Trade Ideas thread

[Biggsohnasty]

But if teams like Toronto or Portland in particular want to shed some bad money to try to sign other players and are willing to give up picks in the 20s, it'd be foolish not to explore that.

Those are the kinds of deals I think the Wolves should be looking at too. They have cap space - take on a contract like Carroll's that might not be great looking but can give you that coveted vet while also giving you some young guys that you can develop further.

I'd rather take on Wes Matthews or Allen Crabbe but if you can get Carroll and the Raptors attach a pick to it, he's better than just about any wing the Wolves can probably attract this summer.

Ingles is a better all around player, will demand kind of the same money and has been healthier. A late first isn't enough if you aren't targeting a specific guy. The chance those guy succeed is minimal.

I would go for Carroll only if he our FA targets are gone.

The "last 1st and 2nd round picks are worthless" notion is what gets you locked into this position where you have to spend 15-20 million on 3 and D wing players.

Lots of good players can be found if you know where to look and what to look for when targetting those players. Also some luck involved but having darts to throw never hurts. There are people on this board are obsessed with Jimmy Butler, Jae Crowder and there are a lot of people that like Matthews, Carroll, Tucker, Ingles - the list goes on. What were those guys before they were at this point? All of them were late 1st to mid-second round picks. Let's develop our own Jae Crowder/Joe Ingles/Wes Matthews/Damarre Carroll.

Picks 20-40 don't have to be useless.

[Neeva]

But if teams like Toronto or Portland in particular want to shed some bad money to try to sign other players and are willing to give up picks in the 20s, it'd be foolish not to explore that.

Those are the kinds of deals I think the Wolves should be looking at too. They have cap space - take on a contract like Carroll's that might not be great looking but can give you that coveted vet while also giving you some young guys that you can develop further.

I'd rather take on Wes Matthews or Allen Crabbe but if you can get Carroll and the Raptors attach a pick to it, he's better than just about any wing the Wolves can probably attract this summer.

Ingles is a better all around player, will demand kind of the same money and has been healthier. A late first isn't enough if you aren't targeting a specific guy. The chance those guy succeed is minimal.

I would go for Carroll only if he our FA targets are gone.

The "last 1st and 2nd round picks are worthless" notion is what gets you locked into this position where you have to spend 15-20 million on 3 and D wing players.

Lots of good players can be found if you know where to look and what to look for when targetting those players. Also some luck involved but having darts to throw never hurts. There are people on this board are obsessed with Jimmy Butler, Jae Crowder and there are a lot of people that like Matthews, Carroll, Tucker, Ingles - the list goes on. What were those guys before they were at this point? All of them were late 1st to mid-second round picks. Let's develop our own Jae Crowder/Joe Ingles/Wes Matthews/Damarre Carroll.

Picks 20-40 don't have to be useless.

Yes it gets annoying how other teams get lucky drafting great players late in the first round/second round and the wolves get Tyus Jones types smh.

[theGreatRC]

Ingles is a better all around player, will demand kind of the same money and has been healthier. A late first isn't enough if you aren't targeting a specific guy. The chance those guy succeed is minimal.

I would go for Carroll only if he our FA targets are gone.

The "last 1st and 2nd round picks are worthless" notion is what gets you locked into this position where you have to spend 15-20 million on 3 and D wing players.

Lots of good players can be found if you know where to look and what to look for when targetting those players. Also some luck involved but having darts to throw never hurts. There are people on this board are obsessed with Jimmy Butler, Jae Crowder and there are a lot of people that like Matthews, Carroll, Tucker, Ingles - the list goes on. What were those guys before they were at this point? All of them were late 1st to mid-second round picks. Let's develop our own Jae Crowder/Joe Ingles/Wes Matthews/Damarre Carroll.

Picks 20-40 don't have to be useless.

Yes it gets annoying how other teams get lucky drafting great players late in the first round/second round and the wolves get Tyus Jones types smh.

We've gotten some pretty decent players with our later picks, most of them we ended up trading to other teams.

