The (Quintessential) Trade Thread, 2017 (Part 5.0)

[London2Boston]

I'm so bored of the I.T trade debate. Who were we going to draft if we tanked harder? Okafor, Willie Stein, Mudiay, Hezonja? Maybe Frank Kaminsky or Winslow? Give me Thomas gift wrapped over any of those dudes..

[CelticFaninLBC]

My opinion on this dude hasn't moved an inch. Can't win a title with him in a starring role, because you have to marry yourself to a ceiling just to do that. He can be on the floor to help close games like Jamal Crawford is, but like Crawford, the dude is best suited to a 6th man role on a real team.

And resigning him to $25-30m a year contract that will play out on the wrong side of 30 years old? That's debatable.

Can you provide a list of "real teams?"

There are no moves that put us above healthy Warriors, Spurs or Cavs teams this year.

How about next year and 2018-19? You can't be the best team overnight. Steph got his ass kicked for his first 6 years in the league.

[Darth Celtic]

Read on Twitter

If he's available for cheap he could really help the C's

Makes 7 million next year, 0% chance we trade for him unless we make a big splash and use up our cap space next year first. Next.

[DarkAzcura]

Our team has won 17 titles with guys like Russell, Bird, Cowens and KG. If you don't have guys of that caliber, and we most certainly do not, you are not winning a title, and that's all there is to it.

Underline those last two sentences and read them again and again and again if you need to. That should not even need to be explained to a Boston sports fan, IMO. Everything you do in rebuilding should be geared towards getting one of those guys.
.

The 3 Pistons titles and the recent Warriors one were won without any players much better than IT.

However, those teams each had a second-best player far ahead of Bradley/Crowder/Horford/Smart.

Total disrespect to Steph Curry.

Guy made the HOF by age 28 and could easily pass Larry Bird in the pantheon sooner rather than later.

I mean calling Thomas Crawford is pretty damn disrespectful also. Thomas is a hell of a lot closer to Curry than Crawford is to Thomas.

[CelticFaninLBC]

I'm so bored of the I.T trade debate. Who were we going to draft if we tanked harder? Okafor, Willie Stein, Mudiay, Hezonja? Maybe Frank Kaminsky or Winslow? Give me Thomas gift wrapped over any of those dudes..

They could have had Winslow or Booker, I guess. I'll take IT and Crowder over either. What Caveman is essentially advocating is not adding Crowder either, who helped win games that year too.

[Captain_Caveman]

I'm so bored of the I.T trade debate. Who were we going to draft if we tanked harder? Okafor, Willie Stein, Mudiay, Hezonja? Maybe Frank Kaminsky or Winslow? Give me Thomas gift wrapped over any of those dudes..

The choice is between one of those guys and Terry Rozier, though. That's a big, big difference when we are talking about all the major trades that haven't happened since then. Pretty sure there may have been a few threads about them since then.

FWIW, IT was freely available to absolutely any team that wanted him in the 2011 draft, again in free agency in 2014, and again at the 2015 trade deadline. The idea that he would have been a super difficult get 28 games later is unrealistic to me.

[CelticFaninLBC]

Read on Twitter

If he's available for cheap he could really help the C's

Makes 7 million next year, 0% chance we trade for him unless we make a big splash and use up our cap space next year first. Next.

Yep, I suspect McBuckets, who makes $3.3 million next year, is a lot more likely.

[Captain_Caveman]

I'm so bored of the I.T trade debate. Who were we going to draft if we tanked harder? Okafor, Willie Stein, Mudiay, Hezonja? Maybe Frank Kaminsky or Winslow? Give me Thomas gift wrapped over any of those dudes..

They could have had Winslow or Booker, I guess. I'll take IT and Crowder over either. What Caveman is essentially advocating is not adding Crowder either, who helped win games that year too.

Absolutely not true. I was one of the very, very few who supported the Rondo trade in real time (along with humblebum, ironically). 90% of you thought we got jacked and cried and cried and cried about it.

