De'Aaron Fox

[Leor_77]

Would it be considered a reach by the Lakers to take him at 2?

[toussaud]

there is no stat that tells me if u will learn how to shoot, but thething is, i dont want a freshman that is a 45% three point shooter.

all his shooting tells me to this point is that he never has had to and he hasnt. he gets to the rim at an elite level. against every level of comp no one has ever had to make him do anything new. if im right handed and u know it, and u know i want to go right and u still cant stop me from going right lol why should i ever go left? id sit me down for even considering going left. why should fox work on his three point game when no one ha ever stopped him from getting to the rim?


rather or not he will shoot comes down to mechanics and want to. westbrook has want to but never ever follows throw on his shot he would improve his % by 10% if he would allow himself to fully follow tbrough on his shot. paytons shot..isnt smooth. his shot is comparable to....afganastanmlol. it has bumps, stops, hitches and everything wls. paytons shot looks like he as had 3 shooting ĉôaches in 4 years i woudnt write him off just yet. jesus whoever looked at exum and thought nba star should quit


stanley johnson on the other hand would be an excellent shooter if he cared enough to be one which he does not so he isnt.


fox has great machanics. someone somewhere älong the line taughr him how to shoot a jump shot and it shows. the question is does he want to be a good nba player or a great one. hes long enough and athletic enough to still e able to have a 15 year nba career without ever learning to shot also his defense. but to be great he has to gt reps.



what i reallllly like about fox is he has the makeup of a stone cold assisian. he just doesnt have big games. the way he is wieed hes just not going to allow his team to lose, with most guys its like well i played hard i scored 25 with fox its no u dont understand were not losing.if i got to score 30 in a half,if i got to play on one ,eg, hich he did more than once this year, if i have to shut this guy on the other team down, if i have to whatever we will not lose. the reason i like fox much more than monk is with monk his scoring is erratic. he can get u 50....but u or him dont know when that will be. with fox, irs almost like he takes offense to the fact that u think u can win. the only way unc beat uk was two bs fouls on fox that sät him for the entire first half . beng in arkansas fan living in lexington i was at the uk arkansas game that was a 4 point game at half fox had 7. fox took over te 2nd half had 25 in the second m retty sure he didnt miss a shot in the second...the game was only ever as close as fox allowed it to be.

because of that intangible i think he will get there

[sikma42]

It's only workouts and they don't mean much but Fox's jumper is def not broken. Mechanics are sound and I think he should be able to improve considerably


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[reanimator]

Considering Wall has 40 lbs on Fox, he absolutely is a better athlete than Fox.

[SelfishPlayer]

Think this is relevant to Fox:

Read on Twitter

How many times have teams picked players because they believed they could team them how to shoot and it not work out?
- Elfrid Payton
- Aaron Gordon
- Ricky Rubio
- Emmanual Mudiay
- Stanley Johnson
- MKG
- Dante Exum
- Kris Dunn

None of those players are as talented as Fox. For the record I believe that Fox is the most talented player in this draft. Fox shot over 47% from 3 over his last 10 games of the season, this was after he started working with the coaching staff on his shot.

Fox has already solidified himself as being what I knew he was.

[916fan]

Unbiased write-up on Fox through 4 games.

Positives:
He's extremely fast, and uses his super quick 1st step to beat defenders off the dribble and get to the rim.
Great in transition
Great handles and ability to break down the defenses
His mid-range jumpshot has been good
Doesn't have good playmaking skills, but shows the ability to make the extra passes
Has not attempted a lot of 3s, but shows the willingness to shoot it, and it looks promising
Peskiness on defense
Able to pick pockets and get steals in the passing lanes
Effort and IQ. Automatic vocal leader

Negatives:
Has been bad on defense
Struggles to guard quicker players, easily gets beat off the dribble despite his quickness (Ulis). Has trouble fighting through picks
Struggles to guard stronger players because they can easily shield him off on the drive (Barrea had his way with Fox)
Struggles to finish around the rim when there's a big man contesting
He constantly tries to avoid contact as much as possible when attacking. He has 57 shot attempts, but only 7 FTA.
Ability to run a 1/2 court offense is still up in the air, but he's done a good job direct players.

