This offseason

[Prokorov]

Kenny must be the worst coach in the NBA. how do you have a top 5 PG and top 5 C and not make the playoffs?

i mean the clippers won 51 games without a top 5 PG or top 5 center!!!

We don't. Even if we did, Lin missed 46 games. So the poster above you can't go on our record.

Anyway, I wish we wouldn't do these Lin ranks with so and so stuff anymore as it goes down a bad road. PG is the strongest position of any in the current NBA.

I personally wouldn't pick IT or Walker over Lin because Lin is a 2-way player, and IT is too small to play effective defense as is Walker to some extent. And Walker needs Batum to help him facilitate (though I love Walker's ball handling and scoring capabilities). Conley may be the best 2-way player of the bunch, may be my choice for best in the league. Not best scorer, not most athletic, but in a combination of useful skills and surrounded by skilled players, one of the best in a team sense. And I like that about Lin, put some good players around him he proves to be a key part of winning, and that's the bottom line and not triple doubles (an overrated stat), high scoring games, or some of the others judged to determine "star" players. Just help win, and come up big when it matters (is what Conley does.) Steph is still great, but not the defender Conley is. And Rondo is a great facilitator. Each PG really has qualities that help his own team, so it isn't just so and so over some one else. You have to consider the team. Rondo stunk on some of the teams he was on but does well on Chicago when he feels like it.

I was just making light of his post... it is obviously insane and not worth real consideration. Chris Paul is better then Lin on both ends by such an extreme margin it makes his entire list a complete sham.

[bws94]

Kenny must be the worst coach in the NBA. how do you have a top 5 PG and top 5 C and not make the playoffs?

i mean the clippers won 51 games without a top 5 PG or top 5 center!!!

We don't. Even if we did, Lin missed 46 games. So the poster above you can't go on our record.

Anyway, I wish we wouldn't do these Lin ranks with so and so stuff anymore as it goes down a bad road. PG is the strongest position of any in the current NBA.

I personally wouldn't pick IT or Walker over Lin because Lin is a 2-way player, and IT is too small to play effective defense as is Walker to some extent. And Walker needs Batum to help him facilitate (though I love Walker's ball handling and scoring capabilities). Conley may be the best 2-way player of the bunch, may be my choice for best in the league. Not best scorer, not most athletic, but in a combination of useful skills and surrounded by skilled players, one of the best in a team sense. And I like that about Lin, put some good players around him he proves to be a key part of winning, and that's the bottom line and not triple doubles (an overrated stat), high scoring games, or some of the others judged to determine "star" players. Just help win, and come up big when it matters (is what Conley does.) Steph is still great, but not the defender Conley is. And Rondo is a great facilitator. Each PG really has qualities that help his own team, so it isn't just so and so over some one else. You have to consider the team. Rondo stunk on some of the teams he was on but does well on Chicago when he feels like it.

I was just making light of his post... it is obviously insane and not worth real consideration. Chris Paul is better then Lin on both ends by such an extreme margin it makes his entire list a complete sham.

I used to like CP3 but lately, it just seems like he can't get his team but so far. I don't know if it is a combo of injuries, the bad free throws of D Jordan, or what, but it just seems at some point, the Clippers lose games they should win for some dumb reason. But CP3 may be a hall of famer.

[Prokorov]

We don't. Even if we did, Lin missed 46 games. So the poster above you can't go on our record.

Anyway, I wish we wouldn't do these Lin ranks with so and so stuff anymore as it goes down a bad road. PG is the strongest position of any in the current NBA.

I personally wouldn't pick IT or Walker over Lin because Lin is a 2-way player, and IT is too small to play effective defense as is Walker to some extent. And Walker needs Batum to help him facilitate (though I love Walker's ball handling and scoring capabilities). Conley may be the best 2-way player of the bunch, may be my choice for best in the league. Not best scorer, not most athletic, but in a combination of useful skills and surrounded by skilled players, one of the best in a team sense. And I like that about Lin, put some good players around him he proves to be a key part of winning, and that's the bottom line and not triple doubles (an overrated stat), high scoring games, or some of the others judged to determine "star" players. Just help win, and come up big when it matters (is what Conley does.) Steph is still great, but not the defender Conley is. And Rondo is a great facilitator. Each PG really has qualities that help his own team, so it isn't just so and so over some one else. You have to consider the team. Rondo stunk on some of the teams he was on but does well on Chicago when he feels like it.

I was just making light of his post... it is obviously insane and not worth real consideration. Chris Paul is better then Lin on both ends by such an extreme margin it makes his entire list a complete sham.

