The future of the team.

[JDR720]

Got this thread idea from braggins, who posted this in the off-season thread.

I'm having a hard time deciding about how I feel about this teams future. On one hand it feel like our situation is really bleak, but at the same time I feel like if you would have swapped out Belinelli/Hibbert for Brogdon/Biyombo, we would have won 50 games last year.

My thoughts on the teams future is while we have some good players, I dont think we have enough potential to be a legitimate contender in the east. I think we could be a solid 5 seed to a 5th worst team in the east, or worse depending on injuries. I do completely agree with braggins that a few bad moves the past couple years really came back to bite us.

[amcoolio]

I am not optimistic. Unless we can pull of a trade/signing of either Melo, Blake or Steph Curry, I don't see us doing anything next year. Maybe a 1st round exit. So I guess I am kind of in holding mode

[chellis]

Think of it this way guys, Cleveland is the best team in the East, with Boston and Washington lagging behind. Golden State is far superior than any team in the East. We aren't competing for championships for a few years. Best case scenario, build consistency in making the playoffs and trying to reach the second round. Other teams (eg, Boston) have shown you can rebuild and retool while being competitive for a playoff spot.

I personally don't think the franchise can survive a lengthy rebuild and could result in a massive loss of fan support/interest and ultimately the relocation of the franchise. I don't want that.

[LofJ]

I agree with BlackOutBuzz from the offseason thread. The team is set to go all-in the next two seasons. After that though, in the summer of 2019, we could be looking at a full rebuild. Kemba and MKG could both leave that summer and unless we nail a few draft picks before then we could be really bad in the 2019-20 season.

I think we're going to be active this summer on the trade market, it will definitely be interesting to see what we do.

[OmegaAtrocity]

I'll get back to you in July, but right now I think we'll be decent. The outlook can't be that bad until we trade future picks away for something really stupid (which Cho has never done) like Memphis.

[fatlever]

Re-posting my thoughts from the offseason thread

When we talk about the team's future, I think we first need to identify the goal of this team over the next year, 2-3 years 5+ years.

Lets be real. There is absolutely zero combination of moves that can position this team into a championship contender in the next 2 years, maybe even longer. We are miles away from the Cavs and the Cavs are miles away from the Warriors. None of that is going to change in the 2 years, probably even longer from the Warriors perspective.

Our short-term goal simply cannot be competing for a championship. That leaves two short term goals of
1) remain competitive, try to make the playoffs, improve brand, build on fanbase, build culture, accept the goal of advancing to 2nd round by 2018-2019.
2) tear it completely down, build from ground up, realize we have zero chance at finals so start immediately working on a 5+ year plan to compete for finals by 2023, by way of accumulating high draft picks, clearing salary.

I think it all comes down to, as a fan, are you OK with having a short-term goal for this team that does not include competing for a championship? If the answer is yes, then option #1, would probably be the best route for the immediate future of the franchise. If the answer is no, then option #2 is really the only route.

Follow-up question for those seeking option #2 is how long can the city and the fans (forget about the owner) stay engaged in a complete rebuild? Is there a chance that bottoming out for 5 years results in the ultimate relocation of the franchise?

[JDR720]

For #1.

Im not sure simply making the playoffs will improve the brand that much or build on fanbase that much. Atlanta has been a playoff team forever and they haven't really built anything, Memphis too (mentioning them because they are in similar markets/ and similar quality of players). Star players will improve the brand/fanbase way more than just making the playoffs with good role players and Kemba, but we dont have a way to get a star....unless we rebuild.

#2.

I think we will need to do this pretty soon anyway. Nic appears to be regressing athletically, Marvin is old (entering season 11 this year), Kemba is a free agent in a couple years (will he stay on a borderline team?). We dont really have any high upside young players either, while some east teams have several. Will they pass us?

I think these two options are either,

1- Try to build the brand/fanbase/culture now and rebuild later (thus undoing the building of brand/culture/fanbase)
or
2-Rebuild now and build the brand/fanbase/culture later (potentially with a few high upside youngsters)

I get wanting to do option 1, but i think its delaying the inevitable and progress made will be undone short afterwards.

[TheKingofSting]

Blow it up. I don't think we will be relocated unless MJ sells the team but I also don't see Mr. Impatience sticking out a full rebuild.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[JDR720]

^ I do agree that MJ is probably the biggest hindrance for the team due to him not being patient. We cut short the last rebuild a few years too early by signing Al. I think we can trace most of our current problems back to that decision.

We have talked about us being in "win now" mode the past couple seasons since we traded for Nic, but "win now" mode actually started with signing Al, then signing Lance, then trading for Nic to replace Lance and most recently trading for Marco/Plumlee. We have made at least one "win now" move a season for the past several seasons.

[Braggins]

This might not be entirely on topic, but I'm firmly back to wanting to just fire Clifford (like... immediately). I was already in favor of firing him, but I've been a bit apprehensive recently because I don't see a clear good replacement at the moment. Now that the season is over and I've reflected on the situation, I just want to get it over with and move on.

[Braggins]

^ I do agree that MJ is probably the biggest hindrance for the team due to him not being patient. We cut short the last rebuild a few years too early by signing Al. I think we can trace most of our current problems back to that decision.

