Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIII

[DANNYLANDOVER]

Muscala signed for peanuts smh

[payitforward]

So...a 1st round pick to dump Nicholson. Niiiice.

That's our Ernie. Mr. Dragsail.

2011 R1 pick (#6) -- player out of the league in 2 years
2011 R1 pick (#18) -- player out of the league in 2 years
2011 high R2 pick -- player waived
2012 R1 pick -- Brad Beal
2012 high R2 pick -- pick Tomas Satoransky who stays 4 years in Europe then is below average (meanwhile, Draymond Green, Jae Crowder, Khris Middleton, Will Barton all went elsewhere)
2012 R2 pick (#49) -- thrown in as part of Okariza trade (meanwhile Kyle O'Quinn becomes very solid rotation NBA Center)
2013 R1 pick -- Otto Porter
2013 high R2 pick -- player out of league in 2 years
2014 R1 pick -- traded for 1-year player rental
2014 R2 pick -- sold for cash
2015 R 1 pick -- Kelly Oubre
2015 R2 pick -- given away in trade for player with team for 1 year (Miller: this is from memory)
2016 R1 pick -- traded for below average PF
2016 R2 pick -- traded to move up in 2015 R1 to get Oubre
2017 R1 pick -- traded for zip
2017 R2 pick -- traded for Tim Frazier

Quite a haul, huh?

edit: You want to really be depressed? Take a look at 2011 alone vs. the Spurs:

Wizards @ #6: Jan Vesely
Spurs @ #15: Kawhi Leonard

Wizards @ #18: Chris Singleton
Spurs @ #29: Cory Joseph

Wizards @ #34: Shelvin Mack
Spurs @ #49: Davis Bertans

[deneem4]

Bye bye Bogs

Read on Twitter

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Good. Maybe he will find someone who will pay him $16M per year, but I was starting to think he would just end up taking the QO.
Edit: So he did find a team to pay him $10.5M per.

That's not a bad price we could've matched that and actually had a tradeable asset

[deneem4]

Muscala signed for peanuts smh

Tyreke Evans signed for nothin

[JWizmentality]

So...a 1st round pick to dump Nicholson. Niiiice.

That's our Ernie. Mr. Dragsail.

2011 R1 pick (#6) -- player out of the league in 2 years
2011 R1 pick (#18) -- player out of the league in 2 years
2011 high R2 pick -- player waived
2012 R1 pick -- Brad Beal
2012 high R2 pick -- pick Tomas Satoransky who stays 4 years in Europe then is below average (meanwhile, Draymond Green, Jae Crowder, Khris Middleton, Will Barton all went elsewhere)
2012 R2 pick (#49) -- thrown in as part of Okariza trade (meanwhile Kyle O'Quinn becomes very solid rotation NBA Center)
2013 R1 pick -- Otto Porter
2013 high R2 pick -- player out of league in 2 years
2014 R1 pick -- traded for 1-year player rental
2014 R2 pick -- sold for cash
2015 R 1 pick -- Kelly Oubre
2015 R2 pick -- given away in trade for player with team for 1 year (Miller: this is from memory)
2016 R1 pick -- traded for below average PF
2016 R2 pick -- traded to move up in 2015 R1 to get Oubre
2017 R1 pick -- traded for zip
2017 R2 pick -- traded for Tim Frazier

Quite a haul, huh?

edit: You want to really be depressed? Take a look at 2011 alone vs. the Spurs:

Wizards @ #6: Jan Vesely
Spurs @ #15: Kawhi Leonard

Wizards @ #18: Chris Singleton
Spurs @ #29: Cory Joseph

Wizards @ #34: Shelvin Mack
Spurs @ #49: Davis Bertans

I want to cry.

[keynote]

Just think of where we were on July 1, 2016.

We had the exact same starting five then as we have now + Oubre -- but we also had max cap room and our 2017 pick. The moonshot plan was to upgrade the starting five; the backup plan was to field a professional bench (combo guard who can score/distribute, backup PF/C who can defend mobile 4/5s, specialists).

If EG had just had an average offseason -- not inspired, but not horrendous -- we'd have likely made it to the EC Finals (granted, we might've been a higher seed and faced the Cavs earlier in the bracket. But still).

Instead, EG managed to to bungle that cap room so *thoroughly* that he had to light that innocent 2017 pick on fire just 8 months later. And, here we are, July 7, 2017, with the same starting five + Oubre, only with no max cap room, no pick, a negative asset in Mahinmi, and an *extremely* iffy bench. We still need a combo guard who can score and distribute, and we (likely) still need a big who can defend mobile 4s and 5s.

