Kyrie Irving

atlantabbq99 · Post #1 » by **atlantabbq99** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:07 am

I'm not really a fan of Kyrie Irving, but I just wanted to float the idea out there...

Dennis and MIN's pick for Kyrie Irving?

Should the Hawks explore trading Dennis and a few other assets for Kyrie? I would look into a reasonable trade package with anything the Hawks have, but have Collins as the only untouchable.

Robo_Claw · Post #2 » by **Robo_Claw** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:44 am

Kyrie never even made the playoffs without LeBron. He's a great scorer and definitely clutch but I don't think he'd make our current team much better. Would definitely sell more tickets though.

Post #3 » by **Jamaaliver** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 4:10 am

^To be fair, he was only 21 at that point. Playing for one of the most dysfunctional rosters/inept coaches in the league.

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Geaux_Hawks · Post #4 » by **Geaux_Hawks** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 9:44 am

Jamaaliver wrote:^To be fair, he was only 21 at that point. Playing for one of the most dysfunctional rosters/inept coaches in the league.

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For these reasons, I would buy into Irving. That and selling tickets would give us a good reason to bring him in. Build a team around him with a top pick next year and cap space to make a run at a Jabari Parker.

atlantabbq99 · Post #5 » by **atlantabbq99** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:15 am

I'm not a fan of Kyrie, but I do think he is an Allen Iverson shooting guard. A sixers' team could be built around him.

Spud2nique · Post #6 » by **Spud2nique** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:00 pm

If we can get him and it's a good deal, then I would. He's only going to get better. On the other side of things, he doesn't fit our retooling right now. Getting him would result in a major reroute for us. He's a top 5 pg in the NBA. I personally think he's gonna end up with Pop and the Spurs. I think it will be a swap for Lamarcus, Murray +1st rounder. Kawhi n Kyrie...yikes!

kg01 · Post #7 » by **kg01** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 4:02 pm

Spud2nique wrote:If we can get him and it's a good deal, then I would. He's only going to get better. On the other side of things, he doesn't fit our retooling right now. Getting him would result in a major reroute for us. He's a top 5 pg in the NBA. I personally think he's gonna end up with Pop and the Spurs. I think it will be a swap for Lamarcus, Murray +1st rounder. Kawhi n Kyrie...yikes!

Our retool is gonna involve doing what we can to obtain high-end talent (via means other than tanking). Going all out for Irving jives with that thinking.

Har_en was no more a 'winner' when HOU got him. Fast forward to now and he's (for some reason) a guy others seek to play with. I say get Kyme and figure the rest out. That's what HOU did.

Post #8 » by **ATL Boy** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 7:31 pm

I'd at least be on the phone with Cleveland right now if I were Schlenk. Kyrie's the star we could build around, we don't have that on the roster right now.

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reazun · Post #9 » by **reazun** » Sat Jul 22, 2017 11:32 pm

Id take him on if the price is right also...i mean who wouldnt?

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LeMasta · Post #10 » by **LeMasta** » Sun Jul 23, 2017 5:41 am

I'd take Kyrie, even with his mediocre defense and unproven leadership as a #1 man. I've been dying to see some exciting, bigger name players on the team. I'd place trust in the management to manage and develop the supporting cast around Kyrie properly.

atlantabbq99 · Post #11 » by **atlantabbq99** » Sun Jul 23, 2017 9:05 am

reazun wrote:Id take him on if the price is right also...i mean who wouldnt?

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Well Dennis could still turn into a 20-22ppg point guard. At age 23, John Wall was a 19ppg player, last year, Dennis at age 23 was an 18ppg scorer.

Geaux_Hawks · Post #12 » by **Geaux_Hawks** » Sun Jul 23, 2017 7:56 pm

LeMasta wrote:I'd take Kyrie, even with his mediocre defense and unproven leadership as a #1 man. I've been dying to see some exciting, bigger name players on the team. I'd place trust in the management to manage and develop the supporting cast around Kyrie properly.

This really depends on whether you think Denis can make a jump over Kyrie just giving you a big name and also taking a leap himself to be more well rounded and performing better in a more stable situation than his early years.

macd-gm · Post #13 » by **macd-gm** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 2:01 pm

Dennis won't ever be the offensive player that Kyrie is already though. Dennis may end up being a better distributor but he's never going to be hitting 3s with a defender in his face. And so far Dennis doesn't really shake his man on offense. It's only move to the hoop is to blow by. These are big differences.

atlantabbq99 · Post #14 » by **atlantabbq99** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 2:21 pm

macd-gm wrote:Dennis won't ever be the offensive player that Kyrie is already though. Dennis may end up being a better distributor but he's never going to be hitting 3s with a defender in his face. And so far Dennis doesn't really shake his man on offense. It's only move to the hoop is to blow by. These are big differences.

