Why trading for Kyrie could cost McD his job

[RaisingArizona]

I don't buy the Irving is Knight comparison AT ALL.

[mg]

I agree with all that except I wouldn't want to trade the 21 Heat pick,unless we added protection. I don't mind picks that much if the have at least top 7 protection or so. I'd probably prefer trading picks over any of our players that were lotto picks because we are already rebuilding them. I don't really want to keep hitting reset. I could deal with protected picks because if he left and we sucked we keep them and if we were getting better we wouldn't need them as much. It would be nice to be two deep with young guys at each position and we could be.

I definitely understand wanting to hold the 21 pick since we have no idea what it's real value is yet and only James Johnson, Kelly Olynyk, Dion Waiters, and Bam Adebayo are (likely to be) under contract for the 2021 season. I just don't think I'd let it or the protections on it be the deal breaker when it comes to bringing in Kyrie, even though I probably wouldn't offer it up right away. I'm pretty sure Bledsoe, TJ, and the 2018 Miami Pick alone is better than anything our competition could/would reasonably offer anyways.

He was an All-Star before Lebron arrived because he puts up empty numbers and voters like flashy scorers. The year before Lebron arrived the Cavs were -4.3 with Kyrie playing. They were a slightly worse offensive team (-1) but a massively better defensive team (+5.3) when he was sitting.

You also have to remember Kyrie just turned 19 when the Cavs drafted him and those stats were put up when he was 20-21 year old kid playing the most difficult position on a godawful Cavs team with the likes of Bennett, Bynum, T.Thompson, Waiters etc. For those comparing him to Knight...that is just an awful comparison. Knight is nowhere near the level of Kyrie.
In my mind Irving has proven himself against the likes of Curry the past few seasons in the Finals. At 25 he should only get better from here as he enters his prime too. Kyrie also generates jersey sales, all star votes, etc and I'm guessing that is something that will appeal to Sarver. I'm actually good either way if they deal for him or not but let's not sit around and pretend that Knight is anywhere near the same level as Kyrie..that's crazy.

[bwgood77]

I definitely understand wanting to hold the 21 pick since we have no idea what it's real value is yet and only James Johnson, Kelly Olynyk, Dion Waiters, and Bam Adebayo are (likely to be) under contract for the 2021 season. I just don't think I'd let it or the protections on it be the deal breaker when it comes to bringing in Kyrie, even though I probably wouldn't offer it up right away. I'm pretty sure Bledsoe, TJ, and the 2018 Miami Pick alone is better than anything our competition could/would reasonably offer anyways.

He was an All-Star before Lebron arrived because he puts up empty numbers and voters like flashy scorers. The year before Lebron arrived the Cavs were -4.3 with Kyrie playing. They were a slightly worse offensive team (-1) but a massively better defensive team (+5.3) when he was sitting.

You also have to remember Kyrie just turned 19 when the Cavs drafted him and those stats were put up when he was 20-21 year old kid playing the most difficult position on a godawful Cavs team with the likes of Bennett, Bynum, T.Thompson, Waiters etc. For those comparing him to Knight...that is just an awful comparison. Knight is nowhere near the level of Kyrie.
In my mind Irving has proven himself against the likes of Curry the past few seasons in the Finals. At 25 he should only get better from here as he enters his prime too. Kyrie also generates jersey sales, all star votes, etc and I'm guessing that is something that will appeal to Sarver. I'm actually good either way if they deal for him or not but let's not sit around and pretend that Knight is anywhere near the same level as Kyrie..that's crazy.

I don't truly think anyone believes Kyrie is comparable to Knight as a player. I think someone mentioned very rich man's Knight or something. Kyrie is the type of player Knight tries to be. They do have some similar tendencies but Knight's don't end well while Kyrie's usually do. Lots of dribbling, some tunnel vision, lots of shots, etc, but you are comparing the worst in the league at doing that with the best in the league at doing that...or close to the best.

[Biff]

He was an All-Star before Lebron arrived because he puts up empty numbers and voters like flashy scorers. The year before Lebron arrived the Cavs were -4.3 with Kyrie playing. They were a slightly worse offensive team (-1) but a massively better defensive team (+5.3) when he was sitting.

You also have to remember Kyrie just turned 19 when the Cavs drafted him and those stats were put up when he was 20-21 year old kid playing the most difficult position on a godawful Cavs team with the likes of Bennett, Bynum, T.Thompson, Waiters etc. For those comparing him to Knight...that is just an awful comparison. Knight is nowhere near the level of Kyrie.
In my mind Irving has proven himself against the likes of Curry the past few seasons in the Finals. At 25 he should only get better from here as he enters his prime too. Kyrie also generates jersey sales, all star votes, etc and I'm guessing that is something that will appeal to Sarver. I'm actually good either way if they deal for him or not but let's not sit around and pretend that Knight is anywhere near the same level as Kyrie..that's crazy.

I don't truly think anyone believes Kyrie is comparable to Knight as a player. I think someone mentioned very rich man's Knight or something. Kyrie is the type of player Knight tries to be. They do have some similar tendencies but Knight's don't end well while Kyrie's usually do. Lots of dribbling, some tunnel vision, lots of shots, etc, but you are comparing the worst in the league at doing that with the best in the league at doing that...or close to the best.

Pretty much. Irving is far far better than Knight but I think their style of play isn't dissimilar. Irving can make circus shots and is actually quite efficient as a scorer, neither of which can be applied to Knight. However, he's not a good playmaker (a very common criticism from Lebron) and there are too many possessions where he just dribbles for most of the play clock. I found it quite ironic that he wanted to go the Spurs. If he thinks Lebron was hard on him, what does he think Pop is going to be like? Pop would be screaming at him constantly. Irving plays nothing like a Pop player. If Pop could actually get him to adjust his game and play within the Spurs system he could actually be a very good player and be far more effective than he is currently. I'm not sure that would be possible but I suppose just about anything is.

[DRK]

I don't buy the Irving is Knight comparison AT ALL.

If Irving is knight, then Len is Tim Duncan