This offseason

[Prokorov]

how about ben mclemore or jonathan simmons as a cheaper alternative than kcp or porter?

McLemore is really bad. worse then kilpatrick. id rather keep kilpatrick.

Simmons i dont buy into... he hasnt looked good on the spurs where they turn everything into gold. no thanks.

not that i want KCP either...

do you think they could do better with having a larger role here and new scenery?

No. Mclemore is a REALLY bad player and if you believe what you here not really a motivated guy.

I can see simmons having such a bad season in some place like san antonio but then doing well here.

[FlipFlopShot]

The big question continues to be what to do with Lopez. Options will start disappearing come draft day and all the way up to trade deadline.

1. Replace him with a better fitting star? Very, very limited options.
2. Let him walk while smoothing the transition? Another year.
3. Resign him with an even larger contract by the end of next season? Go get your money Brolo.
4. Trade him and excel the development of our picks? We lucked out with LeVert.

[Paradise]

McLemore is really bad. worse then kilpatrick. id rather keep kilpatrick.

Simmons i dont buy into... he hasnt looked good on the spurs where they turn everything into gold. no thanks.

not that i want KCP either...

do you think they could do better with having a larger role here and new scenery?

No. Mclemore is a REALLY bad player and if you believe what you here not really a motivated guy.

I can see simmons having such a bad season in some place like san antonio but then doing well here.

We play at a faster pace than the Spurs and we play a different variation of the motion offense. Simmons will benefit greatly from being around younger guys. LeVert/Simmons/RHJ could force turnovers and get out at finish in transition and we both know Rondae and Caris are solid passers already.

He has room to grow and a ridiculous vertical. No reason we couldn't develop him into a starting level SF. You think he'd stink in Philly or Miami? Nope.



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[Prokorov]

do you think they could do better with having a larger role here and new scenery?

No. Mclemore is a REALLY bad player and if you believe what you here not really a motivated guy.

I can see simmons having such a bad season in some place like san antonio but then doing well here.

We play at a faster pace than the Spurs and we play a different variation of the motion offense. Simmons benefit greatly from being around younger guys.

He has room to grow and a ridiculous vertical. No reason we couldn't develop him into a starting level SF. You think he'd stink in Philly or Miami? Nope.



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i think he'd be worse in philly for sure. miami idk. but either way it takes more then a verticle leap. he couldnt catch on with anyone and we didnt deem him worth it when he was here in summer league. really bad run with the spurs outside of some early games. to be honest im not sure id want him if it was on a minor deal.

[Paradise]

No. Mclemore is a REALLY bad player and if you believe what you here not really a motivated guy.

I can see simmons having such a bad season in some place like san antonio but then doing well here.

We play at a faster pace than the Spurs and we play a different variation of the motion offense. Simmons benefit greatly from being around younger guys.

He has room to grow and a ridiculous vertical. No reason we couldn't develop him into a starting level SF. You think he'd stink in Philly or Miami? Nope.



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i think he'd be worse in philly for sure. miami idk. but either way it takes more then a verticle leap. he couldnt catch on with anyone and we didnt deem him worth it when he was here in summer league. really bad run with the spurs outside of some early games. to be honest im not sure id want him if it was on a minor deal.

No, it was a stupid and typical oversight by King. He played very well in summer league.

I'm not sure what else is he supposed to do? He's a 3&D player with good athleticism. I don't understand why everyone expects a finish product to come here. Your looking at upside guys with flashes of very good play. He qualifies as that candidate. He would be the most athletic and best perimeter defender.

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[Prokorov]

No, it was a stupid and typical oversight by King. He played very well in summer league.

I'm not sure what else is he supposed to do? He's a 3&D player with good athleticism. I don't understand why everyone expects a finish product to come here. Your looking at upside guys with flashes of very good play. He qualifies as that candidate. He would be the most athletic and best perimeter defender.

I have issues calling someone a 3 &D guy when they shoot 29% from three. 10 PER and 50 TS% is pretty ugly too,

hard for me to blame billy king when simmons couldnt earn a spot, no other teams showed much interest and the spurs seem to have no interest in brnging him back.

i mean im not saying he cant stick in the NBA but as of now he just looks like a dleague athlete struggling to be an nba player

[Paradise]

No, it was a stupid and typical oversight by King. He played very well in summer league.

I'm not sure what else is he supposed to do? He's a 3&D player with good athleticism. I don't understand why everyone expects a finish product to come here. Your looking at upside guys with flashes of very good play. He qualifies as that candidate. He would be the most athletic and best perimeter defender.

