RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13

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RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#1 » by penbeast0 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 9:42 pm

2017 List
1. Michael Jordan
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
3. Lebron James
4. Bill Russell
5. Tim Duncan
6. Wilt Chamberlain
7. Magic Johnson
8. Shaquille O'Neal
9. Hakeem Olajuwon
10. Larry Bird
11. Kobe Bryant
12. Kevin Garnett
13. ????


OK, go!

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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#2 » by penbeast0 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 9:45 pm

VOTE: George Mikan. Yes, he played in a smaller, appreciably weaker NBA without the great black stars of his day. However, he dominated his league in a way that no one left, not even Shaq, matches. I am willing to switch my vote if (a) someone does a good analysis of his impact v. that of Shaq/Hakeem or (b) someone convinces me that Bird/Kobe/other deserves to be in ahead of Shaq/Hakeem. It's a bit of a cheat since I know he has no support, but I want him to be in the conversation. He was considered the best offensive player of the day AND the best defensive player and had a run of title teams similar to MJ without the hiatus. Of course, then you have to discount for his era . . . figure the talent of about 1 division in Jordan's day, and even less today where the league has greatly expanded it's talent base. However, even in Mikan's day, if you were close to 7 foot tall, you at least considered a basketball career so the talent differential is less than at other positions.

ardee wrote:

Could you repost the stats comparing Mikan to Jordan?



1951 is the first year we have rebounding stats available and, according to Win Shares, the last year of his true prime (WS averaged 21.8 for the 3 years up to that, 13.9 for the 3 years after that, then he retired except for a short, aborted attempt at a comeback in 56). So let's take that and compare it to Jordan's best year of 1991(according to WS, it's either 88 for highest total or 91 for WS/48 and just behind 88 for total because he "only" played 3081 minutes).

In terms of raw averages:
Mikan averaged 14.1reb, 4.1ast, 28.4pts on a ts% of .509 v. a league ts% of .428 on a pace of 94.8
Jordan averaged 6.0reb, 5.5ast, 31.5pts on a ts% of .605 v. a league ts% of .534 and a pace of 95.6

The pace is not that different, nor are the raw numbers taking into account the positions they played; the key is the ts%. But, using a simple ratio, Mikan's equivalent ts% relative to 1991 league numbers is .634! So, rather than being inefficient, you can see that for his time he was extremely efficient. Nothing fancy, but it's always a shock how much efficiency changes from the 50s to the 60s.

Alternate: By the numbers, Oscar Robertson, by the eye test, Jerry West, by advanced statistics David Robinson . . . my secondary pick is Jerry West. There are 4 players in the 1960s who were a clear level above the league, the way LeBron and Curry (and maybe Durant if healthy) have been the last 3 years. They are (in my order) Russell, Wilt, West, and Ocar . . . then there's a big dropoff to Bob Pettit (5th best) and Elgin Baylor (6th best) . . . then another droppoff to anyone else. Pettit (and to a lesser extent Baylor) was more dominant in the 50s so he gets a big boost there v. the Walt Bellamy, Sam Jones, Hal Green types. I consider the 60s to be a strong era in NBA history due to the talent being packed together on a relatively few teams, as high or higher than the 80s and 90s, so there isn't the era penalty that makes Mikan so difficult to judge.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#3 » by Dr Positivity » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:06 pm

Players I'm not voting for in order
- Mikan: Weak competition and not enough longevity anyways
- Moses: +/- has shown bigs who are non floor spacers and not defensive anchors are less valuable than once thought, played a long time overall but at superstar level for less than other stars
- Robinson: Game appears to have exposed somewhat in playoffs, not great prime longevity
- Barkley: His attitude and defense both concern me, I won't vote for him over Dirk considering the leadership difference

I pick

West over Oscar - Oscar's perfectionist style may have been grating on chemistry

Dirk over Karl Malone - Malone's playoff numbers drop in postseason which could be reflective of his forceful style of game being easier to guard in the playoffs compared to a player like Dirk's immense skill and spacing. Good points made in last thread about how Dirk's impact on defense may be as good

Dirk or Erving over West - For longevity and health reasons. West has minimal post prime years and misses a playoffs in his total prime (67). West has some exceptional highs in playoffs but so do the other players