Ty Lawson, Trevor Booker, Andre Roberson to name a few in recent years. (How much of that was actually us picking for the other team is the question)

We got Pek with a second rounder, Craig Smith too. We also picked Ellington who's still in the league.

[Klomp]

Ty Lawson, Trevor Booker, Andre Roberson to name a few in recent years. (How much of that was actually us picking for the other team is the question)

We got Pek with a second rounder, Craig Smith too. We also picked Ellington who's still in the league.

All of it.

History of Wolves drafting 20-60 (guys whose rights were actually owned by the Timberwolves the day after the draft):
2015.1.24 Tyus Jones
2014.2.40 Glenn Robinson III
2013.1.21 Gorgui Dieng
2013.2.52 Lorenzo Brown
2012.2.58 Robbie Hummel
2010.1.30 Lazar Hayward
2009.1.28 Wayne Ellington
2009.2.47 Henk Norel
2008.2.31 Nikola Pekovic
2007.2.41 Chris Richard
2006.2.57 Loukas Mavrokefalidis
2006.2.36 Craig Smith
2005.2.34 Bracey Wright
2004.2.58 Blake Stepp
2003.1.26 Ndudi Ebi
2003.2.55 Rick Rickert

That's a pretty ho-hum list. Is that poor scouting, or is a late 1st/2nd simply overhyped by NBA fans? I'd argue the latter. Sure you can find a gem every once in a while, but there's a lot more misses.

[TooBad]

Wiggins, Pekovic and dunn for Derozan + Wright and Bebe

[Klomp]

LOL

[Biggsohnasty]

Ty Lawson, Trevor Booker, Andre Roberson to name a few in recent years. (How much of that was actually us picking for the other team is the question)

We got Pek with a second rounder, Craig Smith too. We also picked Ellington who's still in the league.

All of it.

History of Wolves drafting 20-60 (guys whose rights were actually owned by the Timberwolves the day after the draft):
2015.1.24 Tyus Jones
2014.2.40 Glenn Robinson III
2013.1.21 Gorgui Dieng
2013.2.52 Lorenzo Brown
2012.2.58 Robbie Hummel
2010.1.30 Lazar Hayward
2009.1.28 Wayne Ellington
2009.2.47 Henk Norel
2008.2.31 Nikola Pekovic
2007.2.41 Chris Richard
2006.2.57 Loukas Mavrokefalidis
2006.2.36 Craig Smith
2005.2.34 Bracey Wright
2004.2.58 Blake Stepp
2003.1.26 Ndudi Ebi
2003.2.55 Rick Rickert

That's a pretty ho-hum list. Is that poor scouting, or is a late 1st/2nd simply overhyped by NBA fans? I'd argue the latter. Sure you can find a gem every once in a while, but there's a lot more misses.

There's no doubt that once you get past the first 10 picks - sometimes even less - it's something of a crapshoot. The Wolves have proven time and again that there's no such thing as a "sure thing" in the draft.

I just hate when people say late firsts and seconds are worthless then clamor to trade for guys like Jimmy Butler and Jae Crowder who were late 1st and early 2nd round picks. There are plenty of good NBA players taken in that range and for a team like the Wolves, they need to find a player in that range that can contribute because they aren't going to attract guys in FA very often.

It's possible to find players that way - it's hard. But I hate when people treat those picks as throwaways.

[Klomp]

I just hate when people say late firsts and seconds are worthless then clamor to trade for guys like Jimmy Butler and Jae Crowder who were late 1st and early 2nd round picks. There are plenty of good NBA players taken in that range and for a team like the Wolves, they need to find a player in that range that can contribute because they aren't going to attract guys in FA very often.

It's possible to find players that way - it's hard. But I hate when people treat those picks as throwaways.

They carry less value if you're looking for immediate contributions on a growing team, which this team should be doing. If you want to wait 3 years for a late 1st to maybe develop into a role player off the bench, fine.

