Draft Discussion Part 3

[Zelaznyrules]

^^I can't argue with any of those stats BW but to me they really mean very little. When you ask an international player to start at power forward, and then because of injuries you move him to small forward for a month or so and then back to the power forward position with occasional stops at the center and small forward spots, it's really difficult to peg where he is with various skills. And for a 30 minute per game player who spent probably 75% of his time on the perimeter, 7.2 rebounds is actually a pretty good showing especially considering that Arizona only scored 77 points per game and they held their opponents to 66.

[NTB]

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[NTB]

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[JMac1]

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Philly: Fultz
LAL: Ball
Celtics: Jackson

[bwgood77]

From the Magic board.....

Why Jonathan Isaac?


Right Time Frame - Magic are currently in player development mode. Cavs and Warriors will continue their run for the next 2-3 years at least. By that time Lebron will be 35 years old and there should be room for new powers to emerge in the East. This time will allow Isaac to mold his body and develop his game... and hopefully, he could be the budding star ready to lead the Magic's next run at the top.

Versatility, Rareness and Fit - Isaac's ability to play 3-5 makes him among the short list of players in the NBA who can do it (Lebron, Giannis, Draymond). Out of the gate he will fit best at SF/PF and that combination makes him the ideal fit next to Aaron Gordon. Isaac can be the shooter/slasher at SF and long help defender at PF while Gordon plays closer to the rim on offense and on the perimeter on defense. In terms of finding another player that will fit as well as Isaac next to Gordon, this opportunity might not ever arise again... and certainly not in the same age fitting. It's hard to pass on Isaac for a PG (no matter how good) because PGs come along every year. Meanwhile, if Elfrid is here Isaac helps spread the floor for Elf's drives in the lane and also gives Elf another fluid big man to throw lobs to.

New Age Center - The Magic have always established themselves around an elite Center to propel them to the Finals (Shaq/Dwight). The next time this happens, it could be around a new age center in the mold of Jonathan Isaac. The sky is the limit for Isaac. It's no secret the league is trending towards small ball, but smarter minds know that doesn't mean length is being ignored. Length definitely still matters. The only things restricting the league from full time small ball is the available talent and the precaution of wear and tear. Regular season basketball is long and arduous... and fast paced basketball will wear teams out. But come playoff time, teams utilize every advantage over that short span and small ball often takes center stage. Isaac's versatility at his size and skills would put the Magic ahead of the curve. Make no doubt, as Isaac grows into his man suit, he WILL play some Center in the NBA and in that line up, the team that has him will have a huge advantage in playoff basketball. They will still need traditional Centers who can eat up minutes at C during the regular season. I'm not advising Isaac as a full time C because too much time at C will result in too much wear and tear on his body. But when we need him there, he will give us a huge edge.

That elusive 2 way player - The Magic have been in desperate need of a star player who can pose as both an offensive and defensive threat. Isaac could easily bring that out-of-box and he's still a very raw player. Say what you want about Isaac's tendency for allowing his veteran teammates to take center stage, and doubting his alpha dog make up. Isaac has shown passionate outbursts and stretches where he carried a veteran FSU squad. He's more than a momentum changer. When all is said and done, Isaac could be the guy to legitimize Magic basketball once again.

Health & Intangibles - Isaac comes in with a clean medical record and rap sheet. Zero issues. Nuff said. A Bronx kid who played HS basketball in Florida. He'll be sure to have a built-in support system in Orlando.

His Competition - Even if I believed Fox would develop a consistent shot to his game, he's simply not a rare enough prospect. It's too foolish to believe that a good FT% is a reliable indicator that someone will become a good shooter. This belief was followed when the Hornets selected Michael Kidd-Gilchrist #2 overall. He held a .025 3PT%, but his .075 FT% made folks believe his shot would come around. Today, Fox sports a .025 3PT% and a .074 FT% and folks are saying the same thing. That his defense, intangibles and strong desire to win are enough... Let's not make the mistake that the Hornets made.