Man, it takes a special kind of skill to turn a promising situation into a sad one so quickly.

[Mojo Amok]

Just think of where we were on July 1, 2016.

We had the exact same starting five then as we have now + Oubre -- but we also had max cap room and our 2017 pick. The moonshot plan was to upgrade the starting five; the backup plan was to field a professional bench (combo guard who can score/distribute, backup PF/C who can defend mobile 4/5s, specialists).

If EG had just had an average offseason -- not inspired, but not horrendous -- we'd have likely made it to the EC Finals (granted, we might've been a higher seed and faced the Cavs earlier in the bracket. But still).

Instead, EG managed to to bungle that cap room so *thoroughly* that he had to light that innocent 2017 pick on fire just 8 months later. And, here we are, July 7, 2017, with the same starting five + Oubre, only with no max cap room, no pick, a negative asset in Mahinmi, and an *extremely* iffy bench. We still need a combo guard who can score and distribute, and we (likely) still need a big who can defend mobile 4s and 5s.

Man, it takes a special kind of skill to turn a promising situation into a sad one so quickly.

To me the problem was really more about spending significant money in that particular offseason to begin with - it was the exact worst moment in NBA history to have lots of cap space with the expectation that it would be spent unless you happened to land either Durant or Horford. Due to a highly unusual supply and demand situation related to that revenue boost, the longer term contracts for substantial money doled out then were generally bad or terrible overspends by most all participants. And now of course the cap is looking like it's going to be more or less stagnant through the next couple years, making almost all the longterm deals signed that summer even worse.

While there might be an alternative universe out there where the Wizards were saved from themselves with Horford coming to Washington, there generally just were not a lot of good outcomes for a team that had built up the expectations with their franchise player and the fans that they were going to spend big money. They almost all shot themselves in the foot with negative signings, some of which were outright catastrophic (Parsons, Noah, Dieng, Crabbe, Turner, Mozgov, etc.)

Even Ad-Hoc usage of the MLE or just retaining guys like Ariza or Booker in the 2014 or 2015 timeframe would have ultimately ended up being a much higher percentage play than 2016. You could just about draw the names of modest and available free agents from a hat in those years and be guaranteed to do better (never even minding great deals like Millsap signing for 2 years @ $19 million, for example). And of course, trades in that earlier timeframe for rotation players that came along that would cut into the 2016 max slot plan were back-burnered as well.

The whole ordeal going back a few years really deserves a Seconds From Disaster episode.

[payitforward]

...Even Ad-Hoc usage of the MLE or just retaining guys like Ariza or Booker in the 2014 or 2015 timeframe would have ultimately ended up being a much higher percentage play than 2016. You could just about draw the names of modest and available free agents from a hat in those years and be guaranteed to do better (never even minding great deals like Millsap signing for 2 years @ $19 million, for example). And of course, trades in that earlier timeframe for rotation players that came along that would cut into the 2016 max slot plan were back-burnered as well.

The whole ordeal going back a few years really deserves a Seconds From Disaster episode.

Very good points!

But, you'll notice, even last Summer there were teams that made good deals rather than bad ones for FAs. SA, for example, w/ Dedmon.

Good GMs didn't fall into the trap; bad ones like Ernie, otoh....

[Mojo Amok]

...Even Ad-Hoc usage of the MLE or just retaining guys like Ariza or Booker in the 2014 or 2015 timeframe would have ultimately ended up being a much higher percentage play than 2016. You could just about draw the names of modest and available free agents from a hat in those years and be guaranteed to do better (never even minding great deals like Millsap signing for 2 years @ $19 million, for example). And of course, trades in that earlier timeframe for rotation players that came along that would cut into the 2016 max slot plan were back-burnered as well.

The whole ordeal going back a few years really deserves a Seconds From Disaster episode.

Very good points!

But, you'll notice, even last Summer there were teams that made good deals rather than bad ones for FAs. SA, for example, w/ Dedmon.

Good GMs didn't fall into the trap; bad ones like Ernie, otoh....

Yeah, I was referring to the larger chunks of cap space and the expectation management with the "our cap plan...." type deal where a team let's it be known that they're in on cap space for difference makers, especially to season ticket holders and Wall. I'm wondering if not spending money was even an option just for PR purposes with how they had positioned themselves.