Fox has played very well for the most part through 4 games.

[reanimator]

Unbiased write-up on Fox through 4 games.

Positives:
He's extremely fast, and uses his super quick 1st step to beat defenders off the dribble and get to the rim.
Great in transition
Great handles and ability to break down the defenses
His mid-range jumpshot has been good
Doesn't have good playmaking skills, but shows the ability to make the extra passes
Has not attempted a lot of 3s, but shows the willingness to shoot it, and it looks promising
Peskiness on defense
Able to pick pockets and get steals in the passing lanes
Effort and IQ. Automatic vocal leader

Negatives:
Has been bad on defense
Struggles to guard quicker players, easily gets beat off the dribble despite his quickness (Ulis). Has trouble fighting through picks
Struggles to guard stronger players because they can easily shield him off on the drive (Barrea had his way with Fox)
Struggles to finish around the rim when there's a big man contesting
He constantly tries to avoid contact as much as possible when attacking. He has 57 shot attempts, but only 7 FTA.
Ability to run a 1/2 court offense is still up in the air, but he's done a good job direct players.

Fox has played very well for the most part through 4 games.

I agree with this but I'm less optimistic about extending his range and his passing.

Its early in the season where its very up and down with lax D and I'm curious to see how he produces once we get deep into the season and the game is more structured.

[916fan]

Unbiased write-up on Fox through 4 games.

Positives:
He's extremely fast, and uses his super quick 1st step to beat defenders off the dribble and get to the rim.
Great in transition
Great handles and ability to break down the defenses
His mid-range jumpshot has been good
Doesn't have good playmaking skills, but shows the ability to make the extra passes
Has not attempted a lot of 3s, but shows the willingness to shoot it, and it looks promising
Peskiness on defense
Able to pick pockets and get steals in the passing lanes
Effort and IQ. Automatic vocal leader

Negatives:
Has been bad on defense
Struggles to guard quicker players, easily gets beat off the dribble despite his quickness (Ulis). Has trouble fighting through picks
Struggles to guard stronger players because they can easily shield him off on the drive (Barrea had his way with Fox)
Struggles to finish around the rim when there's a big man contesting
He constantly tries to avoid contact as much as possible when attacking. He has 57 shot attempts, but only 7 FTA.
Ability to run a 1/2 court offense is still up in the air, but he's done a good job direct players.

Fox has played very well for the most part through 4 games.

I agree with this but I'm less optimistic about extending his range and his passing.

Its early in the season where its very up and down with lax D and I'm curious to see how he produces once we get deep into the season and the game is more structured.

The sample size will be small, but I think he could be a 35% 3pt shooter. His entire shot looks good from start to finish, and he doesn't hesitate. Defenses have actually been guarding him pretty close on top of the key. Of his 5 3pt attempts, I remember 2 of those came from when the defender went under the screen.

He's not much of a playmaker right now, but he's showing that he can pass the ball. Kings keep trying to run a high-post offense that doesn't really help anyone... once they run Fox in PnP and PnR with Willie and Skal, his playmaking skills will start to come out. Willie has actually developed into a very good mid-range shooter too.

[jonjames]

It is only matter of time before he emerges as superstar pg in this league.

[HeadtopChunes]

Fox is looking like he will be the best PG from his class. Some great performances to start the season.

[jonjames]

It is only matter of time before he emerges as superstar pg in this league.

[No-Man]

It is only matter of time before he emerges as superstar pg in this league.

lol he is still bad at making reads on halfcourt settings, can't shoot from 3 to save his life and is living by running the ball like crazy and hitting at impossible rates from midrange (which aint gonna stay with his jumper and how inefficient those shots are)

it'd be good if you check advanced numbers or watch games, and not only the boxscore to try to pad yourself in the back after 8 games mate

[GimmeDat]

It is only matter of time before he emerges as superstar pg in this league.

lol he is still bad at making reads on halfcourt settings, can't shoot from 3 to save his life and is living by running the ball like crazy and hitting at impossible rates from midrange (which aint gonna stay with his jumper and how inefficient those shots are)

it'd be good if you check advanced numbers or watch games, and not only the boxscore to try to pad yourself in the back after 8 games mate

C'mon Fisch, it's okay to eat crow. 21 and 8.6 assists per 36, getting to the line at a high rate, finishing at a high rate, hasn't quite become consistent from 3 yet but is a much more effective mid-range shooter and shot creator now, and has led his team to a 6-3 record.

