Rebuild Slow or Grab a Superstar?

[NuggetsWY]

We've had plenty of talk about getting Butler or George or Milsap or Griffin or ... or ... or ...
But as most of you know, I've been focused on our young players - accumulating as many as possible, with the knowledge that most will never be superstars but with hope that learning together will help build great relationships and a great team with some of them becoming All-Stars or even superstars. I believe that adding one of those superstars does not lift the Nuggets above 3rd or 4th in the west with little chance of winning more than one round in the playoffs (with a very small shot at winning two rounds).

The core of the Warriors will probably hold together for 3 or 4 more years and that is the time when we should be building for IMO. Of course the Nuggets management wants to win now to put seats in the seats - that seems to be their primary focus. However, there are seldom shortcuts to becoming champions - unless you can sign LeBron James along with several veterans.

Luke Walton appears to have the same mindset. https://www.sportsrageous.com/nba/lakers-rumors-coach-luke-walton-opposes-trading-superstar-gsws-reign/72201/

[The Rebel]

1 superstar is a waste of time. Getting a guy like Millsap especially is a waste of time, as he will be declining as the young guys start to reach their potential. Guys like Butler, George, and even Griffin (although I don't want any part of him ever) would be okay if you can convince them to stay for the next couple of years waiting for the young guys to grow.

If the Nuggets are going the superstar route than they have to build a superstar team this summer. There are ways to trade for at least 1 all star type player between now and the draft and still leave enough cap room to sign one this summer, but to pull it off they have to keep the young high ceiling guys on the roster and hope those guys improve greatly this year, otherwise we are back to struggling to even compete with the warriors. As a team with Jokic, George, and Millsap is not going to beat the Warriors without some serious shooters in the backcourt to spread the floor. As crazy as it sounds 2 good all stars and a developing franchise player are just not enough to really be a contender these days.

The only other route is to continue to develop the young guys and build around them, which I know you would prefer, but which I think is the back up option for the team. I would actually prefer they go out and get a guy like Ingles and a young PF like Green, dump some of our veterans for better fits or future picks, and draft another forward, and give it a year to see what you have.

I just believe that the team would prefer to go all in this year, and is going to make a huge mistake like trading Murray or Harris for an all star to sell to the casual fans to get them back to watching the team and buying tickets. It seems they all only want to talk about the playoffs, but forget that the last few years we were in the playoffs there was already a general apathy growing around town. Fans want a team that has a chance to be better than a 1st round team and out, or slightly above average team, but I think the Kroenke's are more concerned with a short term fix, just like at the trade deadline where they reportedly turned down deals that would have helped long term but instead stuck with the basic roster to try to be the 8th seed.

[skywalker33]

I am still of the belief we stay the course with our build, buying a superstar has never worked for us and timing isn't right anyway. This article give a much better understanding of our path given where we are and where the GSW's are

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2017/6/8/15760932/denver-nuggets-the-next-wave-jokic-murray-harris-mudiay-hernangomez-beasley-malone

[U hova]

I'm sort of skeptical about whether the front office can even entice a superstar if they set it as their goal.

[NuggetsWY]

I am still of the belief we stay the course with our build, buying a superstar has never worked for us and timing isn't right anyway. This article give a much better understanding of our path given where we are and where the GSW's are

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2017/6/8/15760932/denver-nuggets-the-next-wave-jokic-murray-harris-mudiay-hernangomez-beasley-malone

Fascinating article; does this mean we should hold our young core together for at least 4 more years and at that time, they'll be at their peak? Fascinating!

[The Rebel]

Dempsey was on Altitude tonight at about 5:45 and was talking about this off-season. Given his job and the station he was on I give him more credibility more now than ever, and for once I like what he had to say. He was almost parroting the article posted by Skywalker, and talking about the Nuggets finding some defensive role players, but let the borderline contenders fight over the bigger names and try to figure out how to catch up with the Warriors.

It also indicates to me guys like our veterans maybe in more demand than some think, as teams like Utah have to add talent or blow up their team and they do not have a ton of money to spend. Meaning good proven role players on older contracts will be in high demand this summer.

