2017 Draft Thread

[Worm Guts]

I'm good with either Isaac or Markkanen right now. I like Monk, but is there enough minutes to go around for Wiggins, Lavine, Dunn, and Monk?

Monk is going to be your main scorer off the bench or would possibly even start if LaVine is brought back slow. There are minutes.

I don't see how you have minutes for Lavine and Monk long term, unless you want to play one at PG, which seems like a bad idea.

[vagelis]

Karl Anthony Towns led the NBA in paint points this last season.

Yes, maybe I was wrong about that because I see him shoot many long 2's and 3's.

I searched a little bit about this now that I found a little bit time and I found this site http://www.nbaminer.com/player-shot-zones/ that has a lot of stats.

I will use restricted area usage which refers to the closest to the basket range.
Towns has restricted area usage 41.31% and in the paint usage 20.89%.
This means that he is 137th in restricted area usage which means that a lot of centers in the league play closer to the basket than Towns.
For example Deandre Jordan has 92.37 restricted area usage, Dwight Howard 79% , Nerlens Noel 66%, Whiteside 50% and Antetokoumpo 52% although he is not a center. There are many other players in this list.

That is the reason that makes me to have the opinion that we need a big who will play closer to the basket than Towns plays.
And we need a big that plays better defense than Towns.
Markannen is not this type of player but he is a good talent. I think that he will not fit well with Towns but he can give a lot of help from the bench.
If we draft Markannen I think that we will need to find another big in the free agency to play in the starting five.
If we want to draft a big we could also consider players like Jarret Allen and John Collins who may have not the talent of Markkanen but they play more like big guys than small forwards.
The best players in this draft are pg's and wings but if all the good players are off the table we can select a big who can play defense, grab rebounds and protects the rim.

[Klomp]

Karl Anthony Towns led the NBA in paint points this last season.

Yes, maybe I was wrong about that because I see him shoot many long 2's and 3's.

I searched a little bit about this now that I found a little bit time and I found this site http://www.nbaminer.com/player-shot-zones/ that has a lot of stats.

I will use restricted area usage which refers to the closest to the basket range.
Towns has restricted area usage 41.31% and in the paint usage 20.89%.
This means that he is 137th in restricted area usage which means that a lot of centers in the league play closer to the basket than Towns.
For example Deandre Jordan has 92.37 restricted area usage, Dwight Howard 79% , Nerlens Noel 66%, Whiteside 50% and Antetokoumpo 52% although he is not a center. There are many other players in this list.

That is the reason that makes me to have the opinion that we need a big who will play closer to the basket than Towns plays.
And we need a big that plays better defense than Towns.
Markannen is not this type of player but he is a good talent. I think that he will not fit well with Towns but he can give a lot of help from the bench.
If we draft Markannen I think that we will need to find another big in the free agency to play in the starting five.
If we want to draft a big we could also consider players like Jarret Allen and John Collins who may have not the talent of Markkanen but they play more like big guys than small forwards.
The best players in this draft are pg's and wings but if all the good players are off the table we can select a big who can play defense, grab rebounds and protects the rim.

Part of me wonders if that's because he was paired with Dieng. Pair him with Markkanen and Towns would probably spend more time in the paint.

[Worm Guts]

It's actually beneficial to have 2 bigs that play away from the basket, it opens up the middle of the floor. It especially works since Towns is more than capable of dominating the post.

[Biggsohnasty]

Towns has shown he can score no matter what big is paired with him.

He can shoot, he can score in the post, he gets to the offensive glass and he can pass.

What he hasn't shown is the ability to defend at a high level. Maybe that will come. And if it does - I suspect his strength will be his ability to defend mobility. So I'm in the camp that says get a rough and rugged big to pair with him who will defend the paint, set picks and finish on easy drop offs around the rim.

[Calinks]

If the Lakers don't turn it around in the next 2-3 years and become a playoff team, it just goes to show how hard rebuilding is. Lakers are the marquee destination and franchise in the NBA today. On paper they have the greatest access to free agents and they have prestige to boot. They have now had back to back to back number 2 picks in the draft, and there is still a good chance they could be crap in a couple years. Ball, the jury is out until we see him on an NBA floor (if he even gets picked by them), Russell has had flashes but is still far away from being a great player, Ingram had a slow rookie year and still have a lot of questions.

