We need shooting. Who do we get?

[jmoy]

Miles would be my top target if we can dump Aldrich's salary. I guess Afflalo would be my second choice. Then re-sign Casspi as the fourth wing. Dunleavy is just too old. He's only played 700-800 minutes each the last two seasons. We need more than that as the third guy and Casspi brings more to the table as the fourth guy.

I look at Dunleavy at getting only 500 minutes. He is insurance when someone gets injured and also is a professional who can play after sitting for 5 games straight. I would want him on the vet minnimum and be be the 5th wing. If the Wolves went with vets and signed say Casspi and Afflalo, you add one a rookie/young wing that plays in the G league and comes up when needed. I am ok with having multiple vets off the bench as Thibs doesn't use it much and that would allow them to play less and hopefully better.
The thing I and none of us really know is personality fit and what Thibs is really looking for in his bench. I prefer bench guys that have a special skill set they are good at and just not be horrible at others while having starters that can do it all(like Butler) so I don't mind Dunleavy type guys.

[minimus]

Our situation with shooting is getting weird. Possible ways to improve our shooting:

1) sign veteran FA shooter for minimum, for instance, Rush, Casspi
2) sign undrafted shooter from SL, for instance, Beachem, Cooke
3) develop our young players, KAT, Jones, Wiggins

To make our team work in the offense we need to use all these three ways to improve. I hope Thibs can make it.

[AirP.]

We are about $6 mil under the cap.
We have the room exception.
We can get vet min guys for insurance.
And we can trade Cole Aldrich.

Even if Cole Aldrich was injured and couldn't play at all, you shouldn't trade him with the OKC 1st. $9 mil for a protected first rounder is well worth it. MIN could stretch him, and get $5 mil in cap space, maybe more if he takes a lower buyout, and keep the pick.

More then likely Thibs will add a vet minimum point guard that can shoot 3s, that's the one spot on the roster he always got great production out of at a vet minimum salary. So that will be some more shooting off the bench.

I agree, and it's an attractive job Not only will the Wolves be winning, but he may feel he can outcompete Tyus Jones for minutes here. I could see Shelvin Mack come here to play defense, Norris Cole or Ronnie Price come back. But we'd only offer the minimum. Swingman is where we would devote our remaining assets.

I'm thinking someone like A.Brooks. Normally at vet min PG you get trash or older small PGs who can still score(but not defend much because of their height and some loss of quickness. 2nd teams for Thibs seems to be tough defensive teams and some small PG who can score. John Lucus III, Nate Robinson, DJ Augustine and A.Brooks all seemed to play big roles no vet minimums for Chicago under Thibs.

[AirP.]

Our situation with shooting is getting weird. Possible ways to improve our shooting:

1) sign veteran FA shooter for minimum, for instance, Rush, Casspi
2) sign undrafted shooter from SL, for instance, Beachem, Cooke
3) develop our young players, KAT, Jones, Wiggins

To make our team work in the offense we need to use all these three ways to improve. I hope Thibs can make it.

I guess I don't get this shooting situation, no deadeye shooters but you have 4 starters who are good but not great 3pt shooters and 2 currently rotation players(T.Jones and Bjelica) who can shoot 3s ok. At anytime Minnesota can run out Teague, Butler, Wiggins, Bjelica and Towns and have 3pt shooting at every single position WITH solid defense.

[shrink]

We are about $6 mil under the cap.

I have us closer to $2.2M.

Are you counting:
J. Butler trade kicker? $.92M
K. Martin dead money? $1.36M
J. Patton cap hold? $2.24M
Roster cap holds? $1.63M

The difference is probably two things.

First, we don't know the specifics of the new free agent contracts of Taj and Teague, just the overall dollars. If you factor in raises, the initial year is lower, the final year is higher. You can the projected numbers with raises from sportrac. We'll have to wait until July 6, and probably much longer, to know for sure

Second, you are including roster holds here, and I was talking about "space under the cap." Including Patton (who I just assume is a salary under the new CBA rule change), I have us at $4.39 in cap space, but add in three roster holds for $1.63 and you get to $6 mil under the cap.

I'm not sure if I am explaining that well.. "cap space" and "space under the cap" sound way too similar.

