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Luke wrote:Cavs are getting Bledsoe, a low 1st, and a player Suns don't want; nothing more...
Captain_Caveman wrote:Luke wrote:Cavs are getting Bledsoe, a low 1st, and a player Suns don't want; nothing more...
I can see them not offering Jackson. Probably a sound decision for PHX, tbh.
But doing so would likely take them out of the top 5-10 teams in the Kyrie chase. He's not getting traded for Bledsoe and a late 1st, in any event.
LivingLegend wrote:Captain_Caveman wrote:Luke wrote:Cavs are getting Bledsoe, a low 1st, and a player Suns don't want; nothing more...
I can see them not offering Jackson. Probably a sound decision for PHX, tbh.
But doing so would likely take them out of the top 5-10 teams in the Kyrie chase. He's not getting traded for Bledsoe and a late 1st, in any event.
Right, Kyrie is 25 years old and I keep hearing "this non-playoff team wont give up their recently acquired top 10 draft pick because they are rebuilding" which I find to be a crock. Acting like Kyrie is some 29-30 year old All-Star that somehow wouldnt fit in well with their 'rebuilding' roster of 22 year olds like the Nuggets/Suns currently have.
Granted the Nuggets are in much better shape because Jokic/Millsap but if you have the chance to pair Kyrie Irving, Nikola Jokic and Paul Millsap together for a team that hasnt been relevant since Carmelo was there in 2009-2010---you dont sit on your hands. Why sit around for 3 more years waiting for your young guys like Murray/Jackson to hopefully develop into the caliber player Kyrie is when you can just hit the fast-forward button and HAVE Kyrie right now.
Captain_Caveman wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Captain_Caveman wrote:
I can see them not offering Jackson. Probably a sound decision for PHX, tbh.
But doing so would likely take them out of the top 5-10 teams in the Kyrie chase. He's not getting traded for Bledsoe and a late 1st, in any event.
Right, Kyrie is 25 years old and I keep hearing "this non-playoff team wont give up their recently acquired top 10 draft pick because they are rebuilding" which I find to be a crock. Acting like Kyrie is some 29-30 year old All-Star that somehow wouldnt fit in well with their 'rebuilding' roster of 22 year olds like the Nuggets/Suns currently have.
Granted the Nuggets are in much better shape because Jokic/Millsap but if you have the chance to pair Kyrie Irving, Nikola Jokic and Paul Millsap together for a team that hasnt been relevant since Carmelo was there in 2009-2010---you dont sit on your hands. Why sit around for 3 more years waiting for your young guys like Murray/Jackson to hopefully develop into the caliber player Kyrie is when you can just hit the fast-forward button and HAVE Kyrie right now.
The other thing here is that the Cavs are under no obligation to do anything other than what is best for them. If trading him to Atlanta is their best play, who cares what Kyrie wants? He is a top young player who will return value on the trade market. With as many as 20 teams in the mix, Cavs are not going to get squeezed by Phoenix or anyone else. It's not a Paul George situation where he can kill trades and torch his trade value by threatening to sign with LA in a year. A team would get Kyrie for a minimum of 2 years, and that has a value a bit higher than a role player and a late 1st.
LivingLegend wrote:Captain_Caveman wrote:Luke wrote:Cavs are getting Bledsoe, a low 1st, and a player Suns don't want; nothing more...
I can see them not offering Jackson. Probably a sound decision for PHX, tbh.
But doing so would likely take them out of the top 5-10 teams in the Kyrie chase. He's not getting traded for Bledsoe and a late 1st, in any event.
Right, Kyrie is 25 years old and I keep hearing "this non-playoff team wont give up their recently acquired top 10 draft pick because they are rebuilding" which I find to be a crock. Acting like Kyrie is some 29-30 year old All-Star that somehow wouldnt fit in well with their 'rebuilding' roster of 22 year olds like the Nuggets/Suns currently have.