I used to like CP3 but lately, it just seems like he can't get his team but so far. I don't know if it is a combo of injuries, the bad free throws of D Jordan, or what, but it just seems at some point, the Clippers lose games they should win for some dumb reason. But CP3 may be a hall of famer.

I mean his career overlaps with kobe/shaw lakers, duncan/kawai/parker spurs, and curry/klay/durant warriors. i mean those are 3 all time teams.

injuries didnt help either. blake going down. either way, if you switch him and lin the clippers would be figting for an 8 seed meanwhile the nets would win 50 games.

[bws94]

I was just making light of his post... it is obviously insane and not worth real consideration. Chris Paul is better then Lin on both ends by such an extreme margin it makes his entire list a complete sham.

I used to like CP3 but lately, it just seems like he can't get his team but so far. I don't know if it is a combo of injuries, the bad free throws of D Jordan, or what, but it just seems at some point, the Clippers lose games they should win for some dumb reason. But CP3 may be a hall of famer.

I mean his career overlaps with kobe/shaw lakers, duncan/kawai/parker spurs, and curry/klay/durant warriors. i mean those are 3 all time teams.

injuries didnt help either. blake going down. either way, if you switch him and lin the clippers would be figting for an 8 seed meanwhile the nets would win 50 games.

I actually don't agree with that part about switching Lin with CP3 would result in that dramatic a difference. I mean, give Lin a PnR center and a talent like Blake Griffin and then run him sometimes with Jamal Crawford, and I think he'd do well. Maybe not quite as good as CP3, but not that far off. But I agree with you about Blake's injuries and the competition.

Edited.

[Kswiss]

I would take Lin over Dennis Schroder, and I think Lin and Jrue Holiday aren't that far apart as players. I'm not a fan of the way Schroder approaches the game or his defense. Very inefficient player imo.

Everyone else, I take over Lin.

I'm not sure if Kswiss was literally trolling or he's dead serious.

No I wasn't trolling, based on how Lin can carry a team and elevate the players around him, I think you gotta put him top5. He's a poor man's Lebron. Look what he did to the Hornets last year with less health and talent than they had this year. Their over-under was 30, he carried them to 48 wins. Back down to 36 this year. After 29 losses in a row, suddenly he makes the Nets look like a competitive playoff team. I think Lin is that good.

[Curns13]

I would take Lin over Dennis Schroder, and I think Lin and Jrue Holiday aren't that far apart as players. I'm not a fan of the way Schroder approaches the game or his defense. Very inefficient player imo.

Everyone else, I take over Lin.

I'm not sure if Kswiss was literally trolling or he's dead serious.

No I wasn't trolling, based on how Lin can carry a team and elevate the players around him, I think you gotta put him top5. He's a poor man's Lebron. Look what he did to the Hornets last year with less health and talent than they had this year. Their over-under was 30, he carried them to 48 wins. Back down to 36 this year. After 29 losses in a row, suddenly he makes the Nets look like a competitive playoff team. I think Lin is that good.

[bws94]

I would take Lin over Dennis Schroder, and I think Lin and Jrue Holiday aren't that far apart as players. I'm not a fan of the way Schroder approaches the game or his defense. Very inefficient player imo.

Everyone else, I take over Lin.

I'm not sure if Kswiss was literally trolling or he's dead serious.

No I wasn't trolling, based on how Lin can carry a team and elevate the players around him, I think you gotta put him top5. He's a poor man's Lebron. Look what he did to the Hornets last year with less health and talent than they had this year. Their over-under was 30, he carried them to 48 wins. Back down to 36 this year. After 29 losses in a row, suddenly he makes the Nets look like a competitive playoff team. I think Lin is that good.

OK. But I'm a Lin fan and I think you're way off base.

Anyway, like the mod said, we're OT.

[MrDollarBills]

I would take Lin over Dennis Schroder, and I think Lin and Jrue Holiday aren't that far apart as players. I'm not a fan of the way Schroder approaches the game or his defense. Very inefficient player imo.

Everyone else, I take over Lin.

I'm not sure if Kswiss was literally trolling or he's dead serious.

I would take Lin over Jrue Holiday. Don't think Holiday has any major advantages over Lin. And Rubio is interesting since his game is so bipolar. He is close to top 5 by some metrics and he is still one of worst PGs in terms of shooting although he has improved recently I think. So I don't know where to rank him. Schroder is still so young so I wouldn't rank him with the veterans. I agree with your assessment but he still has a lot of room for growth.

I think the other guys are better than Lin right now. He missed Lillard, Bledsoe and Teague in the list as well. It is just very difficult to crack the top 15 as a PG in today's NBA.

