This offseason

[Keith Van Horn]

I'm kind of hoping Atlanta loses in straight games, and Milsap wants out. He's a perfect vet candidate that can do a lot for this team. Fit-wise he's great, value-wise he better come at the right price.

As for the gaping hole at SG, Porter is still target #1, but how realistic that is.... not sure. Maybe Allen Crabbe on draft night? I sure as **** hope it would come with their 2018 pick. I wouldn't want to lose Lopez in that deal though anymore... Booker & KJ or something like that.

Let's just say we managed to land Millsap. I think we could slot a useful vet and that's about it. The draft and Euro FA route is the best way not to overpay but still improve.

Lin/Dinwiddie/Goodwin(?)
*FA*/Whitehead/Skil
LeVert/KJ/Harris
Millsap/RHJ/Acy
Lopez/*Draft*/Hamilton


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

You're probably right. I bet a lot of people wouldn't be happy with just getting one big name here, kind of like last year...
but if we sign Milsap to the right deal, and he has the same kind of impact Lin had, works well with the current group and spaces well in Kenny's offense, I wouldn't be mad at that.

What about making the starting SG role a competition in the offseason and summer camp, like between KJ/IW/Harris/Archie/Skil? Best man wins it? IDK just a thought. Obviously it would be less than ideal since they're all still works in progress (expect Kilpatrick). Big names sell too... so yeah people would probably be mad if we don't get a sexy name here.

But I'll wait to pencil in lineups with too much detail until we see the draft and what euros look here.

[Ror1997]

The more I think about it, I feel like KCP and KJ have the same ceiling and are the same type of player. KCP has just had more opportunities. Keeping KJ here long term should be a priority seeing as he's definitely somebody we would target if he weren't already on our team.

[Prokorov]

I'm kind of hoping Atlanta loses in straight games, and Milsap wants out. He's a perfect vet candidate that can do a lot for this team. Fit-wise he's great, value-wise he better come at the right price.

As for the gaping hole at SG, Porter is still target #1, but how realistic that is.... not sure. Maybe Allen Crabbe on draft night? I sure as **** hope it would come with their 2018 pick. I wouldn't want to lose Lopez in that deal though anymore... Booker & KJ or something like that.

Let's just say we managed to land Millsap. I think we could slot a useful vet and that's about it. The draft and Euro FA route is the best way not to overpay but still improve.

Lin/Dinwiddie/Goodwin(?)
*FA*/Whitehead/Skil
LeVert/KJ/Harris
Millsap/RHJ/Acy
Lopez/*Draft*/Hamilton


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

You're probably right. I bet a lot of people wouldn't be happy with just getting one big name here, kind of like last year...
but if we sign Milsap to the right deal, and he has the same kind of impact Lin had, works well with the current group and spaces well in Kenny's offense, I wouldn't be mad at that.

What about making the starting SG role a competition in the offseason and summer camp, like between KJ/IW/Harris/Archie/Skil? Best man wins it? IDK just a thought. Obviously it would be less than ideal since they're all still works in progress (expect Kilpatrick). Big names sell too... so yeah people would probably be mad if we don't get a sexy name here.

But I'll wait to pencil in lineups with too much detail until we see the draft and what euros look here.

we got 0 big names last year. id be THRILLED with milsap. he'd be our best player and make us playoff locks if healthy.

[Prokorov]

Sean Marks gets it.

Read on Twitter

Love it... and glad marks gets it. you start throwing big money at role players and you get a lotto team with no flexibility.

[MrDollarBills]

I'm glad that Marks is tempering expectations

Paul Milsap is not going to play for a twenty win team following a waste of a season with Atlanta.

[Paradise]

Nets big man assistant coach, Mike Batiste will be scouting the Euroleague playoffs in Athens.

Sean Marks, Kenny, Trajan and the most of the assistant coaches will be scouting games independently. That's not including the actual staff of overseas scouts the Nets have sent to the Euroleague.

Never heard of that before. You rarely ever hear a team of assistant coaches doing scouting trips.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[FlipFlopShot]

I'm glad that Marks is tempering expectations

Paul Milsap is not going to play for a twenty win team following a waste of a season with Atlanta.

Also, it wouldn't be up to Millsap. Danny Ferry decides to where and with who if the Hawks completely melts down.

[jbeachboy]

how about ben mclemore or jonathan simmons as a cheaper alternative than kcp or porter?

[jbeachboy]

if they decide to bring back the same team, we should go euro stashes or project types.

