official Melo trade speculation - thread 2

[reub]

"WS48: An estimate on the number of wins contributed by a player per 48 minutes (league average is approximately .100)"

Basketball Reference

[Greenie]

Melo had a WS48 of 0.86 last season, well below an average player. For comparison, Kevin Love's WS48 was 1.63, meaning he contributed almost twice as much to his team than Melo did.

The team sucked.

We don't need advanced stats to tell us this.

But you obviously do.

When Love was with Minny he had a WS48 of .245 in his last season (on a team that sucked). Melo's highest WS48 ever was .184 and last season it was a pitiful .089, less than an average player.

Kyle needs Love money.

[Greenie]

Here we go with these advanced stats again.

[drekwins]

KT put it best

If PJax got fired tmrw and the next GM literally did nothing, he would of done a better job than PJax.

- no bad contracts handed out
- no trading for bad contracts
- we still get another lottery pick

If PJax is rebuilding he'll accomplish #3 without needing to do 1&2.

Let's see if he does it

do you really believe a GM hired would be allowed to do "nothing"? He probably would have ever more of a threat to win and make the playoffs to Dolan after Phil. So that means future 1st round picks would def be on the table.

Sometimes the best move is no move.

Greenie,

Why do you want us to keep Melo? I'm curious as to what your vision is for the Knicks this upcoming year. What do you want their goal to be? Also, which moves (or lack of) do you want to see us make this off-season to support that goal? Using your plan, what would you like our projected starting lineup and rotation to look like entering the season? I'm just curious because I'm trying to understand what the end game is for Melo here AND the Knicks.

[dakomish23]

KT put it best

If PJax got fired tmrw and the next GM literally did nothing, he would of done a better job than PJax.

- no bad contracts handed out
- no trading for bad contracts
- we still get another lottery pick

If PJax is rebuilding he'll accomplish #3 without needing to do 1&2.

Let's see if he does it

do you really believe a GM hired would be allowed to do "nothing"? He probably would have ever more of a threat to win and make the playoffs to Dolan after Phil. So that means future 1st round picks would def be on the table.

It would be called keeping our flexibility while letting the youth develop while getting another top 10 pick.

Sign me up for that all day

[mpharris36]

KT put it best

If PJax got fired tmrw and the next GM literally did nothing, he would of done a better job than PJax.

- no bad contracts handed out
- no trading for bad contracts
- we still get another lottery pick

If PJax is rebuilding he'll accomplish #3 without needing to do 1&2.

Let's see if he does it

do you really believe a GM hired would be allowed to do "nothing"? He probably would have ever more of a threat to win and make the playoffs to Dolan after Phil. So that means future 1st round picks would def be on the table.

It would be called keeping our flexibility while letting the youth develop while getting another top 10 pick.

Sign me up for that all day

I know what its called and I understand the logic. Whether or not the owner would allow that to happen is another thing. You do realize you still report to Dolan right...doing nothing usually doesn't fly.

[Sark]

its hilarious in a way , according to phil melo is the reason the knicks suck
despite the fact the knicks are 2-16 in the games melo has missed the last 2 seasons

as someone already said melo is a scapegoat to cover up for phil's mistakes

mistakes like giving melo a NTC so carmelo would take less than the max to give the knicks more cap space after the 2nd year of his contract ...

cap space is good , using that cap space to sign aaron afflalo , not so good

melo being schrewd negotiated a trade kicker to give him back the money if he were to ever allow a trade, but until he allows it he is a knick and the only to get rid of him with out his permission is to cut him and pay him every red cent he is owed .

Melo had a WS48 of 0.86 last season, well below an average player. For comparison, Kevin Love's WS48 was 1.63, meaning he contributed almost twice as much to his team than Melo did.

according to that stat kyle o'quinn(1.51) is almost as good as kevin love(1.63) and if we went by that stat kyle was by far the knicks best player

Kyle was insanely productive last year. That's why he actually has value. Great contract too.

[F N 11]

If Phil is fired and the next gm goes win now mode y'all going to be sick.

[MadGrinch]

Melo had a WS48 of 0.86 last season, well below an average player. For comparison, Kevin Love's WS48 was 1.63, meaning he contributed almost twice as much to his team than Melo did.

The team sucked.

We don't need advanced stats to tell us this.

But you obviously do.

When Love was with Minny he had a WS48 of .245 in his last season (on a team that sucked). Melo's highest WS48 ever was .184 and last season it was a pitiful .089, less than an average player.

win scores are nice but in the end you have to win

if his win score translated into wins , it would matter , but as it is love has never been on a team that won more than 40 games unless lebron was on the roster alongside him

something carmelo was able to do in each of his 1st 10 seasons

[N Y K]

Buying out melo would be phil's biggest failure ever imo

[mpharris36]

If Phil is fired and the next gm goes win now mode y'all going to be sick.

and I've seen that mills or houston will probably replace him. And you know they don't have the spine to stand up to Dolan. So if he gets involved you know building through the draft stops here.

[Sark]

The team sucked.

We don't need advanced stats to tell us this.

But you obviously do.