Every Tatum fan wants to point to the FSU/Duke game where Tatum supposedly outplayed Isaac. Looking at the stat board, you would assume that. Unless you dove deeper and realized that Isaac picked up a couple of ticky tack fouls early on and was benched. When Isaac did enter the game, he gave Tatum nightmares. Tatum's old man athleticism was no match for the longer and more dynamic Isaac.

I've been high on DSJ for a long time and I'm still a huge fan. I see a Baron Davis, Steve Francis mix and I know he'll be a success in the league. I believe in him fully. So it really is splitting hairs for me when it comes to Isaac vs Smith. In the end, Isaac's upside and rarity is so high that it gives me a bad feeling that if we pass on him that Minnesota will be there to swipe him up. I'm much more fond of the available talent for PG at #25 (or in future drafts), than I am of the comparable options to Isaac at #25 (or in the future).

Our Competition - Speaking of the Wolves, they will be among the new young teams that we will be battling with in the future if health and fortune permit. The Bucks, Sixers, Knicks, Lakers, Suns, and Kings are all stockpiling youth and the Magic need to hit this pick right because there is enough talent in this draft for those teams to be making big additions this summer as well.

No need to overthink this.

[WeekapaugGroove]

Read on Twitter

Philly: Fultz
LAL: Ball
Celtics: Jackson

Yeah I assume boston takes jackson at 3 but it wouldn't shock me if it was tatum or isaac.

Sent from my SM-G930V using RealGM mobile app

[JMac1]

From the Magic board.....

Why Jonathan Isaac?


Right Time Frame - Magic are currently in player development mode. Cavs and Warriors will continue their run for the next 2-3 years at least. By that time Lebron will be 35 years old and there should be room for new powers to emerge in the East. This time will allow Isaac to mold his body and develop his game... and hopefully, he could be the budding star ready to lead the Magic's next run at the top.

Versatility, Rareness and Fit - Isaac's ability to play 3-5 makes him among the short list of players in the NBA who can do it (Lebron, Giannis, Draymond). Out of the gate he will fit best at SF/PF and that combination makes him the ideal fit next to Aaron Gordon. Isaac can be the shooter/slasher at SF and long help defender at PF while Gordon plays closer to the rim on offense and on the perimeter on defense. In terms of finding another player that will fit as well as Isaac next to Gordon, this opportunity might not ever arise again... and certainly not in the same age fitting. It's hard to pass on Isaac for a PG (no matter how good) because PGs come along every year. Meanwhile, if Elfrid is here Isaac helps spread the floor for Elf's drives in the lane and also gives Elf another fluid big man to throw lobs to.

New Age Center - The Magic have always established themselves around an elite Center to propel them to the Finals (Shaq/Dwight). The next time this happens, it could be around a new age center in the mold of Jonathan Isaac. The sky is the limit for Isaac. It's no secret the league is trending towards small ball, but smarter minds know that doesn't mean length is being ignored. Length definitely still matters. The only things restricting the league from full time small ball is the available talent and the precaution of wear and tear. Regular season basketball is long and arduous... and fast paced basketball will wear teams out. But come playoff time, teams utilize every advantage over that short span and small ball often takes center stage. Isaac's versatility at his size and skills would put the Magic ahead of the curve. Make no doubt, as Isaac grows into his man suit, he WILL play some Center in the NBA and in that line up, the team that has him will have a huge advantage in playoff basketball. They will still need traditional Centers who can eat up minutes at C during the regular season. I'm not advising Isaac as a full time C because too much time at C will result in too much wear and tear on his body. But when we need him there, he will give us a huge edge.

That elusive 2 way player - The Magic have been in desperate need of a star player who can pose as both an offensive and defensive threat. Isaac could easily bring that out-of-box and he's still a very raw player. Say what you want about Isaac's tendency for allowing his veteran teammates to take center stage, and doubting his alpha dog make up. Isaac has shown passionate outbursts and stretches where he carried a veteran FSU squad. He's more than a momentum changer. When all is said and done, Isaac could be the guy to legitimize Magic basketball once again.

Health & Intangibles - Isaac comes in with a clean medical record and rap sheet. Zero issues. Nuff said. A Bronx kid who played HS basketball in Florida. He'll be sure to have a built-in support system in Orlando.