[Prokorov]

I'm glad that Marks is tempering expectations

Paul Milsap is not going to play for a twenty win team following a waste of a season with Atlanta.

Also, it wouldn't be up to Millsap. Danny Ferry decides to where and with who if the Hawks completely melts down.

Milsap has a player option. if he wants to opt out he becomes a UFA and can go where he pleases

[Prokorov]

how about ben mclemore or jonathan simmons as a cheaper alternative than kcp or porter?

McLemore is really bad. worse then kilpatrick. id rather keep kilpatrick.

Simmons i dont buy into... he hasnt looked good on the spurs where they turn everything into gold. no thanks.

not that i want KCP either...

[vincecarter4pres]

would anybody be mad if we package those picks for a trade up?

I'm a bit against packaging the picks. As the site below shows, statistically you are going to get the same production out of pick 15 as you are from pick 27. Obviously this doesn't take individual athletes into account, but production over a long period of time. I don't wanna give up 2 bites at a 'star' or 'solid' player. I completely trust Markison, so if they think someone is can't miss enough to do a 2 for one than so be it.

http://www.82games.com/nbadraftpicks.htm

Here's the thing though. The odds are reasonably close you'll land an actual rotation player from either the 15th or 27th pick specifically, but their have been 3 legitimate franchise level players in the past 21 years from the 15th pick, 2 of them in the last 6 years and an additional 2 All Star level players, an additional 6 starting level players and 2 young guys the jury is still out on. There was only 1 All Star level player in the last 20 years from the 27th pick, 3 starting level guys and a few young guys the jury is still out on.

So that's 11 out of a possible 21 players who are at least starting level good players from the 15th pick specifically, with 2 other recent young guys who could become that and 4 rotation players, with only 4 true busts. That's excellent odds.

At the 27th pick, you have 1 All Star level guy(Gobert, so room for growth still), an additional 3 other starting level players, 3 young guys who could become something still and 5 rotation players, with 9 legitimate confirmed busts. That's not great odds overall and terrible odds to find a diamond in the rough true star.

So actually, the odds aren't so reasonable and the difference between 15th and 27th is absolutely immense.

[TheNetsFan]

would anybody be mad if we package those picks for a trade up?

I'm a bit against packaging the picks. As the site below shows, statistically you are going to get the same production out of pick 15 as you are from pick 27. Obviously this doesn't take individual athletes into account, but production over a long period of time. I don't wanna give up 2 bites at a 'star' or 'solid' player. I completely trust Markison, so if they think someone is can't miss enough to do a 2 for one than so be it.

http://www.82games.com/nbadraftpicks.htm

Here's the thing though. The odds are reasonably close you'll land an actual rotation player from either the 15th or 27th pick specifically, but their have been 3 legitimate franchise level players in the past 21 years from the 15th pick, 2 of them in the last 6 years and an additional 2 All Star level players, an additional 6 starting level players and 2 young guys the jury is still out on. There was only 1 All Star level player in the last 20 years from the 27th pick, 3 starting level guys and a few young guys the jury is still out on.

So that's 11 out of a possible 21 players who are at least starting level good players from the 15th pick specifically, with 2 other recent young guys who could become that and 4 rotation players, with only 4 true busts. That's excellent odds.

At the 27th pick, you have 1 All Star level guy(Gobert, so room for growth still), an additional 3 other starting level players, 3 young guys who could become something still and 5 rotation players, with 9 legitimate confirmed busts. That's not great odds overall and terrible odds to find a diamond in the rough true star.

So actually, the odds aren't so reasonable and the difference between 15th and 27th is absolutely immense.

You also have to look at the likelihood of star or solid player being available later. You can't say that just because there's been more success at 17 than 12, 17 is a better pick. Based on that chart if you look at the picks in the 15 range as compared to the 20s, you're talking roughly a 20% chance at a star versus a 5% chance, and roughly a 40% chance of landing a solid or star player verus a roughly 20% chance of landing a solid or star player. You're 4 times as likely to land a star around 15 and twice as likely to land a solid or better player. Why would you want two cracks at the much lower odds of success?

[vincecarter4pres]

I'm glad that Marks is tempering expectations

Paul Milsap is not going to play for a twenty win team following a waste of a season with Atlanta.

I wouldn't be shocked if he signs here tbh. Surprised? Absolutely. But not like blown away shocked.

