Official: Jimmy Butler, #16 to Minnesota for Lavine, Dunn, #7 - merged/Justin Patton injured

[kyrv]

Sorry for being redundant, but 72 pages is a lot of pages.

It seems clear to me that Bulls' management, and I strongly suspect this included both the Reinsdorfs, asked themselves the question, "after this season, do you see us wanting to offer Butler the 'super-max' extension?" I further strongly suspect that the consensus was along the lines of NFW.

I really don't blame them. While you can make a statistical case for Butler being a true superstar, as a long-time Bulls' fan, this mantle never really seemed to fit Jimmy.

If you're considering moving Butler, why wouldn't you be in the Russell sweepstakes? I'd have to think swapping Wade and their 2nd round pick for Deng and Russell beats Lopez and the 27th pick.

OK.

That post made no sense. And Wade and the 2nd pick wouldn't net you a used cookie.

[kyrv]

Oh so now we know the answer - they did this just to screw Butler out of 29 mil with that DPE.
No wonder his trainer is pissed.

I bet they wish his agent was BJ Armstrong...

They can spin it any way they want but I'd blame the players association for setting up a scenario where GarPax has a way to screw JB out of 30 mil because they were def gonna tale that oppertunity if it was there.

I think they hope this makes Wade want to eat $$$ to get out.
I'd rather see him dog it and collect his full 24 mil now.....

So is it your position that:

1) Butler was 100% going to stay?

2) And that you can build a title around Butler at the supermax?

#1 is of course false, #2 not likely.

[GRADEN]

David Griffin anyone?

I mean clearly garpax time is equal to or less than 1 year from today so maybe he would come in and be able to shape things better. Clearly he has a good relationship with the most influential player in the league whom last I checked is a FA in exactly 1 year....

[Hangtime84]

IDK but Kaplan said that Thibs didn't want to include Lavine. He was trying to even absorb Rondo to save the Bulls money but Bulls said that Lavine had to be in deal to happen. Thibs gave his counter which was 16 and no Rondo.

Anyone that was thinking Brooklyn two picks are going to be disappointed but I spent a whole damn year trying to chill the expectations. What fans/media and actual NBA GMs thought as being fair was totally different. Last year they didn't get offered a top 4 pick and the the same this year.

I get people are upset and will never sway someone but the Bulls indeed took the best offer that was made for Jimmy.

Thanks Ralph. You did tell us that Boston may not be keen on giving up a Top 3 pick for Butler, especially on a deep draft. A lot of us wish we've gotten more, but I guess that's just reality. Jimmy may not be coveted as much as we thought.

By the way, did the Bulls ask for Wiggins, or did they prefer LaVine all along?

It's funny but back in Feb I gave the poster hangtime a PM with the rundown which he must of remembered because pm me last night saying spot on as the trade happen exactly as what that pm said to him....

Yes they asked for Wiggins

This totally did happen

[AirP.]

If you're considering moving Butler, why wouldn't you be in the Russell sweepstakes? I'd have to think swapping Wade and their 2nd round pick for Deng and Russell beats Lopez and the 27th pick.

OK.

That post made no sense. And Wade and the 2nd pick wouldn't net you a used cookie.

LA is trying to cut salary to be able to sign 2 max free agents next year. It's not that they liked Brook Lopez, it's that he's in the last year of his contract. The price Brooklyn was looking for Brook was just a 1st round pick last year, he's basically just an expiring contract this year.

So.... trading Wade's expiring contract next year for the more expensive bad contact(Deng) would have been a much better move for LA. Both Mozgov and Deng are signed for 3 more years, Mozgov at 16/17 million and Deng at 18/19 million.

I'd rather have Wade and Mozgov instead of Lopez and Deng, especially when it saves them 2 million more next summer.

If you're going to trade Butler, you got to get all the young assets you can take.

[mack2354]

How does our Front Office not get fired now? The perception around the league is that they fired a top coach in the league who just proved that he is also better as a GM than they are. Let that sink in.

[HomoSapien]

Question: Has a team trading the perceived "superstar" ever also included a first round pick in the deal?

Butler is not a superstar and he's going to decline really fast and in a few years be a worse player than Lavine who is the rising all-star claiber talent. Thibs is going to play Butler 40min per game and soon he will get his injuries which is good for the Bulls since they traded away injury prone player. And keep thinking over the 16th pick, it seemed garbage anyway since the quality of draft prospects for this year drops after #10.

All-NBA player. That's a superstar. If you wont call him that, then call him a top 15 player and ask yourself the same question. Justifying a bad trade based on the quality of the draft (and most people thought it was pretty deep draft) isn't a good reason for getting raped on a trade.

[TheSuzerain]

We should still take on Deng for future picks.

[Benedict Miller]

How does our Front Office not get fired now? The perception around the league is that they fired a top coach in the league who just proved that he is also better as a GM than they are. Let that sink in.

The Reinsdorfs are the biggest problem. It starts at the very top.

[bad knees]

How does our Front Office not get fired now? The perception around the league is that they fired a top coach in the league who just proved that he is also better as a GM than they are. Let that sink in.

When the Bulls fired Thibs, GarPax thought they were handing Fred a championship contending roster. Now two years later, we are in the lower basement of the league. Please, please fire GarPax and hire Hinkie to manage this tank correctly.