His Competition - Even if I believed Fox would develop a consistent shot to his game, he's simply not a rare enough prospect. It's too foolish to believe that a good FT% is a reliable indicator that someone will become a good shooter. This belief was followed when the Hornets selected Michael Kidd-Gilchrist #2 overall. He held a .025 3PT%, but his .075 FT% made folks believe his shot would come around. Today, Fox sports a .025 3PT% and a .074 FT% and folks are saying the same thing. That his defense, intangibles and strong desire to win are enough... Let's not make the mistake that the Hornets made.

Every Tatum fan wants to point to the FSU/Duke game where Tatum supposedly outplayed Isaac. Looking at the stat board, you would assume that. Unless you dove deeper and realized that Isaac picked up a couple of ticky tack fouls early on and was benched. When Isaac did enter the game, he gave Tatum nightmares. Tatum's old man athleticism was no match for the longer and more dynamic Isaac.

I've been high on DSJ for a long time and I'm still a huge fan. I see a Baron Davis, Steve Francis mix and I know he'll be a success in the league. I believe in him fully. So it really is splitting hairs for me when it comes to Isaac vs Smith. In the end, Isaac's upside and rarity is so high that it gives me a bad feeling that if we pass on him that Minnesota will be there to swipe him up. I'm much more fond of the available talent for PG at #25 (or in future drafts), than I am of the comparable options to Isaac at #25 (or in the future).

Our Competition - Speaking of the Wolves, they will be among the new young teams that we will be battling with in the future if health and fortune permit. The Bucks, Sixers, Knicks, Lakers, Suns, and Kings are all stockpiling youth and the Magic need to hit this pick right because there is enough talent in this draft for those teams to be making big additions this summer as well.

No need to overthink this.

Go away BW....Read this yesterday. Very good read that will cause more vacillation; especially the pic.....look at his arms. He looks good right there.

[JMac1]

Read on Twitter

Philly: Fultz
LAL: Ball
Celtics: Jackson

Yeah I assume boston takes jackson at 3 but it wouldn't shock me if it was tatum or isaac.

Sent from my SM-G930V using RealGM mobile app

What if the Lakers take Jackson. Who does Boston want?

[BobbieL]

Read on Twitter

Philly: Fultz
LAL: Ball
Celtics: Jackson

That's what I think too
My first thought was sonuvab**ch!!

damn Colangelo
Suns are going to get hosed again

jeez -- the only way to get Ball or Jackson is to take on Mozgov it seems

And I don't like that so what player between Isaac or Tatum can score the ball. Either of those guys turn in LaMarcus type mid range game to the low post. That's the guy I want.

[itlnsunsfan]

From the Magic board.....

Why Jonathan Isaac?


Right Time Frame - Magic are currently in player development mode. Cavs and Warriors will continue their run for the next 2-3 years at least. By that time Lebron will be 35 years old and there should be room for new powers to emerge in the East. This time will allow Isaac to mold his body and develop his game... and hopefully, he could be the budding star ready to lead the Magic's next run at the top.

Versatility, Rareness and Fit - Isaac's ability to play 3-5 makes him among the short list of players in the NBA who can do it (Lebron, Giannis, Draymond). Out of the gate he will fit best at SF/PF and that combination makes him the ideal fit next to Aaron Gordon. Isaac can be the shooter/slasher at SF and long help defender at PF while Gordon plays closer to the rim on offense and on the perimeter on defense. In terms of finding another player that will fit as well as Isaac next to Gordon, this opportunity might not ever arise again... and certainly not in the same age fitting. It's hard to pass on Isaac for a PG (no matter how good) because PGs come along every year. Meanwhile, if Elfrid is here Isaac helps spread the floor for Elf's drives in the lane and also gives Elf another fluid big man to throw lobs to.