[NuggetsWY]

Dempsey was on Altitude tonight at about 5:45 and was talking about this off-season. Given his job and the station he was on I give him more credibility more now than ever, and for once I like what he had to say. He was almost parroting the article posted by Skywalker, and talking about the Nuggets finding some defensive role players, but let the borderline contenders fight over the bigger names and try to figure out how to catch up with the Warriors.

It also indicates to me guys like our veterans maybe in more demand than some think, as teams like Utah have to add talent or blow up their team and they do not have a ton of money to spend. Meaning good proven role players on older contracts will be in high demand this summer.

I heard him on Wednesday on a radio interview and he was focused on the Nuggets' focus on PFs.

[The Rebel]

Dempsey was on Altitude tonight at about 5:45 and was talking about this off-season. Given his job and the station he was on I give him more credibility more now than ever, and for once I like what he had to say. He was almost parroting the article posted by Skywalker, and talking about the Nuggets finding some defensive role players, but let the borderline contenders fight over the bigger names and try to figure out how to catch up with the Warriors.

It also indicates to me guys like our veterans maybe in more demand than some think, as teams like Utah have to add talent or blow up their team and they do not have a ton of money to spend. Meaning good proven role players on older contracts will be in high demand this summer.

I heard him on Wednesday on a radio interview and he was focused on the Nuggets' focus on PFs.

I did not hear him say much about PF other than Leaf, but he was talking up adding young players that can grow together which is a big change.

[Coeur]

Trade for Carmelo

Sign cp3

Resign gallinari and Plumlee.

Put those 4 w jokic, Murray, jauncho, and mudiay. develop them by winning with them playing and they'll be even better off in 4 years with the next team you put around them.

[The Rebel]

Trade for Carmelo

Sign cp3

Resign gallinari and Plumlee.

Put those 4 w jokic, Murray, jauncho, and mudiay. develop them by winning with them playing and they'll be even better off in 4 years with the next team you put around them.

There is not enough cap room to trade for Melo, sign CP3, and resign Gallo without trading Chandler, Arthur, Faried, and Nelson at a minimum, and that team is a terrible fit together. You have 4 guys that need the ball to be effective in the starting lineup.

[NuggetsWY]

Trade for Carmelo

Sign cp3

Resign gallinari and Plumlee.

Put those 4 w jokic, Murray, jauncho, and mudiay. develop them by winning with them playing and they'll be even better off in 4 years with the next team you put around them.

There is not enough cap room to trade for Melo, sign CP3, and resign Gallo without trading Chandler, Arthur, Faried, and Nelson at a minimum, and that team is a terrible fit together. You have 4 guys that need the ball to be effective in the starting lineup.

Well, there is that; plus Carmelo Anthony is undoubtedly not going to waive his no-trade clause to come to Denver and why would CP3 want to leave a perennial top-4 Western Conference contender to join a team likely to finish 4th to 6th at best; at least for a year or two? In addition, to sign Gallinari & Plumlee both plus sign CP3 and trade for Anthony, the Nuggets would have to trade and/or release every player making more than a rookie minimum.

[skywalker33]

Looking at the current state of the NBA, especially the Western Conference and NBA Champion Warriors, we are not going to be winning anytime soon. But we can continue to build towards the time when we CAN compete. Signing a superstar now would add a few wins (in theory) but regardless, there will always be a juggernaut in our way to the NBA Finals, at least for the next 2-4 years.

On the other hand, we have a pretty promising nucleus which can get better and stronger with the right moves. Perhaps even tanking would make this faster (I would love Michael Porter here) but with our lack of attendance that would be like marketing suicide.

The ONLY reason to sign a superstar would be for attendance IMO

[The Rebel]

Looking at the current state of the NBA, especially the Western Conference and NBA Champion Warriors, we are not going to be winning anytime soon. But we can continue to build towards the time when we CAN compete. Signing a superstar now would add a few wins (in theory) but regardless, there will always be a juggernaut in our way to the NBA Finals, at least for the next 2-4 years.