I have issues calling someone a 3 &D guy when they shoot 29% from three. 10 PER and 50 TS% is pretty ugly too,

hard for me to blame billy king when simmons couldnt earn a spot, no other teams showed much interest and the spurs seem to have no interest in brnging him back.

i mean im not saying he cant stick in the NBA but as of now he just looks like a dleague athlete struggling to be an nba player

You can say that about half our roster. Yet, we can look beyond the ugly stats with our guys but won't with guys like him?


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[Prokorov]

No, it was a stupid and typical oversight by King. He played very well in summer league.

I'm not sure what else is he supposed to do? He's a 3&D player with good athleticism. I don't understand why everyone expects a finish product to come here. Your looking at upside guys with flashes of very good play. He qualifies as that candidate. He would be the most athletic and best perimeter defender.

I have issues calling someone a 3 &D guy when they shoot 29% from three. 10 PER and 50 TS% is pretty ugly too,

hard for me to blame billy king when simmons couldnt earn a spot, no other teams showed much interest and the spurs seem to have no interest in brnging him back.

i mean im not saying he cant stick in the NBA but as of now he just looks like a dleague athlete struggling to be an nba player

You can say that about half our roster. Yet, we can look beyond the ugly stats with our guys but won't with guys like him?

Well we dont always overlook it... which is why guys like bennet and yogi are no longer here. also, our guys like that are all on minimum/ungauranteed contracts. if simmons wants to come here on an ungauranteed 1.65M deal id consider it.

otherwise i want no part of him.

[vincecarter4pres]

I have issues calling someone a 3 &D guy when they shoot 29% from three. 10 PER and 50 TS% is pretty ugly too,

hard for me to blame billy king when simmons couldnt earn a spot, no other teams showed much interest and the spurs seem to have no interest in brnging him back.

i mean im not saying he cant stick in the NBA but as of now he just looks like a dleague athlete struggling to be an nba player

You can say that about half our roster. Yet, we can look beyond the ugly stats with our guys but won't with guys like him?

Well we dont always overlook it... which is why guys like bennet and yogi are no longer here. also, our guys like that are all on minimum/ungauranteed contracts. if simmons wants to come here on an ungauranteed 1.65M deal id consider it.

otherwise i want no part of him.

+1

And this is why I often say people get too obsessed with value and upside type signings, from us here, to actual GM's like Marks.

I get what he's saying when he says that line about where a player gets you, maybe 30 to 35 wins, or the other one in the same presser, about being capped out as a 25 win team, but having 3 Bookers is exactly the same to your cap as 1 Millsap or Hill and as much as those guys on max frighten me, I take them 11 times out of 10 instead of a trifecta of Simmons, Terrence Jones and Ramon Sessions, each at 8 to 10 mill a season.

[Prokorov]

You can say that about half our roster. Yet, we can look beyond the ugly stats with our guys but won't with guys like him?

Well we dont always overlook it... which is why guys like bennet and yogi are no longer here. also, our guys like that are all on minimum/ungauranteed contracts. if simmons wants to come here on an ungauranteed 1.65M deal id consider it.

otherwise i want no part of him.

+1

And this is why I often say people get too obsessed with value and upside type signings, from us here, to actual GM's like Marks.

I get what he's saying when he says that line about where a player gets you, maybe 30 to 35 wins, or the other one in the same presser, about being capped out as a 25 win team, but having 3 Bookers is exactly the same to your cap as 1 Millsap or Hill and as much as those guys on max frighten me, I take them 11 times out of 10 instead of a trifecta of Simmons, Terrence Jones and Ramon Sessions, each at 8 to 10 mill a season.

yeah... which is why i typically dont like those 12-14M per year deals when you are way under the cap. 4 quarters doesnt make a dollar in that situation unless you get a great value. otherwise you are better rolling the money or overpaying an allstar calibur guy

when you are closer to the cap, and dont have max money, those other deals make more sense

[MrDollarBills]

I really don't see any value in giving Simmons a big contract.

if we can't get anything of substance we need to maintain flexibility.

[pickIBL]

Loading up a contract to any spurs role player other than patty mills probably doesn't make sense. Simmons fills a need for the Spurs off the bench, like Gary Neal did in the past, ask them to be something they are not and you'll be disappointing.

[TheNetsFan]

Well we dont always overlook it... which is why guys like bennet and yogi are no longer here. also, our guys like that are all on minimum/ungauranteed contracts. if simmons wants to come here on an ungauranteed 1.65M deal id consider it.

otherwise i want no part of him.