New Age Center - The Magic have always established themselves around an elite Center to propel them to the Finals (Shaq/Dwight). The next time this happens, it could be around a new age center in the mold of Jonathan Isaac. The sky is the limit for Isaac. It's no secret the league is trending towards small ball, but smarter minds know that doesn't mean length is being ignored. Length definitely still matters. The only things restricting the league from full time small ball is the available talent and the precaution of wear and tear. Regular season basketball is long and arduous... and fast paced basketball will wear teams out. But come playoff time, teams utilize every advantage over that short span and small ball often takes center stage. Isaac's versatility at his size and skills would put the Magic ahead of the curve. Make no doubt, as Isaac grows into his man suit, he WILL play some Center in the NBA and in that line up, the team that has him will have a huge advantage in playoff basketball. They will still need traditional Centers who can eat up minutes at C during the regular season. I'm not advising Isaac as a full time C because too much time at C will result in too much wear and tear on his body. But when we need him there, he will give us a huge edge.

That elusive 2 way player - The Magic have been in desperate need of a star player who can pose as both an offensive and defensive threat. Isaac could easily bring that out-of-box and he's still a very raw player. Say what you want about Isaac's tendency for allowing his veteran teammates to take center stage, and doubting his alpha dog make up. Isaac has shown passionate outbursts and stretches where he carried a veteran FSU squad. He's more than a momentum changer. When all is said and done, Isaac could be the guy to legitimize Magic basketball once again.

Health & Intangibles - Isaac comes in with a clean medical record and rap sheet. Zero issues. Nuff said. A Bronx kid who played HS basketball in Florida. He'll be sure to have a built-in support system in Orlando.

His Competition - Even if I believed Fox would develop a consistent shot to his game, he's simply not a rare enough prospect. It's too foolish to believe that a good FT% is a reliable indicator that someone will become a good shooter. This belief was followed when the Hornets selected Michael Kidd-Gilchrist #2 overall. He held a .025 3PT%, but his .075 FT% made folks believe his shot would come around. Today, Fox sports a .025 3PT% and a .074 FT% and folks are saying the same thing. That his defense, intangibles and strong desire to win are enough... Let's not make the mistake that the Hornets made.

Every Tatum fan wants to point to the FSU/Duke game where Tatum supposedly outplayed Isaac. Looking at the stat board, you would assume that. Unless you dove deeper and realized that Isaac picked up a couple of ticky tack fouls early on and was benched. When Isaac did enter the game, he gave Tatum nightmares. Tatum's old man athleticism was no match for the longer and more dynamic Isaac.

I've been high on DSJ for a long time and I'm still a huge fan. I see a Baron Davis, Steve Francis mix and I know he'll be a success in the league. I believe in him fully. So it really is splitting hairs for me when it comes to Isaac vs Smith. In the end, Isaac's upside and rarity is so high that it gives me a bad feeling that if we pass on him that Minnesota will be there to swipe him up. I'm much more fond of the available talent for PG at #25 (or in future drafts), than I am of the comparable options to Isaac at #25 (or in the future).

Our Competition - Speaking of the Wolves, they will be among the new young teams that we will be battling with in the future if health and fortune permit. The Bucks, Sixers, Knicks, Lakers, Suns, and Kings are all stockpiling youth and the Magic need to hit this pick right because there is enough talent in this draft for those teams to be making big additions this summer as well.

No need to overthink this.

The numbers are incorrectly written. For example, a .025 3pt% indicates 25 makes out of 100,000 attempts. Remove the % symbol, and it is still a shortfall, indicating .025 makes out of 1, or 2.5%. The proper numbers would be either .25 3pt shooting, or 25% 3pt shooting percentage. Otherwise, nice piece.

[NTB]

Read on Twitter

[bwgood77]

Spoiler:

From the Magic board.....

Why Jonathan Isaac?


Right Time Frame - Magic are currently in player development mode. Cavs and Warriors will continue their run for the next 2-3 years at least. By that time Lebron will be 35 years old and there should be room for new powers to emerge in the East. This time will allow Isaac to mold his body and develop his game... and hopefully, he could be the budding star ready to lead the Magic's next run at the top.