[Krapinsky]

Our situation with shooting is getting weird. Possible ways to improve our shooting:

1) sign veteran FA shooter for minimum, for instance, Rush, Casspi
2) sign undrafted shooter from SL, for instance, Beachem, Cooke
3) develop our young players, KAT, Jones, Wiggins

To make our team work in the offense we need to use all these three ways to improve. I hope Thibs can make it.

I guess I don't get this shooting situation, no deadeye shooters but you have 4 starters who are good but not great 3pt shooters and 2 currently rotation players(T.Jones and Bjelica) who can shoot 3s ok. At anytime Minnesota can run out Teague, Butler, Wiggins, Bjelica and Towns and have 3pt shooting at every single position WITH solid defense.

I'm not quite there. Butler is obviously an upgrade. But Teague, Wiggins, and Towns are still subpar defenders.

[AirP.]

Our situation with shooting is getting weird. Possible ways to improve our shooting:

1) sign veteran FA shooter for minimum, for instance, Rush, Casspi
2) sign undrafted shooter from SL, for instance, Beachem, Cooke
3) develop our young players, KAT, Jones, Wiggins

To make our team work in the offense we need to use all these three ways to improve. I hope Thibs can make it.

I guess I don't get this shooting situation, no deadeye shooters but you have 4 starters who are good but not great 3pt shooters and 2 currently rotation players(T.Jones and Bjelica) who can shoot 3s ok. At anytime Minnesota can run out Teague, Butler, Wiggins, Bjelica and Towns and have 3pt shooting at every single position WITH solid defense.

I'm not quite there. Butler is obviously an upgrade. But Teague, Wiggins, and Towns are still subpar defenders.

Well, we'll see, Butler can defend the #1 option wing, something Minnesota didn't have last year. Teague isn't that bad of a defender although he dipped in his only year in Indiana, having a good defensive coach could fix that, but no, he won't be the defender Rubio was. I also expect Wiggins and Towns to be better defensively this year with vets on the court to help them understand how to play NBA defense.

[TheProdigy]

We are about $6 mil under the cap.

I have us closer to $2.2M.

Are you counting:
J. Butler trade kicker? $.92M
K. Martin dead money? $1.36M
J. Patton cap hold? $2.24M
Roster cap holds? $1.63M

The difference is probably two things.

First, we don't know the specifics of the new free agent contracts of Taj and Teague, just the overall dollars. If you factor in raises, the initial year is lower, the final year is higher. You can the projected numbers with raises from sportrac. We'll have to wait until July 6, and probably much longer, to know for sure

Second, you are including roster holds here, and I was talking about "space under the cap." Including Patton (who I just assume is a salary under the new CBA rule change), I have us at $4.39 in cap space, but add in three roster holds for $1.63 and you get to $6 mil under the cap.

I'm not sure if I am explaining that well.. "cap space" and "space under the cap" sound way too similar.

Alright so assuming we stretch Aldrich's contract to get $5 million in additional cap space, then we would have $9.39 in total cap space. Is that enough to get CJ Miles? 4 years / $36 million seems low given some of the absurd contracts so far.

[Krapinsky]

We are about $6 mil under the cap.

I have us closer to $2.2M.

Are you counting:
J. Butler trade kicker? $.92M
K. Martin dead money? $1.36M
J. Patton cap hold? $2.24M
Roster cap holds? $1.63M

The difference is probably two things.

First, we don't know the specifics of the new free agent contracts of Taj and Teague, just the overall dollars. If you factor in raises, the initial year is lower, the final year is higher. You can the projected numbers with raises from sportrac. We'll have to wait until July 6, and probably much longer, to know for sure

Second, you are including roster holds here, and I was talking about "space under the cap." Including Patton (who I just assume is a salary under the new CBA rule change), I have us at $4.39 in cap space, but add in three roster holds for $1.63 and you get to $6 mil under the cap.

I'm not sure if I am explaining that well.. "cap space" and "space under the cap" sound way too similar.

Got it. So then we're not that far apart. Still about $2M.

One minor thing of ntoe. The Sportrac numbers look like they are using 8% raises with Teague's contract, but I believe 5% is the maximum allowed on his deal.

