I finally watched this -- and lol "the latest reports" sounds an awful lot like Givony very simply misspeaking. This board, man! We're animals! Animals! Love it. But sorry, this ain't no rumor just a quick easy misspeak.
Agreed, Givony just misspoke. That said, he wasn't measured at the combine and he is still pretty young so it's possible he's a little taller than what they last had on file.
ddb wrote:talked to a scout friend of mine earlier today down in FL. Asked him about Fultz (I'm sure he was anticipating the question from me!)...He said Fultz could be the best PG in the league in 5 years. Said he'd be ready to be a key contributor right away as a rookie. Said his offense is very mature for his age. Said he's dynamic in that he can score & play make from all over the floor. Said he's not getting enough credit for his athleticism...he said people talk about how smooth he is often, but forget how explosive he is as well. I asked for a comp. He said, "I don't want to say Harden, because I think Fultz will be a good defender. but if you can imagine a right handed, more athletic James Harden that will defend" I asked him if the celtics should be considering anyone else at #1... he said, "absolutely not. Fultz is their guy if they keep the pick"
Okay, so I'm sold. Very excited about this draft.
I also asked if he could think of any possible trade partners for the #1 pick. He wasn't ready to answer that question yet. He said that stuff usually heats up as the draft approaches and after teams are working various players out.
I'd trade the pick for AD, too. That's it.
Also wondering - when's the last time a prospect has been as uniformly hyped as Fultz and then underachieved? Pervis Ellison? John Wall took awhile to reach the superstar level he's approaching now.
I would also consider trading this pick for Jokic. I made a point to watch him on League Pass - he is the real deal.
Brad Stevens on fans who want the Celtics to tank: "I don’t think they’ll like me all that much then."
I finally watched this -- and lol "the latest reports" sounds an awful lot like Givony very simply misspeaking. This board, man! We're animals! Animals! Love it. But sorry, this ain't no rumor just a quick easy misspeak.
Yeah I hadn't seen the video either until today. This guy is usually credible but it did sound like he misspoke. Unless he knows and just said it all nonchalant.
aim2please wrote:Fultz is #1 guy, there's no doubt about that. Unless something crazy happens, and you can get AD for #1 pick, Fultz is gonna wear green next season.
Watching some of the other guys, I think I like Jonathan Isaac more than any other guy projected to go in the top 10. His combination of size, length and athleticism is rare to find. He can switch on smaller guys, rebounded really well and made his corner 3s. Modern NBA PF if you ask me.
Who knows what Danny's plan is, but if they miss in free agency and decide they won't pay Smart, IT and Avery next summer, one of them could get traded if the offer is right IMO.
Hypothetically, if Isaac is available at #7, I could see a scenario where Thibs is in love with one of our guards and isn't willing to add another puppy on his roster. I would do it, I think this guy is gonna be really good.
Check out Collins too. I actually like him a bit better than Isaac. I'd be all over trading for either of them. We need some future in our 4/5 rotation.
Collins looks like a safe pick. IMO he has a higher floor but lower ceiling than Isaac.
I was trying to find a comp for him, Cody Zeller or Mason Plumlee with a jump shot came to mind. Above average athleticism, below average length, can switch on perimeter a little bit. Nothing wrong with that, I just think odds are against him being anything more than a low end starter/3rd big.
In fairness, I'm overall against using a high lotto pick on a tall white dude. (Cody Zeller, Kaminsky etc.) I was way off on Porzingis though, so there's that
You're missing a big part of the equation with Collins - the Zellers and the Plumlees are all dwarves in the standing reach department. Collins has a legit 9'3 standing reach - that's 3 inches of reach on the tallest Plumlee and freaking 7 inches on TZ.
That's a big reason why Collins was a major shot-blocking presence and the Zellers and Plumlees were decent rim protectors at best.
So take a random Plumlee or Zeller and give them shot-blocking and great timing and you get stuff like him stuffing Fultz in mid-air: http://www.espn.com/video/clip?id=18233810
And his offensive game is no joke either, though he's likely gonna be a turnover machine early. He has a nice Horford style mid-range game and he has good touch and some quality go-to moves in the post. That plus a rudimentary 3-ball and you've got a beast of a prospect.
