Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion #5: A Serving of Irving?

[Kerrsed]

I mean, there is no reason whatsoever for McD or James Jones to do that...that has zero impact on a trade. Even if Irving really did want to be here (if he did he probably would have mentioned us on his list) and talked to everyone in the organization, what does that have to do with Cleveland deciding to trade him to us? If anything, it would run the risk of making us look desperate for reaching out to him and we might lose leverage.

I mean I just don't see a couple of players talking having any impact on anything regarding where he gets traded.

We are still probably the most likely destination. None of that matters. If we really want him, we can probably get him, but I personally would walk away. I think there is zero chance McD or James Jones are secretly trying to communicate with Irving as it really doesn't serve a point, and would be a little ridiculous.

I disagree.

Irving came out with his "List of Prefered teams". We wernt on it. The idea that our FO wants to gauge his interest in being on the Suns or having a future with him (past the 2 years he would be signed for) isnt pointless. Sure, its not going to effect if Cleveland trades him, but it would at least let us know if he would be happy or even just OK playing here. Ive seen plenty of posters state that they dont want to trade for him because they feel like he wouldnt want to be here, going from a title contender to a team in the middle of rebuilding. I bet it would make our FO feel a hell of a lot better if they knew the answer to that question. And sure, he stated he wont re-sign with any team that trades for him, because honestly, who would when you can get more money on the free market, but at least we could get some kind of gist of if he would even be remotely interested in spending the next say 7 years here.

Maybe he doesnt. That fine, at least our FO would know and not pursue the trade than, knowing he will be out in 2 years and his gameplay for those few years might not be his best (Or be GREAT as he would be playing for a big $ deal). Maybe he says he doesnt mind and likes what we are trying to do here. Who knows, but i think that any team that is making a big trade (like this would be) would want to at least talk to or get some kind of info back from that player prior to trading for them. IMHO the idea of the FO not wanting to talk to Irving beforehand is ridiculous.

And yes, who knows if anyone (Jones or Booker) has talked to him or made an attempt to. I stated in my original post that I could see it happening. Not that it DID happen. The only thing that DID happen was Booker and Irving linked up on Instagram at a very questionable time period. Do i think they did so for a certain reason, hell yes. Do i know for sure? Nope, just pure speculation on my part. But it isnt unheard of to have these young athletes using social media to talk and plan things out with other players.

[bwgood77]

I mean, there is no reason whatsoever for McD or James Jones to do that...that has zero impact on a trade. Even if Irving really did want to be here (if he did he probably would have mentioned us on his list) and talked to everyone in the organization, what does that have to do with Cleveland deciding to trade him to us? If anything, it would run the risk of making us look desperate for reaching out to him and we might lose leverage.

I mean I just don't see a couple of players talking having any impact on anything regarding where he gets traded.

We are still probably the most likely destination. None of that matters. If we really want him, we can probably get him, but I personally would walk away. I think there is zero chance McD or James Jones are secretly trying to communicate with Irving as it really doesn't serve a point, and would be a little ridiculous.

I disagree.

Irving came out with his "List of Prefered teams". We wernt on it. The idea that our FO wants to gauge his interest in being on the Suns or having a future with him (past the 2 years he would be signed for) isnt pointless. Sure, its not going to effect if Cleveland trades him, but it would at least let us know if he would be happy or even just OK playing here. Ive seen plenty of posters state that they dont want to trade for him because they feel like he wouldnt want to be here, going from a title contender to a team in the middle of rebuilding. I bet it would make our FO feel a hell of a lot better if they knew the answer to that question. And sure, he stated he wont re-sign with any team that trades for him, because honestly, who would when you can get more money on the free market, but at least we could get some kind of gist of if he would even be remotely interested in spending the next say 7 years here.

Maybe he doesnt. That fine, at least our FO would know and not pursue the trade than, knowing he will be out in 2 years and his gameplay for those few years might not be his best (Or be GREAT as he would be playing for a big $ deal). Maybe he says he doesnt mind and likes what we are trying to do here. Who knows, but i think that any team that is making a big trade (like this would be) would want to at least talk to or get some kind of info back from that player prior to trading for them. IMHO the idea of the FO not wanting to talk to Irving beforehand is ridiculous.

