The case for Jonathan Isaac

[MasterGMer]

Jonathan is a 4?

I thought that was Gordon's spot, after all the experiment last season

[p0peye]

So we should not draft high upside player because ... PF without post game and jumpshot screams future superstar?

We draft who we think is BPA. There ain't nobody on this roster to make us think twice.

[fendilim]

If we want to talk about his bads, I think this article helps because it doesn't shy away from mentioning his concerns as a wing, but it does stress the value of him being a big and having wing type skills and what that means. Kinda long, but worth the read, imo.

Jonathan Isaac is the best big man in this draft class
https://medium.com/@jzmazlish/jonathan-isaac-is-the-best-big-man-in-this-draft-class-4a92c8f53f84
Good videos here too
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Isaac is typically thought of as a relatively high-floor low-upside 3&D prospect. It is easy to fall into this trap when looking at Isaac. He has good defensive tools and production, some shooting success, and doesn’t offer too much else on the offensive end. As is often the case, draft writer Kaiser Lindeman forced me to look at Isaac in a different light. A closer evaluation of his film and statistical profile revealed that he has a unique combination of strengths, and his upside is being undersold.

General perception of Isaac as a “wing” is in many ways what led to him being underrated. Brandon Ingram’s existence is arguably another reason. Florida State played Isaac as a power forward all year, much like Ingram at Duke last year. Both are gangly and fluid athletes who seem like they should be similarly good on the defensive end. A quick look at their respective defensive production should at least cause us to raise our eyebrows at such an assumption.



The purpose of this chart is not to illustrate that Ingram was a bad defender. He was a fine defensive prospect for a wing (though probably a bit overrated). What should become apparent is just how strong Isaac’s defensive production is. When you consider his rebounding and shot blocking he doesn’t look like a good wing defensive player, he looks like a good *big man*. If Isaac can provide the perimeter versatility of a wing while doing traditional power forward things at a high-level, it completely changes the calculus on his defensive upside.

A look at Isaac’s film from this year more than backs up his numbers. Unlike many wings who rack up solid block numbers, Isaac doesn’t fly in from the weak side to swat guys shots. K.J. McDaniels, Aaron Gordon, and Miles Bridges are all examples of this type of back-side rim protection. What Isaac brings to the table is far more valuable. He instinctually rotates to the rim in help situations and uses verticality well to bother shots. Being 6'10 with a 7'1 wingspan, he is able to alter a lot of shots at the rim that he doesn’t get credited with a block on.

In on-ball situations, Isaac is able to bother shots that are typically converted by the offensive player. Isaac uses that same length and positioning to rebound at an excellent rate for a power forward, or even a center. When you consider team context at Florida State, Isaac’s numbers only become more impressive. They play three guys who are all more “traditional” big-men than Isaac heavy minutes (Michael Ojo, Koumandji, and Jarquez Smith), and Ojo and Koumandji are 7+ foot behemoths who can rebound and block shots at a high level. Theoretically, on an NCAA team with average interior defenders Isaac’s numbers would be even more outlier good.

The biggest flaw in Isaac’s interior defensive profile is his skinniness. There have been really successful skinny big man defenders (cough Nerlens Noel cough), but Isaac’s frame is still an issue. At this stage, he is simply not equipped to guard the NBA’s true power players. The good news is all that really does is prevent him from playing Center, because aside from Blake Griffin, Paul Millsap, and maybe a few others, there aren’t many offensively dominant “power” 4’s.

If anything, since Isaac is a quick-leaper with length and timing he has real upside to eventually play the 5. According to his DraftExpress measurements, he’s already gained 20 pounds in the past two years. If he can add another 20 and get himself to be about 225 it is easy to see him spending some time at the 5.

The reason you would want to play Isaac at the 5 is the devastating versatility it could unlock in a defense. In addition to being good at “big-man things,” Isaac is also a talented perimeter defender.

His short area quickness and reactive ability is about as good as I’ve ever seen in someone his size. Watch his footwork here as he completely cuts off Jayson Tatum’s penetration.

https://streamable.com/lg338

There aren’t many 6'10 guys in the league who can move their feet like that. Isaac’s package of lateral quicks and insane length allows him to make some pretty impressive on-ball defensive plays. Here he is destroying another NBA wing prospect (Justin Jackson) in Kawhi-esque fashion.

https://streamable.com/yqyur

That short area quickness also allows Isaac to get around screens exceptionally well for a player of his stature. Now, Isaac is by no means a perfect defensive prospect. He gets beat off-the-dribble a decent amount. Importantly though, the times he gets beat are almost always due to him gambling for a steal, him not having the strength to cut a guy off, or not having the lateral speed to keep up with someone over distance.