His surface resemblance to the Zellers/Plumlees is doing for him what Turner's wounded giraffe gait did for him - knocking a stud big man prospect out of the top and into the mid-lotto where he's a steal.
I finally watched this -- and lol "the latest reports" sounds an awful lot like Givony very simply misspeaking. This board, man! We're animals! Animals! Love it. But sorry, this ain't no rumor just a quick easy misspeak.
Agreed, Givony just misspoke. That said, he wasn't measured at the combine and he is still pretty young so it's possible he's a little taller than what they last had on file.
Givony boom-goes-the-dynamiting his early interviews with mumble-y teenage athletes up there with the best of deliciously awkward NBA-themed semi-pro media. Not sure it beats the late night fantasy basketball call-in show Rick Kamla had on NBATV - still remember them being so desperate for callers they put some pervy-sounding mouthbreather on the air and Kamla didn't even hang up on him. Just bombarded him with some inane statistics until I started to rethink my life.
I finally watched this -- and lol "the latest reports" sounds an awful lot like Givony very simply misspeaking. This board, man! We're animals! Animals! Love it. But sorry, this ain't no rumor just a quick easy misspeak.
Agreed, Givony just misspoke. That said, he wasn't measured at the combine and he is still pretty young so it's possible he's a little taller than what they last had on file.
Yes and no. It definitely sounded like it was just a misspeak. But the guy measured in at 6'4.75 in shoes at the hoop summit a year ago as a 17 year old (6'3.5 barefooted by Team USA). If you look at the tape from when Markelle went up vs Lonzo, they aren't noticeably different in height. It's not unrealistic that he could've grown .75 or so since his last blessed measurements.
aim2please wrote:Fultz is #1 guy, there's no doubt about that. Unless something crazy happens, and you can get AD for #1 pick, Fultz is gonna wear green next season.
Watching some of the other guys, I think I like Jonathan Isaac more than any other guy projected to go in the top 10. His combination of size, length and athleticism is rare to find. He can switch on smaller guys, rebounded really well and made his corner 3s. Modern NBA PF if you ask me.
Who knows what Danny's plan is, but if they miss in free agency and decide they won't pay Smart, IT and Avery next summer, one of them could get traded if the offer is right IMO.
Hypothetically, if Isaac is available at #7, I could see a scenario where Thibs is in love with one of our guards and isn't willing to add another puppy on his roster. I would do it, I think this guy is gonna be really good.
Check out Collins too. I actually like him a bit better than Isaac. I'd be all over trading for either of them. We need some future in our 4/5 rotation.
I like Collins, but I think I prefer the small-ball stretch 5 upside in Isaac. Seems like the direction the league is going.
Why did we work out Hamadou Diallo? Hmm.we got 3 second rounders, we also have future firsts. I gotta believe Ainge is talking to his agents and said we will take you second round and guarantee you an contract at X. It, maybe we are trying to get a late first to get this guy.
We can trade 2 second round picks and a next year's first (boston's) for maybe a 1st rounder in the 20s. Trades like that are how titles are won.
We can let that guy sit for 2-3 years with no pressure.
Fultz and Ball are both perfect for us. If Fuktz is ball dominant, play IT off the ball. It works, and IT won't be expose too much on D because we can defend in cross matches. IT plays off ball but defends PG. very versatile player hat fuktz is.
Anyone else hoping that for some reason the Lakers don't take Lonzo? Nothing against Lonzo, and besides being a big mouth, I have nothing against Lavar, but for some strange reason I know I would delight in the Lakers passing on Lonzo.
