2016-2017 College Basketball / '17 NBA Draft Thread IV

[Sixersftw]

Jackson has a drive to him that Turner never had.

This. Plus Turner couldn't slash, and get to the basket. Sure he was smart, had a good handle, and was skilled offensively, but he couldn't play off the ball, whereas Jackson is going to be a terror off the ball.

Playing off the ball wasn't a strong point to Turner but that guy could slash w/ the best of them in college and he was hyper competitive and driven. The guy broke his back and came back in a month. A complete hyper competitive psycho. The biggest disappointment in Turner's game was his mental weakness. We thought we were getting a cold blooded assassin. A broke ass Mamba who was gonna close out games but instead we got this mentally frail dude.

Turner and Josh Jackson seem very similar from a drive standpoint coming out of college. I just don't expect JJ to lose that edge the same way.

[Negrodamus]

I think in terms of shooting from anywhere other than the paint, Kris Dunn's junior year and Josh Jackson's freshman year have a lot of similarities.

Kris Dunn: 34% of shots from 2pt J; made 41%. 18.7% of shots from 3pt J; made 35%. 44% FTr; made 68%.
Josh Jackson: 36% of shots from 2pt J; made 38%. 21% of shots from 3pt J; made 37%. 40% FTr; made 56%.

Dunn's three point percentage went up on more attempts (37%) his senior year, but his 2pt FG% went down on less attempts (29% FG).

[LloydFree]

I let Cousins' character issues sour me on him. Last time I make that mistake for someone that talented, unless the dude is suspected of murder or rape or something ultra serious.

Turner makes me a little queasy about Jackson. On one hand I'm like nah it's not even comparable because Jackson is way more athletic, talented, better defender, more potential, etc. On the other hand I'm like Turner was very productive, had great handles in college and we all hoped he'd improve his jumper and he never did. So I worry about that with Jackson, even with his athleticism. But then I'm like well Doug Collins didn't develop anyone and Brett Brown has proven to be good at that, so I should be more comfortable with Jackson just for that reason alone.

But ultimately I'll never be 100% comfortable with a wing/guard who can't shoot. I've stated many times, shooting is my favorite skill in the sport, and having guys who can't shoot is a personal pet peeve of mine. It's like having slap hitters in baseball or guys who only score off deflections in hockey, or possession WRs with no breakaway ability in football. It's just such a tease. You hope and hope and hope they eventually take it to another level, but deep down you're thinking "yeah, prob not gonna happen."

You could get the best of both prospects though:

In the first three games of his college career, he was whistled for 13 fouls. He fouled out of three games and battled foul trouble in countless others. Quick whistles limited his effectiveness in Kansas's NCAA Tournament loss to Oregon.

An article in the Kansas City Star dated Jan. 6 discussed Jackson's penchant for picking up technical fouls — frustration manifesting itself in ill-advised ways. That's also a euphemistic way of describing an incident outside a bar where Jackson repeatedly kicked a car belonging to a member of Kansas's women's basketball team. One could also describe that as a crime.

Jackson also hit a parked car and fled the scene without telling anybody about it for weeks.

Watch on YouTube

Lol. What the hail... I was expecting a Dennis Rodman type flameout based on the setup. What was the video for?

[Negrodamus]

I let Cousins' character issues sour me on him. Last time I make that mistake for someone that talented, unless the dude is suspected of murder or rape or something ultra serious.

Turner makes me a little queasy about Jackson. On one hand I'm like nah it's not even comparable because Jackson is way more athletic, talented, better defender, more potential, etc. On the other hand I'm like Turner was very productive, had great handles in college and we all hoped he'd improve his jumper and he never did. So I worry about that with Jackson, even with his athleticism. But then I'm like well Doug Collins didn't develop anyone and Brett Brown has proven to be good at that, so I should be more comfortable with Jackson just for that reason alone.