That last quality, his speed over long distances, is odd for someone his frame. Usually guys who are long like him can move laterally to keep up with guys but struggle to respond to guys in short areas. Isaac is the opposite. Thankfully, containing guys in small areas is much more relevant in the NBA because help defense prevents guys from being stretched out too much.

Off-the-ball, Isaac does have issues with consistency. He seems to drift at times, and there are questions about his competitiveness. Since he also displays moments of high-instinct rotation and his bottom-line impact is so good these concerns aren’t giant, but are worth thinking about.

With his flaws in mind, I don’t see Isaac as a truly game-changing Kawhi/Draymond level defender. However, given his versatility as a plus perimeter and interior defender Isaac profiles as both a high-floor and high-upside defensive prospect.

In all, Isaac is a pretty high-floor defensive prospect regardless of situation. If a coach does utilize him correctly and plays him at the 4 and 5 he has legitimate All-NBA defensive upside. I don’t think most view Isaac’s defense this way, but I think it’s time to start asking people why not.

When you consider Isaac a true-4 and possible 5 defensively, his offensive profile also becomes all that more enticing. Seriously, why does Lauri Markkanen get the (offensive) benefit of being called a stretch 4/5, while Isaac, who also stretches the floor and is better at actual big man defensive things, get labeled a wing?

Isaac is not a good offensive prospect for a wing. His shot is a real question mark, and he’s not great at attacking off-the-dribble or reading the floor. Those weaknesses look completely different when you consider him as a true 4/5, but still should be evaluated.

Even as a 4/5 a bad shooting outcome would tank his value as a player. Predicting shooting is pretty much impossible, but there are reasons to believe in Isaac’s shot. Shooting 78% from the free throw line is a big deal.His comfort and frequency shooting off-the-dribble pull-ups is also a good sign. He’s probably going to be a solid 35–38% shooter from the NBA three.

He’s an unselfish ball-mover, he’s got a good first step, and as he adds strength he should be very capable of attacking off one or two-dribbles and finishing at the rim. The fact that he can also pull-up fluidly in the mid-range is a plus, and prevents defenses from playing him like a non-threat.

Isaac has also shown flashes of being able to run side pick-and-roll in a pinch. He can be a bit robotic with his reads at times, which caps his upside as a creator, but he is perfectly able to execute weak-side action for an NBA team.

It is crucial to evaluating Isaac’s offense to understand that he will (hopefully) be playing power forward or center. As a wing, Isaac would profile as a below-average, but not terrible, offensive prospect. As a big guy, if his shot doesn’t fail him he is a versatile floor spacer and finisher who can attack closeouts and keep the offense moving.

Isaac is being discussed as if he were a good wing defender with the capability of sliding down a position, much like Harrison Barnes. Instead, he should be thought of as a good interior defender with the versatility to guard on the wing. Such a designation completely changes the way he’s viewed on both ends of the floor.

On defense, Isaac has the potential to be an all-NBA level defender at the power forward due to his versatility. He provides much more interior defense than a small-ball wing, and is as versatile a perimeter defender as almost any big in today’s NBA.

On offense, Isaac is not a great prospect as a wing, but when thought of as an athletic stretch 4 who can shoot some, attack off the bounce, and finish around the rim he looks a lot more appealing. He will never be a star on this end but he could easily be a +1 or +2 guy with a good shooting outcome.

If Isaac does add the strength to play the 5 near full-time his upside only magnifies. At the 5, he would be a below average interior defender but an exceptional perimeter one, and would also gain even more value on the offensive end. Given his status as a late-grower and the weight he’s added this possibility is not out of the question.

My three reasons for skepticism of my own evaluation of Isaac are 1) What if he’s played like a wing 2) What if his shot fails and 3) Am I underrating how poor his BBIQ/on-court “fire” is. If he goes to a bad organization his future looks a lot different, he needs the right situation. Having a coach play him at the 4 is not all that difficult though, so it doesn’t affect my pre-draft ranking of him. His shot is by far the biggest variable in his future, but the same could be said of every prospect. I’m buying his shot being good enough to make him useful. Again, I’ve seen enough indicators of good IQ/competitiveness that I’m buying, but he has had some games (like their elimination game against Xavier) where he looked terrible in this respect.

Worries aside, I am super high on Jonathan Isaac. I think he’s got real +2 O/+3 D upside if played at the 4, and upside even beyond that if he can play the 5. He’s also not purely an upside pick because there are a lot of intermediate scenarios where he could be a useful ~+0.5/+1.5 starting power forward. The flexibility he offers in line-up construction makes him easy to envision on a championship contender. I see a lot of reasons to buy Jonathan Isaac, and since I’m not super high on any of the other wings in this class (more to come on this soon) — he is the #1 wing (and big) in this class for me, and my #3 prospect behind Ball and Fultz.

