batsmasher wrote:I'm certain there have been and will be much worse parents in the NBA than LaVar. The biggest problem is he's now a public figure. In terms of the private life and development side of things for Lonzo - there's really very little to suggest he'd be a problem.
If he's there at 4 there's absolutely no way we pass (pending medical info)
Yes, I see no way we pass on Ball if he is there. As much as I didn't want Ball, if he's there at 4, that would probably be pretty hard to pass up. I would be very interested to know how the team liked him, since they have talked of introducing prospects to the team.
Boston takes Fultz Lakers take Fox Philly takes Monk
Suns on the board with both Ball and Jackson available. Impossible you say? Not really. Remember when both Noel and McLemore were on the board when the Suns took Len? We thought they would both be gone for sure.
So who do you take? I think they take Ball. But it would be tough. Ball's passing is on a different level than anyone else. His defense is being way underrated as well as his athleticism. And I really like Jackson.
I think they take Ball. I'm trying to ready myself to be ok with anyone. And, while Ball has the question marks of finishing at the rim, pick n roll, if Booker could run pick n roll and Lonzo play spot up shooter and knock down 3s, it works. And the fast breaks with this team would be crazy fun.
I can say that I terribly miss having an electrifying passer though, so it would likely be a beauty to watch in that respect.
jcsunsfan wrote:OK. Here is my conspiracy theory. Adam Silver is concerned about all the press LaVar Ball is getting. Its not good for the NBA. He calls Magic and asks him to float some rumors that the Lakers might not draft Ball. Just start talking about how good other players are. It is intended to get LaVar to shut up. Lakers take him just like they had always planned.
I'm not sure this one holds much weight. In fact, I tend to think the opposite. I believe Silver likes LaVar Ball because he has people talking about him and the league. Not only that but he has people siding with the league's sponsors such as Nike and Under Armour. That's a difficult thing to do because people almost always root for the upstart underdog or the little guy against the corporate machine. LaVar is just so brazen and unlikable that people are going the other way with it. This is a win/win for Silver and the league right now.
The good thing if the suns take ball or fox is they want to play a fast breaking offense and that fit those twos skill sets so much better than a slow it down half court game.
Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming Wow! What a Ride!-H.S.T.
I have my concerns about Ball, but if he is there at #4 I think you have to take him. I don't buy into the concerns about Lavar. If the Suns had been 2 with the Lakers 3, then maybe that's a different story. But if the Lakers pass on Ball, I don't see him being an issue anywhere else that Lonzo lands. I think the effect that Lonzo could have on the Suns offense could be huge. I love Bledsoe, and I think he is going to be really good for several more years, but besides the age difference, I would love to see the Suns have much more ball movement. I think Booker could be so much better if he had more spot up opportunities instead of always being the ball handler. I envision something like what Curry does, where he starts the ball movement and then curls through the defense and pops back out in the corner for the spot up.
edurham88 wrote:I have my concerns about Ball, but if he is there at #4 I think you have to take him. I don't buy into the concerns about Lavar. If the Suns had been 2 with the Lakers 3, then maybe that's a different story. But if the Lakers pass on Ball, I don't see him being an issue anywhere else that Lonzo lands. I think the effect that Lonzo could have on the Suns offense could be huge. I love Bledsoe, and I think he is going to be really good for several more years, but besides the age difference, I would love to see the Suns have much more ball movement. I think Booker could be so much better if he had more spot up opportunities instead of always being the ball handler. I envision something like what Curry does, where he starts the ball movement and then curls through the defense and pops back out in the corner for the spot up.
I agree that if the Lakers pass on Ball it puts the whole "want to be a Laker" thing to bed and it won't be an issue. My biggest worry with Ball is if he gets off to a slow start his rookie year things could snow ball. Because of his dads endless idiotic comments if he struggles dude will be getting clowned on by the media and some vets on other teams are going to go out of their way to take it to him. That could be hard on a young guys confidence. Now if he comes in and plays well then people will forget all the silliness. Overall I wish his dad wouldn't have put this unnecessary pressure on the dude and if he becomes a Sun I just hope he can live up to it.
From a basketball perspective yeah I can totally see how a best case Lonzo would be great for everyone. A guy who can get your other young guys easy looks could be huge for their development.
Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming Wow! What a Ride!-H.S.T.