And yes, who knows if anyone (Jones or Booker) has talked to him or made an attempt to. I stated in my original post that I could see it happening. Not that it DID happen. The only thing that DID happen was Booker and Irving linked up on Instagram at a very questionable time period. Do i think they did so for a certain reason, hell yes. Do i know for sure? Nope, just pure speculation on my part. But it isnt unheard of to have these young athletes using social media to talk and plan things out with other players.

Any GM putting much stock in what a guy would say to a team 2 years before free agency would not be a smart GM, just based on recent happenings. He already had a list, and then later said he wouldn't commit to staying with a team after two years. He will have no idea how much he would like it in Phx. An instagram message to a player he doesn't know and just started following wouldn't be too convincing.

You really think Booker calls up McD and says "Hey, got a response from Kyrie on instagram...he's good to stay in 2 years....Book it!" I mean do you know how ridiculous that sounds?

[Kerrsed]

Any GM putting much stock in what a guy would say to a team 2 years before free agency would not be a smart GM, just based on recent happenings. He already had a list, and then later said he wouldn't commit to staying with a team after two years. He will have no idea how much he would like it in Phx. An instagram message to a player he doesn't know and just started following wouldn't be too convincing.

You really think Booker calls up McD and says "Hey, got a response from Kyrie on instagram...he's good to stay in 2 years....Book it!" I mean do you know how ridiculous that sounds?

But see your trying to put words in my mouth. Im not saying that Bookers messaging Kyrie and asking him for a commitment after his deals up. Not at all. Yes, thats ridiculous.

What im saying is that it is in the teams best interest to do what they can to gauge Irvings interest on playing here. You give any GM the opportunity to speak with a player they are looking at trading for (specially giving up good assets) and 30 out of 30 would take that opportunity, rather than just go ahead and make the trade without.

[bwgood77]

Any GM putting much stock in what a guy would say to a team 2 years before free agency would not be a smart GM, just based on recent happenings. He already had a list, and then later said he wouldn't commit to staying with a team after two years. He will have no idea how much he would like it in Phx. An instagram message to a player he doesn't know and just started following wouldn't be too convincing.

You really think Booker calls up McD and says "Hey, got a response from Kyrie on instagram...he's good to stay in 2 years....Book it!" I mean do you know how ridiculous that sounds?

But see your trying to put words in my mouth. Im not saying that Bookers messaging Kyrie and asking him for a commitment after his deals up. Not at all. Yes, thats ridiculous.

What im saying is that it is in the teams best interest to do what they can to gauge Irvings interest on playing here. You give any GM the opportunity to speak with a player they are looking at trading for (specially giving up good assets) and 30 out of 30 would take that opportunity, rather than just go ahead and make the trade without.

I would still take anything Kyrie says with a grain of salt, and thus wouldn't run the risk of contacting him to talk to him. If he wants out that bad he will probably tell anyone anything. I certainly wouldn't switch my decision on what I would give up for him based on anything he said.

[GoblinytE]

I know many find brawadis annoying but anyone who is a hardcore fan like myself is cool in my book. Obviously he couldnt out his "DeepThroat" ..but Ill admit I believe His info and when He posted the kyrie/book pic stating soon..I took it as a Wojbomb or when Gambo breaksnews. So to tbh I think Lebron wants Bled and anything else is a plus to save face. I think a deal has already been struck and the past week or two has been the Cavs Media/FO doing research and possible backlash prep. Cavs Media teams getting info out there and getting reporters to do their thing. Some stupid stuff thats getting out. "Booker this and Jackson that.." lol...all this east coast bias is ridiculous...

I think it's safe to say that many who post on our forum are superfans. To call him a bigger one than many long term fans who post here is a stretch. He probably hasn't even been a fan THAT long, relatively speaking.

