2017 Nets Offseason Thread II

[Keith Van Horn]

Someone talk me into KCP. its looking more and more like a big offer is coming from us and looks like 50/50 or better detroit would not match.

The only 2 things that really give me any kind of optimism is the large volume on which he shot 35% from three (6 per game) and his age.

im having a real tough time justifying a max to someone who is a downgrade offensively to kilpatrick or Bogdanovic. It just seems like paying an insane premium for a 3 and D guy who isnt geat on either end and statistically closer to poor then great on offense

I'm tell yah, there's room to be optimistic if we get him. He's got a ton of room to grow, I really don't think he's a finished product. His volume is going to go through the roof here too. Remember he showed those #s you presented yesterday playing in Detroit, which I think was tied for #22 in terms of pace of offense in the league last year. Definitely will see an increase in production.

And while Levert will go to the bench probably, I'm thinking long term.

-Lin and Russ get to work together for 2 years in the backcourt. This will help groom Russ's game.
-KCP will help take some of the defensive burden off these guys (which was a major issue with our team, and with Russell he'll help)
-in 2 years, we can start Russell/KCP/Levert. I think these 3 would have a ton of room to grow together and play off each other's strengths

We need to start making our brand somehow. We might always have cap space, and can always wait for salary dumps, but if I'm marks I want to start making Brooklyn big and bold. If we miss Porter, I won't be pissed at KCP. We have the ability to take a risk now on a guy like him and I wouldn't mind giving it a shot. Maybe we can sent something like 20-23m/year to him and see what Detroit does. We have the ability to be fluid now, especially with how dominant the Cavs and Warriors have been.

[Paradise]

Someone talk me into KCP. its looking more and more like a big offer is coming from us and looks like 50/50 or better detroit would not match.

The only 2 things that really give me any kind of optimism is the large volume on which he shot 35% from three (6 per game) and his age.

im having a real tough time justifying a max to someone who is a downgrade offensively to kilpatrick or Bogdanovic. It just seems like paying an insane premium for a 3 and D guy who isnt geat on either end and statistically closer to poor then great on offense

Piston fans think he's the only player who gives a **** when he's on the court. Let's get him away from a cancer like Reggie Jackson (remember Billy King wanting to give him the keys? Oh god) and put him in a system with similar minded players and watch him excel. Above all things, he has the mindset to improve. That's a good sign when making a max investment

He received an All-Defensive Team vote.



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[Prokorov]

I'm tell yah, there's room to be optimistic if we get him. He's got a ton of room to grow, I really don't think he's a finished product. His volume is going to go through the roof here too. Remember he showed those #s you presented yesterday playing in Detroit, which I think was tied for #22 in terms of pace of offense in the league last year. Definitely will see an increase in production.

is extra volume on poor efficiency/shooting % a good thing? typically no.

he REALLY needs to get better from inside 20 feet. he shouldnt be such a poor finisher/scorer in the paint/at the rim and he doesnt get to the FT line at all. if those things improve, i think he can be a solid player. but he has a long way to go.

Detoit pretty much not developing any of their young guys the last 5 years is really the only optomism im holding on to.

but betting 25 million a year that detroit sucks that bad with young talent... not sure i want that gambe

[Ror1997]

Someone talk me into KCP. its looking more and more like a big offer is coming from us and looks like 50/50 or better detroit would not match.

The only 2 things that really give me any kind of optimism is the large volume on which he shot 35% from three (6 per game) and his age.

im having a real tough time justifying a max to someone who is a downgrade offensively to kilpatrick or Bogdanovic. It just seems like paying an insane premium for a 3 and D guy who isnt geat on either end and statistically closer to poor then great on offense

Piston fans think he's the only player who gives a **** when he's on the court. Let's get him away from a cancer like Reggie Jackson (remember Billy King wanting to give him the keys? Oh god) and put him in a system with similar minded players and watch him excel. Above all things, he has the mindset to improve. That's a good sign when making a max investment

yeah i like his makeup as a person/worker. but you need more then that if we are talking a 100 million dollar investment. i am encouraged that detroits development staff seems terrible since drummond and harris havent improved much there. morriss either.

but i mean, what seperates his skill/production/potential from snell or ross?

2 years younger than Snell, 3 than Ross. Plus, I haven't been shy about saying KJ is KCP with no jumper. The reason KCP is a 100 mil investment and those guys aren't, is because KCP will give you 30 mpg of a 2 way player, who's still only 23.

[Ror1997]

Someone talk me into KCP. its looking more and more like a big offer is coming from us and looks like 50/50 or better detroit would not match.

The only 2 things that really give me any kind of optimism is the large volume on which he shot 35% from three (6 per game) and his age.

im having a real tough time justifying a max to someone who is a downgrade offensively to kilpatrick or Bogdanovic. It just seems like paying an insane premium for a 3 and D guy who isnt geat on either end and statistically closer to poor then great on offense

Piston fans think he's the only player who gives a **** when he's on the court. Let's get him away from a cancer like Reggie Jackson (remember Billy King wanting to give him the keys? Oh god) and put him in a system with similar minded players and watch him excel. Above all things, he has the mindset to improve. That's a good sign when making a max investment

He received an All-Defensive Team vote.



Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Yeah the main reason I want him is to pair him on the wing with LeVert. Wreck havoc on the passing lanes, and get tons of fast break opportunities.

[Prokorov]

Piston fans think he's the only player who gives a **** when he's on the court. Let's get him away from a cancer like Reggie Jackson (remember Billy King wanting to give him the keys? Oh god) and put him in a system with similar minded players and watch him excel. Above all things, he has the mindset to improve. That's a good sign when making a max investment

He received an All-Defensive Team vote.



Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Yeah the main reason I want him is to pair him on the wing with LeVert. Wreck havoc on the passing lanes, and get tons of fast break opportunities.

He certainly fits our pace... i can see alot of easy buckets with Lin/KCP/Levert on the floor who all get alot of steals in the passing lanes and get out in transition.

[Paradise]

Piston fans think he's the only player who gives a **** when he's on the court. Let's get him away from a cancer like Reggie Jackson (remember Billy King wanting to give him the keys? Oh god) and put him in a system with similar minded players and watch him excel. Above all things, he has the mindset to improve. That's a good sign when making a max investment

He received an All-Defensive Team vote.



Sent from my iPhone using RealGM mobile app

Yeah the main reason I want him is to pair him on the wing with LeVert. Wreck havoc on the passing lanes, and get tons of fast break opportunities.

Trevor Ariza never shot 40% from three until age 28 paired with John Wall. His best shooting season after was 37% from three with Harden.


Ariza at 23 - 8.9 Pts, 4.3 Rebs, 1.8 Asts, 1.7 Stls, 31.9% 3pt. 15.4 PER / 54.4 TS% (Lakers)

His numbers weren't blowing anybody away but Ariza still remained the prototype for a 3-D wing.

KCP plays like a shorter version of him. I suspect Atkinson sees some similarities between him and Carroll as well. Another guy who was a poor efficiency player that turned himself into a 3 & D player.

If the Nets think KCP has more of a willingness to improve than Porter or Hardaway Jr. I'm signing him regardless of what the raw numbers state because it's a guarantee he will look different in a faster pace and with multiple willing passers around him regardless.

Reggie Jackson - 5.5 Asts / 30.3 Ast% / 26.6 USG%
Ish Smith - 5.2 Asts / 32.2 Ast% / 20.5 USG%

Jeremy Lin - 5.1 Asts / 35.5 Ast% / 26.6 USG%

[Born_Ready]

I'm not against bringing KCP in, I just wanted him to get a look if the Otto Porter door had been closed.

My wishlist in order:
Porter
KCP
Redick
Shabazz Muhammad

I figured if the Nets could come a way with one of these players it would be a successful acquisition to the roster.

I'm not crazy in love with the contract to get KCP from Detroit, but the possibility of him playing with Lin/Russell does have me licking my chops a little.

[Paradise]

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Hmm...


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[Ror1997]

He received an All-Defensive Team vote.



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Yeah the main reason I want him is to pair him on the wing with LeVert. Wreck havoc on the passing lanes, and get tons of fast break opportunities.

He certainly fits our pace... i can see alot of easy buckets with Lin/KCP/Levert on the floor who all get alot of steals in the passing lanes and get out in transition.

Easy buckets, easy 3's and an improved role in the offense? Would 16/6/3 on 38% from 3 be farfetched ? That's better than Bojan from last year, and he'did be doing it as a 24 year old, not a 27 year old.

[Paradise]

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[Prokorov]

Yeah the main reason I want him is to pair him on the wing with LeVert. Wreck havoc on the passing lanes, and get tons of fast break opportunities.

He certainly fits our pace... i can see alot of easy buckets with Lin/KCP/Levert on the floor who all get alot of steals in the passing lanes and get out in transition.

Easy buckets, easy 3's and an improved role in the offense? Would 16/6/3 on 38% from 3 be farfetched ? That's better than Bojan from last year, and he'did be doing it as a 24 year old, not a 27 year old.

i dont think thats far fetched at all.... although its hard to really see how the points shake out...

Lin could score 15+ ppg
Russell could score 15-20 ppg
Levert is capable of 12-15 ppg
RHJ is capable of 10-12 ppg
KCP is capable of 15+ ppg

Harris, Skil, whitehead, goodwin could all give you 5+ ppg. skil can give you 10-15 ppg

booker/acy/allen/mozgov can all give you 5-10 ppg.

i think its going to be really inconsistent on who gives you scoring besides lin and russell who should both be good for 15 a game every night. i can see caris with 22 points games and 5 point games. RHJ with 18 points then 4 points... etc...

over the course of 82 hard to say what it averages out to

[Prokorov]

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i would have loved chandler but with mozgov here not sure it makes sense and im sure someone will take chandler for free or a second to where we wouldnt get much asset wise taking him on.

beyond that, they dont have many vets

dudley/barbosa are nice but they wont pay to dump solid players on solid contracts without many years left

knight is the only guy... he doesnt fit here at all, and maybe they give an asset but i doubt its a good asset.