Granted the Nuggets are in much better shape because Jokic/Millsap but if you have the chance to pair Kyrie Irving, Nikola Jokic and Paul Millsap together for a team that hasnt been relevant since Carmelo was there in 2009-2010---you dont sit on your hands. Why sit around for 3 more years waiting for your young guys like Murray/Jackson to hopefully develop into the caliber player Kyrie is when you can just hit the fast-forward button and HAVE Kyrie right now.
Its like putting Murray or Jackson in a microwave and 2 mins later BOOM! out pops a Kyrie Irving, guaranteed. But some fans for whatever reason like to go the Crock Pot route hoping it looks like the picture in the recipe book after 8 hours.
Luke wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Captain_Caveman wrote:
I can see them not offering Jackson. Probably a sound decision for PHX, tbh.
But doing so would likely take them out of the top 5-10 teams in the Kyrie chase. He's not getting traded for Bledsoe and a late 1st, in any event.
Right, Kyrie is 25 years old and I keep hearing "this non-playoff team wont give up their recently acquired top 10 draft pick because they are rebuilding" which I find to be a crock. Acting like Kyrie is some 29-30 year old All-Star that somehow wouldnt fit in well with their 'rebuilding' roster of 22 year olds like the Nuggets/Suns currently have.
Granted the Nuggets are in much better shape because Jokic/Millsap but if you have the chance to pair Kyrie Irving, Nikola Jokic and Paul Millsap together for a team that hasnt been relevant since Carmelo was there in 2009-2010---you dont sit on your hands. Why sit around for 3 more years waiting for your young guys like Murray/Jackson to hopefully develop into the caliber player Kyrie is when you can just hit the fast-forward button and HAVE Kyrie right now.
Its like putting Murray or Jackson in a microwave and 2 mins later BOOM! out pops a Kyrie Irving, guaranteed. But some fans for whatever reason like to go the Crock Pot route hoping it looks like the picture in the recipe book after 8 hours.
Obviously for Denver, getting Irving makes a lot more sense than the Suns, because they have established players already. Getting Irving for the Suns, is only a luxury his owner would love to have if the price is low...
LivingLegend wrote:Captain_Caveman wrote:LivingLegend wrote:
Right, Kyrie is 25 years old and I keep hearing "this non-playoff team wont give up their recently acquired top 10 draft pick because they are rebuilding" which I find to be a crock. Acting like Kyrie is some 29-30 year old All-Star that somehow wouldnt fit in well with their 'rebuilding' roster of 22 year olds like the Nuggets/Suns currently have.
Granted the Nuggets are in much better shape because Jokic/Millsap but if you have the chance to pair Kyrie Irving, Nikola Jokic and Paul Millsap together for a team that hasnt been relevant since Carmelo was there in 2009-2010---you dont sit on your hands. Why sit around for 3 more years waiting for your young guys like Murray/Jackson to hopefully develop into the caliber player Kyrie is when you can just hit the fast-forward button and HAVE Kyrie right now.
The other thing here is that the Cavs are under no obligation to do anything other than what is best for them. If trading him to Atlanta is their best play, who cares what Kyrie wants? He is a top young player who will return value on the trade market. With as many as 20 teams in the mix, Cavs are not going to get squeezed by Phoenix or anyone else. It's not a Paul George situation where he can kill trades and torch his trade value by threatening to sign with LA in a year. A team would get Kyrie for a minimum of 2 years, and that has a value a bit higher than a role player and a late 1st.
Right on, people forget the Cavs are in 110% complete control here acting like they HAVE to accept whatever deal Denver/Phoenix or whoever throws at them. They dont have to do anything. They can easily say "we didnt get what we want and Kyrie will be reporting to camp where we can smooth this over." Frankly, he doesnt have a choice and neither do the teams offering the Cavs trades.
If you want Kyrie Irving--a lowball offer will not get it done because he is under Cavs control for 2 more years. Come correct with a trade offer and he will be yours. The thing about the Cavs having all the control is that they WILL get what they want and what they think is best or he doesnt get traded. Simple as that.