There is zero chance this guy has inside info. You think McD is talking to him? There are not leaks in our front office.

He invests a lot of time trying to get followers. I bet he gained quite a few after posting his "inside news".

That's not to say there won't be a trade. I'm sure if there is he will make his claim about being right...even though I think he said it would happen very soon quite a while back.

I mean I think it's safe to say even Booker has no clue about anything regarding the potential trade.

I dont think he always gets insider biz ..but He is tight with Bled and Booker plus other Suns players...the FO knows Him and was given special treatment on visits. He also messages with Bledsoe's brother I recall. Every youtuber wants more of everything...I get it...but He does have relationships that could 411 but if He shares it..bye bye source/friendship.

[Christine-In-AZ]

Sometime between tomorrow and 6 months from tomorrow...

-Bledsoe is a Cavalier
-Irving is not a Cavalier or a Sun
-Suns add a new young player with great potential...might trade one also
-Cavs(Lebron) make another big move (probably Love) with the Warriors in mind

...after that, Lebron decides he's better off staying in Cleveland through '18-'19. Win or lose, (relatively) easy trips to the Finals are hard to walk away from, and staying in Cleveland (even 1 more year) when everyone thinks you're leaving, is the more compelling narrative for James's legacy. LA or NY can wait one more year.

[lilfishi22]

Any GM putting much stock in what a guy would say to a team 2 years before free agency would not be a smart GM, just based on recent happenings. He already had a list, and then later said he wouldn't commit to staying with a team after two years. He will have no idea how much he would like it in Phx. An instagram message to a player he doesn't know and just started following wouldn't be too convincing.

You really think Booker calls up McD and says "Hey, got a response from Kyrie on instagram...he's good to stay in 2 years....Book it!" I mean do you know how ridiculous that sounds?

But see your trying to put words in my mouth. Im not saying that Bookers messaging Kyrie and asking him for a commitment after his deals up. Not at all. Yes, thats ridiculous.

What im saying is that it is in the teams best interest to do what they can to gauge Irvings interest on playing here. You give any GM the opportunity to speak with a player they are looking at trading for (specially giving up good assets) and 30 out of 30 would take that opportunity, rather than just go ahead and make the trade without.

I would still take anything Kyrie says with a grain of salt, and thus wouldn't run the risk of contacting him to talk to him. If he wants out that bad he will probably tell anyone anything. I certainly wouldn't switch my decision on what I would give up for him based on anything he said.

I'm betting there are teams he straight up has zero interest in playing for, so I don't think it's as simple as he wants out and he'd happily play for any team that trades for him (with or without his long term commitment). He can't and won't give a commitment past Year 2 but I think it's important to at least gauge his interest in playing with the Suns in these two years. If he sees a good fit with the team and potential in the players he's playing with, I think that's great information to have for a McD.

Officially he has no say or power in what team he's traded to but privately, he can influence his ways to certain teams. He can do something as subtle as following Booker on IG to show at least he's a fan of Booker and perhaps it's an opportunity for Booker to sliiiiiide on into them DM's. Or he could let certain teams know through back channels that he doesn't see himself long term there.

What we know officially is probably the tip of the iceberg. What is said behind closed doors and through digital means is how stars influence where they go. The fact that we're still a front runner to me signals that he's at least giving us consideration.

[8on]

what do you guys think?

PHX out: Bledsoe, Chandler
PHX in: Adams, Christon, Singler

We get our center of the future. If we get Ayton or Bamba in the draft, we can always deal Adams to another team pretty easily.

OKC out: Adams, Christon, Singler
OKC in: Aldridge, Chandler

OKC goes all in on the Westbrook era, adding a guy who can be pretty dangerous in the playoffs.

SA out: Aldridge
SA in: Bledsoe

SA gets Bledsoe in exchange for their disgruntled star.

[Puff]

People calling Bender a bust or implying just because we gave Len a chance, we shouldn't give Bender a chance at 19........wow.

Man oh man you guys make a mountain out of mole hill.

