Ultimate Lack of Effort/Desire

[NuggetsWY]

I've watched this 5 times today. It's all over the internet. I've never seen anything like it. Sure, I've seen 4 or 5 seconds roll off like this, but 23 seconds? That's pathetic.

http://www.foxsports.com/nba/story/watch-ty-lawson-make-a-mockery-of-the-denver-nuggets-during-inbounds-play-022417

23 seconds wasted with less than 3 minutes to go and the Nuggets down by 11. The Nuggets just don't seem to care.
Nelson stood just past half court as Lawson let the ball slowly roll with the clock running but the shot clock sitting at 24 seconds. Can you imagine any competitive super-star allowing that? Michael Jordan would have probably run down and smacked Nelson on the head and body-blocked Lawson off the ball just to get at the ball. How about Kevin Garnett? The list goes on.

Nuggets just don't seem to care - they show no passion except when they might get a shot. But that's just my opinion.

[U hova]

Seems like everyone finally has fun after they leave Denver

[The Rebel]

That is something that has always bugged me about Jokic, although he does show the fire occasionally it is rare. That was also the thing I loved about Nurkic, he had no problem going after anybody or fighting for the win. Gallo, Nelson, Faried, Chandler, and Barton have never shown that fire on a consistent basis.

[NuggetsWY]

That is something that has always bugged me about Jokic, although he does show the fire occasionally it is rare. That was also the thing I loved about Nurkic, he had no problem going after anybody or fighting for the win. Gallo, Nelson, Faried, Chandler, and Barton have never shown that fire on a consistent basis.

Totally agree - I'd love to see him dunk more - be aggressive & assertive but I guess that's hard to do with the coach looking for excuses to yank you from the game.

Same thing goes for Murray & even more so for Hernangomez and forget Beasley (Malone has). 30+ mpg is sort of the region of "top players in the league." Not even Harris gets those minutes, only Gallinari and barely Chandler. Injuries do not affect ppg much, just games played. The Nuggets currently have a stat I've never seen before: 8 players averaging over 24 mpg. That's 8 players that are playing more than half the game. Without injuries, that's almost impossible. If every starter played just over 24 mpg, then three bench players played just over 24 mpg and the rest of the players played less than 24 mpg, it's possible but highly unlikely. What does that mean? It means Malone doesn't have a consistent rotation after two years and please don't drink his kool-aid of "3 rookies". Murray has averaged 20 mpg and Hernangomez 14 with a few DNP while Beasley averages 5 mpg but has only played in 18 games.

[LightTheBeam]

That is something that has always bugged me about Jokic, although he does show the fire occasionally it is rare. That was also the thing I loved about Nurkic, he had no problem going after anybody or fighting for the win. Gallo, Nelson, Faried, Chandler, and Barton have never shown that fire on a consistent basis.

Totally agree - I'd love to see him dunk more - be aggressive & assertive but I guess that's hard to do with the coach looking for excuses to yank you from the game.

Same thing goes for Murray & even more so for Hernangomez and forget Beasley (Malone has). 30+ mpg is sort of the region of "top players in the league." Not even Harris gets those minutes, only Gallinari and barely Chandler. Injuries do not affect ppg much, just games played. The Nuggets currently have a stat I've never seen before: 8 players averaging over 24 mpg. That's 8 players that are playing more than half the game. Without injuries, that's almost impossible. If every starter played just over 24 mpg, then three bench players played just over 24 mpg and the rest of the players played less than 24 mpg, it's possible but highly unlikely. What does that mean? It means Malone doesn't have a consistent rotation after two years and please don't drink his kool-aid of "3 rookies". Murray has averaged 20 mpg and Hernangomez 14 with a few DNP while Beasley averages 5 mpg but has only played in 18 games.

Yea.. I feel your pain. Malone as a coach wants to win every game. He will play crappy vets bigger minutes because he feels they give him the best chance to win. I remember it with Travis outlaw and Marcus Thornton.

The Nuggets are in that odd position, having some good vets on the team that could bring in some trade value. Also having some really good youngsters that need time to develop. With Malone I'm sure he prefers to play the vets but management wants him to give time to the rooks.

I would have liked to have seen Denver move Barton/Chandler/Gallo/Faried and try to get a young sf and pf. Something like Gallo/Chandler to the rockets for Decker/Harrell. Then fire Malone before making the Nurkic trade. Hire a coach better suited for player development and go. Move Faried and Barton over the summer trying to move up in the draft.