Versatility, Rareness and Fit - Isaac's ability to play 3-5 makes him among the short list of players in the NBA who can do it (Lebron, Giannis, Draymond). Out of the gate he will fit best at SF/PF and that combination makes him the ideal fit next to Aaron Gordon. Isaac can be the shooter/slasher at SF and long help defender at PF while Gordon plays closer to the rim on offense and on the perimeter on defense. In terms of finding another player that will fit as well as Isaac next to Gordon, this opportunity might not ever arise again... and certainly not in the same age fitting. It's hard to pass on Isaac for a PG (no matter how good) because PGs come along every year. Meanwhile, if Elfrid is here Isaac helps spread the floor for Elf's drives in the lane and also gives Elf another fluid big man to throw lobs to.

New Age Center - The Magic have always established themselves around an elite Center to propel them to the Finals (Shaq/Dwight). The next time this happens, it could be around a new age center in the mold of Jonathan Isaac. The sky is the limit for Isaac. It's no secret the league is trending towards small ball, but smarter minds know that doesn't mean length is being ignored. Length definitely still matters. The only things restricting the league from full time small ball is the available talent and the precaution of wear and tear. Regular season basketball is long and arduous... and fast paced basketball will wear teams out. But come playoff time, teams utilize every advantage over that short span and small ball often takes center stage. Isaac's versatility at his size and skills would put the Magic ahead of the curve. Make no doubt, as Isaac grows into his man suit, he WILL play some Center in the NBA and in that line up, the team that has him will have a huge advantage in playoff basketball. They will still need traditional Centers who can eat up minutes at C during the regular season. I'm not advising Isaac as a full time C because too much time at C will result in too much wear and tear on his body. But when we need him there, he will give us a huge edge.

That elusive 2 way player - The Magic have been in desperate need of a star player who can pose as both an offensive and defensive threat. Isaac could easily bring that out-of-box and he's still a very raw player. Say what you want about Isaac's tendency for allowing his veteran teammates to take center stage, and doubting his alpha dog make up. Isaac has shown passionate outbursts and stretches where he carried a veteran FSU squad. He's more than a momentum changer. When all is said and done, Isaac could be the guy to legitimize Magic basketball once again.

Health & Intangibles - Isaac comes in with a clean medical record and rap sheet. Zero issues. Nuff said. A Bronx kid who played HS basketball in Florida. He'll be sure to have a built-in support system in Orlando.

His Competition - Even if I believed Fox would develop a consistent shot to his game, he's simply not a rare enough prospect. It's too foolish to believe that a good FT% is a reliable indicator that someone will become a good shooter. This belief was followed when the Hornets selected Michael Kidd-Gilchrist #2 overall. He held a .025 3PT%, but his .075 FT% made folks believe his shot would come around. Today, Fox sports a .025 3PT% and a .074 FT% and folks are saying the same thing. That his defense, intangibles and strong desire to win are enough... Let's not make the mistake that the Hornets made.

Every Tatum fan wants to point to the FSU/Duke game where Tatum supposedly outplayed Isaac. Looking at the stat board, you would assume that. Unless you dove deeper and realized that Isaac picked up a couple of ticky tack fouls early on and was benched. When Isaac did enter the game, he gave Tatum nightmares. Tatum's old man athleticism was no match for the longer and more dynamic Isaac.

I've been high on DSJ for a long time and I'm still a huge fan. I see a Baron Davis, Steve Francis mix and I know he'll be a success in the league. I believe in him fully. So it really is splitting hairs for me when it comes to Isaac vs Smith. In the end, Isaac's upside and rarity is so high that it gives me a bad feeling that if we pass on him that Minnesota will be there to swipe him up. I'm much more fond of the available talent for PG at #25 (or in future drafts), than I am of the comparable options to Isaac at #25 (or in the future).

Our Competition - Speaking of the Wolves, they will be among the new young teams that we will be battling with in the future if health and fortune permit. The Bucks, Sixers, Knicks, Lakers, Suns, and Kings are all stockpiling youth and the Magic need to hit this pick right because there is enough talent in this draft for those teams to be making big additions this summer as well.

No need to overthink this.

Go away BW....Read this yesterday. Very good read that will cause more vacillation; especially the pic.....look at his arms. He looks good right there.

Well, we're just talking. I'm pretty sure it's between Isaac and Tatum for the FO, unless Jackson were to slip, which would really surprise me. The fact that Isaac won't work out with any teams after 4 and that they dined with him and worked him out twice. Then of course we worked out Tatum twice as well.