I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I have supported him more than most people since we drafted him. However I am a realist and do not put my head in the sand just because I like him and he wears a Phoenix Sun jersey.

His numbers were abysmal by all standards and he was injured for most of his first year in the league, or at least part of it. He also is Euro big man whom have not exactly taken the NBA by storm as of late.

If I am a Cleveland fan I have not been reading all the hype the Suns organization has heaped on this guy. I also am not part of a fan base that has not been to the playoffs in almost of decade. In addition I am a fan of a team that wants to win a title next year. If I am one of them, Bender does not move the needle for me at all. Cavs fans could care less about their long term future. They know their best chance to win another ring is while Lebron is still part of their team.

I also am tired of the worn out reason for supporting guys like Alex Len. This guy cannot even get a contract above the Qualifying offer. Not many quality bigs wait 5 years to become relevant.

Name one starting big man that has waited 5 years to develop into a relevant NBA Player. Please do not use Robin Freaking Lopez as your example. He is adequate at best.

If I am a Cleveland Cavalier fan I would not want Bender as part of a trade for one of my star players in Kyrie Irving. I want something more.

I think Gambo has it right when he says we have 0% chance of getting Kyrie in a Bledsoe - Bender - Miami Pick scenario.

How do you think Bender fits into the Cleveland rotation next year in their attempt to unseat the Warriors?

That is fine with me. Hopefully Bender is not our next Alex Len.

[Shank]

I mean, there is no reason whatsoever for McD or James Jones to do that...that has zero impact on a trade. Even if Irving really did want to be here (if he did he probably would have mentioned us on his list) and talked to everyone in the organization, what does that have to do with Cleveland deciding to trade him to us? If anything, it would run the risk of making us look desperate for reaching out to him and we might lose leverage.

I mean I just don't see a couple of players talking having any impact on anything regarding where he gets traded.

We are still probably the most likely destination. None of that matters. If we really want him, we can probably get him, but I personally would walk away. I think there is zero chance McD or James Jones are secretly trying to communicate with Irving as it really doesn't serve a point, and would be a little ridiculous.

I disagree.

Irving came out with his "List of Prefered teams". We wernt on it. The idea that our FO wants to gauge his interest in being on the Suns or having a future with him (past the 2 years he would be signed for) isnt pointless. Sure, its not going to effect if Cleveland trades him, but it would at least let us know if he would be happy or even just OK playing here. Ive seen plenty of posters state that they dont want to trade for him because they feel like he wouldnt want to be here, going from a title contender to a team in the middle of rebuilding. I bet it would make our FO feel a hell of a lot better if they knew the answer to that question. And sure, he stated he wont re-sign with any team that trades for him, because honestly, who would when you can get more money on the free market, but at least we could get some kind of gist of if he would even be remotely interested in spending the next say 7 years here.

Maybe he doesnt. That fine, at least our FO would know and not pursue the trade than, knowing he will be out in 2 years and his gameplay for those few years might not be his best (Or be GREAT as he would be playing for a big $ deal). Maybe he says he doesnt mind and likes what we are trying to do here. Who knows, but i think that any team that is making a big trade (like this would be) would want to at least talk to or get some kind of info back from that player prior to trading for them. IMHO the idea of the FO not wanting to talk to Irving beforehand is ridiculous.

And yes, who knows if anyone (Jones or Booker) has talked to him or made an attempt to. I stated in my original post that I could see it happening. Not that it DID happen. The only thing that DID happen was Booker and Irving linked up on Instagram at a very questionable time period. Do i think they did so for a certain reason, hell yes. Do i know for sure? Nope, just pure speculation on my part. But it isnt unheard of to have these young athletes using social media to talk and plan things out with other players.

"The only thing that DID happen was Booker and Irving linked up on Instagram"

Lol "linked up" Booker started following Kyrie and Kyrie does not even follow him back.

[JMac1]

People calling Bender a bust or implying just because we gave Len a chance, we shouldn't give Bender a chance at 19........wow.

Man oh man you guys make a mountain out of mole hill.