Jokic/Nurkic
Harrell/Hernangomez
Decker/Beasley
Harris/Murray
Mudiay

Draft a pg at the top of the draft and probably a pf with the Memphis pick you had. Keep Arthur/Jameer as positive vets.

Either way good luck to you guys, always liked the Nuggets.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using RealGM mobile app

[The Rebel]

That is something that has always bugged me about Jokic, although he does show the fire occasionally it is rare. That was also the thing I loved about Nurkic, he had no problem going after anybody or fighting for the win. Gallo, Nelson, Faried, Chandler, and Barton have never shown that fire on a consistent basis.

Totally agree - I'd love to see him dunk more - be aggressive & assertive but I guess that's hard to do with the coach looking for excuses to yank you from the game.

Same thing goes for Murray & even more so for Hernangomez and forget Beasley (Malone has). 30+ mpg is sort of the region of "top players in the league." Not even Harris gets those minutes, only Gallinari and barely Chandler. Injuries do not affect ppg much, just games played. The Nuggets currently have a stat I've never seen before: 8 players averaging over 24 mpg. That's 8 players that are playing more than half the game. Without injuries, that's almost impossible. If every starter played just over 24 mpg, then three bench players played just over 24 mpg and the rest of the players played less than 24 mpg, it's possible but highly unlikely. What does that mean? It means Malone doesn't have a consistent rotation after two years and please don't drink his kool-aid of "3 rookies". Murray has averaged 20 mpg and Hernangomez 14 with a few DNP while Beasley averages 5 mpg but has only played in 18 games.

Yea.. I feel your pain. Malone as a coach wants to win every game. He will play crappy vets bigger minutes because he feels they give him the best chance to win. I remember it with Travis outlaw and Marcus Thornton.

The Nuggets are in that odd position, having some good vets on the team that could bring in some trade value. Also having some really good youngsters that need time to develop. With Malone I'm sure he prefers to play the vets but management wants him to give time to the rooks.

I would have liked to have seen Denver move Barton/Chandler/Gallo/Faried and try to get a young sf and pf. Something like Gallo/Chandler to the rockets for Decker/Harrell. Then fire Malone before making the Nurkic trade. Hire a coach better suited for player development and go. Move Faried and Barton over the summer trying to move up in the draft.

Jokic/Nurkic
Harrell/Hernangomez
Decker/Beasley
Harris/Murray
Mudiay

Draft a pg at the top of the draft and probably a pf with the Memphis pick you had. Keep Arthur/Jameer as positive vets.

Either way good luck to you guys, always liked the Nuggets.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using RealGM mobile app

When he is allowed to play his game Murray is actually a scoring PG, but Malone lets Barton basically run the point and has Murray playing off the ball all the damn time. The handful of times Murray has actually been allowed to play point he plays well and the offense does as well.

Malone is a weird guy, he comes off as a great, knowledgeable coach in most interviews and is supposed to be a players and defensive coach, yet he has publicly feuded with several of the players and our defense is the worst in the league. He also obviously has either no control over the veterans or is an idiot, and I personally think it is lack of control because he seems smart enough in interviews I have heard. Yet the veterans all seem to do whatever they feel like doing.

The crazy thing is our young guys all look great and seem to be playing within the system. When Chandler, Gallo, Faried, and Barton were out of the games before the all star break the offense ran smoothly and they did a great job, with them the offense is a series of iso plays with the occasional play run with Jokic getting the ball at the top of the key, about once every 5-7 plays.

Jameer is actually the 2nd worst offender with doing what he wants and ignoring the way the offense is supposed to be run, with gallo the worst and Barton a close 3rd. While you had a range of fans wanting different things, there was really 3 groups, those that only wanted to move 1 veteran (mainly Gallo or Nelson), some of us that were hoping for 3 guys (one of Barton or Nelson, 1 of Chandler or Gallo, and 1 of Arthur or Faried), and a couple that wanted all the veterans gone.

While the win against the Warriors was basically a fluke, as everybody seemed to get very hot from 3 on the same night, the ball movement and defense were not flukes. It was the young guys doing what they are supposed to do, playing within the system on both ends, and putting in max effort. I have said for weeks that removing some of the vets would make this team better and I still believe that, those are the guys giving constant effort. Even with some of them overthinking things and making mistakes there is really no question that Murray, Mudiay, Beasley, and HernanGomez are giving max effort when they are on the court.