Also worth mentioning that you can trade for whoever you want as long as you do what every other tanking team does and sit people with minor injuries. I was rarely particularly vocal about the IT trade itself as opposed to the fact that we didn't shut it down after starting that year 16-30.

[bucknersrevenge]

I think you HAVE to resign IT now. Have to. Earlier in the year when all the defensive numbers on IT were starting to come out and we were playing pretty uneven ball in December, I was thinking that maybe we might just let Isaiah walk away. IT was scoring like 24-25 a game and we were still pretty inconsistent. But since then he has just blown up to an unstoppable, MVP-esque level. At this point, you just can't deny him anymore. You can't trade him because his valuation and his salary are so ridiculously mismatched. But Ainge has always talked about how hard it is to find legit scorers in this league. IT is most certainly legit and to let him walk away after his deal is done would be to completely burn the asset. I don't know if he gets the max, but Danny is not gonna let him walk out of the door. Affix him with the proper valuation and that way, if in 3 years Danny wants to move him he'll be at a number more befitting his value.

As it relates to this deadline, nothing is gonna happen. Nothing much anyway. If you think about it for a second, this roster still has not played together with everyone healthy yet, and yet this is a vastly improved team over the last 6 weeks. To get Bradley and Brown back after the All-star break offers us a chance with a favorable schedule to really see how strong we can finish heading into the playoffs. Myself I'm not worried about whether we are the 5th best team, 4th best 11th best or whatever. That number doesn't really matter right now anyway. All that matters is that we are a young, vastly improving team in a position to add a ton of REAL talent over the next couple of years and people around the NBA are really starting to take notice.

[Captain_Caveman]

Can you provide a list of "real teams?"

There are no moves that put us above healthy Warriors, Spurs or Cavs teams this year.

How about next year and 2018-19? You can't be the best team overnight. Steph got his ass kicked for his first 6 years in the league.

4th year in the league he led a team to the 2nd round in a historically good conference on a badly injured leg. Won 51 games the next year and would have made the 2nd round if not for having no center. Won the title and MVP in his 6th year.

[Darth Celtic]

People say IT isn't good enough to start on a championship team.

Then they say.

We should have tanked harder and not traded for IT that year because he single handedly took a 16-30 team to the playoffs in 1/3 of a season........



Somebody tell me more about this thread. Just STFU and talk about trades to make this team better. This is the trade thread, not if we should have made a trade 3 **** years ago. The DICKSLAPPING in this thread is REAL!

[Captain_Caveman]

People say IT isn't good enough to start on a championship team.

Then they say.

We should have tanked harder and not traded for IT that year because he single handedly took a 16-30 team to the playoffs in 1/3 of a season........



Somebody tell me more about this thread. Just STFU and talk about trades to make this team better. This is the trade thread, not if we should have made a trade 3 **** years ago. The DICKSLAPPING in this thread is REAL!

He took us to the 7th seed in the worst year any conference has ever had before we got DICKSLAPPED by the Cavs.

Fine... I like IT well enough, but if you guys are set on it, let's do this.

Read on Twitter

None of the true Celtic greats would have ever spoke in this manner. 17 titles, 0 scoring champions, despite having guys like Bird who could have won them at will.

Dude is playing for accolades and a max contract.

We may be able to work with that going forward. No question he can close games like a **** against non-elite teams. Reminiscent of the Derrick Rose MVP year in some respects.

But that's not the "goal".

[London2Boston]

There are no moves that put us above healthy Warriors, Spurs or Cavs teams this year.

How about next year and 2018-19? You can't be the best team overnight. Steph got his ass kicked for his first 6 years in the league.

4th year in the league he led a team to the 2nd round in a historically good conference on a badly injured leg. Won 51 games the next year and would have made the 2nd round if not for having no center. Won the title and MVP in his 6th year.

