2016-17 MVP Discussion Thread Pt 2

K_chile22 · Post #1221 » by **K_chile22** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:46 pm

inquisitive wrote:Hell. Just give it to harden and westbrook and call it a day. Co MVP

I feel like then everyone gets screwed lol

Post #1222 » by **bondom34** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 8:57 pm

K_chile22 wrote:
inquisitive wrote:Hell. Just give it to harden and westbrook and call it a day. Co MVP

I feel like then everyone gets screwed lol

Ties are like kissing your sister.

EH15 · Post #1223 » by **EH15** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:00 pm

How dumb will it look when Harden goes from not making the All NBA team to MVP? There's obviously a flaw in voting there and too many times they have often got the 2nd and 3rd teams wrong. Harden was obviously not a non All NBAer last year. You don't go from not being 1 of the top 6 guards in your 7th season to being MVP (or top 2 finish) in your 8th season. It simply does not happen when the production was already there to begin with. It's even more egregious when you realize that he made the 1st team the year before.

ocelot17 · Post #1224 » by **ocelot17** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:14 pm

EH15 wrote:How dumb will it look when Harden goes from not making the All NBA team to MVP? There's obviously a flaw in voting there and too many times they have often got the 2nd and 3rd teams wrong. Harden was obviously not a non All NBAer last year. You don't go from not being 1 of the top 6 guards in your 7th season to being MVP (or top 2 finish) in your 8th season. It simply does not happen when the production was already there to begin with. It's even more egregious when you realize that he made the 1st team the year before.

Isn't it obvious? The media, just like realgm doesn't like harden because of his reputation.

Sometimes that reputation is hard to shake off when you've been labeled a lazy defender because of some YouTube videos and shaqtin a fool.

This is the same media that said klay Thompson was a better player than harden.

RightToCensor · Post #1225 » by **RightToCensor** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:39 pm

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/245323/Straw-Poll-Of-106-Media-Members-Shows-Harden-Ahead-Of-Westbrook-In-MVP-Race

Edrees · Post #1226 » by **Edrees** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:47 pm

EH15 wrote:How dumb will it look when Harden goes from not making the All NBA team to MVP? There's obviously a flaw in voting there and too many times they have often got the 2nd and 3rd teams wrong. Harden was obviously not a non All NBAer last year. You don't go from not being 1 of the top 6 guards in your 7th season to being MVP (or top 2 finish) in your 8th season. It simply does not happen when the production was already there to begin with. It's even more egregious when you realize that he made the 1st team the year before.

Pretty sure it won't look dumb at all, Steve Nash won MVP in 2004-2005 after not making the ALL NBA team in the 2003-2004 season prior. And he was around his 8th season in the league, too. And he ALSO had previously been on the All nba team a season before. There's not a single person who said the NBA looks dumb for this.

Oh how ironic, guess what got nash the mvp that year after not being an All nba caliber player the year prior - suddenly D'antoni coached his team :lol:

Note: Rose all won MVP after missing all nba team year prior. He was in the league just a few years, though

Starboy · Post #1227 » by **Starboy** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:48 pm

Westbrook is just as bad as Harden imo. Harden flops a tiny bit more, but Westbrook bitches a lot more. It's a toss up.

I don't see how Westbrook gets the MVP over Harden at this point though.

bondom34 wrote:
K_chile22 wrote:
inquisitive wrote:Hell. Just give it to harden and westbrook and call it a day. Co MVP

I feel like then everyone gets screwed lol

Ties are like kissing your sister.

encouraged in Oklahoma?

Post #1228 » by **bondom34** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:51 pm

Starboy wrote:
encouraged in Oklahoma?

I don't live in Oklahoma. Is this a tradition you know of?

Post #1229 » by **bwgood77** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 9:56 pm

Starboy wrote:Westbrook is just as bad as Harden imo. Harden flops a tiny bit more, but Westbrook bitches a lot more. It's a toss up.

I don't see how Westbrook gets the MVP over Harden at this point though.

bondom34 wrote:
K_chile22 wrote:I feel like then everyone gets screwed lol

Ties are like kissing your sister.

encouraged in Oklahoma?

Lets all stay on topic and don't take shots at team's home towns unless you want a strike for baiting.

K_chile22 · Post #1230 » by **K_chile22** » Thu Mar 16, 2017 10:08 pm

EH15 wrote:Harden was obviously not a non All NBAer last year

I think Dwight had more to do with that then Harden, honestly. He still put up 29/8/7 iirc on nearly 60% TS. He only missed because they won 41 games, which appears to be more Dwight's and coaching fault in hindsight.

Which leads me to this point: If preseason predictions don't matter, how can Harden be left off all NBA for winning 41 and Russ win MVP winning 45. Russ is obviously better this year than Harden last, but jumping from out of the top 6 guards to MVP of the whole league is a gigantic leap.