[kyrv]

David Griffin anyone?

I mean clearly garpax time is equal to or less than 1 year from today so maybe he would come in and be able to shape things better. Clearly he has a good relationship with the most influential player in the league whom last I checked is a FA in exactly 1 year....

How is it clear they have one year or less? Because you typed it? They have lifetime contracts.

[HomoSapien]

Question: Has a team trading the perceived "superstar" ever also included a first round pick in the deal?

IDK but Kaplan said that Thibs didn't want to include Lavine. He was trying to even absorb Rondo to save the Bulls money but Bulls said that Lavine had to be in deal to happen. Thibs gave his counter which was 16 and no Rondo.

Anyone that was thinking Brooklyn two picks are going to be disappointed but I spent a whole damn year trying to chill the expectations. What fans/media and actual NBA GMs thought as being fair was totally different. Last year they didn't get offered a top 4 pick and the the same this year.

I get people are upset and will never sway someone but the Bulls indeed took the best offer that was made for Jimmy.

Obviously we'll never know for sure, but I'm having trouble believing that Thibs was willing to walk away from the Butler trade over the 16th pick. LaVine is injured, Dunn had a poor rookie season, and they didn't have a top 3 pick. I just fail to see where their leverage is.

I think Thibs knew that Gar has a history of adding additional picks if he wants to make a trade bad enough and took advantage of that weakness.

[kyrv]

How does our Front Office not get fired now? The perception around the league is that they fired a top coach in the league who just proved that he is also better as a GM than they are. Let that sink in.

The Reinsdorfs are the biggest problem. It starts at the very top.

I do find it odd that people think a different FO is going to suddenly get a blank check. Not to mention, the Reinsdorfs will be picking said person.

[TheSuzerain]

Thibs probably also knew they were foolishly infatuated with Dunn. He was still our coach during that evaluation period.

[TheGOATRises007]

This FO is obsessed with awful point guards.

1st Grant. Then Payne. Now Dunn.

Wonder who's next?

[kyrv]

OK.

That post made no sense. And Wade and the 2nd pick wouldn't net you a used cookie.

LA is trying to cut salary to be able to sign 2 max free agents next year. It's not that they liked Brook Lopez, it's that he's in the last year of his contract. The price Brooklyn was looking for Brook was just a 1st round pick last year, he's basically just an expiring contract this year.

So.... trading Wade's expiring contract next year for the more expensive bad contact(Deng) would have been a much better move for LA. Both Mozgov and Deng are signed for 3 more years, Mozgov at 16/17 million and Deng at 18/19 million.

I'd rather have Wade and Mozgov instead of Lopez and Deng, especially when it saves them 2 million more next summer.

If you're going to trade Butler, you got to get all the young assets you can take.

Not really. They already have more than enough young players. The idea is to get incredibly lucky for a generational talent.

I am surprised you think they need more point guards.

This stuff of just making something up and then being mad it didn't happen is bizarre.

[My2CentsR]

ACL's aren't nearly the concern that they used to be. I'm a Lakers fan but I absolutely love Lavine. It's obvious that he works hard at his craft and I think he can be an all-star in this league.

Are you trolling? We've put up with four years of a young MVP Rose never getting back to form after an ACL injury. First year being traded to the Knicks, and he's still dealing with injuries. Between the two teams, you'd think they have a few good doctors that would fix him up if they could.

Now we lose a multi-year allstar and top 5 two way players in the league for a question mark with poorer stats to begin with? No thanks.

[kyrv]

Question: Has a team trading the perceived "superstar" ever also included a first round pick in the deal?

IDK but Kaplan said that Thibs didn't want to include Lavine. He was trying to even absorb Rondo to save the Bulls money but Bulls said that Lavine had to be in deal to happen. Thibs gave his counter which was 16 and no Rondo.

Anyone that was thinking Brooklyn two picks are going to be disappointed but I spent a whole damn year trying to chill the expectations. What fans/media and actual NBA GMs thought as being fair was totally different. Last year they didn't get offered a top 4 pick and the the same this year.

I get people are upset and will never sway someone but the Bulls indeed took the best offer that was made for Jimmy.

Obviously we'll never know for sure, but I'm having trouble believing that Thibs was willing to walk away from the Butler trade over the 16th pick. LaVine is injured, Dunn had a poor rookie season, and they didn't have a top 3 pick. I just fail to see where their leverage is.

I think Thibs knew that Gar has a history of adding additional picks if he wants to make a trade bad enough and took advantage of that weakness.

Pax confirmed what Ralph said. That was the deal.

And by FAR the best offer.

Also the 2nd rounder, nobody offered any future pick.

[kyrv]

This FO is obsessed with awful point guards.

1st Grant. Then Payne. Now Dunn.

Wonder who's next?

Well they dodged the Russell sweepstakes bullet.

[Lauri_Legend]

This FO is obsessed with awful point guards.

1st Grant. Then Payne. Now Dunn.

Wonder who's next?

Well they dodged the Russell sweepstakes bullet.

They could've done the exact same trade with the Lakers but replace Wade with Brook Lopez. We get a young talent in return. Lakers get their expiring contract...