JMac1 wrote:Could someone please tell me what PG Monk couldn't guard because of his size....?
Also, Monk is a shooter who is athletic and can play next to Booker, Lauri is a slow footed C who would kill us on D way more than Monk.
Who here doesn't love shooting?
Monk has good size and athleticism to cover PG's and finish.......dude is 19.
From everything people keep saying here over and over, Monk or Tatum should be the pick, based on their concerns.
I have yet to hear posters say, we need defense only nor offense only, but most are stressing players offensive weaknesses over their defensive weaknesses....so that is what most are looking for.
You guys are trying to create two-way players when there aren't any at this time. So do you want a defender in Jackson or Fox, possible Issac; or scorers like DSJ, Monk, Tatum or Lauri....
Speaking as if player X will resolve his weakness vs player Z is unfounded at this time and really just dissonance because you can't 100 percent sell yourself on a player.
As they are now and the game is going. Jackson, Monk, Fox, and Tatum are good prospects in some capacity.
Btw, I would have drafted Lauri in A heart beat 10 years ago.
First of all do you understand that the Suns had the lowest assist rates of any team in the NBA last year? So what is your answer to this? get a player to play the main distributor position who doesn't pass? If a team isnt passing then it is a game of 1 on 5 and that isnt going be a very successful team. Monk is a natural shooting guard who is undersized at 6'3" who has a hard time guarding players whos after averages 6'6". So your answer is to say that he isnt a shooting guard but a point guard. My problem isnt Monk a point guard; he is a undersized shoot first shooting guard.
edurham88 wrote:I have my concerns about Ball, but if he is there at #4 I think you have to take him. I don't buy into the concerns about Lavar. If the Suns had been 2 with the Lakers 3, then maybe that's a different story. But if the Lakers pass on Ball, I don't see him being an issue anywhere else that Lonzo lands. I think the effect that Lonzo could have on the Suns offense could be huge. I love Bledsoe, and I think he is going to be really good for several more years, but besides the age difference, I would love to see the Suns have much more ball movement. I think Booker could be so much better if he had more spot up opportunities instead of always being the ball handler. I envision something like what Curry does, where he starts the ball movement and then curls through the defense and pops back out in the corner for the spot up.
Not only Booker, but just think how many more opportunities guys like Warren, Chriss, Bender, etc will get. Fewer people would get shut out of the offense or having to just rely on getting points off misses and stuff. I think everyone's level of play on the team would rise.
edurham88 wrote:I have my concerns about Ball, but if he is there at #4 I think you have to take him. I don't buy into the concerns about Lavar. If the Suns had been 2 with the Lakers 3, then maybe that's a different story. But if the Lakers pass on Ball, I don't see him being an issue anywhere else that Lonzo lands. I think the effect that Lonzo could have on the Suns offense could be huge. I love Bledsoe, and I think he is going to be really good for several more years, but besides the age difference, I would love to see the Suns have much more ball movement. I think Booker could be so much better if he had more spot up opportunities instead of always being the ball handler. I envision something like what Curry does, where he starts the ball movement and then curls through the defense and pops back out in the corner for the spot up.
Not only Booker, but just think how many more opportunities guys like Warren, Chriss, Bender, etc will get. Fewer people would get shut out of the offense or having to just rely on getting points off misses and stuff. I think everyone's level of play on the team would rise.
Also, with his size he could backup the 2 spot and play a few minutes with Ulis. Thus, we would just need a 3rd string caliber guard at the end of the day (preferably a combo guard) to round out the rotation.
Ball likely won't be there, but if he does fall and the draft goes something like 1. Fultz, 2. Fox, 3. Monk, then that is best case scenario for us because it means we could get Ball and trade Bledsoe to get back in while getting a good shot at one of the SFs like Jackson or Isaac later in the lottery.
edurham88 wrote:I have my concerns about Ball, but if he is there at #4 I think you have to take him. I don't buy into the concerns about Lavar. If the Suns had been 2 with the Lakers 3, then maybe that's a different story. But if the Lakers pass on Ball, I don't see him being an issue anywhere else that Lonzo lands. I think the effect that Lonzo could have on the Suns offense could be huge. I love Bledsoe, and I think he is going to be really good for several more years, but besides the age difference, I would love to see the Suns have much more ball movement. I think Booker could be so much better if he had more spot up opportunities instead of always being the ball handler. I envision something like what Curry does, where he starts the ball movement and then curls through the defense and pops back out in the corner for the spot up.