He's not a finished product, he still needs to extend that range out consistently, he's still learning the nuances of PG play in the half-court, etc. But he's bringing a hell of a lot to the table right now.

Not only were you one of the only people to have Fox outside of the lottery, but you had him at 23. Not calling you out, just saying. I had Luwawu at 7 in 2016.. it's okay, it was my first year really getting in to the draft in depth and I learnt from it. But I don't think anyone who had him in that top 10 or even 5 is regretting that choice in the slightest based on what we've seen so far.

[No-Man]

lol I didn't have him at 23rd man, I had him there like a year before the 2017 draft, in my first board pre-season before anybody had played a game, in my last board that dropped in the site that now is TheStepien, and used to be odetooden.com (run by currently 76ers scout Sean Derenthal) Fox was 9th going to Dallas (and a ton of his draft value for me was trade value)

And again, nothing that you have stated there it's replying to what I have written before, I know the numbers, he is shooting 67% from the FT line, doesn't do anything off-ball, is hitting at impossible rates to maintain from mid-range, and still can't score from 3, he is a transition player, which is good and useful, and I always thought he was a NBA level PG, it's just impossible to be good enough with him at the helm, he is kinda useless next to another ball dominant player and he is just not good enough in terms of reads, shooting, versatility on defense, to play off-ball

It's fine for the Kings, they have mediocre young talent and they might top out as a low end Playoff caliber team, which for them it's a win I guess, but when I am drafting I am aiming for more, hence why I was lower on Fox than most and I still am

He is 170lbs, in transition of course he can blow past most, in half-court setting he doesn't have the speed to power athleticism that guys like Wall or Westbrook, that have a good 40lbs on him, do, and he is going to be in trouble to be efficient

I knew he was going to produce numbers, which is good, there is trade value attached to him, you could move him for a lot, it's too bad that the Kings will never do so (at least for now), because one of the main reasons I ended up ranking him 9th, was related to that possibility

[GimmeDat]

lol I didn't have him at 23rd man, I had him there like a year before the 2017 draft, in my first board pre-season before anybody had played a game, in my last board that dropped in the site that now is TheStepien, and used to be odetooden.com (run by currently 76ers scout Sean Derenthal) Fox was 9th going to Dallas (and a ton of his draft value for me was trade value)

And again, nothing that you have stated there it's replying to what I have written before, I know the numbers, he is shooting 67% from the FT line, doesn't do anything off-ball, is hitting at impossible rates to maintain from mid-range, and still can't score from 3, he is a transition player, which is good and useful, and I always thought he was a NBA level PG, it's just impossible to be good enough with him at the helm, he is kinda useless next to another ball dominant player and he is just not good enough in terms of reads, shooting, versatility on defense, to play off-ball

It's fine for the Kings, they have mediocre young talent and they might top out as a low end Playoff caliber team, which for them it's a win I guess, but when I am drafting I am aiming for more, hence why I was lower on Fox than most and I still am

He is 170lbs, in transition of course he can blow past most, in half-court setting he doesn't have the speed to power athleticism that guys like Wall or Westbrook, that have a good 40lbs on him, do, and he is going to be in trouble to be efficient

I knew he was going to produce numbers, which is good, there is trade value attached to him, you could move him for a lot, it's too bad that the Kings will never do so (at least for now), because one of the main reasons I ended up ranking him 9th, was related to that possibility

Just having a cursory look back at your posts in the mock draft sub-forum, you have him at 23rd in September, in May you say you have him 23-25th in a big board sense and refer to him as a backup PG -

Spoiler:

It has to do with the way I see basketball and the draft more than how good is or isn't De'Aaron Fox, I have him there at 18th because that's about where the situation made sense, both for the team, IND might need a ton of help creating if PG is traded and Teague let go, and also where his value eventually can make up for the jump from where I have him in my board in terms of basic value on court (which would be around 23-25th, the highest I can go to a back-up PG) compared to that range in the late teens.

