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Political Roundtable Part XII

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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1641 » by nate33 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:42 pm

gtn130 wrote:
nate33 wrote:
DCZards wrote:
I am betting on the American people taking down the President. Have you seen his poll numbers lately? I believe they're only going to get worse.


The Rasmussen Reports daily Presidential Tracking Poll for Wednesday shows that 53% of Likely U.S. Voters approve of President Trump’s job performance. Forty-seven percent (47%) disapprove.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/trump_administration/prez_track_feb15


Oh, back to Rasmussen polls already.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/pollster-ratings/

Rasmussen was the second most accurate pollster regarding the Trump election.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1642 » by gtn130 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:50 pm

nate33 wrote:

Rasmussen was the second most accurate pollster regarding the Trump election.


We've already had this debate, and you've already made that terrible argument, which has already been defeated.

Citing ONLY a Rasmussen poll to make your argument is no different than if I claimed a huge majority of Americans approve of Obama's foreign policy legacy because of a Huffington Post poll.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1643 » by bealwithit » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:54 pm

So Trump just had an interesting "press conference" with Bibi.

Trump took 2 questions from extremely conservative networks, said he doesn't really care if there's a 2-state or 1-state solution, and that Flynn is a good man who was treated unfairly by leaks and the fake media because he beat Hillary in the election.

So decades of American foreign policy is just being thrown out? You don't care what happens, just as long as Israel and Palestine figure it out themselves? Which NEVER HAPPENS successfully?
If Flynn was such a good man who was just treated unfairly by the fake media -- why did you fire him? Why wouldn't you vouch for him?
Why would you imply that the intelligence community is only leaking these things because they wanted Hillary to win? What proof do you have of this? Why are you saying this? Do you not understand that this just makes you look worse to them?
Fake media? Then he only fields questions from garbage news organizations that will wash his feet with their softball trash.

Our president is a totally paranoid, nonsensical, lying, gaslighting idiot and I seriously lose respect for people that defend any of this garbage. He's an embarrassment.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1644 » by DCZards » Wed Feb 15, 2017 5:59 pm

dckingsfan wrote:
gtn130 wrote:
nate33 wrote:It wasn't baseless at the time, and there was no additional impugning of her integrity. Comey merely said that a bunch more emails came in and we needed to look at them.

LOL please, Nate. You don't actually believe this. The result of re-opening the case was that it created more noise, more scandal, more negativity around Hillary. Stop playing dumb.

Sadly, we are thinking that this is the reason Hillary lost. It wasn't. Her message didn't resonate with middle-America, she didn't campaign there...


Agree that Hillary's message didn't resonate in middle-America in the same way that Trump's message did. However, the voting results were so close in states such as Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania that it's not hard to believe that Clinton may have won those states if it were not for the fallout from the emails and Comey's intervention.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1645 » by Wizardspride » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:00 pm

Read on Twitter

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1646 » by AFM » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:06 pm

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2017-02-15/trump-offers-national-security-advisor-job-robert-harward-reuters

TRUMP HAS OFFERED NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISER JOB TO VICE ADMIRAL ROBERT HARWARD -SOURCES
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1647 » by bealwithit » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:06 pm

Wizardspride wrote:
Read on Twitter

Like honestly, the dude is calling the Russian ambassador 5 times and no one told him to do this or was aware of it? He was just... doing this by himself? For what reason? How did no one know about this?
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1648 » by DCZards » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:12 pm

From Gallup's Daily Tracking Poll -- This is how well President Trump's first few weeks in the Oval Office have gone, according to the American people:

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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1649 » by JWizmentality » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:12 pm

Is President dufus still attacking the intelligence community? You think they're done with the dirt? Have at it haus! Let me grab my popcorn.

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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1650 » by gtn130 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:14 pm

DCZards wrote:No commentary necessary.

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Gallup's Daily Tracking Poll

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FAKE NEWS!