Not only Booker, but just think how many more opportunities guys like Warren, Chriss, Bender, etc will get. Fewer people would get shut out of the offense or having to just rely on getting points off misses and stuff. I think everyone's level of play on the team would rise.
Also, with his size he could backup the 2 spot and play a few minutes with Ulis. Thus, we would just need a 3rd string caliber guard at the end of the day (preferably a combo guard) to round out the rotation.
Ball likely won't be there, but if he does fall and the draft goes something like 1. Fultz, 2. Fox, 3. Monk, then that is best case scenario for us because it means we could get Ball and trade Bledsoe to get back in while getting a good shot at one of the SFs like Jackson or Isaac later in the lottery.
It might be possible to trade Bledsoe to the Kings for 10 at that point if they knew they could come out of this draft with Jackson and Bledsoe, and then we could take Collins or Anunoby or Markkanen if we wanted. I don't think anyone above that would trade for Bledsoe except maybe Dallas.
The NBA draft is in about two weeks, and new info is coming in. We are finding out more about what teams are seeing in workouts and debating in front offices.
This mock draft is based on conversations with NBA scouts and general managers.
1. Boston Celtics (via Nets) Markelle Fultz Washington Freshman Guard
Fultz was in Boston on Monday and Tuesday for interviews, medical testing and a workout. The information will be critical for Boston in a few ways.
He didn't do medical testing at the combine, so this will give the Celtics their first good look at his health. And with Lonzo Ball refusing to work out for the Celtics, it gives Fultz a chance to solidify the thinking that he's the best prospect for the team.
Fultz has been the top guy on the Celtics' board for a while, but he's not the only player they're considering. Ball, De'Aaron Fox, Josh Jackson and Jayson Tatum are also in the mix, according to sources.
A strong workout and interview could help seal the deal for Fultz.
2. Los Angeles Lakers Lonzo Ball UCLA Freshman Guard
The Lakers are going out of their way to stifle talk that Ball to L.A. is a done deal. Partially it's about controlling the narrative and their draft destiny, but it's also around some genuine disagreements in the front office about who's the best pick for the Lakers' future.
De'Aaron Fox and Josh Jackson have a real shot at going No. 2. Ball is the favorite, but he's far from a lock.
3. Philadelphia 76ers (via Kings) Josh Jackson Kansas Freshman Forward
The chances that the Sixers draft a guard or a wing are high -- the question appears to be which one.
There's quite a debate going on between the front office and coaching staff about who they should take. Best player available? That's probably Josh Jackson or De'Aaron Fox. Their elite toughness, athleticism and defensive potential are very attractive. The problem is that both players struggle as shooters and the Sixers need backcourt players who can stroke it.
Best fit among available players? Malik Monk or Dennis Smith. Both players are athletic, shoot well and play off the ball (a must given head coach Brett Brown's decision to make Ben Simmons the Sixers' primary ball handler).
The Sixers still have several workouts to continue to gauge the best fit, so it's premature to put a solid favorite here. But based on the sheer level of admiration for a particular player, it's between Fox and Jackson. I'm giving Josh Jackson the edge right now, but it's a slight edge.
4. Phoenix Suns De'Aaron Fox Kentucky Freshman Guard
The Suns are hoping that Lonzo Ball falls to No. 4. They like him and think he's a good fit in their system alongside Devin Booker.
If he's not there, it will be between Jackson, Fox and Tatum. With Jackson off the board, Fox seems like an ideal fit. The Suns are loaded with offensive talent. Getting Fox's defensive versatility, intensity and playmaking should really improve the Suns and open the door to an Eric Bledsoe trade.
Spoiler:
5. Sacramento Kings (via 76ers) Jayson Tatum Duke Freshman Forward
Fox came in to work out with the Kings this week, and there is a strong impulse to get him. They think he's a nice complement to Buddy Hield and he would really ramp up the rebuilding of their culture. The problem is that Sacramento has become his floor, not his ceiling.
The Kings also like Jackson, but he too looks like he'll be off the board before they draft.
There's talk inside the organization about combining picks Nos. 5 and 10 to move up in the draft to secure Fox. But if they found a taker, that would be a high price to pay to move up two to three spots.