Pick comes down to Dirk vs Dr. J. Some good arguments in the last thread saying that we should take Erving's late ABA performance as elgitimate. If so, his peak is a GOAT contender. He goes OFF in 76 in both the regular season and Finals and has great impact outside of just the boxscore too. Dirk has great +/- value in modern game due to value of his spacing, positive defense, that puts him square in the convo with players like KG and Kobe. Longevity wise their amount of prime years is close but it's hard to to tell how "prime" early ABA Erving is. Both hold on for valuable post prime play. Dirk is better offensive career than Erving for me but Erving is a terrific defender. Because I feel his peak is one level higher than Dirk I'll go with Erving

Vote: Julius Erving

2nd: Dirk Nowitzki
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#4 » by JordansBulls » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:17 pm

The guys I am considering here are Moses Malone, Julius Erving, Oscar Robertson, Dirk Nowitzki and Karl Malone.

1st Vote: Moses Malone (we are talking about a guy dominated head to head vs Kareem,
Spoiler:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/h2h_finder.cgi?request=1&player_id1_hint=Moses+Malone&player_id1_select=Moses+Malone&player_id1=malonmo01&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Kareem+Abdul-Jabbar&player_id2_select=Kareem+Abdul-Jabbar&player_id2=abdulka01&idx=players

He won 3 league MVP's (including back to back in a league with Kareem, Magic, Bird, Dr J), 1 Finals MVP and was an all time dominant rebounder.

2nd Vote: Karl Malone
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#5 » by JoeMalburg » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:22 pm

Dr Positivity wrote:Players I'm not voting for in order
- Mikan: Weak competition and not enough longevity anyways
- Moses: +/- has shown bigs who are non floor spacers and not defensive anchors are less valuable than once thought, played a long time overall but at superstar level for less than other stars
- Robinson: Game appears to have exposed somewhat in playoffs, not great prime longevity
- Barkley: His attitude and defense both concern me, I won't vote for him over Dirk considering the leadership difference

I pick

West over Oscar - Oscar's perfectionist style may have been grating on chemistry

Dirk over Karl Malone - Malone's playoff numbers drop in postseason which could be reflective of his forceful style of game being easier to guard in the playoffs compared to a player like Dirk's immense skill and spacing. Good points made in last thread about how Dirk's impact on defense may be as good

Dirk or Erving over West - For longevity and health reasons. West has minimal post prime years and misses a playoffs in his total prime (67). West has some exceptional highs in playoffs but so do the other players

Pick comes down to Dirk vs Dr. J. Some good arguments in the last thread saying that we should take Erving's late ABA performance as elgitimate. If so, his peak is a GOAT contender. He goes OFF in 76 in both the regular season and Finals and has great impact outside of just the boxscore too. Dirk has great +/- value in modern game due to value of his spacing, positive defense, that puts him square in the convo with players like KG and Kobe. Longevity wise their amount of prime years is close but it's hard to to tell how "prime" early ABA Erving is. Both hold on for valuable post prime play. Dirk is better offensive career than Erving for me but Erving is a terrific defender. Because I feel his peak is one level higher than Dirk I'll go with Erving

Vote: Julius Erving

2nd: Dirk Nowitzki


That was a rollercoaster ride. I like your destination. Was sure you were going for Dirk.

I think you're making an overly simplistic case against Mikan and Moses, but in the context of your post, that seemed to be your intent. Expand if you're willing.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#6 » by rebirthoftheM » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:26 pm

I guess since KG is in now, maybe his support will be more open minded now :D * (similar stuff were said in the previous thread. poking fun). Probably the last time we hear much from +/- stuff tho.

Dr Positivity wrote:Players I'm not voting for in order
- Mikan: Weak competition and not enough longevity anyways
- Moses: +/- has shown bigs who are non floor spacers and not defensive anchors are less valuable than once thought, played a long time overall but at superstar level for less than other stars
2nd: Dirk Nowitzki


Is this something that was investigated/tentatively determined during Moses' era, or is it a era portability issue, in the sense that Malone would not be a high impact player later on?

I pick

Dr Positivity wrote: West over Oscar - Oscar's perfectionist style may have been grating on chemistry


Do explain. One thing I gained from Jerry West recent interviews is that he was continuously depressed and anxious during his playing days. He shut off the world around him and lived through basketball. I wonder whether any of this filtered into how he interacted with his teammates? We don't hear much drama between West and Baylor tho.