On the other hand, we have a pretty promising nucleus which can get better and stronger with the right moves. Perhaps even tanking would make this faster (I would love Michael Porter here) but with our lack of attendance that would be like marketing suicide.

The ONLY reason to sign a superstar would be for attendance IMO

I agree with you unless they are building a super team there is no point in signing 1 all star, but that team has to be built this year and I don't see them being able to pull it off without giving up Murray or Harris.

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It's not Michael Porter, but you maybe able to get a Porter? if they are going to go for it all and guys want to play with Jokic we may finally start getting some decent choices in free agency this year. I would prefer if we go with young improving players that can be apart of and grow with the team like Porter then with bad fits that are oing to want the ball in their hands every other play.

I will say though that the Nuggets already committed marketing suicide. The constant talk about building around stars like gallo, Chandler, and Faried the last couple of years, and previously Gallo and Nurkic which Nurkic being pushed out has just killed the team with the fan base. With Karl and being able to make the playoffs regardless of the roster fans would buy those guys, without Karl and the mess with Shaw they destroyed the support that they had among many fans. Losing Lawson the way they did was really the final straw with some fans.

Truth is bringing in a bad fit, even if it is a superstar that does not work will only mean a short term bump in ticket sales, people are tired of just missing or making the playoffs and most will see it as a short term move to sell tickets which would just keep their reputation down around town. I think it is much easier to sell a young upstart team built around that is getting better everyday and has a chance to be special and actually wins a few more games. I they bring in a couple of the right players, get rid of a couple of the veterans, and another great young player that would be an easy sale and I can see much of the town starting to pay attention. Even if the team fails, it will not destroy the fan base anymore, as they can just change out pieces in a year or two and as long as Jokic, Harris, and Murray continue to improve the team should as well.

The one thing the Nuggets did well was find some under the radar free agent or players to trade for, with the last one being Barton (unless Plumlee dramatically improves next year). The type that are stuck in roles where even their coaches say they are capable of more but due to the team structure they cannot perform to their best on that team. You know those guys are team guys and willing to do the work that is required of them to make the team better. they can be replaced by their current teams looking for someone to fill that role for cheaper but given a bigger role they are capable. We are a team that needs guys that can do what they have already shown and allow them to carve out a bigger role if they are good enough to demand it.

Look at the jump Harrison Barnes made this season, despite being more of a second scorer than a good primary scorer, he did pretty well in that role overall for his 1st year being allowed to play to his skills. I don't believe he is as good as Porter Jr, but he got a big contract and most Mavs fans are happy with him on that deal.

[Coeur]

Trade for Carmelo

Sign cp3

Resign gallinari and Plumlee.

Put those 4 w jokic, Murray, jauncho, and mudiay. develop them by winning with them playing and they'll be even better off in 4 years with the next team you put around them.

There is not enough cap room to trade for Melo, sign CP3, and resign Gallo without trading Chandler, Arthur, Faried, and Nelson at a minimum, and that team is a terrible fit together. You have 4 guys that need the ball to be effective in the starting lineup.

Well, there is that; plus Carmelo Anthony is undoubtedly not going to waive his no-trade clause to come to Denver and why would CP3 want to leave a perennial top-4 Western Conference contender to join a team likely to finish 4th to 6th at best; at least for a year or two? In addition, to sign Gallinari & Plumlee both plus sign CP3 and trade for Anthony, the Nuggets would have to trade and/or release every player making more than a rookie minimum.

Nugs could be a lot better than the clippers right away w cp3 and Carmelo and gallinari with jokic and Murray. Even mudiay and jauncho are pieces the clippers don't have young guys comparable to.

[The Rebel]

There is not enough cap room to trade for Melo, sign CP3, and resign Gallo without trading Chandler, Arthur, Faried, and Nelson at a minimum, and that team is a terrible fit together. You have 4 guys that need the ball to be effective in the starting lineup.