"Things aren't as chaotic as the media would have you believe." - Trump Surrogate Nate
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1651 » by nate33 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:21 pm

gtn130 wrote:
nate33 wrote:
gtn130 wrote:
Oh, back to Rasmussen polls already.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/pollster-ratings/

Rasmussen was the second most accurate pollster regarding the Trump election.


We've already had this debate, and you've already made that terrible argument, which has already been defeated.

Citing ONLY a Rasmussen poll to make your argument is no different than if I claimed a huge majority of Americans approve of Obama's foreign policy legacy because of a Huffington Post poll.


Okay then:
Image
No change in his approval since the Flynn revelations, and his disapproval numbers have actually dropped. :lol:

Overall, his poll numbers have been pretty flat. His approval/disapproval was 42/51 after the Inauguration Day boost wore off by 1/27/17. It is currently 40/53. And that despite unrelenting negative press.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1652 » by gtn130 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:28 pm

nate33 wrote:
gtn130 wrote:
nate33 wrote:Rasmussen was the second most accurate pollster regarding the Trump election.


We've already had this debate, and you've already made that terrible argument, which has already been defeated.

Citing ONLY a Rasmussen poll to make your argument is no different than if I claimed a huge majority of Americans approve of Obama's foreign policy legacy because of a Huffington Post poll.


Okay then:
Image
No change in his approval since the Flynn revelations, and his disapproval numbers have actually dropped. :lol:

Overall, his poll numbers have been pretty flat. His approval/disapproval was 42/51 after the Inauguration Day boost wore off by 1/27/17. It is currently 40/53. And that despite unrelenting negative press.


Strong insights from Nate "kellyanne" 33
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1653 » by gtn130 » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:36 pm

Kellyanne33, his disapproval has not dropped. According to Gallup, the poll you're now citing, it has gone up:

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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1654 » by sfam » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:46 pm

Illuminaire wrote:
bealwithit wrote:Funny how the Trumpers justified the Wikileaks/DNC stuff by saying that the end result of a sketchy, rogue organization leaking private conversations of American citizens was worth it because of the information we ended up getting out of those emails... *snip*
There's so much smoke you HAVE to investigate for a fire. Otherwise the whole house is gonna burn down.


I completely get this. I do favor transparency. I will say that there is one huge difference between the two leaks (so far).

Wikileaks published all the information after scrubbing absolutely necessary things, so the result was a publicly available record that anyone could browse, research, and form their own opinions about.

These intelligence community leaks are almost entirely opaque by comparison. Only select members of the media are getting the actual facts, and all the public is getting is the media interpretation of those facts. We don't get to read the contents of those phone calls and decide for ourselves.

I'm not OK with that. If they want to be noble whistleblowers, provide the information so that people can decide for themselves what is the right understanding of it.

Wikileaks scrubbed nothing. They provided everyone's information - regular staffers and the like who had no part of this - totally in the public domain. They've done this continually.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1655 » by Wizardspride » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:46 pm

Read on Twitter

President Donald Trump referred to African countries, Haiti and El Salvador as "shithole" nations during a meeting Thursday and asked why the U.S. can't have more immigrants from Norway.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1656 » by sfam » Wed Feb 15, 2017 6:51 pm

nate33 wrote:I never said it didn't influence the election. I was just disagreeing with sfam that Comey was somehow lying or otherwise impugning her integrity.

Well again, Comey did this reportedly due to the leaks coming from the NY office. These leaks continued nonstop - they said repeatedly, which was on a daily spin cycle on Fox news - I'm pretty sure you say it - that Hillary was about to be indicted. Those were the leaks happening around the Comey letter from the FBI. They were completely baseless, and were done with the expressed purpose of discrediting a Presidential candidate.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1657 » by sfam » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:03 pm

FAH1223 wrote:
sfam wrote:This is a good overview, but I would dispute Assad's support. He was well on his way out, and losing most of his territory until Russia intervened. Bottom line though, you had a relatively modern country, with most citizens well educated and living fine with others of different backgrounds. Now you have a complete nightmarish situation, which most agree Assad bears the majority of the blame, but so too do Russia, Obama, Iran, Turkey and the rest of the Middle east.


