Around the league 2016-2017

TTP · Post #1081 » by **TTP** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:20 pm

Kobblehead wrote:What talent do they really have other than Giannis?

I don't see any other player on their roster capable of being better than Porter or even Beal.

Middleton is very clearly better than Porter and probably better than Beal (though those two might be the 2nd and 3rd best SGs in the NBA).

Kobblehead · Post #1082 » by **Kobblehead** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:22 pm

There's no way that Middleton is better than Porter.

Porter almost generated more value above replacement THIS YEAR than Middleton has in the 9000 minutes of his career.

Negrodamus · Post #1083 » by **Negrodamus** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:25 pm

TTP wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:What talent do they really have other than Giannis?

I don't see any other player on their roster capable of being better than Porter or even Beal.

Middleton is very clearly better than Porter and probably better than Beal (though those two might be the 2nd and 3rd best SGs in the NBA).

I know you're very analytical in your judgements, so I'll ask: what evidence leads you to believe Middleton is not only better, but very clearly better, than Porter?

Kobblehead · Post #1084 » by **Kobblehead** » Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:30 pm

Yeah, that's a weird take from TTP.

TTP · Post #1085 » by **TTP** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:01 am

Negrodamus wrote:
TTP wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:What talent do they really have other than Giannis?

I don't see any other player on their roster capable of being better than Porter or even Beal.

Middleton is very clearly better than Porter and probably better than Beal (though those two might be the 2nd and 3rd best SGs in the NBA).

I know you're very analytical in your judgements, so I'll ask: what evidence leads you to believe Middleton is not only better, but very clearly better, than Porter?

I like Porter a lot. I did a full NBA re-draft among mostly intelligent NBA friends prior to the season starting and took Porter 91st on one of my teams (thus I was arguably higher on Porter than the other seven guys), so I was not surprised to see him break out further this year. That said, I don't think his shooting this year is sustainable and I don't think he's as valuable on either end as Middleton is.

I think Middleton is the most underrated player in the NBA. He was arguably the second best SG in the league each of the last two seasons (was second in RPM wins each season behind Harden). He doesn't really have any weaknesses other than not being the primary creator on his team, which is irrelevant when comparing him to Porter, who has a much smaller offensive role than Middleton does. He creates for both himself and others, shoots excellently from outside, and can defend multiple positions. He can probably succeed when thrown into any lineup.

The Bucks are just so much better when he's on the court and they've been on fire since he's been back - I'm not surprised at all that they're stomping the Raptors. His splits the last 3 years: +7.1 (despite recovering from a brutal injury), +12.6, +15.3.

I think Middleton is somewhere around the 15th to 20th best player in the NBA and he should have been an All-Star last year (though not surprising that he wasn't given the voters overvalue volume scoring and undervalue all-around contribution). I'd probably have Porter in the 30-45 range but would have to map out a full list to be sure.

I also like when one of the most knowledgeable NBA people on the planet has a similar take to me. I'm sure his models love Middleton.

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XtremeDunkz · Post #1086 » by **XtremeDunkz** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:06 am

Too many acronyms. Makes me think too hard.

TTP · Post #1087 » by **TTP** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:08 am

XtremeDunkz wrote:Too many acronyms. Makes me think too hard.

The double negative in the Tweet is worse than the acronyms, which are at least justifiable with the character limits.

Ericb5 · Post #1088 » by **Ericb5** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:19 am

shawn_hemp wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:So the endgame with all this Celtic posturing would be Melo, Horford and a 30 year old 5'8" PG? Yeah, that would be great for us.

It's like they pulled off a steal of a trade to get all of these great assets for aging players, then turned around and traded them for even less iconic aging players

Man this has got to be fake news, no way are the Celtics that dumb

Have the Celtics traded any assets for any players at all?

They are always involved in rumors, but they haven't done anything.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

shawn_hemp · Post #1089 » by **shawn_hemp** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:51 am

Ericb5 wrote:
shawn_hemp wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:So the endgame with all this Celtic posturing would be Melo, Horford and a 30 year old 5'8" PG? Yeah, that would be great for us.

It's like they pulled off a steal of a trade to get all of these great assets for aging players, then turned around and traded them for even less iconic aging players

Man this has got to be fake news, no way are the Celtics that dumb

Have the Celtics traded any assets for any players at all?

They are always involved in rumors, but they haven't done anything.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I was referring to the supposed Melo trade

Idk, would you trade a BKN pick for Melo if you were the Celtics? Kind of puts Jaylen Brown deeper in the rotation no?