Well, there is that; plus Carmelo Anthony is undoubtedly not going to waive his no-trade clause to come to Denver and why would CP3 want to leave a perennial top-4 Western Conference contender to join a team likely to finish 4th to 6th at best; at least for a year or two? In addition, to sign Gallinari & Plumlee both plus sign CP3 and trade for Anthony, the Nuggets would have to trade and/or release every player making more than a rookie minimum.

Nugs could be a lot better than the clippers right away w cp3 and Carmelo and gallinari with jokic and Murray. Even mudiay and jauncho are pieces the clippers don't have young guys comparable to.

No they wouldn't, in fact with all that talent I doubt we would be better than we are now. You have 5 guys who all play best with the ball in their hands, and 2 that do not even bother to play defense half the time. Getting every big name you can is a terrible way to build a team, you have to get players that fit well together.

[NuggetsWY]

Well, there is that; plus Carmelo Anthony is undoubtedly not going to waive his no-trade clause to come to Denver and why would CP3 want to leave a perennial top-4 Western Conference contender to join a team likely to finish 4th to 6th at best; at least for a year or two? In addition, to sign Gallinari & Plumlee both plus sign CP3 and trade for Anthony, the Nuggets would have to trade and/or release every player making more than a rookie minimum.

Nugs could be a lot better than the clippers right away w cp3 and Carmelo and gallinari with jokic and Murray. Even mudiay and jauncho are pieces the clippers don't have young guys comparable to.

No they wouldn't, in fact with all that talent I doubt we would be better than we are now. You have 5 guys who all play best with the ball in their hands, and 2 that do not even bother to play defense half the time. Getting every big name you can is a terrible way to build a team, you have to get players that fit well together.

All-Star teams only work during All-star games because no one plays defense and it's just for fun. When superstars get serious, they want the ball in their hands - it's what makes them great.
(((A generalization that is usually true.

[Coeur]

Nugs could be a lot better than the clippers right away w cp3 and Carmelo and gallinari with jokic and Murray. Even mudiay and jauncho are pieces the clippers don't have young guys comparable to.

No they wouldn't, in fact with all that talent I doubt we would be better than we are now. You have 5 guys who all play best with the ball in their hands, and 2 that do not even bother to play defense half the time. Getting every big name you can is a terrible way to build a team, you have to get players that fit well together.

All-Star teams only work during All-star games because no one plays defense and it's just for fun. When superstars get serious, they want the ball in their hands - it's what makes them great.
(((A generalization that is usually true.

i understand that thinking. Just think that the offense with that team would be controlled by cp3 and that with him and jokic it would leave Carmelo and gallinari off of double coverage and able to act quickly. More like Olympic Carmelo. Would assume that would be the most efficient Carmelo. I thought the coach that used him almost the best of any coach was bzdilik. Camby to Carmelo high low was deadly. Jokic to Carmelo would be even more difficult to stop.

[skywalker33]

I am still of the belief we stay the course with our build, buying a superstar has never worked for us and timing isn't right anyway. This article give a much better understanding of our path given where we are and where the GSW's are

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2017/6/8/15760932/denver-nuggets-the-next-wave-jokic-murray-harris-mudiay-hernangomez-beasley-malone

Well, maybe if we can get 2-3 superstars, I may change my tune a little....

[NuggetsWY]

I am still of the belief we stay the course with our build, buying a superstar has never worked for us and timing isn't right anyway. This article give a much better understanding of our path given where we are and where the GSW's are

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2017/6/8/15760932/denver-nuggets-the-next-wave-jokic-murray-harris-mudiay-hernangomez-beasley-malone

Well, maybe if we can get 2-3 superstars, I may change my tune a little....

I've always been accused of being an optimist in general - until the current ownership of the Nuggets.
But give me zero all-stars or three; two won't do it in my mind ((( and I'd still prefer to stay the course, gamble on youth and build for 3-5 years from now.

But I'll grand you this one.

[The Rebel]

Looks like the Celtics are going to build their superteam, I think we can put together a better one if we keep our 3 young stars.