[Keith Van Horn]

I'm tell yah, there's room to be optimistic if we get him. He's got a ton of room to grow, I really don't think he's a finished product. His volume is going to go through the roof here too. Remember he showed those #s you presented yesterday playing in Detroit, which I think was tied for #22 in terms of pace of offense in the league last year. Definitely will see an increase in production.

is extra volume on poor efficiency/shooting % a good thing? typically no.

he REALLY needs to get better from inside 20 feet. he shouldnt be such a poor finisher/scorer in the paint/at the rim and he doesnt get to the FT line at all. if those things improve, i think he can be a solid player. but he has a long way to go.

Detoit pretty much not developing any of their young guys the last 5 years is really the only optomism im holding on to.

but betting 25 million a year that detroit sucks that bad with young talent... not sure i want that gambe

I'm mobile right now so I can't check easily, busy didn't Harrison Barnes see slight dip in his % but increase his ppg by 8 or 9 points? If he shots 37-40% from 3 and gets 18 ppg while providing great defense, while being still so young, that'd be perfect for us.


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[Ror1997]

Cavs still wanna dump Shump, but need a new trade partner. Maybe take on shump, then try to send him to a contender for a pick at the deaeline?

[Papi_swav]

I'm not going to lie, those videos did KCP some justice for me, we don't have a defender on this team that can do the things he does. He shined against the games biggest stars. I wouldn't put too much thought in his bad advanced defensive stats, Detroit is just a bad team and he pretty much was the only one that cared on that team says Detroit fans. We have a bunch of guards so I think somebody might have to go, but I'm a little more open to signing KCP now honestly, I think our coaching crew can develop him. He can shoot off the dribble and around screens which alot of guys can't do efficiently. I'm on the fence with him now but leaning towards the no side.

[MrDollarBills]

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The cost for dumping their boated contracts better come with a pick. no dice otherwise.

[Prokorov]

[
I'm mobile right now so I can't check easily, busy didn't Harrison Barnes see slight dip in his % but increase his ppg by 8 or 9 points? If he shots 37-40% from 3 and gets 18 ppg while providing great defense, while being still so young, that'd be perfect for us.

Harrison Barnes is the poster boy of why i DONT want to max porter or KCP.

you give a role guy the max and give him big volume and he might get some raw numbers but if your top option is a role player you are going to be terrible. case in point dallas was terrible.

Barnes posted 19.5 points 5.1 rebounds and 1.5 assists and his percentages dropped drastically across the board with the added volume:

three point%: dipped from 40.5 to 35.1
FG%: dipped from 48.2 to 46.6
TS% dropped from 57.3 to 54.1

He took an extra 5.2 shots per game and only scored and additional 5.9 points.

this is typically what happens when you throw a ton of extra volume at a role player. their raw stats might look better but everything else takes a dip...

Now, dont get me wrong. 19.5 points on 54TS% and 35% from three isnt bad. thats pretty solid. but when your top 2 option is scoring on averagish efficiency you wont be very good on offense or overall. which they werent.

I dont think barnes is a 5th wheel... i think he can be the #3 guy on a good playoff team. but i dont think he is a max guy or a 1-2 option on a good team. and if you pay him the max he has to be a top 2 option unless you can luck into a rookie star.

we dont really have the draft picks to hope a rookie bails us out from a max contract to a role player

[TheBrooklynKidd]

What about Carroll and OG for Skill and the Pacers 2nd (likely 30-35 next draft)? If they don't want Skill they can have Harris or Goodwin. If they wanna take on better players then they can have Booker plus any of the minimum guys.

The fact that OG dropped to us in the draft and we still passed on him will never not heart my brain. I'd love for them to get him in a trade, but they never should've passed on him to begin with.

I disagree. Jarrett Allen was a better prospect before the college season started and remains the better prospect even without considering OG injuries.

It's much harder to find centers that are long, mobile, great shot blockers and versatile on offense like Allen than it is to find lanky forwards that struggle to shoot.

OG was overrated all year because everyone said he had a 7'6 wingspan which turned out to be complete BS.

We're truly blessed that Allen dropped to us, he had no business being there at #22.

[Prokorov]

I'm not going to lie, those videos did KCP some justice for me, we don't have a defender on this team that can do the things he does. He shined against the games biggest stars. I wouldn't put too much thought in his bad advanced defensive stats, Detroit is just a bad team and he pretty much was the only one that cared on that team says Detroit fans. We have a bunch of guards so I think somebody might have to go, but I'm a little more open to signing KCP now honestly, I think our coaching crew can develop him. He can shoot off the dribble and around screens which alot of guys can't do efficiently. I'm on the fence with him now but leaning towards the no side.

Yeah... detroit being a mess and not developing drummond/harris/morris certainly helps the mvoe for KCP for me where i can twist myself into not hating it... but like you still a no on the move.

he literally hasnt improved anything he struggled with or grown on any of the things he had potential for. thats not good look for the pistons on a guy who seems like a hard worker