I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I have supported him more than most people since we drafted him. However I am a realist and do not put my head in the sand just because I like him and he wears a Phoenix Sun jersey.

His numbers were abysmal by all standards and he was injured for most of his first year in the league, or at least part of it. He also is Euro big man whom have not exactly taken the NBA by storm as of late.

If I am a Cleveland fan I have not been reading all the hype the Suns organization has heaped on this guy. I also am not part of a fan base that has not been to the playoffs in almost of decade. In addition I am a fan of a team that wants to win a title next year. If I am one of them, Bender does not move the needle for me at all. Cavs fans could care less about their long term future. They know their best chance to win another ring is while Lebron is still part of their team.

I also am tired of the worn out reason for supporting guys like Alex Len. This guy cannot even get a contract above the Qualifying offer. Not many quality bigs wait 5 years to become relevant.

Name one starting big man that has waited 5 years to develop into a relevant NBA Player. Please do not use Robin Freaking Lopez as your example. He is adequate at best.

If I am a Cleveland Cavalier fan I would not want Bender as part of a trade for one of my star players in Kyrie Irving. I want something more.

I think Gambo has it right when he says we have 0% chance of getting Kyrie in a Bledsoe - Bender - Miami Pick scenario.

How do you think Bender fits into the Cleveland rotation next year in their attempt to unseat the Warriors?

That is fine with me. Hopefully Bender is not our next Alex Len.

Well go to the Cavs board......the last two guys who posted said they wouldn't mind Bender and explained why. Second.....it's funny how you say you are a realist, however you don't put your head in the sand. So if people here believe it's to early to give up on Bender, we are putting our heads in the sand? Just because we want to keep him doesn't mean we haven't noticed his shortcomings. Maybe some here believe that his shortcoming aren't going to last forever.

[bwgood77]

People calling Bender a bust or implying just because we gave Len a chance, we shouldn't give Bender a chance at 19........wow.

Man oh man you guys make a mountain out of mole hill.

I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I have supported him more than most people since we drafted him. However I am a realist and do not put my head in the sand just because I like him and he wears a Phoenix Sun jersey.

His numbers were abysmal by all standards and he was injured for most of his first year in the league, or at least part of it. He also is Euro big man whom have not exactly taken the NBA by storm as of late.

If I am a Cleveland fan I have not been reading all the hype the Suns organization has heaped on this guy. I also am not part of a fan base that has not been to the playoffs in almost of decade. In addition I am a fan of a team that wants to win a title next year. If I am one of them, Bender does not move the needle for me at all. Cavs fans could care less about their long term future. They know their best chance to win another ring is while Lebron is still part of their team.

I also am tired of the worn out reason for supporting guys like Alex Len. This guy cannot even get a contract above the Qualifying offer. Not many quality bigs wait 5 years to become relevant.

Name one starting big man that has waited 5 years to develop into a relevant NBA Player. Please do not use Robin Freaking Lopez as your example. He is adequate at best.

If I am a Cleveland Cavalier fan I would not want Bender as part of a trade for one of my star players in Kyrie Irving. I want something more.

I think Gambo has it right when he says we have 0% chance of getting Kyrie in a Bledsoe - Bender - Miami Pick scenario.

How do you think Bender fits into the Cleveland rotation next year in their attempt to unseat the Warriors?

That is fine with me. Hopefully Bender is not our next Alex Len.

Gambo thinks there is no chance we get Irving unless Booker, Jackson, or our first round pick is included. And maybe the last two combined.

I agree that Bender makes zero sense for Cleveland. Looking at raw stats like you are does not paint a pretty picture. Watching him and looking at on/off #s shows some good things. Comparing him to Len is pointless. They are completely different, and while I think we should hold onto Len, that was one of the worst drafts ever consensus wise (though some good bigs picked later have impressed).

I agree though, that if I was Cleveland I wouldn't make the trade for Bender, Chriss, Warren or whoever we throw in there because those players are pointless for them...they are not pointless for us.