+1

And this is why I often say people get too obsessed with value and upside type signings, from us here, to actual GM's like Marks.

I get what he's saying when he says that line about where a player gets you, maybe 30 to 35 wins, or the other one in the same presser, about being capped out as a 25 win team, but having 3 Bookers is exactly the same to your cap as 1 Millsap or Hill and as much as those guys on max frighten me, I take them 11 times out of 10 instead of a trifecta of Simmons, Terrence Jones and Ramon Sessions, each at 8 to 10 mill a season.

yeah... which is why i typically dont like those 12-14M per year deals when you are way under the cap. 4 quarters doesnt make a dollar in that situation unless you get a great value. otherwise you are better rolling the money or overpaying an allstar calibur guy

when you are closer to the cap, and dont have max money, those other deals make more sense

I agree. The way the CBA is set up, you're essentially forced to land your stars first, and then use exceptions & draft picks to fill out the rest of the roster. If you lock yourself into mid-level and mid-priced players, the only way to land higher end players is to get lucky in the draft. Given the max length of contracts is down to 4 years for outside FAs, the downside of overpays is much lower than it used to be.

[vincecarter4pres]

+1

And this is why I often say people get too obsessed with value and upside type signings, from us here, to actual GM's like Marks.

I get what he's saying when he says that line about where a player gets you, maybe 30 to 35 wins, or the other one in the same presser, about being capped out as a 25 win team, but having 3 Bookers is exactly the same to your cap as 1 Millsap or Hill and as much as those guys on max frighten me, I take them 11 times out of 10 instead of a trifecta of Simmons, Terrence Jones and Ramon Sessions, each at 8 to 10 mill a season.

yeah... which is why i typically dont like those 12-14M per year deals when you are way under the cap. 4 quarters doesnt make a dollar in that situation unless you get a great value. otherwise you are better rolling the money or overpaying an allstar calibur guy

when you are closer to the cap, and dont have max money, those other deals make more sense

I agree. The way the CBA is set up, you're essentially forced to land your stars first, and then use exceptions & draft picks to fill out the rest of the roster. If you lock yourself into mid-level and mid-priced players, the only way to land higher end players is to get lucky in the draft. Given the max length of contracts is down to 4 years for outside FAs, the downside of overpays is much lower than it used to be.

Which is why even though I'm not a quick fix guy obsessed with the playoffs or even our pick being given away next season, I'd still advocate chasing Millsap or maybe Hill. Unless as Prok is saying, roll the cap on a huge 1 year overpay, or my preferred modus operandi would be use the cap to absorb salary to get 1st round picks, if at all possible.

[Prokorov]

Loading up a contract to any spurs role player other than patty mills probably doesn't make sense. Simmons fills a need for the Spurs off the bench, like Gary Neal did in the past, ask them to be something they are not and you'll be disappointing.

i dont get patty mills either. unless you think he will break out into an avery bradley like 2 way player.

Mills is a good shooter but one who is undersized, can only play one position and at 29 isnt some young prospect with a ton of growth potential anymore. to me he is like barbosa. great role guy if your a playoff team. but not someone a bad team should sink 6-10M per year into and eat into what you can offer other players.

Mills is a guy you use the MLE on. not your cap space

[vincecarter4pres]

Loading up a contract to any spurs role player other than patty mills probably doesn't make sense. Simmons fills a need for the Spurs off the bench, like Gary Neal did in the past, ask them to be something they are not and you'll be disappointing.

i dont get patty mills either. unless you think he will break out into an avery bradley like 2 way player.

Mills is a good shooter but one who is undersized, can only play one position and at 29 isnt some young prospect with a ton of growth potential anymore. to me he is like barbosa. great role guy if your a playoff team. but not someone a bad team should sink 6-10M per year into and eat into what you can offer other players.

Mills is a guy you use the MLE on. not your cap space

Agreed and my guess is he costs $10 to $14 million a year to come to a team like this, best case like $8 million in the first season for the full 4 years and Mills would have a player option years 3 and 4.

[spaceballer]

Loading up a contract to any spurs role player other than patty mills probably doesn't make sense. Simmons fills a need for the Spurs off the bench, like Gary Neal did in the past, ask them to be something they are not and you'll be disappointing.

i dont get patty mills either. unless you think he will break out into an avery bradley like 2 way player.