Also perhaps we'll get more in-depth conversations about Julius. There's been discussions about his ball handling and pockycandy recently uploaded a nice montage from his ABA days. From what I can see, I i think i might have slightly overblown his handling deficiency in the half court. He could use both hands at a pretty decent level- he is no Jerry West (though his left hand is noticeably weaker in the half court, which is understandable given the era), had a nice one dribble drive to get past his defender and could switch directions swiftly. But I noticed he tended to dribble the ball a little too much in-front of him, which seems liable to being stripped in the modern era.

One thing I wonder is... how would Irving's handles do against zone defenses, traps off the P & R etc... where a player needs to exhibit numerous handling manoeuvres to get free. I didn't see much of this from Irving, but then again, given the state of defenses back in the day, it was not needed.

His defensive impact also needs to be fleshed out, as there seems to be so many different opinions on it.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#7 » by Jaivl » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:30 pm

rebirthoftheM wrote:Probably the last time we hear much from +/- stuff tho.

You wish Why would we do that? It's some of the best info we have out there.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#8 » by rebirthoftheM » Thu Jul 13, 2017 10:38 pm

Jaivl wrote:
rebirthoftheM wrote:Probably the last time we hear much from +/- stuff tho.

You wish Why would we do that? It's some of the best info we have out there.


Karl Malone nearly took out KG despite KG being the king of +/-, and there being strong indication he would have romped Malone if the data was available through-out the 90s. And consider the other dudes getting noise- West, Oscar, Irving and even Moses... all we have for them is WOWY stuff (which a lot of people do not cite as evidence). A lot of the arguments in the previous thread were about box score stuff and accolades. Dirk will probably get some chatter based on the +/- but I don't think it will get him across the line because not many people are infatuated with his defense.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#9 » by therealbig3 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:01 pm

Personally, I think this is between Dirk, Dr. J, West, and Oscar.

Probably not fair, but I avoid Mikan because it's really hard to rate him, and I just don't think as highly of Karl or Moses as a lot of other people do.

Specifically, with regards to Karl vs Dirk...again, I'm not seeing defense really being a significant factor in that comparison, and Dirk is pretty obviously superior offensively. Karl has the longevity advantage over anyone, but Dirk had a very long prime himself, and he was just a flat out better player.

EDIT: I think Robinson should absolutely be getting consideration as well, along with Wade.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#10 » by mischievous » Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:10 pm

I'm definitely going to go Oscar unless someone makes a convincing case for West or Dr J over him. While I think Dr J peaked slightly higher, i think he was pretty clearly worse offensively over the course of their careers and I don't know enough about his d to use that. West is a better defender based on reputation, but Oscar again is clearly better offensively than him to. He seemed to score on comparable volume and efficiency while consistently taking on a much larger playmaking load. Dirk is getting close, but I don't see his offense as comparable to Oscar, and from my eye test has never seen his d as more than an average yet at times slight positive. Karl Malone is a longevity King..but despite having an all time point guard feed him he couldn't maintain respectable scoring efficiency in the playoffs. I see him and Dirk as next to each other, I usually argue for Karl but i can be swayed otherwise. Once these guys and Moses are in i will probably start to make a pro Wade case, possibly in a biased manner so look out.

Vote: The big O(can be swayed though i'll be reading)

2nd: Dr Julius Erving
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#11 » by therealbig3 » Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:12 pm

As for all these players being from the last 5 years...

From the top 12...

2 are from the 60s (Russell and Wilt)
1 is from the 70s and 80s (Kareem)
2 are from the 80s (Magic and Bird)
2 are from the 80s and 90s (Jordan and Hakeem)
1 is from the 90s and 00s (Shaq)
3 are from the 00s (Duncan, Kobe, and Garnett)
1 is from the 00s and 10s (LeBron)

That's a pretty even distribution, and the discussion is between a 50s guy (Mikan), a 00s guy (Dirk), two 70s and 80s guys (Moses and Dr. J), two 60s guys (Oscar and West), and two 90s guys (Karl and D-Rob). Maybe Barkley as well, who would also fit into that 80s/90s era.