But ultimately I'll never be 100% comfortable with a wing/guard who can't shoot. I've stated many times, shooting is my favorite skill in the sport, and having guys who can't shoot is a personal pet peeve of mine. It's like having slap hitters in baseball or guys who only score off deflections in hockey, or possession WRs with no breakaway ability in football. It's just such a tease. You hope and hope and hope they eventually take it to another level, but deep down you're thinking "yeah, prob not gonna happen."

You could get the best of both prospects though:

In the first three games of his college career, he was whistled for 13 fouls. He fouled out of three games and battled foul trouble in countless others. Quick whistles limited his effectiveness in Kansas's NCAA Tournament loss to Oregon.

An article in the Kansas City Star dated Jan. 6 discussed Jackson's penchant for picking up technical fouls — frustration manifesting itself in ill-advised ways. That's also a euphemistic way of describing an incident outside a bar where Jackson repeatedly kicked a car belonging to a member of Kansas's women's basketball team. One could also describe that as a crime.

Jackson also hit a parked car and fled the scene without telling anybody about it for weeks.

Watch on YouTube

Lol. What the hail... I was expecting a Dennis Rodman type flameout based one the setup. What was the video for?

I think I read that he had 3 technical fouls on the year. DeMarcus had 4 at UK.

I personally don't care about that, but if you have problems with the way DeMarcus Cousins acted in college, you cannot dismiss this fact with Josh Jackson. Especially since Cousins never let this type of behavior follow him off the court.

[Negrodamus]

Been watching a lot of Jonathan Isaac recently. It's getting harder and harder to keep Tatum at my top spot. He reminds me of how I felt about Myles Turner on offense: sweet stroke that's able to hit from anywhere on the floor, especially the free throw line.

Just watched a large amount of the Duke @ FSU game. If he didn't play with chuckers like Bacon and Rathan Mayes, he would have put up way more points. Between playing offense mainly on the perimeter and guarding the opposing SF, I think it's safe to say that he's a wing at the next level. He's not OG Anunoby good at defense, but he's damn close.

On a side note, FSU and Duke are miserable to watch. Both play zero team ball, but you can tell Duke squandered an amazing opportunity. That team was stacked.

[Unbreakable99]

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[eagereyez]

http://www.derekbodner.com/2017/05/30/2017-sixers-big-board-1-0/

[LloydFree]

http://www.derekbodner.com/2017/05/30/2017-sixers-big-board-1-0/
The scouting report on Frank N cracks me up...

Frank Ntilikina 6'5 PG Strasbourg Intl
Elite defensive potential (and versatility), drastically improved efficiency and confidence in his outside shot combine to make him a really good fit with the 76ers. He doesn’t project as much of a shot creator or offensive initiator, but he fits in well with what the 76ers need alongside Ben Simmons.

They continue to list him as a big PG at 6'5 so he will stand out. But the scouting report is of a regular sized shooting guard with a work in process shot.

[Wilfried]

I agree with Derek that Jonathan Isaac would fit very well.

Given his potential, I would really make that pick too. Huge upside, defensive talent, fits in perfectly between Embiid and Simmons.

[smittybanton]

Been watching a lot of Jonathan Isaac recently. It's getting harder and harder to keep Tatum at my top spot. He reminds me of how I felt about Myles Turner on offense: sweet stroke that's able to hit from anywhere on the floor, especially the free throw line.

Just watched a large amount of the Duke @ FSU game. If he didn't play with chuckers like Bacon and Rathan Mayes, he would have put up way more points. Between playing offense mainly on the perimeter and guarding the opposing SF, I think it's safe to say that he's a wing at the next level. He's not OG Anunoby good at defense, but he's damn close.

On a side note, FSU and Duke are miserable to watch. Both play zero team ball, but you can tell Duke squandered an amazing opportunity. That team was stacked.

I just re-watched that game and almost put Tatum atop my board (again). Lol. I love them all. Trade down!

[Negrodamus]

Been watching a lot of Jonathan Isaac recently. It's getting harder and harder to keep Tatum at my top spot. He reminds me of how I felt about Myles Turner on offense: sweet stroke that's able to hit from anywhere on the floor, especially the free throw line.