If Ball slips it might be interesting. I wonder if Ball slipped all the way to 5 if the Kings would still take Fox.

[King4Day]

Well unless we really want Ball or Jackson, I guess we'll end up settling for Tatum, Isaac, or Fox. Maybe we can convince the Kings we're taking Fox and they'll bite. Otherwise nothing to see here

[BobbieL]

Spoiler:

From the Magic board.....

Go away BW....Read this yesterday. Very good read that will cause more vacillation; especially the pic.....look at his arms. He looks good right there.

Well, we're just talking. I'm pretty sure it's between Isaac and Tatum for the FO, unless Jackson were to slip, which would really surprise me. The fact that Isaac won't work out with any teams after 4 and that they dined with him and worked him out twice. Then of course we worked out Tatum twice as well.

If Ball slips it might be interesting. I wonder if Ball slipped all the way to 5 if the Kings would still take Fox.

Do the Celtics need Ball?

So, Sixers go Fultz - which makes sense as they probably want to sign Lowry for PG

Jackson goes to the Lakers than - or do they take Ball

But if JJ goes to Lakers - do the Celtics need Ball ? I have no idea what the Celtics need but it might be a 4 - is that Tatum or Isaac to pair with Jaylen Brown?

[JMac1]

Spoiler:

From the Magic board.....

Go away BW....Read this yesterday. Very good read that will cause more vacillation; especially the pic.....look at his arms. He looks good right there.

Well, we're just talking. I'm pretty sure it's between Isaac and Tatum for the FO, unless Jackson were to slip, which would really surprise me. The fact that Isaac won't work out with any teams after 4 and that they dined with him and worked him out twice. Then of course we worked out Tatum twice as well.

If Ball slips it might be interesting. I wonder if Ball slipped all the way to 5 if the Kings would still take Fox.

That's the draft story right there. Fultz, Ball, and Jackson will be gone, I believe that 100 percent. The only thing in doubt is who will be picking the player and who goes first between Ball and Jackson.

If Isaac can't play the 3, it has to be Tatum. I am 70 percent positive that is who we are drafting.

[Saberestar]

Read on Twitter

That doesn't change anything for us IMO. Philly goes Fultz, Lakers Ball and Ainge drafts Jackson.

Hopefully Ainge goes after a different player...Isaac has worked out for them, and DSJ has a workout too.

[ATTL]

Can't we get in on this trade for the first pick?

[RunSunRun]

Man, I have a feeling something crazy is going to happen on draft day. Why does Philly want Fultz so badly...giving up on the Simmons PG experiment before it even begins? Boston, is it about assets, do they think Fultz isn't as good as advertised, or do they feel Jackson is #1 but feel he'll fall to #3?

Biggest question mark, if this trade happens, is what the Lakers end up doing.

Do they screw Boston and take Jackson at #2? Does Boston take Ball or go with Tatum/Isaac? Soooo many questions and scenarios.

Man, this draft is more exciting than the regular season, hahaha.

/insert heavy breathing cat picture here

[Saberestar]

Can't we get in on this trade for the first pick?

I would love it.

[JMac1]

Spoiler:

Go away BW....Read this yesterday. Very good read that will cause more vacillation; especially the pic.....look at his arms. He looks good right there.

Well, we're just talking. I'm pretty sure it's between Isaac and Tatum for the FO, unless Jackson were to slip, which would really surprise me. The fact that Isaac won't work out with any teams after 4 and that they dined with him and worked him out twice. Then of course we worked out Tatum twice as well.

If Ball slips it might be interesting. I wonder if Ball slipped all the way to 5 if the Kings would still take Fox.

Do the Celtics need Ball?

So, Sixers go Fultz - which makes sense as they probably want to sign Lowry for PG

Jackson goes to the Lakers than - or do they take Ball

But if JJ goes to Lakers - do the Celtics need Ball ? I have no idea what the Celtics need but it might be a 4 - is that Tatum or Isaac to pair with Jaylen Brown?

Boston needs Ball more than Tatum.....I guess. They do need scoring....so maybe they go Tatum. Definitely not Isaac.