Not to mention, basketball just gets better over the years. Makes sense that the later generations have more all timers. There's just more talent to go around.

But again, that's not even what we're seeing here. It's a really even distribution. But yeah, guys like Wade and CP3 and Nash SHOULD probably be part of the conversation soon, along with guys like Stockton, Ewing, and Pippen. I think it's too early to discuss KD or Curry in the top 20-30 though.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#12 » by Dr Positivity » Thu Jul 13, 2017 11:56 pm

mischievous wrote:While I think Dr J peaked slightly higher, i think he was pretty clearly worse offensively over the course of their careers and I don't know enough about his d to use that.


I had Dr. J as the higher value defender than a player like Oscar (Great steal and block, strong physical tools, SF is better defensive position than PG), although if someone has a counter to that I might change my mind. It is weird Dr J didn't make more all defensive teams in the NBA
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#13 » by mischievous » Fri Jul 14, 2017 12:03 am

Dr Positivity wrote:
mischievous wrote:While I think Dr J peaked slightly higher, i think he was pretty clearly worse offensively over the course of their careers and I don't know enough about his d to use that.


I had Dr. J as the higher value defender than a player like Oscar (Great steal and block, strong physical tools, SF is better defensive position than PG), although if someone has a counter to that I might change my mind. It is weird Dr J didn't make more all defensive teams in the NBA

I would agree he is a better defender, but I don't really think he's elite on that end. So i'm not sure it makes up for the offensive advantage.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#14 » by Blackmill » Fri Jul 14, 2017 12:10 am

Some Regression Results...

I finally got around to doing the regression I said I would in the first couple threads. What I did was very close to WOWYR (which you can read about here and here) but with four differences:

    1. The lambda was chosen using generalized cross validation rather than k-fold cross validation.

    2. By accident, I am missing any games from June, which is the finals and sometimes parts of the conference finals. I don't expect this to make a difference in the results, though I plan to eventually re-scrape for all the missing June data, and if there is a difference I'll be sure to make a post about it.

    3. If you read Elgee's post on WOWYR, you would know it excludes players who do not meet certain minute thresholds. I do the same, though I made 25 minutes a strict requirement, rather than allowing for sub-cases where players playing fewer minutes can find a place in the regression.

    4. Perhaps the biggest difference, I still use each player's MPG for the season, instead of MP each game, post-1984. I did this because I noticed the top players in Elgee's results are dominated by those who played after 1984. I became suspicious that the regression was more likely to underestimate player impact than overestimate, which we expect given the regularization, and thus by providing more granular data the regression can make better predictions which are not underestimations to the same degree.

      Note: The results I arrived at are still dominated by players who played after 1984, but in comparison, their fitted values are not so clearly ahead of those for player's who played before 1984

One of the first things I did was run a regression on the whole data set from 1957 to 2017. This has advantages and disadvantages:

    1. The advantage is the regression has plenty of data on all the players. Consistently, when doing the regression over smaller sets of years, the players at the top are those who played just one or two seasons. This also has consequences on players who played a reasonable number of seasons during the time frame, since their values are influenced by every one else's, and it's possible to find examples of including or excluding single seasons radically changing the fitted values for some players largely because what the regression thinks of the player's teammates changes.

    2. The disadvantage is two fold. First, we are not isolating each player's prime. Jordan will get knocked for his Wizard years, Kareem and Duncan for their last couple seasons, Kobe for the start and end of his career, and so on. Second, the regression will assign only a single value for each player. Thus, players who played with very young or very old teammates, who became or were once great, will be knocked as well.

Here are the top-40, with players who played less than six full seasons not included.