I totally agree with this. I think its going to be difficult for this franchise to be much more successful than we have been the last few years as long as MJ is running the show. I think being mediocre and making the playoffs sometimes might be about as good as it will get. The only reason we are even good enough now to be considered mediocre is because MJ let go for a couple years and let Cho tank, but I don't see that happening again after all the negative press he got for the last tank.

[Vanderbilt_Grad]

This team is in an interesting spot and it's future is unclear.

Cho's state blueprint a few years ago was "sustainable success" with the idea of keeping most draft picks and getting matching pieces through free agency or trades at the right time. Feels like they've gone a bit more towards "win now" ... probably due to MJ as pointed out ... but it's not like Cho has traded a ton of picks. He's only given up on 22 and a guy who clearly wasn't working out here in Vonleh.

The average age of the team is still reasonably low. Lots of the young guys are signed to reasonable contracts right now.

On the other hand the aggregate of all those contracts is pretty bad, limiting options. The team really lacks star power, with Kemba as the lone bright spot there.

The wildcards are Frank (can he develop into that second star?), MKG (will he ever be more than he was last year - or should the team trade him?), Nic (will a summer working with the staff here pay off in wins next year?), and Marvin (will he bounce back from a somewhat down year?)....

With a little draft or free agent luck and 2-3 of those guys above stepping up next year could be special. Or the team could draft poorly, guys just don't get better and the team ends up in a no-man's land.

IDK.

Personally I like that the team is trying to win more. I'm not excited about the prospect of blowing things up again. I would rather the team continue to make small moves to improve. I would be OK with a trade of MKG, Marvin, or some of the bench guys - for players that make sense in Cliff's system, but I'm not 100% convinced that it's needed yet.

In 4 years, barring trades, this team will have Nic, Zeller, and Plum for sure. Kemba will have been a free agent the year prior - if he's still here he will be getting PAID. Frank will be on his first non-rookie contract. MKG and Marv both have player's options for that year. Odds are that Marv opts in and MKG out. Those 7 guys are the future of the team. We really need to cross our fingers about Plum & Kemba I guess.

[JDR720]

and when i say rebuild, i dont necessarily mean a total blow it up type rebuild.

I would trade Nic, Marvin, Plumlee....basically any older player on long deals for picks/prospects now or during the trade deadline. then I would try to resign Kemba, but if he doesn't want to resign i would trade him too. I would keep Cody, Frank, maybe MKG. Wouldn't even try to trade Marco and Lamb just let them expire, they aren't that expensive and Lamb could still be something.

[Braggins]

We should have done what JDR just said at last seasons trade deadline and tanked out the season. Instead we further mortgaged our cap situation for the next three years to add a 3rd string center (and our coach still thinks we need to add another center) and limited our draft position (to the point where we might whiff on the first two tiers of prospects) in order to make a wild run for the 8th seed.

[Snidely FC]

1) remain competitive, try to make the playoffs, improve brand, build on fanbase, build culture, accept the goal of advancing to 2nd round by 2018-2019.

I'm firmly in Camp #1

[LofJ]

I'm in camp 1 as well. We have two more seasons to see what this team can give us. Then in the summer of 2019 we may have to rebuild if Kemba leaves.

I just hope we can draft a few solid players between now and then and maybe pull off another Batum like trade by trading down in this draft (Derrick Favors please).

[Eoghan]

[TheKingofSting]

Another point I thought of was that we may make a trade or draft Giles and that works out or something but we still won't pass the Cavs, Celtics, or Wizards in the East and it seems like I'm leaving a team out somewhere. Our ceiling is probably a fifth place team in the East and that is far from certain.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Cheeze]

The Hornets will remain a marginally successful franchise as long as they field a roster without a superstar. All contenders have a superstar-level player. Charlotte does not have that player, not even Kemba. They wont take the next step until they find that player.

To get one, you have to be lucky in love or lucky on the dating circuit or you buy one from Russia or somewhere. Buying one is super-expensive (George, Paul, Curry, Lebron) and finding an Isaiah Thomas type that blows up is rare. Best chance is to wait for the right draft opportunity and go get your man.

Otherwise, you're a team pining away for someone else's superstar to take it off the treadmill. That's where the Hornets are.

Charlotte is a franchise with excellent fundamentals for a small market team. They're fiscally sound, not a luxury tax payer, have talent and depth, manage their trades and free agent signings well (all teams have debatable trades, so let's leave Plumlee out of this), have talent and consistency on the coaching staff and a roster that's young and growing. What they don't have is a superstar.

Now...where to get one? In my view, it has to come through the draft. Which player or players in this draft would you consider a potential super-star level player? And if there is a player or two with that potential, what do the Hornets have to do to go get that player?

[powerforward]

I like watching basketball. I get the idea of hope but I watched the tanking years and it is awful. I'm not a championship or bust guy, I would love to build a team that can be a consistent 50 win team, and I think that if we improve our 6-8 guys in the rotation we are close to that.

kemba
batum
mkg
frank
zeller
upgrade from ramon
upgrade from lamb
marvin
marco

I think our best lineup really would be batum at the 3 and a solid guy at the 2 (a lot like we had with c. lee), and I hate the thought of moving on from MKG I would entertain the thought of mkg and 11 to move up a few spots.