Rebuilding is not as easy as fans think. When you blow it up you need a lot of luck on your said to go from zero to a contender. If the Lakers are still building their team up in 3 years that means that could happen to anybody. My hope is the wolves can get to a point where they can contend and we can just reinvent ourselves as time goes on like the Spurs have managed to do. They have basically rebuilt while being a championship level team the whole time.

[Vindicater]

This is a big part of what excites me about Isaac:

"He tries to play the game the right way," Hamilton said. "Doesn't hold on to the ball. He tries to do everything he can to try to help the team win. And sometimes people are like, 'Would you like for him to be more aggressive?' Well, we want him to develop at his own pace and to be comfortable with it. Defensively, he takes challenges, blocks shots and rebounds. He is concerned about making the pass to the guy who gets the assist. He's not all caught up in statistics.

http://www.naplesnews.com/story/sports/college/fgcu/2017/03/15/ncaa-tournament-seminoles-jonathan-isaac-long-way-his-barron-collier-days/99231930/

Sounds like what they said about Wesley Johnson.

That worked out well.

Are you comparing Jonathan Isaac to Wes Johnson?

No, I am saying that alot of things in the quote above are similar to what they said about Wesley Johnson. Particularly discussing the aggressiveness and overpassing of the ball.

[LordBaldric]

Karl Anthony Towns led the NBA in paint points this last season.

Yes, maybe I was wrong about that because I see him shoot many long 2's and 3's.

I searched a little bit about this now that I found a little bit time and I found this site http://www.nbaminer.com/player-shot-zones/ that has a lot of stats.

I will use restricted area usage which refers to the closest to the basket range.
Towns has restricted area usage 41.31% and in the paint usage 20.89%.
This means that he is 137th in restricted area usage which means that a lot of centers in the league play closer to the basket than Towns.
For example Deandre Jordan has 92.37 restricted area usage, Dwight Howard 79% , Nerlens Noel 66%, Whiteside 50% and Antetokoumpo 52% although he is not a center. There are many other players in this list.

That is the reason that makes me to have the opinion that we need a big who will play closer to the basket than Towns plays.
And we need a big that plays better defense than Towns.
Markannen is not this type of player but he is a good talent. I think that he will not fit well with Towns but he can give a lot of help from the bench.
If we draft Markannen I think that we will need to find another big in the free agency to play in the starting five.
If we want to draft a big we could also consider players like Jarret Allen and John Collins who may have not the talent of Markkanen but they play more like big guys than small forwards.
The best players in this draft are pg's and wings but if all the good players are off the table we can select a big who can play defense, grab rebounds and protects the rim.

Come back to me with your list once you have filtered out the guards/wings (irrelevant to KAT), then all the players with below average usage rates (bums on offense), and finally all the players with weak TS% (more bums).

[Klomp]

No, I am saying that alot of things in the quote above are similar to what they said about Wesley Johnson. Particularly discussing the aggressiveness and overpassing of the ball.

People used to say it about LeBron James too

[ace625214]

I searched a little bit about this now that I found a little bit time and I found this site http://www.nbaminer.com/player-shot-zones/ that has a lot of stats.

I will use restricted area usage which refers to the closest to the basket range.
Towns has restricted area usage 41.31% and in the paint usage 20.89%.
This means that he is 137th in restricted area usage which means that a lot of centers in the league play closer to the basket than Towns.
For example Deandre Jordan has 92.37 restricted area usage, Dwight Howard 79% , Nerlens Noel 66%, Whiteside 50% and Antetokoumpo 52% although he is not a center. There are many other players in this list.