Captain_Caveman wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Captain_Caveman wrote:
The other thing here is that the Cavs are under no obligation to do anything other than what is best for them. If trading him to Atlanta is their best play, who cares what Kyrie wants? He is a top young player who will return value on the trade market. With as many as 20 teams in the mix, Cavs are not going to get squeezed by Phoenix or anyone else. It's not a Paul George situation where he can kill trades and torch his trade value by threatening to sign with LA in a year. A team would get Kyrie for a minimum of 2 years, and that has a value a bit higher than a role player and a late 1st.
Right on, people forget the Cavs are in 110% complete control here acting like they HAVE to accept whatever deal Denver/Phoenix or whoever throws at them. They dont have to do anything. They can easily say "we didnt get what we want and Kyrie will be reporting to camp where we can smooth this over." Frankly, he doesnt have a choice and neither do the teams offering the Cavs trades.
If you want Kyrie Irving--a lowball offer will not get it done because he is under Cavs control for 2 more years. Come correct with a trade offer and he will be yours. The thing about the Cavs having all the control is that they WILL get what they want and what they think is best or he doesnt get traded. Simple as that.
No doubt. The Cavs just keeping Kyrie and then liquidating everyone next summer is an underrated play here. With LeBron likely leaving in a year, trading Kyrie for 75 cents on the dollar makes them a lesser contender in their last year of contending. Might just be better off going for it and then getting 50 cents on the dollar for Kyrie next summer. Then you tank again, which is the only build plan that has ever worked for them anyways.
The challenge there is that this relationship looks severed. With Kyrie and the front office, and Kyrie and his teammates. I don't think you can just hug this out in training camp and go forward. Really looks like there is bad blood there.
As a Celts fan, I tip my hat to them for their run and say, "We'll take it from here."
Superhuman wrote:I bet my two left nuts that if a trade were to happen, Jackson would absolutely not be part of the deal.
Suns would not trade away a promising young prospect like JJ, for two season of Kyrie. Even with that sliver of hope he'd resign, don't risk it. And I think Suns management knows how majority of fans feel. Continue development of the exciting young guns rather than be stuck in 8th seed purgatory. Hope that in 4-5 years the western conference wont be as tough as it is now. If the cavs won't budge, then hang up the phone. Let them deal with the Kyrie situation themselves.
LivingLegend wrote:Luke wrote:LivingLegend wrote:
Right, Kyrie is 25 years old and I keep hearing "this non-playoff team wont give up their recently acquired top 10 draft pick because they are rebuilding" which I find to be a crock. Acting like Kyrie is some 29-30 year old All-Star that somehow wouldnt fit in well with their 'rebuilding' roster of 22 year olds like the Nuggets/Suns currently have.
Granted the Nuggets are in much better shape because Jokic/Millsap but if you have the chance to pair Kyrie Irving, Nikola Jokic and Paul Millsap together for a team that hasnt been relevant since Carmelo was there in 2009-2010---you dont sit on your hands. Why sit around for 3 more years waiting for your young guys like Murray/Jackson to hopefully develop into the caliber player Kyrie is when you can just hit the fast-forward button and HAVE Kyrie right now.
Its like putting Murray or Jackson in a microwave and 2 mins later BOOM! out pops a Kyrie Irving, guaranteed. But some fans for whatever reason like to go the Crock Pot route hoping it looks like the picture in the recipe book after 8 hours.
Obviously for Denver, getting Irving makes a lot more sense than the Suns, because they have established players already. Getting Irving for the Suns, is only a luxury his owner would love to have if the price is low...
Well unfortunalty for the Suns they dont have a option of what the price will be. The Cavs will say the price and if its not something the owner of the Suns wants to do--they dont get Kyrie and hes off to another team or back on the Cavs roster until next year.
Something tells me though a a small market team who is desperate for the exposure, publicity and revenue Kyrie will give their franchise will cave at the end of the day and end up giving the Cavs their asking price.
MotownMadness wrote:Superhuman wrote:I bet my two left nuts that if a trade were to happen, Jackson would absolutely not be part of the deal.