Rubio is hard to rank because you look at his shooting and go "ehhh" but then his playmaking and defensive chops really can't be denied. The guy is an elite passer in the sport, bar none, and has been since he was a teenager. I have way too much respect for him honestly.

Actually, I would take Lin over Teague too. To be very blunt, I think Jeff Teague plays like a bitch a lot of times and gets a pass for it.

I think Holiday and Lin are on par with each other, but that's also up for interpretation.

[Prokorov]

Lin having Lebron like impact now?

i give up.... it doesnt get more delusional then a Lin fan.

[Keith Van Horn]

I'd take Teague here to be our 2nd guard, especially since he would come cheaper than Hill and probably on par with Teodosic money. Having rapport with Kenny could be a major deal. I don't know enough about Teague's defense though tbh, I know Hill is an excellent defender and Milos I've heard is so-so. Those 3 guys would all do well starting between Lin and Levert.

The power forward position remains a concern too. Millsap would be top target, Blake option 2. Both of those guys are home runs though... so I'll not be too optimistic.

As season progresses next year, try to get a first rounder near the deadline for either Booker or RHJ (my wish would be to see if Booker could net us a pick to a playoff hopeful team).

Need to hope that Levert has a strong off season. We have very high expectations of him but need to be realistic.

[reelsgm]

No I wasn't trolling, based on how Lin can carry a team and elevate the players around him, I think you gotta put him top5. He's a poor man's Lebron. Look what he did to the Hornets last year with less health and talent than they had this year. Their over-under was 30, he carried them to 48 wins. Back down to 36 this year. After 29 losses in a row, suddenly he makes the Nets look like a competitive playoff team. I think Lin is that good.

Question is: Could ANY starting level PG lead most talent-less (oxymoronic?) team to wins like Lin post ASB? -- Most believe, yes.

But focus on gm 82 a moment. Caveats: 1) One game sample size minimal relevancy, take with grain-of-salt; 2) Bropez also out but many aren't convinced his ability to lead wins anyway.

Fact remains a pre-Lin starting lineup: Dinw,Foye,CLV,RHJ,JHam for Bropez played hard against Bulls A-team but they cooked us all 4 Qs. Bulls even bricked shot-after-shot but we played worse. Bench awful - KJ, IW terrible. Reality-check game, stark difference - a throwback to some "I'm-getting-mine" play of earlier.

Final Bulls game indicated, despite the vaunted "improvement" of development guys -- we're still a hairs away from 12 win abysmal-ness.

Don't know who else/how many others could lead us to Wins but to believe this team's "improvement" without a skilled capable leader at point gets us out of deep cellar -- is pure fantasy.

[Prokorov]

No I wasn't trolling, based on how Lin can carry a team and elevate the players around him, I think you gotta put him top5. He's a poor man's Lebron. Look what he did to the Hornets last year with less health and talent than they had this year. Their over-under was 30, he carried them to 48 wins. Back down to 36 this year. After 29 losses in a row, suddenly he makes the Nets look like a competitive playoff team. I think Lin is that good.

Question is: Could ANY starting level PG lead most talent-less (oxymoronic?) team to wins like Lin post ASB? -- Most believe, yes.

But focus on gm 82 a moment. Caveats: 1) One game sample size minimal relevancy, take with grain-of-salt; 2) Bropez also out but many aren't convinced his ability to lead wins anyway.

Fact remains a pre-Lin starting lineup: Dinw,Foye,CLV,RHJ,JHam for Bropez played hard against Bulls A-team but they cooked us all 4 Qs. Bulls even bricked shot-after-shot but we played worse. Bench awful - KJ, IW terrible. Reality-check game, stark difference - a throwback to some "I'm-getting-mine" play of earlier.

Final Bulls game indicated, despite the vaunted "improvement" of development guys -- we're still a hairs away from 12 win abysmal-ness.

Don't know who else/how many others could lead us to Wins but to believe this team's "improvement" without a skilled capable leader at point gets us out of deep cellar -- is pure fantasy.

This nets team with chris paul doesnt miss the playoffs. few guys have a bigger impact on winning. we'd be a 45+ win team

[reelsgm]

This nets team with chris paul doesnt miss the playoffs. few guys have a bigger impact on winning. we'd be a 45+ win team[/quote]
CP3 ... well then how 'bout with Jrue Holiday or guys at or below his level?