Allowing Lawson to pull that ball rolling trick that he learned from Billups in Denver was just a terrible example of the lack of effort from some of the veterans especially on defense. The young guys would not have let that happen if they were allowed to play.

[darivo]

yesterday vs Nets, i made a gif based on lack defensive effort



take note on Gallo, that is the extra man in 2vs1 vs Lopez in the low post, and he recovers to the weak side, to cover Lin.

He defended with high energy and stops the first run to the basket and the step back to the 3pt line.

also he stayed near of Lin when he finally went to the basket.

Very high defensive effort.

But Faried........


when you plays basketball and you gives everything on defense, but you dont see your teammates with this energy the next time maybe you will be less intense

[NuggetsWY]

take note on Gallo, that is the extra man in 2vs1 vs Lopez in the low post, and he recovers to the weak side, to cover Lin.

He defended with high energy and stops the first run to the basket and the step back to the 3pt line.

also he stayed near of Lin when he finally went to the basket.

Very high defensive effort.

But Faried........

when you plays basketball and you gives everything on defense, but you dont see your teammates with this energy the next time maybe you will be less intense

I've always contended that when he wants to, Gallinari can be a rather good, bordering on great defender - unfortunately he doesn't seem to want to very often. Maybe it's just dissatisfaction with the Nuggets' defense over the last 4 years.

Fairied has never been known as a good defender. At the start of this year, he was out of the starting lineup and seemed to hustle more on defense. He wasn't great, but wasn't bad. That only lasted a month or so from what I can see. We may have the worst defense in the league, but just think how bad it would be if we hadn't hired a very defensive-minded head coach.

[NuggetsWY]

Malone as a coach wants to win every game. He will play crappy vets bigger minutes because he feels they give him the best chance to win. I remember it with Travis outlaw and Marcus Thornton.

When he is allowed to play his game Murray is actually a scoring PG, but Malone lets Barton basically run the point and has Murray playing off the ball all the damn time. The handful of times Murray has actually been allowed to play point he plays well and the offense does as well.

<snip>

The crazy thing is our young guys all look great and seem to be playing within the system. When Chandler, Gallo, Faried, and Barton were out of the games before the all star break the offense ran smoothly and they did a great job, with them the offense is a series of iso plays with the occasional play run with Jokic getting the ball at the top of the key, about once every 5-7 plays.

<snip>

While the win against the Warriors was basically a fluke, as everybody seemed to get very hot from 3 on the same night, the ball movement and defense were not flukes. It was the young guys doing what they are supposed to do, playing within the system on both ends, and putting in max effort. I have said for weeks that removing some of the vets would make this team better and I still believe that, those are the guys giving constant effort. Even with some of them overthinking things and making mistakes there is really no question that Murray, Mudiay, Beasley, and HernanGomez are giving max effort when they are on the court.

Allowing Lawson to pull that ball rolling trick that he learned from Billups in Denver was just a terrible example of the lack of effort from some of the veterans especially on defense. The young guys would not have let that happen if they were allowed to play.

Hey Rebel, if RipPizzaGuy weren't a Kings's fan, I'd like this guy - he might even make a reasonable honorary Nuggets fan.

Sounds like his analysis is much the same as what some of our people have been saying. We make fun of the Kings' front office, and rightfully so. However, what does it say when they fired Malone faster than the Nuggets did. <sigh>

[LightTheBeam]

Totally agree - I'd love to see him dunk more - be aggressive & assertive but I guess that's hard to do with the coach looking for excuses to yank you from the game.

Same thing goes for Murray & even more so for Hernangomez and forget Beasley (Malone has). 30+ mpg is sort of the region of "top players in the league." Not even Harris gets those minutes, only Gallinari and barely Chandler. Injuries do not affect ppg much, just games played. The Nuggets currently have a stat I've never seen before: 8 players averaging over 24 mpg. That's 8 players that are playing more than half the game. Without injuries, that's almost impossible. If every starter played just over 24 mpg, then three bench players played just over 24 mpg and the rest of the players played less than 24 mpg, it's possible but highly unlikely. What does that mean? It means Malone doesn't have a consistent rotation after two years and please don't drink his kool-aid of "3 rookies". Murray has averaged 20 mpg and Hernangomez 14 with a few DNP while Beasley averages 5 mpg but has only played in 18 games.