[C.lupus]

Ty Lawson, Trevor Booker, Andre Roberson to name a few in recent years. (How much of that was actually us picking for the other team is the question)

We got Pek with a second rounder, Craig Smith too. We also picked Ellington who's still in the league.

All of it.

History of Wolves drafting 20-60 (guys whose rights were actually owned by the Timberwolves the day after the draft):
2015.1.24 Tyus Jones
2014.2.40 Glenn Robinson III
2013.1.21 Gorgui Dieng
2013.2.52 Lorenzo Brown
2012.2.58 Robbie Hummel
2010.1.30 Lazar Hayward
2009.1.28 Wayne Ellington
2009.2.47 Henk Norel
2008.2.31 Nikola Pekovic
2007.2.41 Chris Richard
2006.2.57 Loukas Mavrokefalidis
2006.2.36 Craig Smith
2005.2.34 Bracey Wright
2004.2.58 Blake Stepp
2003.1.26 Ndudi Ebi
2003.2.55 Rick Rickert

That's a pretty ho-hum list. Is that poor scouting, or is a late 1st/2nd simply overhyped by NBA fans? I'd argue the latter. Sure you can find a gem every once in a while, but there's a lot more misses.

That's actually not a bad list considering the draft positions, particularly since 2008.

2015.1.24 Tyus Jones - Fine pick, he's a smart player and should have a decent career in the NBA.
2014.2.40 Glenn Robinson III - Good pick for his draft position.
2013.1.21 Gorgui Dieng - Good pick, fringe starter.
2013.2.52 Lorenzo Brown - Fine for a late 2nd rounder. Deserved more of a chance imo.
2012.2.58 Robbie Hummel - Fine for a very late 2nd rounder. I'd still take him as an end of bench guy over Hill and Payne.
2010.1.30 Lazar Hayward - meh
2009.1.28 Wayne Ellington - Has had a decent career, which is about all you should expect at 28.
2009.2.47 Henk Norel - Was picked to grease the wheels of Rubio coming over and a Euro-stash. He served his purpose.
2008.2.31 Nikola Pekovic - Very good pick for a second rounder

That's about as good drafting with later picks as anyone should expect.

[Biggsohnasty]

I just hate when people say late firsts and seconds are worthless then clamor to trade for guys like Jimmy Butler and Jae Crowder who were late 1st and early 2nd round picks. There are plenty of good NBA players taken in that range and for a team like the Wolves, they need to find a player in that range that can contribute because they aren't going to attract guys in FA very often.

It's possible to find players that way - it's hard. But I hate when people treat those picks as throwaways.

They carry less value if you're looking for immediate contributions on a growing team, which this team should be doing. If you want to wait 3 years for a late 1st to maybe develop into a role player off the bench, fine.

Not saying you have to draft a guy in the late 1st-2nd to come in and play immediately. But it'd be nice to have some developmental players on the roster to go along with the young talent the team has already accumulated.

Again this comes back to where the roster is at this point. After this summer, the team will likely be what it is in terms of adding outside talent - so the only way to get better is by player development. Continue adding players that can develop for a few years. The team should always be looking to add players that can develop no matter what kind of phase they think they are in.

The Bulls were winning a bunch and added Jimmy Butler. He took a little while to emerge but the team was fine in the process.

That's what I want the Wolves to strive to be. Get players in FA or via trade but also continue to stack up young projectable talent to that when said FAs are old or gone, you have readymade replacements on the roster.

That's not easy to do. But for a team in this market, that's how you build a sustainable winner.

[Mattya]

Wiggins, Pekovic and dunn for Derozan + Wright and Bebe

Absolutely not.

[PharmD]

If we totally strike out in free agency, using our cap space to eat the contract of someone who sucks like Demarre Carroll isn't the worst thing ever. It just all depends on what you get to take him.

Dallas can't give us very much to take Wes as they have already traded away their 2nds in 17, 18, 19, and 20 and a high-ish first would probably make them balk.

[minimus]

If we totally strike out in free agency, using our cap space to eat the contract of someone who sucks like Demarre Carroll isn't the worst thing ever. It just all depends on what you get to take him.

