2017 OKC Thunder Trade Discussion

[slick_watts]

You really think he's unattainable? He's a good player but I if we were willing to move some of our better pieces, it's seems reasonable. They obviously need a PG, which we can't offer. Would they have any interest in a shooting guard like Abrines? I would hate to give up Abrines but RoCo's defense probably makes it worth it. If Covington is that good of a player, why not go all in for him?

covington is better than abrines and is playing for $1.5mm next season- then the sixers have full bird rights. why would they trade him for abrines?

i don't think we have anything that would move the needle for philly on covington.

[ThunderBolt]

You really think he's unattainable? He's a good player but I if we were willing to move some of our better pieces, it's seems reasonable. They obviously need a PG, which we can't offer. Would they have any interest in a shooting guard like Abrines? I would hate to give up Abrines but RoCo's defense probably makes it worth it. If Covington is that good of a player, why not go all in for him?

covington is better than abrines and is playing for $1.5mm next season- then the sixers have full bird rights. why would they trade him for abrines?

i don't think we have anything that would move the needle for philly on covington.

Say we get Roberson for around 10 million a year. At the trade deadline would Roberson + Abrines be close?

[Kizz Fastfists]

Sign n trade have always been rare but could a sign n trade make everyone happy with Robes? Acquirer gets him but lessens net salary outlay. Thunder get something and the payroll doesn't get as ridiculous and more locked in for a meh plus team. Robes gets paid and maybe by a good team.

Roberson's value is mostly restricted to contenders. A team like Cleveland might want him in a S&T, but they aren't going to give you much. Boston likes wing defenders and maybe after using their cap space they'd be interested in a S&T, but the best case would be a 2019 first from Memphis or LAC and cap filler. GS might be interested in Roberson if they lose Livignston and Iguodala this off-season. Utah or SA could want to go for more defense.

I don't think there is any S&T without taking back salary so it doesn't really help them any. Anyone who could take Roberson with cap space in a S&T would just sign him outright. It would have to be a team over the cap and they would have to send out salary. OKC has to trade Kanter before they can really think about doing anything with Roberson other than making the QO.

[Andre Roberstan]

What would it take to get Robert Covington? He ought to be a little easier to acquire than an Otto Porter/Harrison Barnes. He's only 26, which is great. What do we offer? Roberson? Sabonis?

Covington's one of the best wing defenders in the league and a very capable 3-point shooter. We can't offer anything Philly would want.

You really think he's unattainable? He's a good player but I if we were willing to move some of our better pieces, it's seems reasonable. They obviously need a PG, which we can't offer. Would they have any interest in a shooting guard like Abrines? I would hate to give up Abrines but RoCo's defense probably makes it worth it. If Covington is that good of a player, why not go all in for him?

Let me put it this way:

Saying "would they have any interest in a shooting guard like Abrines" in a trade for Covington is like starting a Russ trade with "would they have any interest in Kemba Walker".

[Andre Roberstan]

You really think he's unattainable? He's a good player but I if we were willing to move some of our better pieces, it's seems reasonable. They obviously need a PG, which we can't offer. Would they have any interest in a shooting guard like Abrines? I would hate to give up Abrines but RoCo's defense probably makes it worth it. If Covington is that good of a player, why not go all in for him?

covington is better than abrines and is playing for $1.5mm next season- then the sixers have full bird rights. why would they trade him for abrines?

i don't think we have anything that would move the needle for philly on covington.

Say we get Roberson for around 10 million a year. At the trade deadline would Roberson + Abrines be close?

No. Not at all. Not even in the ballpark.

[ThunderBolt]

covington is better than abrines and is playing for $1.5mm next season- then the sixers have full bird rights. why would they trade him for abrines?

i don't think we have anything that would move the needle for philly on covington.

Say we get Roberson for around 10 million a year. At the trade deadline would Roberson + Abrines be close?

No. Not at all. Not even in the ballpark.

He's a good player but why does he have a value equal to Ben Simmons? He's 26 and averaged 12 and 6.5. That's very good but it's not like he's an all star. Just trying to figure out why is value is that high.

[Andre Roberstan]

Say we get Roberson for around 10 million a year. At the trade deadline would Roberson + Abrines be close?