Just watched a large amount of the Duke @ FSU game. If he didn't play with chuckers like Bacon and Rathan Mayes, he would have put up way more points. Between playing offense mainly on the perimeter and guarding the opposing SF, I think it's safe to say that he's a wing at the next level. He's not OG Anunoby good at defense, but he's damn close.

On a side note, FSU and Duke are miserable to watch. Both play zero team ball, but you can tell Duke squandered an amazing opportunity. That team was stacked.

I just re-watched that game and almost put Tatum atop my board (again). Lol. I love them all. Trade down!

Yea, at this point, if we can get 5 and 10, I'd do it in a heart beat.

My ideal picks would be Isaac at 5 and Mitchell at 10 or DSJ at 5 and Anunoby (I think I'm alone on this one, but he seems like an all NBA team defense down the road). Preferably the first one because they would work wonders with the team as it's currently constructed. But I'd be fine with DSJ, Jackson, Tatum, Isaac, or Fox at 3 so I'd definitely be fine with them at 5.

I'll reiterate that I do think it would be contingent on Ball falling to three, which seems likely with every passing day.

[SelfishPlayer]

Isaac is an NBA stretch 4, drafting him would be a mistake with Simmons and Saric already in fold at the 4. That would be Noel, Embiid, Okafor all over again or Iggy and Turner. NBA GMs will never bail you out when you stockpile at one position. Generally the players do not produce as well as they could on the court creating even more devaluation.

[Negrodamus]

I agree with Derek that Jonathan Isaac would fit very well.

Given his potential, I would really make that pick too. Huge upside, defensive talent, fits in perfectly between Embiid and Simmons.

Yea, and between constantly defending the 3 (and even the 2 and 1 at times from the full games I've watched) along with living on the perimeter on offense, he'll definitely thrive at a 3. Can play small ball 4 and 5 which makes him such an alluring prospect.

[Kolkmania]

Isaac is an NBA stretch 4, drafting him would be a mistake with Simmons and Saric already in fold at the 4. That would be Noel, Embiid, Okafor all over again or Iggy and Turner. NBA GMs will never bail you out when you stockpile at one position. Generally the players do not produce as well as they could on the court creating even more devaluation.

Difference is that Okafor, Noel and Embiid can never co-exist on the same floor since their skillsets all limit them as 5's. Iguodala and Turner are also poor fits in the sense that they both clog the lane.

Like you said, Isaac is a stretch 4 on the offensive end, while Simmons will have the ball in his hands as much as possible. As long as Jonathan Isaac is capable of providing enough gravity I don't see a reason why that's doomed to fail. Defensively they have kind of overlapping skills, since both player's best position is defending the opponents 4. However, they're both capable of defending the three, so unlike Okafor + Noel/Embiid and Turner + Iguodala they're not devestating fits on one end of the floor.

That said, it's obviously not the ideal fit like Malik Monk for example.

[SelfishPlayer]

Isaac is an NBA stretch 4, drafting him would be a mistake with Simmons and Saric already in fold at the 4. That would be Noel, Embiid, Okafor all over again or Iggy and Turner. NBA GMs will never bail you out when you stockpile at one position. Generally the players do not produce as well as they could on the court creating even more devaluation.

Difference is that Okafor, Noel and Embiid can never co-exist on the same floor since their skillsets all limit them as 5's. Iguodala and Turner are also poor fits in the sense that they both clog the lane.

Like you said, Isaac is a stretch 4 on the offensive end, while Simmons will have the ball in his hands as much as possible. As long as Jonathan Isaac is capable of providing enough gravity I don't see a reason why that's doomed to fail. Defensively they have kind of overlapping skills, since both player's best position is defending the opponents 4. However, they're both capable of defending the three, so unlike Okafor + Noel/Embiid and Turner + Iguodala they're not devestating fits on one end of the floor.

That said, it's obviously not the ideal fit like Malik Monk for example.

Iguodala shot .394 from 3 during his final season here, so I disagree with the lane clogging thing pertaining to both of them...

