The Steve Clifford Thread 2.0 - Off the Cliff we go

Braggins · Post #441 » by **Braggins** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 2:00 am

yosemiteben wrote:
Braggins wrote:Apparently we broke the record for most 3pt FGs allowed in a season.

6 of the top 7 all time are from this season. 7 of the top 10. 14 of the top 20.

We still allow the most 3pt FGs in the league. That seems like a bad thing.

catch20two · Post #442 » by **catch20two** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 2:25 am

Braggins wrote:Apparently we broke the record for most 3pt FGs allowed in a season.

Question is will Clifford find a adjustment in his 3x Dig defensive scheme that'll change our misfortunes in giving up so many 3s?

Post #443 » by **yosemiteben** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 2:59 am

Braggins wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:
Braggins wrote:Apparently we broke the record for most 3pt FGs allowed in a season.

6 of the top 7 all time are from this season. 7 of the top 10. 14 of the top 20.

We still allow the most 3pt FGs in the league. That seems like a bad thing.

Sure, but teams are jacking shots at a historical rate so the fact that it's a record isn't all that relevant.

Mystical Apples · Post #444 » by **Mystical Apples** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 3:07 am

Braggins wrote:
yosemiteben wrote:
Braggins wrote:Apparently we broke the record for most 3pt FGs allowed in a season.

6 of the top 7 all time are from this season. 7 of the top 10. 14 of the top 20.

We still allow the most 3pt FGs in the league. That seems like a bad thing.

Playing Devil's Advocate how do fouls, turnovers, ishy passing, transition D, rebounding, and offensive 3PA rates alter a team's defensive 3FGA/100?

Cause dumb Phoenix certainly passes the defensive 3FGA smell test. And not coincidentally, sucks at pretty much everything else.

LamarMatic7 · Post #445 » by **LamarMatic7** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 11:14 am

catch20two wrote:
Braggins wrote:Apparently we broke the record for most 3pt FGs allowed in a season.

Question is will Clifford find a adjustment in his 3x Dig defensive scheme that'll change our misfortunes in giving up so many 3s?

It feels to me like we took a step backwards in regards to switching this season. Given Cody's abilities, I wish we did more of that.

You need a more menacing big for this current strategy to work regularly - where he comes up almost to the level of the screen and then backpedals. If the opposing point guard is capable of swinging the ball over him to the other corner, chances are we're toast. I don't really like the cross-rotating that follows after that where someone has to scramble over to cover for the man who was down in the paint to act as weak-side help for Zeller's man.

Obviously, the team was above average on defense for most of the year, but it seems to be a strategy that can be exploited when targeted. Just remember some of the games that Miami had against the Hornets last year in the playoffs.

The best defensive teams seem to either have scary humans as centers or can wreck chaos on the perimeter via switching or more aggressive strategies like showing on pick-and-rolls.

Post #446 » by **fatlever** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 5:10 pm

some discussion on Twitter today about Cliff's schemes and our defensive issues

Read on Twitter

Post #447 » by **yosemiteben** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 5:13 pm

I think those points are fair.

Post #448 » by **fatlever** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 7:04 pm

The issues with Batum's defense bug me more than anything.

FreeMario · Post #449 » by **FreeMario** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 10:38 pm

Please fire clifford hire van gundy

Braggins · Post #450 » by **Braggins** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 11:06 pm

Firing Clifford and then hiring a coach who has the exact same coaching philosophy (Van Gundy), but seems dumber and hasn't coached in 10 years, does not seem like a good plan. Id much rather give Silas a shot if fired Clifford.

316Hornets · Post #451 » by **316Hornets** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 11:13 pm

This team needs a lock down 3 and D SG. Lee filled that need last season. Batum is just not cut out to guard 2s.

Braggins · Post #452 » by **Braggins** » Thu Apr 6, 2017 11:21 pm

Batum might be better suited to guarding small ball 4s than 2s. Oddly enough, his length/rim protection and rebounding are his best attributes on defense. Hes honestly not particularly good at guarding 3s, but thats probably his most natural defensive position.

Post #453 » by **Diop** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 12:19 am

the catch 22 is that Clifford has been (all appears to have been) a big supporter of signing known poor perimeter defenders for their offence.

Mystical Apples · Post #454 » by **Mystical Apples** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 12:23 am

Braggins wrote:Firing Clifford and then hiring a coach who has the exact same coaching philosophy (Van Gundy), but seems dumber and hasn't coached in 10 years, does not seem like a good plan. Id much rather give Silas a shot if fired Clifford.

Got a kick out of this.

catch20two · Post #455 » by **catch20two** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 12:50 am

316Hornets wrote:This team needs a lock down 3 and D SG. Lee filled that need last season. Batum is just not cut out to guard 2s.

I think that's selling us short. We need a all-star level scoring wing more than we need defense. If we get a 3&D wing that only average about 10-15 I still wouldn't have faith in us being a contender but of course I'll have hope as a fan.

TinmanZBoy · Post #456 » by **TinmanZBoy** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 2:03 am

the hornets schemed exactly the same way last season...

Post #457 » by **yosemiteben** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 2:57 am

catch20two wrote:
316Hornets wrote:This team needs a lock down 3 and D SG. Lee filled that need last season. Batum is just not cut out to guard 2s.

I think that's selling us short. We need a all-star level scoring wing more than we need defense. If we get a 3&D wing that only average about 10-15 I still wouldn't have faith in us being a contender but of course I'll have hope as a fan.

It's an interesting question. I'm not sure which I'd prefer - another type A scorer at SG or a Lee-esque 3&D.

Vanderbilt_Grad · Post #458 » by **Vanderbilt_Grad** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 1:14 pm

yosemiteben wrote:
catch20two wrote:
316Hornets wrote:This team needs a lock down 3 and D SG. Lee filled that need last season. Batum is just not cut out to guard 2s.

I think that's selling us short. We need a all-star level scoring wing more than we need defense. If we get a 3&D wing that only average about 10-15 I still wouldn't have faith in us being a contender but of course I'll have hope as a fan.

It's an interesting question. I'm not sure which I'd prefer - another type A scorer at SG or a Lee-esque 3&D.

The team needs both, and the scoring doesn't have to come from the 2 spot. Lee and Lin were great fits in those roles and this year's team really missed having guys with those skillsets.

As long as Cliff is the coach the team really needs to find guys who can fit his system and make it work.

Mystical Apples · Post #459 » by **Mystical Apples** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 5:36 pm

catch20two wrote:
316Hornets wrote:This team needs a lock down 3 and D SG. Lee filled that need last season. Batum is just not cut out to guard 2s.

I think that's selling us short. We need a all-star level scoring wing more than we need defense. If we get a 3&D wing that only average about 10-15 I still wouldn't have faith in us being a contender but of course I'll have hope as a fan.

This isn't even a fair fight. A playmaking wing with decent size is a non-negotiable. Defensive chops is a distant 3rd or 4th on the list of required skills.

Eoghan · Post #460 » by **Eoghan** » Fri Apr 7, 2017 5:50 pm

TinmanZBoy wrote:the hornets schemed exactly the same way last season...

I think the competition got better from last season too. Even the Sixers are trying now. I feel like a lot of this season boiled down to us taking one step forward while a bunch of teams took 2-3 steps forward.