That is the reason that makes me to have the opinion that we need a big who will play closer to the basket than Towns plays.
And we need a big that plays better defense than Towns.
Markannen is not this type of player but he is a good talent. I think that he will not fit well with Towns but he can give a lot of help from the bench.
If we draft Markannen I think that we will need to find another big in the free agency to play in the starting five.
If we want to draft a big we could also consider players like Jarret Allen and John Collins who may have not the talent of Markkanen but they play more like big guys than small forwards.
The best players in this draft are pg's and wings but if all the good players are off the table we can select a big who can play defense, grab rebounds and protects the rim.

That's also just a percentage of the players usage by area, not overall usage. Here are his full numbers for anyone not wanting to follow the link and scroll:

Above Break 3......Mid-Range......Paint.........RA........Right Corner 3.....Left Corner 3....Backcourt(heaves)
....14.54...............19.20.........20.89.......41.31...........1.96...............1.89..............0.20

So KAT takes shot or commits a turnover from the lane 62.2% of the time. That's pretty high. None of those could be considered long-2s or 3s. Short 12ft jumpers from just outside the block aren't even captured in that since he isn't in the paint. You can see that almost all of his 3s come from above the break, which means most of them are coming in pick-and-pop action.

What these numbers say to me is that Towns scores a lot inside, but works inside-out and will knock down jumpers when left open. That doesn't mean he prefers to do that, it just means that he can do it efficiently. Having Markannen would not crowd the wings. It would provide spacing while Karl is posting up and give Ricky another shooter to sling the ball to when he and KAT are rolling to the rim.

Before the AS break, the top three lineups all featured KAT and Dieng. Post break, KAT was still in the top 3 lineups, but Gorgui was only in one of them. KAT's stats also improved a lot after the break. I read that as once some of Dieng's minutes were replaced with Casspi and Bjelica, KAT had a lot more space and did better offensively. When Towns and Dieng play together, there is less space. Dieng takes 40% of his shots from the mid-range, and 36.67% from the restricted area. Gorgui rarely gets post-up plays run for him, so that means he's either being a "spacer" in the mid-range, or he's cutting for dunks and putbacks. He's still the spacing PF to KAT's inside C game. A better, more athletic shooter at the 4 would be even better, and a traditional center would absolutely kill spacing on Rubio/Towns PnRs.

[Biggsohnasty]

How would a traditional center kill spacing on Rubio/Towns PnRs?

Teams aren't exactly worried about sticking to Dieng because of his sniping ability at the elbows - if you have a traditional big sitting on the baseline ala DeAndre Jordan, you can operate a completely functional Pick and roll.

How often do the Wolves run pick and roll though? That isn't something they do a ton of and even if it is, this gets back to what people dislike about Rubio. If you have shooting from typical places like your perimeter guys, you don't need to find a big man who can shoot. Because finding bigs that can shoot while also defend at a high level are really hard to get. Rubio not being able to shoot kills spacing as much as a true center.

[Klomp]

One thing I've started to see with Markkanen is that he's quite a bit more skilled than he showed at Arizona. He's more than just a spot-up shooter. He's got a bit of Bjelica in his game, but at 2 inches taller.

Watch on YouTube

[ace625214]

How would a traditional center kill spacing on Rubio/Towns PnRs?

Teams aren't exactly worried about sticking to Dieng because of his sniping ability at the elbows - if you have a traditional big sitting on the baseline ala DeAndre Jordan, you can operate a completely functional Pick and roll.

How often do the Wolves run pick and roll though? That isn't something they do a ton of and even if it is, this gets back to what people dislike about Rubio. If you have shooting from typical places like your perimeter guys, you don't need to find a big man who can shoot. Because finding bigs that can shoot while also defend at a high level are really hard to get. Rubio not being able to shoot kills spacing as much as a true center.

Absolutely kill is probably a bit of an overstatement, but it wouldn't help. Towns gets quite a few buckets on slightly delayed rolls. Having a big waiting baseline is another defender that can come help. Dieng is not DeAndre Jordan. He can't come flying in and catch lobs 12 feet up.

I would like to have a big that can defend, too, but that's not what we're talking about right now. Vagelis was saying he thinks we need to fill the center position, not the PF spot. I disagreed with that.