Mills is a good shooter but one who is undersized, can only play one position and at 29 isnt some young prospect with a ton of growth potential anymore. to me he is like barbosa. great role guy if your a playoff team. but not someone a bad team should sink 6-10M per year into and eat into what you can offer other players.

Mills is a guy you use the MLE on. not your cap space

Agreed and my guess is he costs $10 to $14 million a year to come to a team like this, best case like $8 million in the first season for the full 4 years and Mills would have a player option years 3 and 4.

Player options can only be for a single year at the end of a contract. So it can't be a player option in both years 3 and 4.

[Prokorov]

yeah... which is why i typically dont like those 12-14M per year deals when you are way under the cap. 4 quarters doesnt make a dollar in that situation unless you get a great value. otherwise you are better rolling the money or overpaying an allstar calibur guy

when you are closer to the cap, and dont have max money, those other deals make more sense

I agree. The way the CBA is set up, you're essentially forced to land your stars first, and then use exceptions & draft picks to fill out the rest of the roster. If you lock yourself into mid-level and mid-priced players, the only way to land higher end players is to get lucky in the draft. Given the max length of contracts is down to 4 years for outside FAs, the downside of overpays is much lower than it used to be.

Which is why even though I'm not a quick fix guy obsessed with the playoffs or even our pick being given away next season, I'd still advocate chasing Millsap or maybe Hill. Unless as Prok is saying, roll the cap on a huge 1 year overpay, or my preferred modus operandi would be use the cap to absorb salary to get 1st round picks, if at all possible.

Yup... i HATE how Hill/Milsaps deals look 2 years out. but thats a better move for the franchise then signing mid level roll guys to long deals. at least overpaying hill/milsap gets you to the playoffs and makes this team more attractive as a future destination. and those guys have name value where it wouldnt be impossible to dump them with 1 year left.

if those guys say no, which i think they will... id rather more overpay 1+1 guys for sure like you said. try again next year. every year this team will look more attractive as a FA destination and every year we will have more young talent.

like marks said, last thing you want is a capped out 25-35 win team.

I'm 100% about trying to be good in 5 years and have it sustainable over in 1 or 2 years. but if milsap hill want to come here thats not the worst thing if it can help land free agents down the road for when we get our picks back and the young guys develop.

Hill/Milsap would expire in either 19-20 or 20-21 right when we gain pick control back. We would gain a ton of cap room by then as well

[shakendfries]

I agree. The way the CBA is set up, you're essentially forced to land your stars first, and then use exceptions & draft picks to fill out the rest of the roster. If you lock yourself into mid-level and mid-priced players, the only way to land higher end players is to get lucky in the draft. Given the max length of contracts is down to 4 years for outside FAs, the downside of overpays is much lower than it used to be.

Which is why even though I'm not a quick fix guy obsessed with the playoffs or even our pick being given away next season, I'd still advocate chasing Millsap or maybe Hill. Unless as Prok is saying, roll the cap on a huge 1 year overpay, or my preferred modus operandi would be use the cap to absorb salary to get 1st round picks, if at all possible.

Yup... i HATE how Hill/Milsaps deals look 2 years out. but thats a better move for the franchise then signing mid level roll guys to long deals. at least overpaying hill/milsap gets you to the playoffs and makes this team more attractive as a future destination. and those guys have name value where it wouldnt be impossible to dump them with 1 year left.

if those guys say no, which i think they will... id rather more overpay 1+1 guys for sure like you said. try again next year. every year this team will look more attractive as a FA destination and every year we will have more young talent.

like marks said, last thing you want is a capped out 25-35 win team.

Remember the Monta Ellis, Brandon Jennings, & Ersan Illyasova led Milwaukee Bucks?

[Prokorov]

i dont get patty mills either. unless you think he will break out into an avery bradley like 2 way player.

Mills is a good shooter but one who is undersized, can only play one position and at 29 isnt some young prospect with a ton of growth potential anymore. to me he is like barbosa. great role guy if your a playoff team. but not someone a bad team should sink 6-10M per year into and eat into what you can offer other players.

Mills is a guy you use the MLE on. not your cap space

Agreed and my guess is he costs $10 to $14 million a year to come to a team like this, best case like $8 million in the first season for the full 4 years and Mills would have a player option years 3 and 4.

Player options can only be for a single year at the end of a contract. So it can't be a player option in both years 3 and 4.

Yeah, the only move that makes sense for mills us to overpay him and give him like 2/24 or 2/28 with the second year being a team option. basically bringing in mills to help mentor young guys and provide shooting while essential being a place holder for the cap room.