HotRocks34 · Post #1231 » by **HotRocks34** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:05 am

I think if Westbrook gets the triple double record (he is now 8 games away from it with 14 games left), averages a triple double and OKC finishes strong, he's going to win the award.

Westbrook had a 30.3 PER coming into tonight's game. He's just on a mission right now.

I don't think we will ever see this happen again in the NBA if Westbrook does it this year. A triple-double season playing at under a 100.0 pace. Oscar played at like a 127 pace the year he averaged a triple double.

We are witnessing stats history, if Westbrook can stay on this pace.

dautjazz · Post #1232 » by **dautjazz** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:19 am

LeBron is a tank, you need Shaq to stop him.

Enviado por mi telefono movil

B-easy · Post #1233 » by **B-easy** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:41 am

Averaging a triple double and/or breakng the record is a lot more impressive than being MVP anyway.

Thundershock88 · Post #1234 » by **Thundershock88** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:46 am

Just wondering where that Raptors fan is who said it's easy to pad your stats when you're on a crap team....

ProfessorJM · Post #1235 » by **ProfessorJM** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:47 am

I think Harden will win the MVP, but in the future it will largely be forgotten in the context of Westbrook's season. Harden is having a great year, but in terms of MVP history and lore, it's just another award. Westbrook's season may be remembered for a long time, especially as it connects with Durant leaving and that whole narrative, which is another thing that I think will not be forgotten for a long time. (Because Durant will be an easy HOF player, but this move will forever be part of his story)

K_chile22 · Post #1236 » by **K_chile22** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:50 am

B-easy wrote:Averaging a triple double and/or breakng the record is a lot more impressive than being MVP anyway.

Because round numbers are nice

Screwston · Post #1237 » by **Screwston** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:54 am

ProfessorJM wrote:I think Harden will win the MVP, but in the future it will largely be forgotten in the context of Westbrook's season. Harden is having a great year, but in terms of MVP history and lore, it's just another award. Westbrook's season may be remembered for a long time, especially as it connects with Durant leaving and that whole narrative, which is another thing that I think will not be forgotten for a long time. (Because Durant will be an easy HOF player, but this move will forever be part of his story)

True

RightToCensor · Post #1238 » by **RightToCensor** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 1:57 am

If this was 2006 and you were talking about Nash and Kobe then I'd understand, but Harden is averaging 29/11/8 while anchoring an offense that's second All-Time in ORtg. He's the only player in NBA History to have multiple 50 point triple-double games, he's leading the league in APG, he leads the league in double-doubles (53 out of 68 games), and is second in triple-doubles (17). Harden's statline is nothing to look over, and his team will be remembered greatly for their over-the-top shooting.

EH15 · Post #1239 » by **EH15** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:05 am

Edrees wrote:
EH15 wrote:How dumb will it look when Harden goes from not making the All NBA team to MVP? There's obviously a flaw in voting there and too many times they have often got the 2nd and 3rd teams wrong. Harden was obviously not a non All NBAer last year. You don't go from not being 1 of the top 6 guards in your 7th season to being MVP (or top 2 finish) in your 8th season. It simply does not happen when the production was already there to begin with. It's even more egregious when you realize that he made the 1st team the year before.

Pretty sure it won't look dumb at all, Steve Nash won MVP in 2004-2005 after not making the ALL NBA team in the 2003-2004 season prior. And he was around his 8th season in the league, too. And he ALSO had previously been on the All nba team a season before. There's not a single person who said the NBA looks dumb for this.

Oh how ironic, guess what got nash the mvp that year after not being an All nba caliber player the year prior - suddenly D'antoni coached his team

Note: Rose all won MVP after missing all nba team year prior. He was in the league just a few years, though

Are you disagreeing with my sentiment or the finer detail? Because Harden had already made two 1st team All NBA and a 3rd team before his snub last year. Nash only made two 3rd team All NBA before jumping into 1st team and MVP in 05.

Are you saying that Harden did indeed deserve to be left off last year? Or that Nash and Harden benefit greatly from D'Antoni's system and in hindsight don't deserve those accolades?

Either way, Harden deserved to be All NBA last year. These voters continually nitpick if and when team records come into play. Blazers won only 3 more games last year. Kings lost 10 more games last year.

ProfessorJM · Post #1240 » by **ProfessorJM** » Fri Mar 17, 2017 2:16 am

K_chile22 wrote:
B-easy wrote:Averaging a triple double and/or breakng the record is a lot more impressive than being MVP anyway.

Because round numbers are nice

I agree with you mathematically and logically, but sports history and lore is impacted by narrative/perception and the reality is that say a .398 batting average versus .399 is one point and .399 to .400 is also one point, but that single point - although the same mathematically - is a world of difference for sports. Sports statistics have their own relativity much like say a minute in time can be relative depending on how pleasurable/horrible that minute feels to that person. Westbrook only gets 9.9 assists, his season will likely be forgotten even though if you think about it is it really all that less impressive?

Who will win MVP?