I agree. I also don't see Dennis as Rondo. I see him as All Star Devin Harris, who can shoot 35% from three.

Post #15 » by **Jamaaliver** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 2:44 pm

Geaux_Hawks wrote:This really depends on whether you think Denis can make a jump over Kyrie just giving you a big name and also taking a leap himself to be more well rounded and performing better in a more stable situation than his early years.

Agreed.

One thing about KI as a big name: I think Kyrie is more likely to attract top players to play alongside him...wherever he goes.

He's already been an All Star, All NBA, Olympic Gold Medalist, NBA Champion, 25 PPG scorer at a pretty young age.

Other elite talents seem attracted to the prospect of playing alongside him.

This is an aspect no recent Hawk player could offer.

Kyrie is a flawed player with clear holes in his game that haven't been corrected at a pretty late stage. (Don't even get me started on his ego.)

But he'd make a hell of a franchise pillar to start a rebuild around with his reputation as a star player and his on court production.

(NOTE: I think Miami makes perfect sense as place to ship him. The Heat has attractive vets to trade to Cleveland (Dragic, Whiteside) -- and young pieces in T Johnson, J Winslow and Bam that could pair nicely with KI moving forward.)

atlantabbq99 · Post #16 » by **atlantabbq99** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:08 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:
Geaux_Hawks wrote:This really depends on whether you think Denis can make a jump over Kyrie just giving you a big name and also taking a leap himself to be more well rounded and performing better in a more stable situation than his early years.

Agreed.

One thing about KI as a big name: I think Kyrie is more likely to attract top players to play alongside him...wherever he goes.

He's already been an All Star, All NBA, Olympic Gold Medalist, NBA Champion, 25 PPG scorer at a pretty young age.

Other elite talents seem attracted to the prospect of playing alongside him.

This is an aspect no recent Hawk player could offer.

Kyrie is a flawed player with clear holes in his game that haven't been corrected at a pretty late stage. (Don't even get me started on his ego.)

But he'd make a hell of a franchise pillar to start a rebuild around with his reputation as a star player and his on court production.

(NOTE: I think Miami makes perfect sense as place to ship him. The Heat has attractive vets to trade to Cleveland (Dragic, Whiteside) -- and young pieces in T Johnson, J Winslow and Bam that could pair nicely with KI moving forward.)

I agree with everything except for this. Kyrie doesn't have a good locker room reputation around the league. He is not a cancer, but teammates have called him very introverted, and he has been criticized by his teammates for not passing.

Post #17 » by **Jamaaliver** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:34 pm

^A very fair point.

MaceCase · Post #18 » by **MaceCase** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:43 pm

macd-gm wrote:Dennis won't ever be the offensive player that Kyrie is already though. Dennis may end up being a better distributor but he's never going to be hitting 3s with a defender in his face. And so far Dennis doesn't really shake his man on offense. It's only move to the hoop is to blow by. These are big differences.

That blow by got him to the hoop 10% more than Kyrie so maybe that shake, although aesthetically pleasing, isn't particularly all that effective.

kg01 · Post #19 » by **kg01** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 3:57 pm

MaceCase wrote:
macd-gm wrote:Dennis won't ever be the offensive player that Kyrie is already though. Dennis may end up being a better distributor but he's never going to be hitting 3s with a defender in his face. And so far Dennis doesn't really shake his man on offense. It's only move to the hoop is to blow by. These are big differences.

That blow by got him to the hoop 10% more than Kyrie so maybe that shake, although aesthetically pleasing, isn't particularly all that effective.

Well, you know @macd-gm is one-a those fans that're wow'd by the flashy stuff. He's waiting for the return of the and1 mixtape :wink:

(just messin' witcha, macd)

macd-gm · Post #20 » by **macd-gm** » Mon Jul 24, 2017 4:45 pm

MaceCase wrote:
macd-gm wrote:Dennis won't ever be the offensive player that Kyrie is already though. Dennis may end up being a better distributor but he's never going to be hitting 3s with a defender in his face. And so far Dennis doesn't really shake his man on offense. It's only move to the hoop is to blow by. These are big differences.

That blow by got him to the hoop 10% more than Kyrie so maybe that shake, although aesthetically pleasing, isn't particularly all that effective.

But it's not just about getting to the hoop. It's about making shots. Dennis' offense (right now) is open 3s and beating guys to the right side glass. That's it. Shaking his man for a 10 footer, step backs, fade aways, shooting over your defender. Those aren't in his game but they are all there in Kyrie's. I'm not even that big of fan of his but you have to admit he is an offensive threat big time.

More on subject, I'm not convinced that Kyrie can be the #1 option on a championship team but it'd be nice to finally have a player that is a legit scorer.