Yea.. I feel your pain. Malone as a coach wants to win every game. He will play crappy vets bigger minutes because he feels they give him the best chance to win. I remember it with Travis outlaw and Marcus Thornton.

The Nuggets are in that odd position, having some good vets on the team that could bring in some trade value. Also having some really good youngsters that need time to develop. With Malone I'm sure he prefers to play the vets but management wants him to give time to the rooks.

I would have liked to have seen Denver move Barton/Chandler/Gallo/Faried and try to get a young sf and pf. Something like Gallo/Chandler to the rockets for Decker/Harrell. Then fire Malone before making the Nurkic trade. Hire a coach better suited for player development and go. Move Faried and Barton over the summer trying to move up in the draft.

Jokic/Nurkic
Harrell/Hernangomez
Decker/Beasley
Harris/Murray
Mudiay

Draft a pg at the top of the draft and probably a pf with the Memphis pick you had. Keep Arthur/Jameer as positive vets.

Either way good luck to you guys, always liked the Nuggets.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N920A using RealGM mobile app

When he is allowed to play his game Murray is actually a scoring PG, but Malone lets Barton basically run the point and has Murray playing off the ball all the damn time. The handful of times Murray has actually been allowed to play point he plays well and the offense does as well.

Malone is a weird guy, he comes off as a great, knowledgeable coach in most interviews and is supposed to be a players and defensive coach, yet he has publicly feuded with several of the players and our defense is the worst in the league. He also obviously has either no control over the veterans or is an idiot, and I personally think it is lack of control because he seems smart enough in interviews I have heard. Yet the veterans all seem to do whatever they feel like doing.

The crazy thing is our young guys all look great and seem to be playing within the system. When Chandler, Gallo, Faried, and Barton were out of the games before the all star break the offense ran smoothly and they did a great job, with them the offense is a series of iso plays with the occasional play run with Jokic getting the ball at the top of the key, about once every 5-7 plays.

Jameer is actually the 2nd worst offender with doing what he wants and ignoring the way the offense is supposed to be run, with gallo the worst and Barton a close 3rd. While you had a range of fans wanting different things, there was really 3 groups, those that only wanted to move 1 veteran (mainly Gallo or Nelson), some of us that were hoping for 3 guys (one of Barton or Nelson, 1 of Chandler or Gallo, and 1 of Arthur or Faried), and a couple that wanted all the veterans gone.

While the win against the Warriors was basically a fluke, as everybody seemed to get very hot from 3 on the same night, the ball movement and defense were not flukes. It was the young guys doing what they are supposed to do, playing within the system on both ends, and putting in max effort. I have said for weeks that removing some of the vets would make this team better and I still believe that, those are the guys giving constant effort. Even with some of them overthinking things and making mistakes there is really no question that Murray, Mudiay, Beasley, and HernanGomez are giving max effort when they are on the court.

Allowing Lawson to pull that ball rolling trick that he learned from Billups in Denver was just a terrible example of the lack of effort from some of the veterans especially on defense. The young guys would not have let that happen if they were allowed to play.

Ya I wondered about murray being a pg or a 2g. He certainly has better size to play the 1 so if that works out great.

Ya I loved his interviews, he always said the right thing. Problem was we didn't see that translate on the court. People forget he won 28 games in his first season in Sac. It wasn't like this guy was the next popovich. Ideally he should probably be a #1 assistant coach.

Ya Jokic with his passing ability and touch should have the ball run through him. Considering the rest of the team is very athletic letting him run through the high post would really seem to work.

I think that's the problem with being in between veterans and young guys. The vets always give lazy efforts because they don't think the team is committed to winning at least imo.

What do you think the chances Gallo resigns with Denver are? Would you guys personally want him back? I honestly pegged him as gone last contract and he resigned so I can speak on it.

I heard reports you guys made a monster offer for Paul George, I wonder if that offer was based around young guys like Murray+ in an attempt to contend or if it was an offer vets for vets. Any idea?

[LightTheBeam]

Malone as a coach wants to win every game. He will play crappy vets bigger minutes because he feels they give him the best chance to win. I remember it with Travis outlaw and Marcus Thornton.

When he is allowed to play his game Murray is actually a scoring PG, but Malone lets Barton basically run the point and has Murray playing off the ball all the damn time. The handful of times Murray has actually been allowed to play point he plays well and the offense does as well.