[shrink]

Alright so assuming we stretch Aldrich's contract to get $5 million in additional cap space, then we would have $9.39 in total cap space. Is that enough to get CJ Miles? 4 years / $36 million seems low given some of the absurd contracts so far.

C.J. Miles is my favorite as well, but I don't think it's how you play the game.

Look at it this way. There is a giant pot full of free agents, and the cream rises to the top. There are a group of thirsty teams, with money in their pockets. At the beginning of free agency, the thirstiest rush to the pot, and they want the cream. There are only a limited number of truly good starters, and teams rush to get them, to have an advantage over their opponents. Thibs rushes, because he has two starter spots to fill. The owners give out bigger contracts to lock these players up.

Very soon though, the thirstiest owners have spent their money, and those that haven't are sitting under a shady tree, feeling content and full. Unlike last year where every owner had lots of money thanks to the cap spike, only a handful still have money, and those that do are often saving for next year's pot. Unfortunately for the players, about two thirds of the guys still wanting NBA jobs are still in the pot, and owners aren't rich or thirsty. For these non-starters and end of bench guys, they must quickly find jobs, and probably for less than they expected. The dividing line between the talented who get paid, and everyone else, puts a lot more people in the "everyone else" category this year. This means bargains for owners that can find the players that can contribute, if they get off the star-economies.

So as we approach the end of significant money, is C.J. Miles talented enough to end up on the right side of that dividing line? I'm not sure he is. I would not be disappointed to see him on our team for that number, even as a bench player, because he would get minutes even from Thibs. We might even have to pay this much anyway to get him to consider a 2-year deal, which we could start above the non-taxpayer MLE that other teams may be able to offer. However, it might be wiser to wait a few days and see who else gets signed. Risky, but the contract could be substantially less.

[shrink]

Got it. So then we're not that far apart. Still about $2M.

One minor thing of note. The Sportrac numbers look like they are using 8% raises with Teague's contract, but I believe 5% is the maximum allowed on his deal.

That has to be right, since we aren't his original team.

I am not surprised. I discussed with Worm Guts elsewhere that I don't fully trust Sportrac. Maybe they improved, but last year when I thought about switching over, they had qualifying offers confused with cap holds. I used their numbers because someone in another thread brought them up, so I plugged them in my spreadsheet because they had raises. I probably should have looked to see if they got the raises right. Thanks.

[Calinks]

At this point we may wind up signing a couple of summer league/free agency guys who will be sitting around after all the real deals are made.

[SBM]

I have said it so many times. Dunleavy, Thabo, Afflalo, Anthony Tolliver, Jeff Green, vets such are what you feel team out with. Note that Tolliver, Dunleavy and Afflalo were bought out, meaning they already got paid, you simply add there salary to what they were already paid out.

[guille_4]

You're going to pay 7 mil this year for a player at the end of the bench that Thibs doesn't trust? Waste of space

Then trade him somewhere that can use him. We shouldn't have to attach a 1st to dump a contract that is a reasonable contract to begin with.

It's not a big contract but he was pretty terrible last season.

Thibs only gave him 8.6 minutes per game, and no one has ever given him over 16 minutes per game in 7 seasons.

That's pretty bad for a player making 14M over the next 2 seasons.

We may not need to attach a 1st but probably a 2nd, unless we want to take back a similar value contract that's a better fit (a wing player).

[Loyal[]Wolf]

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[SO_MONEY]

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No thanks.

[_AIJ_]

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No thanks.

Hes a shooter so he is fine. We need **** on this team.

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[Jammer]

I don't know where several posters calculations lead them to believe that the Wolves have a dollar of cap space. This has been analyzed ad nauseum in other threads, so we shouldn't have to keep pointing out the errors in the calculations of those who think that there is anything left. Teague and Gibson got it all. And no rights to Casspi or Rush.
Just veteran minimum or Room MLE are all that is left.

[Slim Tubby]

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No thanks.

Hes a shooter so he is fine. We need **** on this team.

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I can't stand the guy but we do need shooting. I'd prefer to target Lou Williams instead.

[Loyal[]Wolf]

Yeah, I don't think we can pick and choose too much. But, this is who we would get.

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