Won the title by facing team after team ravaged by injuries. You can only beat what is in front of you and fair enough as they were damn good, but we saw what healthy Kyrie did to him in the finals. We saw the Cavs bullying and targeting him every time possible. He had 2 other all star quality guys on his team and one being a DPOY candidate. It was a greatly built team, but I still say none of those players on the team would undeniably make any team a contender without other all star talent, which is what Thomas is currently being judged on.

Even KD, who is probably the closest on the current roster to being able to do that couldn't get it done with a certified stud Guard next to him.

[London2Boston]

People say IT isn't good enough to start on a championship team.

Then they say.

We should have tanked harder and not traded for IT that year because he single handedly took a 16-30 team to the playoffs in 1/3 of a season........



Somebody tell me more about this thread. Just STFU and talk about trades to make this team better. This is the trade thread, not if we should have made a trade 3 **** years ago. The DICKSLAPPING in this thread is REAL!

He took us to the 7th seed in the worst year any conference has ever had before we got DICKSLAPPED by the Cavs.

Fine... I like IT well enough, but if you guys are set on it, let's do this.

Read on Twitter

None of the true Celtic greats would have ever spoke in this manner. 17 titles, 0 scoring champions, despite having guys like Bird who could have won them at will.

Dude is playing for accolades and a max contract.

We may be able to work with that going forward. No question he can close games like a **** against non-elite teams. Reminiscent of the Derrick Rose MVP year in some respects.

But that's not the "goal".

Oh come on. No Celtic would have took pride in or aimed for being the absolute best in the league at something? He's hardly doing a Melo and scoring points to the downfall of the team is he?

[Captain_Caveman]

How about next year and 2018-19? You can't be the best team overnight. Steph got his ass kicked for his first 6 years in the league.

4th year in the league he led a team to the 2nd round in a historically good conference on a badly injured leg. Won 51 games the next year and would have made the 2nd round if not for having no center. Won the title and MVP in his 6th year.

Won the title by facing team after team ravaged by injuries. You can only beat what is in front of you and fair enough as they were damn good, but we saw what healthy Kyrie did to him in the finals. We saw the Cavs bullying and targeting him every time possible. He had 2 other all star quality guys on his team and one being a DPOY candidate. It was a greatly built team, but I still say none of those players on the team would undeniably make any team a contender without other all star talent, which is what Thomas is currently being judged on.

Even KD, who is probably the closest on the current roster to being able to do that couldn't get it done with a certified stud Guard next to him.

OK, but they did win the title and the guy's claim about him getting his ass kicked for his 1st 6 years is not only demonstrably false, it applies with much more accuracy to Jordan and LeBron, who are arguably the best two players ever.

Truth of the matter is, after dealing with injuries on a dysfunctional team for 3 years in his early 20s, Curry was killing for thrills by year 4.

[Captain_Caveman]

Oh come on. No Celtic would have took pride in or aimed for being the absolute best in the league at something? He's hardly doing a Melo and scoring points to the downfall of the team is he?

Not as the Celts are currently constructed (aka a team of defensive role players that cannot win it all due to a lack of star power).

But if we are being real, there's at least a little bit of a red flag with his multiple brinks trunk comments and essentially saying that his "goal" is to outscore a very selfish Westbrook down the stretch of this season.

[bucknersrevenge]

People say IT isn't good enough to start on a championship team.

Then they say.

We should have tanked harder and not traded for IT that year because he single handedly took a 16-30 team to the playoffs in 1/3 of a season........



Somebody tell me more about this thread. Just STFU and talk about trades to make this team better. This is the trade thread, not if we should have made a trade 3 **** years ago. The DICKSLAPPING in this thread is REAL!

He took us to the 7th seed in the worst year any conference has ever had before we got DICKSLAPPED by the Cavs.

Fine... I like IT well enough, but if you guys are set on it, let's do this.

Read on Twitter

None of the true Celtic greats would have ever spoke in this manner. 17 titles, 0 scoring champions, despite having guys like Bird who could have won them at will.

Dude is playing for accolades and a max contract.

We may be able to work with that going forward. No question he can close games like a **** against non-elite teams. Reminiscent of the Derrick Rose MVP year in some respects.