Other options include Tatum, Jonathan Isaac and Dennis Smith. All three players fit a need for the Kings.
Tatum or Isaac would be a nice long-term replacement for Rudy Gay. Smith is the next-best point guard on the board. Right now Tatum has the edge. He's the safest of the three guys.
6. Orlando Magic Jonathan Isaac Florida State Freshman Forward
With team president Jeff Weltman and GM John Hammond now running the show in Orlando, you can be sure that they won't be afraid to gamble. Both of them love long, athletic and versatile players with upside, and Isaac has as much upside as anyone in the draft.
He's also one of the biggest risks. But in Milwaukee, Hammond and Weltman bet on Giannis Antetokounmpo and they won't be afraid to take Isaac.
7. Minnesota Timberwolves Lauri Markkanen Arizona Freshman Forward
We've been back and forth between Isaac and Markkanen here for several mock drafts.
Both are excellent fits for the Wolves, who are looking for a stretch-4. Isaac would offer more upside. Markkanen is more ready now and a more proven shooter.
With Isaac off the board, this looks like Markkanen's spot.
8. New York Knicks Malik Monk Kentucky Freshman Guard
The Knicks are looking at a number of backcourt players, including Monk, Dennis Smith and Frank Ntilikina.
Monk may be the highest upside player and best fit of the group. If he lands here, Knicks fans will love him when he heats up.
9. Dallas Mavericks Dennis Smith NC State Freshman Guard
The Mavs need a young point guard to build around and would be happy to take the best one that falls to them at No. 9.
Ntilikina has great size for his position, plays with strength and displays a great feel. He's also an improving shooter. He reminds me a bit of George Hill. Smith has more athleticism, shoots it better and is more NBA ready, but does not quite possess the same feel for the game.
The Mavs have scouted Ntilkina more than any other team in the league, but I think it might be hard for them to pass on Smith if he's there. He's really good and in a normal draft would be a top-five pick.
10. Sacramento Kings (via Pelicans) Frank Ntilikina France Age: 18 Guard
The Kings will have to be pretty happy with this haul if they end up with Tatum and Ntilkina.
Ntilkina could be their starting point guard of the future. He's more raw than the other elite point guard prospects, but at this point in the draft he's a great get. Other prospects that will get a look here include Luke Kennard, Donovan Mitchell and Harry Giles.
11. Charlotte Hornets Donovan Mitchell Louisville Sophomore Guard
Mitchell has been one of the highest risers in the draft since his season ended.
NBA scouts are talking themselves into his elite combination of athleticism, length and versatility. Some teams think he can play some point, others see him as the next Eric Gordon. His versatility will be a strong selling point for the Hornets.
Zach Collins and Luke Kennard are also strongly in the mix at No. 11.
12. Detroit Pistons Luke Kennard Duke Sophomore Guard
The Pistons have been flirting with trading this pick for a more established player, but if they keep it, look for them to try to nab a shooter.
Kennard wowed NBA scouts and GMs at his pro day, putting on an epic 3-point display and showing more athleticism than scouts thought he had a Duke (the Lakers recorded him with a 38.5-inch max vertical at his workout).
Kennard is getting interest as high as No. 8 to the Knicks. He's a hot name to watch right now.
13. Denver Nuggets OG Anunoby Indiana Sophomore Forward
Anunoby will be affected by what doctors have to say about his surgically repaired knee. Some teams feel it might be up to a year before he gets back to full health.
Even with the possibility he'll miss next season, I'm not sure the Nuggets will be scared off. They could use a long, athletic player like Anunoby, who can guard five positions on the floor.
John Collins and Harry Giles are other strong possibilities at No. 13.
14. Miami Heat Zach Collins Gonzaga Freshman Center
The Heat are eyeing several players to pair in the front court with Hassan Whiteside. Zach Collins, John Collins and Giles are the three strongest contenders at this point.
Collins has the unusual ability to both stretch the floor and protect the rim. He's a good athlete, he's aggressive and his analytics scores are through the roof.
He is in the mix as high as No. 9 to the Mavs. I don't think he slips past here.
15. Portland Trail Blazers Harry Giles Duke Freshman Forward
Teams are still taking a wait-and-see attitude on Giles. He was very impressive in a pro-day workout in New York last week. He showed no real ill effects from his knee injuries. He was bouncy and active and reminded some scouts why they fell in love with him as the potential No. 1 pick before his latest knee injury.