Suns would not trade away a promising young prospect like JJ, for two season of Kyrie. Even with that sliver of hope he'd resign, don't risk it. And I think Suns management knows how majority of fans feel. Continue development of the exciting young guns rather than be stuck in 8th seed purgatory. Hope that in 4-5 years the western conference wont be as tough as it is now. If the cavs won't budge, then hang up the phone. Let them deal with the Kyrie situation themselves.
I'm just not sure the Suns FO thinks the same way. They seem to try and rush the process every FA trying to sign older All Star caliber players but just strike out. They seem like a FO that is hell bent on trying to take a shortcut and not one that wants to rebuild properly.
MEGAQUIB wrote:No chance the Cavs can get Jackson. I bet the most PHX is willing to offer is Bledsoe, Warren, Bender
Luke wrote:LivingLegend wrote:Luke wrote:
Obviously for Denver, getting Irving makes a lot more sense than the Suns, because they have established players already. Getting Irving for the Suns, is only a luxury his owner would love to have if the price is low...
Well unfortunalty for the Suns they dont have a option of what the price will be. The Cavs will say the price and if its not something the owner of the Suns wants to do--they dont get Kyrie and hes off to another team or back on the Cavs roster until next year.
Something tells me though a a small market team who is desperate for the exposure, publicity and revenue Kyrie will give their franchise will cave at the end of the day and end up giving the Cavs their asking price.
Where do you get that the Suns are desperate? Suns fans posting here are telling us the opposite. Also, Irving is redundant with Booker...
Superhuman wrote:MotownMadness wrote:Superhuman wrote:I bet my two left nuts that if a trade were to happen, Jackson would absolutely not be part of the deal.
Suns would not trade away a promising young prospect like JJ, for two season of Kyrie. Even with that sliver of hope he'd resign, don't risk it. And I think Suns management knows how majority of fans feel. Continue development of the exciting young guns rather than be stuck in 8th seed purgatory. Hope that in 4-5 years the western conference wont be as tough as it is now. If the cavs won't budge, then hang up the phone. Let them deal with the Kyrie situation themselves.
I'm just not sure the Suns FO thinks the same way. They seem to try and rush the process every FA trying to sign older All Star caliber players but just strike out. They seem like a FO that is hell bent on trying to take a shortcut and not one that wants to rebuild properly.
I like to believe they're getting smarter and realize that. And after having Blake Griffin, LMA, and Lebron toying with us during free agency last couple years, they know they can't rely on attracting free agents. And the likelihood of Kyrie resigning during free agency is like 30%. So when in doubt, go the 76ers route.
Plus a Kyrie/Booker backcourt would work great in 2k, but in reality they are both poor passers and defenders and don't really compliment each other at all.
JHFVF07 wrote:Superhuman wrote:MotownMadness wrote: I'm just not sure the Suns FO thinks the same way. They seem to try and rush the process every FA trying to sign older All Star caliber players but just strike out. They seem like a FO that is hell bent on trying to take a shortcut and not one that wants to rebuild properly.
I like to believe they're getting smarter and realize that. And after having Blake Griffin, LMA, and Lebron toying with us during free agency last couple years, they know they can't rely on attracting free agents. And the likelihood of Kyrie resigning during free agency is like 30%. So when in doubt, go the 76ers route.
Plus a Kyrie/Booker backcourt would work great in 2k, but in reality they are both poor passers and defenders and don't really compliment each other at all.
Curious, they could be a great backourt if Jackson develops into a better version of Iguodala.
Superhuman wrote:JHFVF07 wrote:Superhuman wrote:I like to believe they're getting smarter and realize that. And after having Blake Griffin, LMA, and Lebron toying with us during free agency last couple years, they know they can't rely on attracting free agents. And the likelihood of Kyrie resigning during free agency is like 30%. So when in doubt, go the 76ers route.
Plus a Kyrie/Booker backcourt would work great in 2k, but in reality they are both poor passers and defenders and don't really compliment each other at all.
Curious, they could be a great backourt if Jackson develops into a better version of Iguodala.
Hmm, or maybe a poor man's Lebron