We have a decent base, we have 2 high level vets. 14-22 with Lin in the lineup. 14 of 20 wins with Lin. And in fact, 14-22 with a number of those losses while Lin was on a minutes limit, or the game he got injured in a couple times as well, meaning a lot closer to .500 and this was often without LeVert.

There aren't many contender types out there who have max cap space for him, nor will give it to him, he isn't going to have that many options tbh.

Brooklyn could be a draw.


Teams with max cap(or close to it) who are interesting basketball-wise:

Boston - Would they give him max?
Chicago - Would they give him max? Will Wade be back? Will they trade Butler?
Indiana - Would they give him max? What happens with Paul George? Does Teague stay?
Miami - Would they give him max? They have Justice Winslow as the 4 of the future.
Minnesota -Would they max him? Cold winters. Move KAT to the 5?
Philly - Would they max him? Lot of trade chips and interesting pieces. Been bad forever though and weird management.
Phoenix - Would they max him? ?Who do they draft? Do they make a splashy trade for say Blake?
San An - Do Pau, Dedmon and Lee pick up their option? Will LMA willingly make the move to the 5? Do they really need a point guard? Does Ginobili come back cheap?
Utah - Would they move Favors? Can they move Burks? Will Hayward return?
Sacto - Who do they draft? Is there future set at the 4 already? Do they pursue him at all?

I don't think a lot of these are realistic options.
Boston will pursue bigger and younger fish.
Chicago has a lot of question marks, but could be a major player.
Indiana is too far-fetched imho, with PG likely on the outs and Teague may walk as well.
Miami doesn't seem like the team who would pursue him.
Minny isn't a super desirable landing spot for Millsap imho.
Philly has potential, but their best young guy is a walking knee injury and they need a point guard bad, Simmons is a big question mark and where exactly does Paul fit? Very doubtful in my humble opinion.
Phoenix is a dark horse I can see pushing for him. But I still think they pursue other younger and bigger names.
San An would be great for both, but they need 3 guys to walk away from around $23 million in options, Manu to comeback for straight peanuts and on top of all this they have to convince LMA to play the 5 full time, which he hates the idea of.
Utah feels like too many moving pieces and uncertainty. And does he want to go back there for the ending of his career anyway?
Sacto is a ridiculous long shot, I don't know why anyone of his cache would want to go there, especially at this point in his career.


There's always staying in Atlanta if they offer him the 5 years with full raises, I can't see him walking away, but if they don't, I feel like we'll be in there making a push.

[vincecarter4pres]

I'm a bit against packaging the picks. As the site below shows, statistically you are going to get the same production out of pick 15 as you are from pick 27. Obviously this doesn't take individual athletes into account, but production over a long period of time. I don't wanna give up 2 bites at a 'star' or 'solid' player. I completely trust Markison, so if they think someone is can't miss enough to do a 2 for one than so be it.

http://www.82games.com/nbadraftpicks.htm

Here's the thing though. The odds are reasonably close you'll land an actual rotation player from either the 15th or 27th pick specifically, but their have been 3 legitimate franchise level players in the past 21 years from the 15th pick, 2 of them in the last 6 years and an additional 2 All Star level players, an additional 6 starting level players and 2 young guys the jury is still out on. There was only 1 All Star level player in the last 20 years from the 27th pick, 3 starting level guys and a few young guys the jury is still out on.

So that's 11 out of a possible 21 players who are at least starting level good players from the 15th pick specifically, with 2 other recent young guys who could become that and 4 rotation players, with only 4 true busts. That's excellent odds.

At the 27th pick, you have 1 All Star level guy(Gobert, so room for growth still), an additional 3 other starting level players, 3 young guys who could become something still and 5 rotation players, with 9 legitimate confirmed busts. That's not great odds overall and terrible odds to find a diamond in the rough true star.

So actually, the odds aren't so reasonable and the difference between 15th and 27th is absolutely immense.

You also have to look at the likelihood of star or solid player being available later. You can't say that just because there's been more success at 17 than 12, 17 is a better pick. Based on that chart if you look at the picks in the 15 range as compared to the 20s, you're talking roughly a 20% chance at a star versus a 5% chance, and roughly a 40% chance of landing a solid or star player verus a roughly 20% chance of landing a solid or star player. You're 4 times as likely to land a star around 15 and twice as likely to land a solid or better player. Why would you want two cracks at the much lower odds of success?

Exactly! I was just pointing to those specific picks because those are the picks we either have or were discussing acquiring, but the gap gets even bigger when we're just comparing 2 pick ranges to each other.