No. Not at all. Not even in the ballpark.

He's a good player but why does he have a value equal to Ben Simmons? He's 26 and averaged 12 and 6.5. That's very good but it's not like he's an all star. Just trying to figure out why is value is that high.

He's making 1.5mil, he's one of the best defenders in the league, and he can shoot the 3. 3&D wings are basically the scarcest commodity in the NBA behind superstar players, especially ones that are as dirt cheap as Covington. He's untradeable unless they're including him in a package for a superstar player. It's supply and demand. You want a list of all the 3&D players of Covington's quality that make 1.5mil or less? Here's the list:

Robert Covington

[Pillendreher]

He has one season left with 1,5 million. That's not valuable to other teams because he'll get paid in 12 months time.

And regarding the 3pt shot: He's at 33 % for the season. Sub 50 eFG%.

You're (vastly) overvaluing him. Philly has no incentive to trade him, but I wouldn't trade Abrines straight up for Covington either, so there's that.
A lot of Covington's intrigue still comes from his first season and his contract. The first one is about to change dramatically and he hasn't been above average at the 2nd one since his sophomore season.

[jambalaya]

You can take less salary back in a S&T from a capped team. At least $3 million less, maybe $5m. And teams under cap even less.


Covington has a RPM estimate of plus 3.55. 8th best for SFs and much better than Robes. The question is which GM knows about / believes less in RPM? Most don't respect / rely on it much if any.

[ThunderBolt]

I'm not suggesting one of our assets straight across for covington. Maybe a combination of Abrines, Sabonis, Roberson, draft pick, McDermott. I thought a combination of possibly two of those might generate some interest.

[Pillendreher]

I'm not suggesting one of our assets straight across for covington. Maybe a combination of Abrines, Sabonis, Roberson, draft pick, McDermott. I thought a combination of possibly two of those might generate some interest.

Why would you sell half the farm for a guy who can't shoot?
He shot 30 % on corner 3s this season! The last time Covington had a solid season from 3, we were wondering about our lottery pick and Mitch McGary's potential and future role.

[Andre Roberstan]

He has one season left with 1,5 million. That's not valuable to other teams because he'll get paid in 12 months time.

And regarding the 3pt shot: He's at 33 % for the season. Sub 50 eFG%.

You're (vastly) overvaluing him. Philly has no incentive to trade him, but I wouldn't trade Abrines straight up for Covington either, so there's that.
A lot of Covington's intrigue still comes from his first season and his contract. The first one is about to change dramatically and he hasn't been above average at the 2nd one since his sophomore season.

He's at 35% for his career on very high volume—I'd chalk it up to a down year. His role's changed, and he's gotten fewer corner 3 opportunities by a pretty significant amount than he has in previous years

He'll get paid in 12 months, yeah, but he'll be RFA. And he's a piece that's worth keeping around.

[ThunderBolt]

I'm not suggesting one of our assets straight across for covington. Maybe a combination of Abrines, Sabonis, Roberson, draft pick, McDermott. I thought a combination of possibly two of those might generate some interest.

Why would you sell half the farm for a guy who can't shoot?
He shot 30 % on corner 3s this season! The last time Covington had a solid season from 3, we were wondering about our lottery pick and Mitch McGary's potential and future role.

I wouldn't give up Abrines and sabonis, but I think certain combinations of a two for one could be worth it. That being said, based upon some of the preceding comments his contact seems to be more valuable than his skills.

[slick_watts]

He has one season left with 1,5 million. That's not valuable to other teams because he'll get paid in 12 months time.

he's about league average 3pt for his career on 1300+ attempts and elite defense at multiple positions. i think that'd be valuable to a lot of teams, especially a contending team that wants to add him + other pieces. easy to fit $1.5mm of salary into the cap sheet.

[jambalaya]

If you trust RPM to be fairly close for most guys, it has said Covington's value is completely on defense for at least 2 years. His offensive impact estimate has been small negative.

[bbms]

I'm not suggesting one of our assets straight across for covington. Maybe a combination of Abrines, Sabonis, Roberson, draft pick, McDermott. I thought a combination of possibly two of those might generate some interest.