Spoiler:
Oscar Robertson: 8.17440313961
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar: 6.00160305044
Marc Gasol: 5.86949181662
John Stockton: 5.85137846504
Jerry West: 5.69099893136
Larry Bird: 5.42091725767
Michael Jordan: 5.17750091503
Magic Johnson: 5.0883282586
Vlade Divac: 5.03216295778
Bill Russell: 5.01597771069
Paul Millsap: 4.64913104721
LeBron James: 4.48963856742
Charles Barkley: 4.39735631558
Billy Cunningham: 4.28419502991
David Robinson: 4.18913711245
Wilt Chamberlain: 4.1675021247
Rashard Lewis: 4.1406827461
Paul Pierce: 4.13818986678
Cliff Levingston: 4.02393240086
Andre Iguodala: 3.99190507129
John Havlicek: 3.98714541027
Clyde Drexler: 3.97934152384
Dirk Nowitzki: 3.9751039827
Steve Nash: 3.95264201506
Hakeem Olajuwon: 3.91583926344
Paul Pressey: 3.84977757632
Dikembe Mutombo: 3.77061264129
Bob Lanier: 3.76607312567
Thaddeus Young: 3.72146426899
Ben Wallace: 3.60972293311
Chris Paul: 3.60561256364
Kevin Garnett: 3.53719182632
Nate McMillan: 3.39738875882
Tim Duncan: 3.35100925965
Doc Rivers: 3.19478703687
Willis Reed: 3.17223596463
Manu Ginobili: 3.16305929763
Bob Weiss: 3.14541255624
Bob Pettit: 3.08298603252


Some general comments:

    - I won't dwell on it long, since topic has passed, but I feel obligated to mention it. For all the people saying that Kareem wasn't impactful, he's second all-time in this regression, and shows similarly well in regressions focused around specific player's primes. Aside from a couple ten-game samples there was never evidence to the contrary.

    - Like WOWYR, we have a good number of unexpected names in the top-40, but otherwise we see all-time greats. The number of strange results that I got doesn't seem to be any more than what Elgee got which is reassuring.

    - Oscar is far ahead of the pack. What's remarkable is he looks this great even if you don't include his Bucks years. My suspicion was that he was getting a massive boost from when he joined the Bucks and their SRS shot up but that wasn't the case. I'm surprised there hasn't been more support for him thus far.

A Problem...

So, while it's nice to have these results, there are problems. I'll walk through an illustrative example.

Let's look at Tim Duncan's results from 1998 to 2003. He's shows up as the very best with a fitted value of 5.78813166657 which isn't too surprising. Now, what about from 1998 to 2002? Duncan still show up well, his fitted value is 4.28670048637, but he's no longer at the very top. Was Duncan's 2003 year just so good it totally changes the results? Well, if we run the regression on just the 2003 season, Duncan looks like a 3.03965743306 (though results this season seemed deflated). Okay, let's extend the sample, and run it over 2002-2003. This time Duncan appears as a 2.77350967918. You should be thinking this is quite strange.

What's going on is Tim Duncan's fitted values are being greatly affected by his teammates. In the 1998 to 2002 regression, David Robinson is a 2.94718081154, while in the 1998 to 2003 regression Robinson is a 1.35647870915, and this is because he shows up as a -1.96055137035 in the 2003 season.

Five seasons isn't a large sample so we don't want to put too much stock into the results for Duncan and Robinson I've been discussing. However, it should be recognized that a player's fitted values can depend greatly on the regression's impression of other players, and in particular teammates. Even with a seemingly reasonable sample for some player of interest, it must be considered if the sample is large enough for the player's teammates, which makes running the regression on just a player's prime very difficult.

Now, with a larger sample regression, we don't expect this to be as much of a problem. After all, the regression will generally need to be more accurate in estimating the player who has ten years in the sample than the player with five years in order to minimize the loss function. However, this does prevent us from isolating a player's prime.

Providing an alternative that uses multiple seasons of data to yield estimates for smaller sets of seasons is something I will work on in the upcoming days. That, and measuring the error.

A Request...

I'm also going to make a request for help. I would like to get my hands on some RAPM (lineup) data to test the noise. The websites that had several years available for free are down as are the data sets which fpliii uploaded a year or so ago. I have a half-made scraper to get the RAPM data, but right now I want to focus on improving my WOWYR-type model, and I have a back log of research papers that I'm reading through. In other words, I'm lacking for time, and would really appreciate a helping hand. Even just a single year would be great if some one happens to have the data on hand.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#15 » by THKNKG » Fri Jul 14, 2017 12:52 am

So Blackmill's data helps affirm what I was thinking - I'm in between Oscar and Dirk for this spot. Malone^2, DRob, West, Barkley, Erving are all right behind. Oscar measures out on top of any metric we have of the time (which shows why the 71 Bucks had the highest SRS ever - adding 2 GOAT level players to the same team with perfect fit).