[Foshan]

Love the idea of Isaac & Monk.

Simmons / Monk / RoCo / Isaac / Embiid (offenseively)

Monk / Roco / Isaac / Simmons / Embiid (defensively)

[smittybanton]

Been watching a lot of Jonathan Isaac recently. It's getting harder and harder to keep Tatum at my top spot. He reminds me of how I felt about Myles Turner on offense: sweet stroke that's able to hit from anywhere on the floor, especially the free throw line.

Just watched a large amount of the Duke @ FSU game. If he didn't play with chuckers like Bacon and Rathan Mayes, he would have put up way more points. Between playing offense mainly on the perimeter and guarding the opposing SF, I think it's safe to say that he's a wing at the next level. He's not OG Anunoby good at defense, but he's damn close.

On a side note, FSU and Duke are miserable to watch. Both play zero team ball, but you can tell Duke squandered an amazing opportunity. That team was stacked.

I just re-watched that game and almost put Tatum atop my board (again). Lol. I love them all. Trade down!

Yea, at this point, if we can get 5 and 10, I'd do it in a heart beat.

My ideal picks would be Isaac at 5 and Mitchell at 10 or DSJ at 5 and Anunoby (I think I'm alone on this one, but he seems like an all NBA team defense down the road). Preferably the first one because they would work wonders with the team as it's currently constructed. But I'd be fine with DSJ, Jackson, Tatum, Isaac, or Fox at 3 so I'd definitely be fine with them at 5.

I'll reiterate that I do think it would be contingent on Ball falling to three, which seems likely with every passing day.

I think we give SAC stuff to help get that 5 & 10. I think TJ Maxx and Justin Anderson do more for them than they will do for us.
Then, I think we can add more stuff we don't really need to move from #10 past the Knicks to make sure we get Dennis Smith Jr.

Jonathan Isaac and Dennis Smith Jr would be an awesome draft.
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However, I think if I'm Danny Ainge, I would prefer the 5 & 10 over the #1, seeing as how Jonathan Isaac or Jayson Tatum fits their needs much better than the other prospects. It's kind of like when the Phillies got the #1 pick last year and took Mickey Moniak--who should be a fantastic player but happened to be in a draft where there was no clear cut absolute stud-muffin.

Jonathan Isaac and either Zach Collins/Lauri Markkanen would be a better draft than 'just' Markelle Fultz. The idea that you just replace Avery Bradley's 1st team All-NBA defense with a rookie who will be a little bit better than D'Angelo Russell is a bit much for me. Does anyone here fear Boston more if they got Fultz?
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I want to eat all of Portland's bad contracts and their late first round picks. Every one of their castoffs can be a productive, although expensive bench player for us. Even Evan Turner, who is a lesser version of Big Ben. Crabbe, Harkless. Crabbe shot 44% from 3pt last year, and had a DFG% of 44.1 (42% in 2016). Gimme!

Every one of their late round firsts will be very valuable contracts for us to make moves in the future. Bam Adebayo, Harry Giles and TJ Leaf will be very good NBA players. Dejounte Murray was in my top10 last year. This year I'm putting my chips behind TJ Leaf.

This is the news we've been waiting for. Make me a believer, Bryan!

[Negrodamus]

Love the idea of Isaac & Monk.

Simmons / Monk / RoCo / Isaac / Embiid (offenseively)

Monk / Roco / Isaac / Simmons / Embiid (defensively)

Not bad. I do think RoCo and Isaac will neutralize the massive defensive deficiencies of Monk. I'm curious as to how the rotation will work, as in, when Simmons is on the bench.

[ROA]

With #5 and #10 - Isaac and Monk, or Tatum and Mithcell.

[smittybanton]

Thinking aloud: Sacramento has cap space this year, and they have bigs. But what free agents want to play for the Kings? They could keep #5 and get DeAaron Fox, then trade #10 and capspace to the Portland Trailblazers for #14, 20, 23 and Maurice Harkless and Evan Turner. Probably can get OG Anunoby at #14 as their small-forward-of-the-future.