But that's not the "goal".

Hmmm...that quote is taken out of context. After that sentence he said something to the effect of "Yeah I'm confident that I can do it. But that's NOT the goal. If I get it, I get it. If I don't, I don't." Someone completely rearranged that quote.

EDIT: After seeing the interview, he said that, but what he also said was "I'm confident I can but like I said I'm not chasin that. Maybe it happens, maybe it doesn't....etc" Then he spoke with reverence about having his name mentioned with All-time Celtic greats. He knos his job here is to score with this team. So he wants to be the best at that but he also makes it clear that it's all about the winning. And to say none of the Celtics greats would have spoken like he has is just silly. Bird spoke like him and worse all the time. Bird was beyond confident. He was cocky. He knew he was great and didn't mind telling you; on or off the court.

Watch on YouTube

[Ben-N1ce]

Read on Twitter

If he's available for cheap he could really help the C's

Makes 7 million next year, 0% chance we trade for him unless we make a big splash and use up our cap space next year first. Next.

How is 7 million a lot for a guy that can drop 20+ on any given night when a total worthless scrub like Zeller makes 8 million...

[bucknersrevenge]

Oh come on. No Celtic would have took pride in or aimed for being the absolute best in the league at something? He's hardly doing a Melo and scoring points to the downfall of the team is he?

Not as the Celts are currently constructed (aka a team of defensive role players that cannot win it all due to a lack of star power).

But if we are being real, there's at least a little bit of a red flag with his multiple brinks trunk comments and essentially saying that his "goal" is to outscore a very selfish Westbrook down the stretch of this season.

To my knowledge he only said it once. The other couple of times it came up is when reporters asked him to comment on it in subsequent interviews. Danny even had a big laugh about it. That's not a comment to get bent about whatsoever. Honestly, IT's making a shade under 6.6million this season and that number actually goes DOWN next season believe it or not. Given the rate money is flying around these days, if that's the worst comment he makes I give him credit for remarkable restraint.

[Captain_Caveman]

People say IT isn't good enough to start on a championship team.

Then they say.

We should have tanked harder and not traded for IT that year because he single handedly took a 16-30 team to the playoffs in 1/3 of a season........



Somebody tell me more about this thread. Just STFU and talk about trades to make this team better. This is the trade thread, not if we should have made a trade 3 **** years ago. The DICKSLAPPING in this thread is REAL!

He took us to the 7th seed in the worst year any conference has ever had before we got DICKSLAPPED by the Cavs.

Fine... I like IT well enough, but if you guys are set on it, let's do this.

Read on Twitter

None of the true Celtic greats would have ever spoke in this manner. 17 titles, 0 scoring champions, despite having guys like Bird who could have won them at will.

Dude is playing for accolades and a max contract.

We may be able to work with that going forward. No question he can close games like a **** against non-elite teams. Reminiscent of the Derrick Rose MVP year in some respects.

But that's not the "goal".

Hmmm...that quote is taken out of context. After that sentence he said something to the effect of "Yeah I'm confident that I can do it. But that's NOT the goal. If I get it, I get it. If I don't, I don't." Someone completely rearranged that quote.

EDIT: After seeing the interview, he said that, but what he also said was "I'm confident I can but like I said I'm not chasin that. Maybe it happens, maybe it doesn't....etc" Then he spoke with reverence about having his name mentioned with All-time Celtic greats. He knos his job here is to score with this team. So he wants to be the best at that but he also makes it clear that it's all about the winning. And to say none of the Celtics greats would have spoken like he has is just silly. Bird spoke like him and worse all the time. Bird was beyond confident. He was cocky. He knew he was great and didn't mind telling you; on or off the court.

Watch on YouTube

Right on, glad to hear it. Doesn't sit well with me as quoted, and my bad for not reading into it more.

As to past Celtic greats, or any Patriot greats, Bird spoke competitively, for the most part. He certainly didn't play like a guy concerned with scoring championships.