Now, I'm in a tough situation. There are MAX impact guys on the board - Oscar, West, Robinson, and there are awesome longevity guys - Dirk, Moses, Malone. I'm at a standstill trying to parse through them all.

Some pluses and concerns for Dirk and Oscar:

Dirk:
Pluses
-greatest offensive gravity ever
-GOAT level offensive talent
-solid enough defender (average to slightly above average)
-incredibly efficiently scorer
-not a great "playmaker" but his gravity is a sort of intrinsic playmaking mechanism that makes up for his "deficiency" there (as compared to guys like Karl)
-playoff resiliency against elite defenses
-really strong longevity (10+ year prime, 15+ high value years)
-solid portability, and able to "do his thing" and produce elite offenses regardless of team composition, whether offensive or defensive teammate emphasis
-well-rounded scoring toolbox (especially ~08 and later)
-really good defensively rebounder
-good guy/good teammate

Concerns
-playoff blights (06 finals, 07 vs Warriors, etc.) are all concerns
-at best, a slight positive on defense, which is super valuable for bigs

Oscar:
Pluses
-short list for greatest offensive facilitators ever (Magic, Nash, Oscar - that's the top)
-short list for greatest offensive players ever
-excellent scaling, as the Bucks showed
-really good from midrange and on post ups
-just as solid in the playoffs as "Mr. Clutch" when not counting his old man Bucks years

Concerns
-poor longevity relatively speaking (though now would be a good time to do some searching into "relative longevity")
-not the consummate teammate/attitude (though this is only a slight concern)
-how good was his defense?
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#16 » by ceiling raiser » Fri Jul 14, 2017 12:59 am

Hey guys, been a bit busy, so I need to catch up when I have time (very soon) and jump in.
Blackmill wrote:I would like to get my hands on some RAPM data to test the noise.

Here's a 21 year set of single-year NPI (97-00 from AcrossTheCourt's site, 01-17 from J.E.):

http://www8.zippyshare.com/v/kWLn1fMB/file.html

EDIT: Ah, matchupfiles I think. I can see what I have and reupload.
Now that's the difference between first and last place.
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eminence
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#17 » by eminence » Fri Jul 14, 2017 1:01 am

Blackmill wrote:.


When you say get your hands on some RAPM data do you just mean the lineup data?
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#18 » by Blackmill » Fri Jul 14, 2017 1:04 am

fpliii wrote:Hey guys, been a bit busy, so I need to catch up when I have time (very soon) and jump in.
Blackmill wrote:I would like to get my hands on some RAPM data to test the noise.

Here's a 21 year set of single-year NPI (97-00 from AcrossTheCourt's site, 01-17 from J.E.):

http://www8.zippyshare.com/v/kWLn1fMB/file.html

EDIT: Ah, matchupfiles I think. I can see what I have and reupload.


eminence wrote:
Blackmill wrote:.


When you say get your hands on some RAPM data do you just mean the lineup data?


Yeah, my bad, I wasn't clear about that. I'm looking for the lineup data.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#19 » by ceiling raiser » Fri Jul 14, 2017 1:07 am

Blackmill wrote:
fpliii wrote:Hey guys, been a bit busy, so I need to catch up when I have time (very soon) and jump in.
Blackmill wrote:I would like to get my hands on some RAPM data to test the noise.

Here's a 21 year set of single-year NPI (97-00 from AcrossTheCourt's site, 01-17 from J.E.):

http://www8.zippyshare.com/v/kWLn1fMB/file.html

EDIT: Ah, matchupfiles I think. I can see what I have and reupload.


eminence wrote:
Blackmill wrote:.


When you say get your hands on some RAPM data do you just mean the lineup data?


Yeah, my bad, I wasn't clear about that. I'm looking for the lineup data.

Here's 01-06, I think it's all I have:

http://www8.zippyshare.com/v/qg0gCAUK/file.html
Now that's the difference between first and last place.
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Re: RealGM Top 100 List 2017 -- #13 

Post#20 » by Blackmill » Fri Jul 14, 2017 1:08 am

fpliii wrote:Here's 01-06, I think it's all I have:

http://www8.zippyshare.com/v/qg0gCAUK/file.html


Thanks!

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