This article just proved he and Gordon can't co-exist.

[PennytoShaq]

So if Isaac is future big ( and i already had debate with PennytoShaq lot of times in past ) doesn't that mean that he will spend most of the time playing PF , just like Gordon? Why use a pick to double it down on only position we have in place?
You can't trow Isaac and his below 100 kg at center any time soon and as Skin above copy pasted- most of his stats point out that he is big man, not wing prospect.
And, as MagicMatic above pointed out, even if he has star potential ( and that's still in the air,just like with every other prospect) how valuable is that really in league where not a single contender plays through bigs?

We don't know that teams see Isaac as a future big. They may see him as a wing hybrid. He played the wing game in college.

As for AG, he doesn't play the wing game at all so I doubt that will matter much.

I think the Magic draft Isaac if they work him out and see versatility to play 3-5. If he is a 4-5 guy I don't think he has the same ceiling and I don't think the Magic take him.

[Furinkazan]

You didnt convince me.Im still on DSJ bandwagon.Im dead set on him its DSJ or bust in my mind.
I know Im setting myslef up for a huge disappointment because we never drafted a player I wanted us to draft so at the same time Im already preparing my rant speech XD.

[ChiBullsBears]

I have compared Isaac to Ibaka since last year. He doesn't have near the perimeter skills to be a 3, his shooting is alright nothing special. At the 4 he can be a shot blocker like Ibaka is with some range and his lack of ball handling won't be a severe there.

[pepe1991]

So if Isaac is future big ( and i already had debate with PennytoShaq lot of times in past ) doesn't that mean that he will spend most of the time playing PF , just like Gordon? Why use a pick to double it down on only position we have in place?
You can't trow Isaac and his below 100 kg at center any time soon and as Skin above copy pasted- most of his stats point out that he is big man, not wing prospect.
And, as MagicMatic above pointed out, even if he has star potential ( and that's still in the air,just like with every other prospect) how valuable is that really in league where not a single contender plays through bigs?

We don't know that teams see Isaac as a future big. They may see him as a wing hybrid. He played the wing game in college.

As for AG, he doesn't play the wing game at all so I doubt that will matter much.

I think the Magic draft Isaac if they work him out and see versatility to play 3-5. If he is a 4-5 guy I don't think he has the same ceiling and I don't think the Magic take him.

It's just hard to imagine somebody that tall playing SF . Sure Durant and Giannis are doing it just fine but they are exception, not a rule.

[PennytoShaq]

I have compared Isaac to Ibaka since last year. He doesn't have near the perimeter skills to be a 3, his shooting is alright nothing special. At the 4 he can be a shot blocker like Ibaka is with some range and his lack of ball handling won't be a severe there.

He was one of the most efficient shooters from 3 of all the top guys in this draft.

[PennytoShaq]

So if Isaac is future big ( and i already had debate with PennytoShaq lot of times in past ) doesn't that mean that he will spend most of the time playing PF , just like Gordon? Why use a pick to double it down on only position we have in place?
You can't trow Isaac and his below 100 kg at center any time soon and as Skin above copy pasted- most of his stats point out that he is big man, not wing prospect.
And, as MagicMatic above pointed out, even if he has star potential ( and that's still in the air,just like with every other prospect) how valuable is that really in league where not a single contender plays through bigs?

We don't know that teams see Isaac as a future big. They may see him as a wing hybrid. He played the wing game in college.

As for AG, he doesn't play the wing game at all so I doubt that will matter much.

I think the Magic draft Isaac if they work him out and see versatility to play 3-5. If he is a 4-5 guy I don't think he has the same ceiling and I don't think the Magic take him.

It's just hard to imagine somebody that tall playing SF . Sure Durant and Giannis are doing it just fine but they are exception, not a rule.

I'm not asking you to imagine it. I am simply saying that I believe he will be analyzed as a wing by Hammond. So if we take him, I believe Hammond will state in his Presser that he sees Isaac as a versatile wing player.

[Def Swami]

I have compared Isaac to Ibaka since last year. He doesn't have near the perimeter skills to be a 3, his shooting is alright nothing special. At the 4 he can be a shot blocker like Ibaka is with some range and his lack of ball handling won't be a severe there.

He was one of the most efficient shooters from 3 of all the top guys in this draft.