I don't have polls or a guide. But the minority groups have supported the government intensely. Assad is still standing because the Sunni business class in Damascus and Aleppo still back him... if they didn't, he'd have been gone long ago.. and most Syrians do not want the alternative. Aleppo's population didn't back the rebel groups in 2012 and the western part of the city remained the government stronghold.

I don't think Assad is on his way out immediately. Russia is pressing with the diplomatic talks in Kazakhstan. Iran is participating but wants to win militarily. The Syrian government has a Ministry of Reconciliation which is granting amnesty to fighters after areas are beseiged and busing them to Idlib with their arms or disarming them and letting them stay or go to Damascus, Latakia, Tartus, Aleppo, etc.

Turkey has backed off on the "Assad must go" mantra.

I blame the rise in sectarianism not only on Assad releasing the psychos from the prisons but Saudi/Qatar financed groups and media by fostering Shia/Sunni tension which as you said is foreign to Syria's culture and history. It is a mainly Sunni Muslim country but has had harmony amongst all its people despite an authoritarian regime of the Assad family.


Assad isn't on his way out at all now. He absolutely was prior to the Russians joined in propping him up. I attended numerous roundtables on this - there really wasn't much support for Assad other than from his Alawite base. His brutal and repressive response turned public sentiment away from him. Unfortunately there was never a united anything in the way of resistance. And its sort of impossible to discuss Syria without discussing Iraq and the ISIS incursion.

My understanding is most minorities and tribes have been gauging their own safety almost continually and changing course based on this. In studying armed actor dispersion, you find very little in the way of ideology driving the changing allegiances. As Assad has been doing better, its not surprising his support increases.

Bottom line though, Russia changed the dynamic completely. They haven't been fighting terrorists, they've been propping up chemical weapons wielding Assad.

I don't know anyone who thinks there is a real chance of the civil war actually ending any time in the next decade.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1658 » by sfam » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:14 pm

Wizardspride wrote:
Read on Twitter

This is of course looney for a completely basic reason.

There are more Palestinians than Israelis, and their birth rate is higher, so if there is one state, this means:

1. Palestinians will eventually run it

2. It will have to engage in Apartheid

Neither of those solutions are viable.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1659 » by dckingsfan » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:17 pm

DCZards wrote:
dckingsfan wrote:
gtn130 wrote:LOL please, Nate. You don't actually believe this. The result of re-opening the case was that it created more noise, more scandal, more negativity around Hillary. Stop playing dumb.

Sadly, we are thinking that this is the reason Hillary lost. It wasn't. Her message didn't resonate with middle-America, she didn't campaign there...

Agree that Hillary's message didn't resonate in middle-America in the same way that Trump's message did. However, the voting results were so close in states such as Wisconsin, Michigan and Pennsylvania that it's not hard to believe that Clinton may have won those states if it were not for the fallout from the emails and Comey's intervention.

Well, I would put it a different way. If she had run even a slightly better campaign without the "deplorables" comment, she would have won. She was the wrong candidate without a resonating message.

But this isn't just happening in the presidential elections. House Republicans won popular vote by over 3 million votes. And you can look at what is happening to the governorships.

If Ds are going to with the presidency, they need candidates like the Bill Clinton (its the economy stupid) and Obama (hope & change) to take some of those red states.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XII 

Post#1660 » by sfam » Wed Feb 15, 2017 7:19 pm

JWizmentality wrote:Is President dufus still attacking the intelligence community? You think they're done with the dirt? Have at it haus! Let me grab my popcorn.

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Its starting to become clear why Trump has been attacking the Intelligence community - he may know they have the goods on him. Now that they're leaking it out, Trump has to be more than a little concerned.

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