<snip>

The crazy thing is our young guys all look great and seem to be playing within the system. When Chandler, Gallo, Faried, and Barton were out of the games before the all star break the offense ran smoothly and they did a great job, with them the offense is a series of iso plays with the occasional play run with Jokic getting the ball at the top of the key, about once every 5-7 plays.

<snip>

While the win against the Warriors was basically a fluke, as everybody seemed to get very hot from 3 on the same night, the ball movement and defense were not flukes. It was the young guys doing what they are supposed to do, playing within the system on both ends, and putting in max effort. I have said for weeks that removing some of the vets would make this team better and I still believe that, those are the guys giving constant effort. Even with some of them overthinking things and making mistakes there is really no question that Murray, Mudiay, Beasley, and HernanGomez are giving max effort when they are on the court.

Allowing Lawson to pull that ball rolling trick that he learned from Billups in Denver was just a terrible example of the lack of effort from some of the veterans especially on defense. The young guys would not have let that happen if they were allowed to play.

Hey Rebel, if RipPizzaGuy weren't a Kings's fan, I'd like this guy - he might even make a reasonable honorary Nuggets fan.

Sounds like his analysis is much the same as what some of our people have been saying. We make fun of the Kings' front office, and rightfully so. However, what does it say when they fired Malone faster than the Nuggets did. <sigh>

When we were talking about trading Cousins, I was really hoping the Nuggets were gonna get him. I didn't know how the Jokic/Cousins fit would work but I wanted to see him and Malone reunite!

[NuggetsWY]

<snip>
Ya I loved his interviews, he always said the right thing. Problem was we didn't see that translate on the court. People forget he won 28 games in his first season in Sac. It wasn't like this guy was the next popovich. Ideally he should probably be a #1 assistant coach.

Ya Jokic with his passing ability and touch should have the ball run through him. Considering the rest of the team is very athletic letting him run through the high post would really seem to work.

I think that's the problem with being in between veterans and young guys. The vets always give lazy efforts because they don't think the team is committed to winning at least imo.

What do you think the chances Gallo resigns with Denver are? Would you guys personally want him back? I honestly pegged him as gone last contract and he resigned so I can speak on it.

I heard reports you guys made a monster offer for Paul George, I wonder if that offer was based around young guys like Murray+ in an attempt to contend or if it was an offer vets for vets. Any idea?

Apparently the Nuggets don't have a direction, not that anyone can identify anyway. Chandler's complaint was "inconsistently". I thought it might be not knowing whether he would be a backup or starter from game to game and/or a PF or SF. Faried was a little upset over losing his starting spot (several times). We are past 1.5 years and we finally have our starting center but nobody knows who are PF is and Gallinari is our starting SF when he isn't injured but his backup might be Chandler or Barton. SG is Harris with Barton as a backup unless Murray is his backup. PG has been Mudiay but now it's Nelson and either one was backup but now the backup is Barton even though Murray has been a PG all his life until 1 year at Kentucky and this year. He's probably got the best handles on the team.

Gallinari says he wants to finish his career in Denver (Chandler & Faried have said that at one point also). They plus Arthur gave the team a discount for sure. Will Gallinari stay? Nobody knows because Gallinari hasn't said "guarantee" and he probably can't until the team says "guarantee" but they haven't said that so ... ... I don't want Faried or Arthur or Gallinari or Chandler or Barton or Nelson not because I don't like them but because Malone plays them too much. Gallinari leads the team in minutes but he misses games with injury. Reduced minutes might eliminate missed games but Malone doesn't do that.

Not sure what was offered for Paul George. Rumors say Murray might have been involved but that was what the Pacers wanted. Many of us would love George but not many would include Murray.

Untouchable, absolutely, totally, completely --- Jokic (((unless our front office is really stupid
Highly unlikely to be made available ------------ Murray
Probably not available unless a SG like Butler is included --- Harris
anyone else would be available for Paul George IMO.

[NuggetsWY]

When we were talking about trading Cousins, I was really hoping the Nuggets were gonna get him. I didn't know how the Jokic/Cousins fit would work but I wanted to see him and Malone reunite!

I was hoping Denver wouldn't get him. I get that Cousins is a great talent and that off the court he is a great man and great for the community, but I can give you 17 technicals as to how much he can hurt a team, not counting other stars not wanting to sign, etc.