[Prokorov]

I'm glad that Marks is tempering expectations

Paul Milsap is not going to play for a twenty win team following a waste of a season with Atlanta.

I wouldn't be shocked if he signs here tbh. Surprised? Absolutely. But not like blown away shocked.

We have a decent base, we have 2 high level vets. 14-22 with Lin in the lineup. 14 of 20 wins with Lin. And in fact, 14-22 with a number of those losses while Lin was on a minutes limit, or the game he got injured in a couple times as well, meaning a lot closer to .500 and this was often without LeVert.

There aren't many contender types out there who have max cap space for him, nor will give it to him, he isn't going to have that many options tbh.

Brooklyn could be a draw.


Teams with max cap(or close to it) who are interesting basketball-wise:

Boston - Would they give him max?
Chicago - Would they give him max? Will Wade be back? Will they trade Butler?
Indiana - Would they give him max? What happens with Paul George? Does Teague stay?
Miami - Would they give him max? They have Justice Winslow as the 4 of the future.
Minnesota -Would they max him? Cold winters. Move KAT to the 5?
Philly - Would they max him? Lot of trade chips and interesting pieces. Been bad forever though and weird management.
Phoenix - Would they max him? ?Who do they draft? Do they make a splashy trade for say Blake?
San An - Do Pau, Dedmon and Lee pick up their option? Will LMA willingly make the move to the 5? Do they really need a point guard? Does Ginobili come back cheap?
Utah - Would they move Favors? Can they move Burks? Will Hayward return?
Sacto - Who do they draft? Is there future set at the 4 already? Do they pursue him at all?

I don't think a lot of these are realistic options.
Boston will pursue bigger and younger fish.
Chicago has a lot of question marks, but could be a major player.
Indiana is too far-fetched imho, with PG likely on the outs and Teague may walk as well.
Miami doesn't seem like the team who would pursue him.
Minny isn't a super desirable landing spot for Millsap imho.
Philly has potential, but their best young guy is a walking knee injury and they need a point guard bad, Simmons is a big question mark and where exactly does Paul fit? Very doubtful in my humble opinion.
Phoenix is a dark horse I can see pushing for him. But I still think they pursue other younger and bigger names.
San An would be great for both, but they need 3 guys to walk away from around $23 million in options, Manu to comeback for straight peanuts and on top of all this they have to convince LMA to play the 5 full time, which he hates the idea of.
Utah feels like too many moving pieces and uncertainty. And does he want to go back there for the ending of his career anyway?
Sacto is a ridiculous long shot, I don't know why anyone of his cache would want to go there, especially at this point in his career.


There's always staying in Atlanta if they offer him the 5 years with full raises, I can't see him walking away, but if they don't, I feel like we'll be in there making a push.

I think indy will 100% push for milsap at the max... they know they need to put more talent around him or he will ask out. I think the bulls go all out for him as well... talk about a team that needs 3 point shooting and defense from a big.

[vincecarter4pres]

I'm glad that Marks is tempering expectations

Paul Milsap is not going to play for a twenty win team following a waste of a season with Atlanta.

I wouldn't be shocked if he signs here tbh. Surprised? Absolutely. But not like blown away shocked.

We have a decent base, we have 2 high level vets. 14-22 with Lin in the lineup. 14 of 20 wins with Lin. And in fact, 14-22 with a number of those losses while Lin was on a minutes limit, or the game he got injured in a couple times as well, meaning a lot closer to .500 and this was often without LeVert.

There aren't many contender types out there who have max cap space for him, nor will give it to him, he isn't going to have that many options tbh.

Brooklyn could be a draw.


Teams with max cap(or close to it) who are interesting basketball-wise:

Boston - Would they give him max?
Chicago - Would they give him max? Will Wade be back? Will they trade Butler?
Indiana - Would they give him max? What happens with Paul George? Does Teague stay?
Miami - Would they give him max? They have Justice Winslow as the 4 of the future.
Minnesota -Would they max him? Cold winters. Move KAT to the 5?
Philly - Would they max him? Lot of trade chips and interesting pieces. Been bad forever though and weird management.
Phoenix - Would they max him? ?Who do they draft? Do they make a splashy trade for say Blake?
San An - Do Pau, Dedmon and Lee pick up their option? Will LMA willingly make the move to the 5? Do they really need a point guard? Does Ginobili come back cheap?
Utah - Would they move Favors? Can they move Burks? Will Hayward return?
Sacto - Who do they draft? Is there future set at the 4 already? Do they pursue him at all?