Why would you sell half the farm for a guy who can't shoot?
He shot 30 % on corner 3s this season! The last time Covington had a solid season from 3, we were wondering about our lottery pick and Mitch McGary's potential and future role.

I wouldn't give up Abrines and sabonis, but I think certain combinations of a two for one could be worth it. That being said, based upon some of the preceding comments his contact seems to be more valuable than his skills.

Me neither. I'd wait at least one more full season before trying to move them. They can do a few things the Thunder won't be able to find on the cheap. Sabonis can be a positive defensive player on a big formation in this small-oriented league and stretch the floor. Abrines can create offense and spread the floor. Their skillset warrant the wait.

[ThunderBolt]

Why would you sell half the farm for a guy who can't shoot?
He shot 30 % on corner 3s this season! The last time Covington had a solid season from 3, we were wondering about our lottery pick and Mitch McGary's potential and future role.

I wouldn't give up Abrines and sabonis, but I think certain combinations of a two for one could be worth it. That being said, based upon some of the preceding comments his contact seems to be more valuable than his skills.

Me neither. I'd wait at least one more full season before trying to move them. They can do a few things the Thunder won't be able to find on the cheap. Sabonis can be a positive defensive player on a big formation in this small-oriented league and stretch the floor. Abrines can create offense and spread the floor. Their skillset warrant the wait.

Obviously we aren't setup to beat golden state. It just seems like we need to commit to one side or the ball, offensive or defensive. They way are rotations are now, we have specialists at one end and liabilities at the other. I feel like an offensively challenged team is more likely to have games they shoot well than a defensively challenged team is likely to happen to have a lockdown game.

As I look at our lineups, I wonder if we should commit to the defensive end and just continue to let Russ run the offense. Kanter, McDermott and Abrines would be guys that we could live without. It might be an ugly style of basketball to watch, but we could potentially be the best defense in the league if Russ would buy in.

[Pillendreher]

He has one season left with 1,5 million. That's not valuable to other teams because he'll get paid in 12 months time.

he's about league average 3pt for his career on 1300+ attempts and elite defense at multiple positions. i think that'd be valuable to a lot of teams, especially a contending team that wants to add him + other pieces. easy to fit $1.5mm of salary into the cap sheet.

I'm not saying that he's not a decent enough player. I'm saying he's not that good of a 3pt shooter and that his very cheap contract will be a thing of the past in just a year's time. What kind of contract will he get? Is 60/4 totally improbable?

I feel like the same thing happens to those young, unexpected contributors. They come out of nowhere, but once that 'WHO'S THAT' feeling passes and they sign their first contract, the 'hype' is over. Look at Miami's young guys. Both got paid. Now they have to live up to that. It doesn't really matter that they were cheap as **** only a couple of months ago.

[slick_watts]

He has one season left with 1,5 million. That's not valuable to other teams because he'll get paid in 12 months time.

he's about league average 3pt for his career on 1300+ attempts and elite defense at multiple positions. i think that'd be valuable to a lot of teams, especially a contending team that wants to add him + other pieces. easy to fit $1.5mm of salary into the cap sheet.

I'm not saying that he's not a decent enough player. I'm saying he's not that good of a 3pt shooter and that his very cheap contract will be a thing of the past in just a year's time. What kind of contract will he get? Is 60/4 totally improbable?

I feel like the same thing happens to those young, unexpected contributors. They come out of nowhere, but once that 'WHO'S THAT' feeling passes and they sign their first contract, the 'hype' is over. Look at Miami's young guys. Both got paid. Now they have to live up to that. It doesn't really matter that they were cheap as **** only a couple of months ago.

the nets signed tyler johnson to a 4/50 offer sheet that miami matched so to say covington wouldn't be desirable using johnson as an example...?

johnson's right below derozan and above w. matthews on sg rpm and making way less than either than them.

covington would be highly desirable if he was made available via trade.

[Kizz Fastfists]

You can take less salary back in a S&T from a capped team. At least $3 million less, maybe $5m. And teams under cap even less.

It is a percentage not a dollar amount. The amount incoming must be more than 120% of the salary leaving if the team will end the trade over the cap. Assuming Roberson is doing a S&T at $10M OKC would have to take back over $8M in salary if dealing with a team over the cap. That still leaves OKC clears significant salary.