[Prokorov]

This nets team with chris paul doesnt miss the playoffs. few guys have a bigger impact on winning. we'd be a 45+ win team

CP3 ... well then how 'bout with Jrue Holiday or guys at or below his level?[/quote]

No Jrue Holiday doesnt change anything and im not convinced he is better then Lin.

but this top 5 PG better then chris paul stuff is just crazy talk.

[reelsgm]

This nets team with chris paul doesnt miss the playoffs. few guys have a bigger impact on winning. we'd be a 45+ win team

CP3 ... well then how 'bout with Jrue Holiday or guys at or below his level?

No Jrue Holiday doesnt change anything and im not convinced he is better then Lin.

but this top 5 PG better then chris paul stuff is just crazy talk.

Comparing CP3 and Lin isn't that like comparing Lin to Lebron in your book?

So your belief it appears is that Lin's somewhere between CP3 and Holiday ... guess that's progress.

[Prokorov]

CP3 ... well then how 'bout with Jrue Holiday or guys at or below his level?

No Jrue Holiday doesnt change anything and im not convinced he is better then Lin.

but this top 5 PG better then chris paul stuff is just crazy talk.

Comparing CP3 and Lin isn't that like comparing Lin to Lebron in your book?

So your belief it appears is that Lin's somewhere between CP3 and Holiday ... guess that's progress.

it is an insult to CP3 and everyone who reads this forum to compare lin to CP3 as if they are on the same level.

CP3 is a hall of famer and all-NBA player who statistically has an enormous impact on wins and elite numbers.

Lin is a journeyman who has bounced from team to team between starting and reserve rolls whose numbers dont come close to making it reasonable to consider him a top 5 PG or anything near that.

if you want to argue Lin vs the Holidays, teagues, and schroeders sure. that makes sense...

Wall/CP3//Lillards... i mean at that point its either trolling or delusional.

[Claud]

Lin has the same impact as LBJ now and better than IT, Kyrie, CP3 and Conley... wow really bad troll attempt.

Lin is a best an AVERAGE NBA starter..


I'm happy we got Lin and I think he's a solid player but some of his fans are just absolutely blind or love to troll and start **** up.

[reelsgm]

No Jrue Holiday doesnt change anything and im not convinced he is better then Lin.

but this top 5 PG better then chris paul stuff is just crazy talk.

Comparing CP3 and Lin isn't that like comparing Lin to Lebron in your book?

So your belief it appears is that Lin's somewhere between CP3 and Holiday ... guess that's progress.

it is an insult to CP3 and everyone who reads this forum to compare lin to CP3 as if they are on the same level.

CP3 is a hall of famer and all-NBA player who statistically has an enormous impact on wins and elite numbers.

Lin is a journeyman who has bounced from team to team between starting and reserve rolls whose numbers dont come close to making it reasonable to consider him a top 5 PG or anything near that.

if you want to argue Lin vs the Holidays, teagues, and schroeders sure. that makes sense...

Wall/CP3//Lillards... i mean at that point its either trolling or delusional.

I didn't bring up CP3 ... you did

[Kswiss]

No Jrue Holiday doesnt change anything and im not convinced he is better then Lin.

but this top 5 PG better then chris paul stuff is just crazy talk.

Comparing CP3 and Lin isn't that like comparing Lin to Lebron in your book?

So your belief it appears is that Lin's somewhere between CP3 and Holiday ... guess that's progress.

it is an insult to CP3 and everyone who reads this forum to compare lin to CP3 as if they are on the same level.

CP3 is a hall of famer and all-NBA player who statistically has an enormous impact on wins and elite numbers.

Lin is a journeyman who has bounced from team to team between starting and reserve rolls whose numbers dont come close to making it reasonable to consider him a top 5 PG or anything near that.

if you want to argue Lin vs the Holidays, teagues, and schroeders sure. that makes sense...

Wall/CP3//Lillards... i mean at that point its either trolling or delusional.

I agree Lin doesn't post massive numbers, he only cares about winning and that's all he does. I never really bought into the whole "stats over winning basketball" argument. To me the top 5 PGs should be the players most capable of carrying a team to wins... Lin made us around a .500 team without a legitimate PF or SG (I think levert is a legit starter). Next year, hopefully we can put all this debate to rest with a healthy Lin season and we'll see what happens record-wise. Look at all the talent surrounding CP3 throughout his career and he's never made it out of the second round in 10+ years... let's stop with the "CP3 goat talk." He's having a good series (for him) against Utah and still his ball-dominant style of play is leading to them getting handled. I can't imagine what he'd do with much less talent on this Nets team smh

[Prokorov]

I didn't bring up CP3 ... you did

I didn't bring up CP3, kswiss did....