The key will be the medical results. Giles, like many of the other top prospects in the draft, didn't go through the combine medical testing and chose instead to do a private physical. Once teams get a look at those results, we'll have a better feel for whether No. 15 is too high or too low. But if feels like extraordinary value for the Blazers here.
The only NBA sponsors with more weight then ESPN (TV rights) are the shoe companies. Nike is especially powerful and Lavar has gotten himself on Nike's radar.
Nike is going to want to ruin Lavar and Lonzo.
What better way to do that then put him in a small market like Phoenix or Sacramento?
(That's not laughter...it's crying...dear god...I don't want Lonzo and I don't want Lavar).
JMac1 wrote:Could someone please tell me what PG Monk couldn't guard because of his size....?
Also, Monk is a shooter who is athletic and can play next to Booker, Lauri is a slow footed C who would kill us on D way more than Monk.
Who here doesn't love shooting?
Monk has good size and athleticism to cover PG's and finish.......dude is 19.
From everything people keep saying here over and over, Monk or Tatum should be the pick, based on their concerns.
I have yet to hear posters say, we need defense only nor offense only, but most are stressing players offensive weaknesses over their defensive weaknesses....so that is what most are looking for.
You guys are trying to create two-way players when there aren't any at this time. So do you want a defender in Jackson or Fox, possible Issac; or scorers like DSJ, Monk, Tatum or Lauri....
Speaking as if player X will resolve his weakness vs player Z is unfounded at this time and really just dissonance because you can't 100 percent sell yourself on a player.
As they are now and the game is going. Jackson, Monk, Fox, and Tatum are good prospects in some capacity.
Btw, I would have drafted Lauri in A heart beat 10 years ago.
First of all do you understand that the Suns had the lowest assist rates of any team in the NBA last year? So what is your answer to this? get a player to play the main distributor position who doesn't pass? If a team isnt passing then it is a game of 1 on 5 and that isnt going be a very successful team. Monk is a natural shooting guard who is undersized at 6'3" who has a hard time guarding players whos after averages 6'6". So your answer is to say that he isnt a shooting guard but a point guard. My problem isnt Monk a point guard; he is a undersized shoot first shooting guard.
What's my answer to the lowest assist number? My answer is get somebody who can make an open shot and convert the pass into an assist....
You can pass all you want, if nobody can make an open shot you won't have assist....what was our three point shooting percent again? What is the most dominant style of basketball today?
And far as Monk guarding 6'6 guys.....you just don't understand you don't have to guard on defense who guards you on offense.......
I know they run this at the end of the workout, so he's probably gassed, but he doesn't seem like he's pushing it very hard. And Gerald Bourguet posted a video of the end and he doesn't seem like he's too worried about how many he gets. Maybe it's just because I'm a runner, but I would be at least pushing those last 20-30 seconds with everything I had left. Although, the record is 28 3/4, and he got 25, so it's not like he was that far off.
“It tells you two things in particular,” he told Doug & Wolf on Arizona Sports 98.7 FM. “The first is what kind of physical condition these guys are in. This is serious. This opportunity usually only comes around once, especially in the draft. If you’re not prepared for this, I think that’s a red flag for us. If you are super-prepared, that’s obviously a good sign. And the second thing, maybe the most important thing, is just see how they fight when things aren’t going well or aren’t going their way.
“Most of the guys handle it pretty well and fight through the adversity and the fatigue. But some guys don’t. Some guys start to go into cruise-mode and shutdown and quit. In my experiences over 13 or 14 drafts now is that’s a very good indicator of what you’re going to get when you select a player. Obviously the guys who don’t fight through it and quit, we tend to stay away from.”
Helps us a ton either way. If Fox is drafted Ball or Jackson falls, if not, we get 5 and 10.....and don't lose the guy we want unless we want Fox.
Exactly. So I look at it like this:
A. The draft goes as expected, Fultz/Ball/Jackson and we can then trade our pick to Sacramento and end up with Tatum or Monk while also getting Collins or Ntilikina.
B. Lakers end up taking Fox over Ball and that leaves us Jackson or Ball.
C. Philly plays the game and trades them the #3 and we still land Jackson.
It's seriously a win-win-the if the story is correct, and I'm guessing it is.
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