He's an okay, not great, shooter from deep right now. He was pretty streaky with his 3 point shot; had some hot and cold months. He definitely shot the ball from mid-range well. One of my concerns is how good of a long range shooter he can become. There's a lot of good indicators, but it's still something he'll have to prove he can do consistently with a longer 3 point line.

[BadMofoPimp]

Maybe, Isaac can be developed to play the game, but I am concerned as I feel this team needs more out of this draft.

Watch on YouTube

[fendilim]

I have compared Isaac to Ibaka since last year. He doesn't have near the perimeter skills to be a 3, his shooting is alright nothing special. At the 4 he can be a shot blocker like Ibaka is with some range and his lack of ball handling won't be a severe there.

He was one of the most efficient shooters from 3 of all the top guys in this draft.

35% for a spot up shooter in convincing.

[JF5]

He's my 2nd choice if DSJ isn't there at 6... I hope we would just obtain the following pick so we could get him AND DSJ so everyone is happy.

[drsd]

We draft who we think is BPA. There ain't nobody on this roster to make us think twice.

Regardless, Mr. BPA is the choice. Example: Markelle Fultz is widely expected to be drafted by the Celts even though starting PG is their lowest need.

Trades and the FA market is were teams are balanced. The draft can only about maximising assets.


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[pepe1991]

Maybe, Isaac can be developed to play the game, but I am concerned as I feel this team needs more out of this draft.

Watch on YouTube

Some data from this video are just so ugly.
0-7 in iso situations when he puts ball on the floor.
Most pick&rolls end with turnover.
Settles for long 2s .
Doesn't have nba range when he shoot 3s
2-7 in situations where he pushes transition with 40% turnover rate on 20 possessons. ( in other words he ruined 13 out of 20 transition plays )


And maybe big part that nobody talks about- -asthmatic. Could influence his conditioning and how much he can workout and run. Good player but prospect. Will take time to develop. I would prefer Smith over him but i would be fine with him at 6#.

[SOUL]

I don't think asthma is a huge deal if he can control it. Harden had it growing up, Rodman had it, a lot of greats in other sports. Anthony Bennett also had it but he would've sucked without it too.

[fendilim]

Maybe, Isaac can be developed to play the game, but I am concerned as I feel this team needs more out of this draft.

Watch on YouTube

Some data from this video are just so ugly.
0-7 in iso situations when he puts ball on the floor.
Most pick&rolls end with turnover.
Settles for long 2s .
Doesn't have nba range when he shoot 3s
2-7 in situations where he pushes transition with 40% turnover rate on 20 possessons. ( in other words he ruined 13 out of 20 transition plays )


And maybe big part that nobody talks about- -asthmatic. Could influence his conditioning and how much he can workout and run. Good player but prospect. Will take time to develop. I would prefer Smith over him but i would be fine with him at 6#.

Exactly why I don't want to waste the 6th pick on this guy. We already did that with our previous picks. Getting basketball players this time would be better.

[pepe1991]

Maybe, Isaac can be developed to play the game, but I am concerned as I feel this team needs more out of this draft.

Watch on YouTube

Some data from this video are just so ugly.
0-7 in iso situations when he puts ball on the floor.
Most pick&rolls end with turnover.
Settles for long 2s .
Doesn't have nba range when he shoot 3s
2-7 in situations where he pushes transition with 40% turnover rate on 20 possessons. ( in other words he ruined 13 out of 20 transition plays )


And maybe big part that nobody talks about- -asthmatic. Could influence his conditioning and how much he can workout and run. Good player but prospect. Will take time to develop. I would prefer Smith over him but i would be fine with him at 6#.

Exactly why I don't want to waste the 6th pick on this guy. We already did that with our previous picks. Getting basketball players this time would be better.

That's 0-7 in isos where he puts ball on the floor ( i forgot to add ). But in general i'm more worried about his asthma and how that it could influence his body development and stamina. For example McGee has asthma and he simply can't play bigger min. I remember in series vs Lakers,when he played for Nuggets, in his best playoff game ever he had to ask coach Karl to put him out because he couldn't breath. Some other good players have asthma as well ( i think even Harden ) so it's so important to know how bad his asthmatic attacks are and how often they repeat.

[Jiwol]

Isaac is intriguing but I'm leaning towards DSJ. We need an alpha male on this roster full of softies and he looks like one in the making.

[drsd]

Jonathan is a 4?

I thought that was Gordon's spot, after all the experiment last season

Isaac as the next Rashard Lewis has the young kid as a 3-wing for about 7 years and then transitioning to a 4 in the late stages of his NBA career. In the new NBA, he actually might transition from 3 to 5 when he is in his late 20s - early 30s.


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