From memory, you slowly moved him up a bit as the season went on but were never high on him, the lowest on this entire forum, in fact. Heck, it's not even relevant.

I'm not here trying to call anyone out, that is not in the spirit of the forum, but when someone comments about Fox looking the goods, after a 31/10/15 outing, no less, and it's replied with condescending 'lol's' and 'mate', telling someone they don't watch the games, as if it's an absurd take, is just tiresome.

Think what you want about Fox, I don't care. Kings fans are more than ecstatic with where he's at in his development right now.

[doordoor123]

This was always a possibility with Fox. His jumper was never terrible and his ability to beat guys off the dribble was always there. Plus he has always been super engaging and smart. I think I had him and Lonzo Ball really close. And I still think Lonzo can be really good, I just think LeBron being in LA is going to delay his rise. But it’s probably better for him since it takes pressure off of himself to perform like a top pick until he is able to figure it out. His third year will be him starting to finally figure it out and his fourth year will be his year. Fox is developing a little faster than anticipated, but Fox is a great learner. He picks up things really quickly. If I can recall, he learned all his moves from playing 2k.

[No-Man]

Well I mean, he clearly isn't going in deep analyzing Fox, and just quoted himself cause he saw the boxscore or the highlight reel, hence why I called him out, there are reasons to be optimistic about Fox, but when you scratch slightly deeper than the surface you get to the numbers and the reality, and it's what it is, doubling down on him been a superstar to me it's an absurd take right now

trade value is a huge component towards added value and the draft value proposition, I had Fox 18th at that point and he went all the way up to 9th in my last board, I mean in that same thread by the end I post a link to it (in a site that right now is down) but that's where he was at, going to the Mavs

Again, I am low on Fox if you want to build a contender, top5 legit team in the league, I might be wrong, but I think if you dig deep enough and go by his highlights, he is a fun player to watch no doubt, and focus on the real substance, my stance isn't crazy, and it wasn't back then either

[No-Man]

This was always a possibility with Fox. His jumper was never terrible and his ability to beat guys off the dribble was always there. Plus he has always been super engaging and smart. I think I had him and Lonzo Ball really close. And I still think Lonzo can be really good, I just think LeBron being in LA is going to delay his rise. But it’s probably better for him since it takes pressure off of himself to perform like a top pick until he is able to figure it out. His third year will be him starting to finally figure it out and his fourth year will be his year. Fox is developing a little faster than anticipated, but Fox is a great learner. He picks up things really quickly. If I can recall, he learned all his moves from playing 2k.

His jumper remains terrible, he has cleaned that ugly-ass 2 motion shot a bit, but he still cocks it back and doesn't release at the right point, plus has a ton of loose elements going on with it, and he is beating people off the dribble cause they are playing at a frantic pace, he still doesn't have the tools to do that against a disciplined defense in the half-court, he has wiggle and handles, just not a pull-up jumper, o the ability to finish in traffic without been able to load up in an open space due to his slender built

Smart in which way? I mean he knows what style of play suits him best, but he isn't naturally gifted as a play-maker/passer or doesn't have that level of "smart" when it comes to organize, generate for others and create play

Lonzo is better at everything that Fox other than scoring right now, considering how little versatility Fox has on both ends, I'd take Ball without even thinking

Like I said before, this shouldn't surprise nobody (Fox been productive) it was one of the main arguments for me to rank him high enough, he was always going to put up numbers (same with Ayton even though they are different players) and a big reason why you would be able to bring back value with them, because they are tradeable early on

[nolang1]

Yeah the 'advanced numbers' crack there was especially dumb given that Fox's on/off net rating has been in the neighborhood of +30 so far, and of course criticizing Fox for playing well in transition is like criticizing Steph Curry for relying on his three-point shot.

[No-Man]

Yeah the 'advanced numbers' crack there was especially dumb given that Fox's on/off net rating has been in the neighborhood of +30 so far, and of course criticizing Fox for playing well in transition is like criticizing Steph Curry for relying on his three-point shot.

yeah cause advanced numbers are only RPM, I am talking about detailed stats in general