Ok after re-reading your post I just realized your right and this is just another rumor to grab views on bleacher report

Highly, HIGHLY doubt the Celtics trade for Melo

XtremeDunkz · Post #1090 » by **XtremeDunkz** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:53 am

Ericb5 wrote:
shawn_hemp wrote:
Kobblehead wrote:So the endgame with all this Celtic posturing would be Melo, Horford and a 30 year old 5'8" PG? Yeah, that would be great for us.

It's like they pulled off a steal of a trade to get all of these great assets for aging players, then turned around and traded them for even less iconic aging players

Man this has got to be fake news, no way are the Celtics that dumb

Have the Celtics traded any assets for any players at all?

They are always involved in rumors, but they haven't done anything.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

David Lee was acquired by the Boston Celtics from the Golden State Warriors in exchange for Chris Babb, Gerald Wallace and a TPE.

That was the last Celtics trade. July 27th, 2015.

Ericb5 · Post #1091 » by **Ericb5** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 2:15 am

shawn_hemp wrote:
Ericb5 wrote:
shawn_hemp wrote:
It's like they pulled off a steal of a trade to get all of these great assets for aging players, then turned around and traded them for even less iconic aging players

Man this has got to be fake news, no way are the Celtics that dumb

Have the Celtics traded any assets for any players at all?

They are always involved in rumors, but they haven't done anything.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I was referring to the supposed Melo trade

Idk, would you trade a BKN pick for Melo if you were the Celtics? Kind of puts Jaylen Brown deeper in the rotation no?

Ok after re-reading your post I just realized your right and this is just another rumor to grab views on bleacher report

Highly, HIGHLY doubt the Celtics trade for Melo

I wouldn't trade a Brooklyn pick for Melo for sure. I think that would be a bad move.

That being said, I think that they could have EASILY had Butler, George, or Cousins if they would have stepped up. Ainge has kept his powder dry, and we don't know how it is going to turn out, but seeing that they could have had Cousins if they had offered this year's Brooklyn pick for example, they BETTER be right with their draft choices.

Even as a knucklehead, Cousins is a flat out superstar, and Boston is still looking for one. For a team like Boston that is a playoff team on the cusp of contending in the east at least, taking the chance to get the superstar when you have it seems like a no brainer.

I believe in building through the draft, and the Nets haul is a ridiculous bounty, but if they are doing everything else in their power to win now, it makes no sense to play the long game with the Nets picks.

They should either cash them in for win now pieces, or they should stop trying to win now.

I have been a Sixers fan since 86 or so, so I just missed the core rivalry with the Celtics. I don't hate them like many Sixers fans do.

Lloyd always says that he would hate to see the Celtics get Ball, but I'd be fine with that. I want them to succeed, and then lose to us in future years in the playoffs anyway.

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Post #1092 » by **CoreyGallagher** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:02 am

Watching this Rockets-Thunder game, with how tightly refs call these, Embiid would draw so many fouls.

Kobblehead · Post #1093 » by **Kobblehead** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:22 pm

Games start earlier today (Bucks/Raptors tip at 3pm). I'll probably catch both Eastern Conference games.

Unbreakable99 · Post #1094 » by **Unbreakable99** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:30 pm

Boston is winning the series now. They will reach the conference finals.

the_process · Post #1095 » by **the_process** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:05 pm

Unbreakable99 wrote:Boston is winning the series now. They will reach the conference finals.

I hope that's true and they buy in, trade for Melo and max out IT.

However, I'd bet on Washington in the 2nd round.

76ciology · Post #1096 » by **76ciology** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:20 pm

How do you guys find Gordon Hayward? He's good but I'm not that high on him. Better than Klay? Not looking at the stats, I'd rather have Klay and his reliable scoring.

snoopdogg88 · Post #1097 » by **snoopdogg88** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 3:33 pm

Sucks for the Clippers

It's almost as though relying on players who are always injured and can't stay healthy is a bad way to go and will burn you every time. *coughJoelEmbiidcough*

JojoSlimbiid · Post #1098 » by **JojoSlimbiid** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:53 pm

76ciology wrote:How do you guys find Gordon Hayward? He's good but I'm not that high on him. Better than Klay? Not looking at the stats, I'd rather have Klay and his reliable scoring.

Hayward is a much better player. I'm sure the advance stats love Klay but when damn near all of your baskets are assisted it's hard to compare you to guys that can create for themselves.

TTP · Post #1099 » by **TTP** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 5:07 pm

76ciology wrote:How do you guys find Gordon Hayward? He's good but I'm not that high on him. Better than Klay? Not looking at the stats, I'd rather have Klay and his reliable scoring.

I think Hayward is probably a tier up from Klay but there are going to be plenty of teams that you'd prefer to have Klay on.

Negrodamus · Post #1100 » by **Negrodamus** » Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:43 pm

Giannis travels like every time in a fast break situation. We get called on that every time.