There will always be guys who fall through the cracks, though they often are gotten on one or two year show-me contracts (for example, Dedmon is a free agent as we speak). But, that's really a different experience and doesn't require actual cap space.

[NatP4]

We were so close to horford though. That would've been huge.

Wall Sato
Beal Mac
Oubre OG Anunoby (2017 1st)
Porter Keef
Horford Gortat


Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhh this team forsure makes the NBA finals

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

So, forgive my ignorance here, but even if we match Otto, we still could take on some salary (like a Crowder dump) if Uncle T was willing to pay the tax, right?

[NatP4]

So, forgive my ignorance here, but even if we match Otto, we still could take on some salary (like a Crowder dump) if Uncle T was willing to pay the tax, right?

No because we didn't pick up a TPE in a Bojan sign and trade. Can't make uneven trades like a pick for Crowder. Plus even if we did, those cheap idiots wouldn't pay money to be compete

[Tricky_Kid]

Can the Wiz affort to sign J.Crawford? I am scared they want do it but dunno if the can?

[DCZards]

We were so close to horford though. That would've been huge.

Wall Sato
Beal Mac
Oubre OG Anunoby (2017 1st)
Porter Keef
Horford Gortat


Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhh this team forsure makes the NBA finals

You're kidding, right?

[truwizfan4evr]

wizards need to sign free agent Willie Reed he's a under rated player. He could be a good player for us.

[NatP4]

We were so close to horford though. That would've been huge.

Wall Sato
Beal Mac
Oubre OG Anunoby (2017 1st)
Porter Keef
Horford Gortat


Ughhhhhhhhhhhhhhh this team forsure makes the NBA finals

You're kidding, right?

Replacing the Mahinmi/Jennings/Bojan/Smith with Al Horford and the top wing defender in the draft we atleast beat Boston (they wouldn't have horford) and probably beat Cleveland also. Horford averaged 14-7-5 that would've been huge for us.

[NatP4]

wizards need to sign free agent Willie Reed he's a under rated player. He could be a good player for us.

100% agree but we aren't signing anyone else and Reed is on the market because he priced himself out of Miami's range

[dangermouse]

If Porter is like "yeah screw it" and goes to BKN, surely Grunners gets the boot right? I mean he's well beyond due the boot at this point, but after such a disaster the owner would have to or we'd burn down the Verizon center am i right?

[Benjammin]

If Porter is like "yeah screw it" and goes to BKN, surely Grunners gets the boot right? I mean he's well beyond due the boot at this point, but after such a disaster the owner would have to or we'd burn down the Verizon center am i right?

Those who fail to pay attention to history are doomed to repeat it.

Sent from my XT1650 using RealGM mobile app

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

So...a 1st round pick to dump Nicholson. Niiiice.

That's our Ernie. Mr. Dragsail.

2011 R1 pick (#6) -- player out of the league in 2 years
2011 R1 pick (#18) -- player out of the league in 2 years
2011 high R2 pick -- player waived
2012 R1 pick -- Brad Beal
2012 high R2 pick -- pick Tomas Satoransky who stays 4 years in Europe then is below average (meanwhile, Draymond Green, Jae Crowder, Khris Middleton, Will Barton all went elsewhere)
2012 R2 pick (#49) -- thrown in as part of Okariza trade (meanwhile Kyle O'Quinn becomes very solid rotation NBA Center)
2013 R1 pick -- Otto Porter
2013 high R2 pick -- player out of league in 2 years
2014 R1 pick -- traded for 1-year player rental
2014 R2 pick -- sold for cash
2015 R 1 pick -- Kelly Oubre
2015 R2 pick -- given away in trade for player with team for 1 year (Miller: this is from memory)
2016 R1 pick -- traded for below average PF
2016 R2 pick -- traded to move up in 2015 R1 to get Oubre
2017 R1 pick -- traded for zip
2017 R2 pick -- traded for Tim Frazier

Quite a haul, huh?

edit: You want to really be depressed? Take a look at 2011 alone vs. the Spurs:

Wizards @ #6: Jan Vesely
Spurs @ #15: Kawhi Leonard

Wizards @ #18: Chris Singleton
Spurs @ #29: Cory Joseph

Wizards @ #34: Shelvin Mack
Spurs @ #49: Davis Bertans

Well done. This post should be your signature.

We should put it on a scroll and nail it to Ted's door.