When Love was with Minny he had a WS48 of .245 in his last season (on a team that sucked). Melo's highest WS48 ever was .184 and last season it was a pitiful .089, less than an average player.

win scores are nice but in the end you have to win

if his win score translated into wins , it would matter , but as it is love has never been on a team that won more than 40 games unless lebron was on the roster alongside him

something carmelo was able to do in each of his 1st 10 seasons

Teammates matter too. Isn't that why Melo could make the playoffs his first 10 years but miss them the last 4?

[seren]

Let's all agree that Melo has been a huge disappointment as a Knick. He could never lead this team in a meaningful way. He is essentially one of the best second fiddle players ever.

Sent from my XT1575 using RealGM mobile app

[dakomish23]

do you really believe a GM hired would be allowed to do "nothing"? He probably would have ever more of a threat to win and make the playoffs to Dolan after Phil. So that means future 1st round picks would def be on the table.

It would be called keeping our flexibility while letting the youth develop while getting another top 10 pick.

Sign me up for that all day

I know what its called and I understand the logic. Whether or not the owner would allow that to happen is another thing. You do realize you still report to Dolan right...doing nothing usually doesn't fly.

I think even Dolan would understand that doing bad things is worse than doing nothing at all.

Would you be against that?

A new FO head gets hired and commits to the long term view by refusing to do bad trades just to dump players and refuses to sign over the hill aging locker room presence vets looking for a final pay day, to larger deals for a sight but useless improvement. All while developing the kids as you head to another top 10 pick.

I think the fan base would give a standing ovation in unison.

[Sark]

Buying out melo would be phil's biggest failure ever imo

Phil's tenure will be defined by how KP, Willy, and Frank turn out. The Melo years will be a footnote of Knicks history. If the kids end up great, then his legacy is great. If they all bust, then his legacy goes down the drain here.

[MP4LIFE]

It would be called keeping our flexibility while letting the youth develop while getting another top 10 pick.

Sign me up for that all day

I know what its called and I understand the logic. Whether or not the owner would allow that to happen is another thing. You do realize you still report to Dolan right...doing nothing usually doesn't fly.

I think even Dolan would understand that doing bad things is worse than doing nothing at all.

Would you be against that?

A new FO head gets hired and commits to the long term view by refusing to do bad trades just to dump players and refuses to sign over the hill aging locker room presence vets looking for a final pay day, to larger deals for a sight but useless improvement. All while developing the kids as you head to another top 10 pick.

I think the fan base would give a standing ovation in unison.

Have you been watching the Knicks over the last 17 years? They've done the exact opposite of that under Dolan. Why would that change now?

[DOT]

It would be called keeping our flexibility while letting the youth develop while getting another top 10 pick.

Sign me up for that all day

I know what its called and I understand the logic. Whether or not the owner would allow that to happen is another thing. You do realize you still report to Dolan right...doing nothing usually doesn't fly.

I think even Dolan would understand that doing bad things is worse than doing nothing at all.

Would you be against that?

A new FO head gets hired and commits to the long term view by refusing to do bad trades just to dump players and refuses to sign over the hill aging locker room presence vets looking for a final pay day, to larger deals for a sight but useless improvement. All while developing the kids as you head to another top 10 pick.

I think the fan base would give a standing ovation in unison.

All Dolan cares about is how much tickets and merch he sells

As long as KP is as big a product as we all hope, Dolan should stay out of it

[dakomish23]

I know what its called and I understand the logic. Whether or not the owner would allow that to happen is another thing. You do realize you still report to Dolan right...doing nothing usually doesn't fly.

I think even Dolan would understand that doing bad things is worse than doing nothing at all.

Would you be against that?

A new FO head gets hired and commits to the long term view by refusing to do bad trades just to dump players and refuses to sign over the hill aging locker room presence vets looking for a final pay day, to larger deals for a sight but useless improvement. All while developing the kids as you head to another top 10 pick.

I think the fan base would give a standing ovation in unison.

Have you been watching the Knicks over the last 17 years? They've done the exact opposite of that under Dolan. Why would that change now?

Didn't seem to mind when Walsh kept the powder dry for a few years as we collected top 10 picks.

[bigtimeRC3]

Nets fan here.

We would take Melo off your hands with an unprotected 1st rounder attached for next year. Hell, we will even give you expiring Trevor Booker in return.
Melo gets to stay close to home atleast.

thats a good deal

[MadGrinch]

When Love was with Minny he had a WS48 of .245 in his last season (on a team that sucked). Melo's highest WS48 ever was .184 and last season it was a pitiful .089, less than an average player.

win scores are nice but in the end you have to win

if his win score translated into wins , it would matter , but as it is love has never been on a team that won more than 40 games unless lebron was on the roster alongside him

something carmelo was able to do in each of his 1st 10 seasons

Teammates matter too. Isn't that why Melo could make the playoffs his first 10 years but miss them the last 4?

last year's team was easily talented enough to make the playoffs and before jackson enforced the triangle they were over .500 and well on their way .

love is not the level of player that should be the focus of a playoff team

if you go by ws48 david lee is a better player than carmelo

advanced stats have their merits but when used without context they are meaningless