Can't believe that finally the Celtics are getting the number one pick, but this also decreases the intrigue in the draft to a certain extent. Who knows with Ainge, but hopefully Fultz is a foregone conclusion. There is something to watching the draft and hoping and wishing that a player you want falls passed the other teams and the Celtics get a gem. Paul Pierce was my favorite time that this happened. I guess I'll have to focus on the second round and hope for some prospect to fall in that area.
ddb wrote:talked to a scout friend of mine earlier today down in FL. Asked him about Fultz (I'm sure he was anticipating the question from me!)...He said Fultz could be the best PG in the league in 5 years. Said he'd be ready to be a key contributor right away as a rookie. Said his offense is very mature for his age. Said he's dynamic in that he can score & play make from all over the floor. Said he's not getting enough credit for his athleticism...he said people talk about how smooth he is often, but forget how explosive he is as well. I asked for a comp. He said, "I don't want to say Harden, because I think Fultz will be a good defender. but if you can imagine a right handed, more athletic James Harden that will defend" I asked him if the celtics should be considering anyone else at #1... he said, "absolutely not. Fultz is their guy if they keep the pick"
Okay, so I'm sold. Very excited about this draft.
I also asked if he could think of any possible trade partners for the #1 pick. He wasn't ready to answer that question yet. He said that stuff usually heats up as the draft approaches and after teams are working various players out.
I'd trade the pick for AD, too. That's it.
Also wondering - when's the last time a prospect has been as uniformly hyped as Fultz and then underachieved? Pervis Ellison? John Wall took awhile to reach the superstar level he's approaching now.
I would also consider trading this pick for Jokic. I made a point to watch him on League Pass - he is the real deal.
Homerclease wrote:Who do we like at pick 37? Draft and stash? An upperclassmen that may be more ready to contribute immediately? A project type player?
This draft doesn't have a lot of draft and stash player. Personally I would like Cam Oliver he's undersized but a great athlete and his weaknesses can be improved in the right environment.
aim2please wrote:Collins looks like a safe pick. IMO he has a higher floor but lower ceiling than Isaac.
I was trying to find a comp for him, Cody Zeller or Mason Plumlee with a jump shot came to mind. Above average athleticism, below average length, can switch on perimeter a little bit. Nothing wrong with that, I just think odds are against him being anything more than a low end starter/3rd big.
In fairness, I'm overall against using a high lotto pick on a tall white dude. (Cody Zeller, Kaminsky etc.) I was way off on Porzingis though, so there's that
greenroom31 wrote:So I just went back and watched all the Draftexpress video of Collins and I'm still not sold. I like his shot and his footwork, but worry about his ability to play in the interior and not get pushed around. He's got a pretty strong lower body but not upper body and he plays a little bit under the rim at times too. He bites on all sorts of pump fakes and fouls at a ridiculous rate, and that's against college scrubs. Oh yeah, he also basically never passes the ball under any circumstances.
All in all he seems like a bit of a project and is really more of a 4 than a 5. Definitely wouldn't consider him in the top 8 and probably not until mid-teens.
I'm with the two of you on this, except he he looks like a pure 5 to me. He looks like somewhat mobile as a 5, but not switchable enough to be a 4. With Horford and Zizic we don't have much need for another. What really kills it for me is the lack of length and lack of physicality (both weaknesses on the draftexpress video). Maybe he has a 9'3" standing reach, but when paired with his athleticism he plays as if he's smaller.
I wouldn't mind him at 12-18, but if we get #10 I'd hope for one of Isaac/Tatum/Jackson to drop. If none of those guys are available I'd have a hard time deciding between Collins and Anunoby. I haven't really watched much tape on any of these guys outside of the top 8, so I'm not going to flip if Ainge takes one guy over another.
"Danny Ainge needs to shut the **** up and manage his own team. He was the biggest whiner when he was playing, and I know that because I coached against him." Pat Riley
Homerclease wrote:Who do we like at pick 37? Draft and stash? An upperclassmen that may be more ready to contribute immediately? A project type player?
This draft doesn't have a lot of draft and stash player. Personally I would like Cam Oliver he's undersized but a great athlete and his weaknesses can be improved in the right environment.
I like Bell and Swanigan personally at 37. I had hopes that Jeanne would fall there and we could keep him in France for another year or two but I think he goes first round for sure now. There's also guys like Hart and Thornwell who should likely be there.