Dallas can't give us very much to take Wes as they have already traded away their 2nds in 17, 18, 19, and 20 and a high-ish first would probably make them balk.

Allen Crabbe had surgery. I wonder if his value is lower now. I'd accept Crabbe trade if they attach #15 pick

[Vindicater]

No trades.

Hit the draft. Let Towns/Wiggins/Rubio work into the contending trio they can be.

[Crazy-Canuck]

No trades.

Hit the draft. Let Towns/Wiggins/Rubio work into the contending trio they can be.

We need to acquire more experienced support. So, a trade might be a necessity unless we hit it big in free agency (milsap or ibaka along with a player like Tucker).

As much as we would all love for Kat and Wiggins to become 2 way stars, it's not going to happen overnight considering the offensive load they carry.

Having 2 defenders (wing and paint) will help them ease into those responsibilities as their bodies mature.

[Killboard]

But if teams like Toronto or Portland in particular want to shed some bad money to try to sign other players and are willing to give up picks in the 20s, it'd be foolish not to explore that.

Those are the kinds of deals I think the Wolves should be looking at too. They have cap space - take on a contract like Carroll's that might not be great looking but can give you that coveted vet while also giving you some young guys that you can develop further.

I'd rather take on Wes Matthews or Allen Crabbe but if you can get Carroll and the Raptors attach a pick to it, he's better than just about any wing the Wolves can probably attract this summer.

Ingles is a better all around player, will demand kind of the same money and has been healthier. A late first isn't enough if you aren't targeting a specific guy. The chance those guy succeed is minimal.

I would go for Carroll only if he our FA targets are gone.

The "last 1st and 2nd round picks are worthless" notion is what gets you locked into this position where you have to spend 15-20 million on 3 and D wing players.

Lots of good players can be found if you know where to look and what to look for when targetting those players. Also some luck involved but having darts to throw never hurts. There are people on this board are obsessed with Jimmy Butler, Jae Crowder and there are a lot of people that like Matthews, Carroll, Tucker, Ingles - the list goes on. What were those guys before they were at this point? All of them were late 1st to mid-second round picks. Let's develop our own Jae Crowder/Joe Ingles/Wes Matthews/Damarre Carroll.

Picks 20-40 don't have to be useless.

That's why I said kind of "If you aren't targeting a specific guy ". There is always gems out there, but the skill level to find them is pretty high. You also can find undrafted rookies or Dleague players without spend assets on them.

[Yuri Vaultin]

Would there be any interest in a Demarre Carroll for Pekvoic's corpse type deal? Carroll seems to fill a definite need in Minny and has not been used right at all by Casey in Raptorland.

[Killboard]

Would there be any interest in a Demarre Carroll for Pekvoic's corpse type deal? Carroll seems to fill a definite need in Minny and has not been used right at all by Casey in Raptorland.

There is no need to involve Pekovic. He will be retired at some point in the summer, but as far as I know only us can retire him and clean the salary off the books.

Carroll would be a fair get but kind of meh. He has passed his prime and has spend a lot of time injured. He would be a ok option if all our FA targets are gone (and there is a couple of toronto guys in there: PatPat, Tucker) Jamaychal Green, Ingles, Taj Gibson, Porter, Millsap, even Rudy Gay (for less money than Carroll I would be ok).

[minimus]

No trades.

Hit the draft. Let Towns/Wiggins/Rubio work into the contending trio they can be.

In other words you're saying let Thibs run KAT, Wiggins and LaVine until their bodies break.

[minimus]

Would there be any interest in a Demarre Carroll for Pekvoic's corpse type deal? Carroll seems to fill a definite need in Minny and has not been used right at all by Casey in Raptorland.

Hi Yuri! I like Carroll fit in MIN. Would you do something like this: Aldrich for Carroll + #23 pick?

Last year in Aldrich contract is partially guaranteed.

P.S. Could you please describe Ibaka and Tucker in Toronto? Here we have some polarizing opinions about their performance and possible contracts.