I don't think a lot of these are realistic options.
Boston will pursue bigger and younger fish.
Chicago has a lot of question marks, but could be a major player.
Indiana is too far-fetched imho, with PG likely on the outs and Teague may walk as well.
Miami doesn't seem like the team who would pursue him.
Minny isn't a super desirable landing spot for Millsap imho.
Philly has potential, but their best young guy is a walking knee injury and they need a point guard bad, Simmons is a big question mark and where exactly does Paul fit? Very doubtful in my humble opinion.
Phoenix is a dark horse I can see pushing for him. But I still think they pursue other younger and bigger names.
San An would be great for both, but they need 3 guys to walk away from around $23 million in options, Manu to comeback for straight peanuts and on top of all this they have to convince LMA to play the 5 full time, which he hates the idea of.
Utah feels like too many moving pieces and uncertainty. And does he want to go back there for the ending of his career anyway?
Sacto is a ridiculous long shot, I don't know why anyone of his cache would want to go there, especially at this point in his career.


There's always staying in Atlanta if they offer him the 5 years with full raises, I can't see him walking away, but if they don't, I feel like we'll be in there making a push.

I think indy will 100% push for milsap at the max... they know they need to put more talent around him or he will ask out. I think the bulls go all out for him as well... talk about a team that needs 3 point shooting and defense from a big.

I agree with you on both, but I don't see the interest from Millsap with Indiana unless George guarantees him he's staying and either Teague comes back, or they land a new point guard. And even then, it's Indiana. Not trying to trash Indiana, I've never been, but it's pretty basic and rural. Maybe that's what Millsap likes, but idk.



Chicago to me is a huge player for Millsap. I know I wouldn't want to live in Chicago though, even as a 100 millionaire. It's just too dangerous. You don't even have to be involved in anything shady or in the bad neighborhoods and you could become a home invasion or kidnapping target, along with your friends and family and you could also be a random victim just driving through some of those places, it is that bad there. If you grew up in the area, I could see why you stay, but to willingly move there, you'd have to really believe in Jimmy Butler and some questionable executives running things behind the scenes. All that said, yes, they have to be considered some of the front runners for him.

They're actually incredibly interesting if Wade walks. They could have Butler, Robin Lopez, a bunch of young guys on rookie contract and almost $60 million in cap space including cap holds and partial guarantees against the cap. Could you imagine them signing Paul Millsap and Chris Paul?

[Prokorov]

out. I think the bulls go all out for him as well... talk about a team that needs 3 point shooting and defense from a big.

I agree with you on both, but I don't see the interest from Millsap with Indiana unless George guarantees him he's staying and either Teague comes back, or they land a new point guard. And even then, it's Indiana. Not trying to trash Indiana, I've never been, but it's pretty basic and rural. Maybe that's what Millsap likes, but idk. [/quote]

i think teague and PG would be on board if they knew milsap was a possibility... especially teague since they played together. at milsaps age im not sure how big a deal location is... maybe it is?

Chicago to me is a huge player for Millsap. I know I wouldn't want to live in Chicago though, even as a 100 millionaire. It's just too dangerous. You don't even have to be involved in anything shady or in the bad neighborhoods and you could become a home invasion or kidnapping target, along with your friends and family and you could also be a random victim just driving through some of those places, it is that bad there. If you grew up in the area, I could see why you stay, but to willingly move there, you'd have to really believe in Jimmy Butler and some questionable executives running things behind the scenes. All that said, yes, they have to be considered some of the front runners for him.

Man.. i lived in chicago for 2 years... some bad areas but you make it sound like an NWA song or something lol

They're actually incredibly interesting if Wade walks. They could have Butler, Robin Lopez, a bunch of young guys on rookie contract and almost $60 million in cap space including cap holds and partial guarantees against the cap. Could you imagine them signing Paul Millsap and Chris Paul?

Paul/Butler/Milsap is a pretty sick team

[vincecarter4pres]

Man.. i lived in chicago for 2 years... some bad areas but you make it sound like an NWA song or something lol

Lol, well there were like 4 or 5 home invasions on NBA and NFL players in the Chicago suburbs just the last few years.

[jbeachboy]

how about ben mclemore or jonathan simmons as a cheaper alternative than kcp or porter?

McLemore is really bad. worse then kilpatrick. id rather keep kilpatrick.

Simmons i dont buy into... he hasnt looked good on the spurs where they turn everything into gold. no thanks.

not that i want KCP either...

do you think they could do better with having a larger role here and new scenery?