation". So we might as well gamble on keeping him.