[Swish4]

Isaac has Kawhi Leonard potential

[Biggsohnasty]

How would a traditional center kill spacing on Rubio/Towns PnRs?

Teams aren't exactly worried about sticking to Dieng because of his sniping ability at the elbows - if you have a traditional big sitting on the baseline ala DeAndre Jordan, you can operate a completely functional Pick and roll.

How often do the Wolves run pick and roll though? That isn't something they do a ton of and even if it is, this gets back to what people dislike about Rubio. If you have shooting from typical places like your perimeter guys, you don't need to find a big man who can shoot. Because finding bigs that can shoot while also defend at a high level are really hard to get. Rubio not being able to shoot kills spacing as much as a true center.

Absolutely kill is probably a bit of an overstatement, but it wouldn't help. Towns gets quite a few buckets on slightly delayed rolls. Having a big waiting baseline is another defender that can come help. Dieng is not DeAndre Jordan. He can't come flying in and catch lobs 12 feet up.

I would like to have a big that can defend, too, but that's not what we're talking about right now. Vagelis was saying he thinks we need to fill the center position, not the PF spot. I disagreed with that.

Fair enough. I tend to agree that they need a center to pair with Towns myself but there are certainly arguments both ways. Realistically they just need a good player next to him - or good enough to push Dieng into a "3rd big" role.

Ideally you find a player who can both shoot and play rugged inside while defending - JaMychal Green might be the ideal FA target in that regard. But if you have to pick between 3-point shooting big and defensive-minded, paint-controlling big, I think I'd place a higher premium on paint-controlling big.

[andyhop]

Realistically they just need a good player next to him - or good enough to push Dieng into a "3rd big" role.

They need KAT to stop being terrible defensively a lot more than they need to replace the best defender on the team in Dieng.

[Biggsohnasty]

Didn't say they need to "replace" Dieng. Get another good player so that the Wolves have 3 good bigs instead of 2 - and ideally one that can be the team's "second-best" big - making Dieng the team's third best big.

[PharmD]

Karl Anthony Towns led the NBA in paint points this last season.

Yes, maybe I was wrong about that because I see him shoot many long 2's and 3's.

I searched a little bit about this now that I found a little bit time and I found this site http://www.nbaminer.com/player-shot-zones/ that has a lot of stats.

I will use restricted area usage which refers to the closest to the basket range.
Towns has restricted area usage 41.31% and in the paint usage 20.89%.
This means that he is 137th in restricted area usage which means that a lot of centers in the league play closer to the basket than Towns.
For example Deandre Jordan has 92.37 restricted area usage, Dwight Howard 79% , Nerlens Noel 66%, Whiteside 50% and Antetokoumpo 52% although he is not a center. There are many other players in this list.

That is the reason that makes me to have the opinion that we need a big who will play closer to the basket than Towns plays.
And we need a big that plays better defense than Towns.
Markannen is not this type of player but he is a good talent. I think that he will not fit well with Towns but he can give a lot of help from the bench.
If we draft Markannen I think that we will need to find another big in the free agency to play in the starting five.
If we want to draft a big we could also consider players like Jarret Allen and John Collins who may have not the talent of Markkanen but they play more like big guys than small forwards.
The best players in this draft are pg's and wings but if all the good players are off the table we can select a big who can play defense, grab rebounds and protects the rim.

Umm, Towns' restricted area usage is lower because he scores on postups. The guys with the super high restricted area usage are garbage men that only throw down lobs and putbacks. If DeAndre Jordan is 12 feet away he might as well be in the backcourt.

[shangrila]

Realistically they just need a good player next to him - or good enough to push Dieng into a "3rd big" role.

They need KAT to stop being terrible defensively a lot more than they need to replace the best defender on the team in Dieng.

Dieng is not the best anything on this team, let alone best defender.

[minimus]

Realistically they just need a good player next to him - or good enough to push Dieng into a "3rd big" role.

They need KAT to stop being terrible defensively a lot more than they need to replace the best defender on the team in Dieng.

Dieng is not the best anything on this team, let alone best defender.

He at least cares about defense.