We don't know what type of negotiations Len is in. Noel hasn't gotten an offer either....it's likely in a holding pattern until he accepts. No one will rush into anything. Few restricted free agents get offers from other teams unless they are max offers. No one needs centers.

[JMac1]

Wow that Len draft sucked hard!!

[thamadkant]

This ain't gonna happen and I'm totally cool with it.

Trust the timeline.

Keep all of our youth and get two top 10 picks in this upcoming (and likely loaded) daft.

Only move I want to make is maybe moving Bledsoe for a youngster.

That heat pick is going to be outside the top 15...

And the tanking out East will be ridiculous next season. Good thing when a tanker goes against a tanker out east, one of them add wins and they meet each other over 40 times a season. Suns are going to be against west teams for over 40 games.

[Moochthemonkey]

what do you guys think?

PHX out: Bledsoe, Chandler
PHX in: Adams, Christon, Singler

We get our center of the future. If we get Ayton or Bamba in the draft, we can always deal Adams to another team pretty easily.

OKC out: Adams, Christon, Singler
OKC in: Aldridge, Chandler

OKC goes all in on the Westbrook era, adding a guy who can be pretty dangerous in the playoffs.

SA out: Aldridge
SA in: Bledsoe

SA gets Bledsoe in exchange for their disgruntled star.

so we get an old school center (who is an average rebounder for his position at best- averaged about 4 less rpg than Chandler last year) who is due 100 million over the next four years (his contract doesn't make him easily tradeable), a 2nd round draft pick with dyslexic parents (try spelling his first name backwards), and 3 more years of a tweener forward who averages 2.75 ppg and dons a school shooter haircut. to me, this a prime example of a 'just because' trade. unless there's an incoming 1st included, and this is the best the Suns can acquire for Chandler and Bledsoe, it would be wiser to just let them expire.

[Kerrsed]

Some interesting trade ideas on the trade board.

To Cleveland:
Eric Bledsoe
Nik Vucevic
Evan Fournier

To Orlando:
Dragan Bender
Miami 2018 1st
Iman Shumpert
Channing Frye

To Phoenix:
Kyrie Irving

The Suns get their man in Irving to run the show with Devin Booker

the Cavs turn Irving into a fringe all star point guard, a great scoring guard, and a dynamic offensive big off the bench. this makes the Cavs the deepest team in the league for one more run at GSW.

Thompson/Vucevic
Love/Green
Lebron/Korver
Fournier/Smith
Blesdoe/Rose

the Magic go nuclear. Bender/Gordon/Isaac could be a dynamic front court going into the future.

This second one i really like but had to alter it for him as it had to be split into 2 trade so Noel could be included (And to get Dallas to agree to it):

Ok, killing two birds with one stone.

Breaking up the trade to make it work, and Dallas dumping salary.

So trade #1. http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yc5adr7l
Dallas gets: Irving
Cleveland gets: Bledsoe/Curry/Dallas future 1st(Whenever)/Miami 2018 1st
Phoenix gets: Smith Jr/Powell

Trade #2.
Dallas gets: Chandler
Phoenix gets: Noel (S&T)

I took out the 2nd round picks from the Suns, as they are now also saddled taking on Powell's bad contract.

(Interesting note, after doing this trade Suns would not give Len his QO making him a FA that Dallas could end up signing while under the cap).

So we have a very creative Bled/Bender/MIA 1st for Irving and a Bled/Chandler/MIA 1st for DSJ/Noel/Powell.

[Kerrsed]

so we get an old school center (who is an average rebounder for his position at best- averaged about 4 less rpg than Chandler last year) who is due 100 million over the next four years (his contract doesn't make him easily tradeable), a 2nd round draft pick with dyslexic parents (try spelling his first name backwards), and 3 more years of a tweener forward who averages 2.75 ppg and dons a school shooter haircut. to me, this a prime example of a 'just because' trade. unless there's an incoming 1st included, and this is the best the Suns can acquire for Chandler and Bledsoe, it would be wiser to just let them expire.

Cmon, thats not cool!

Spoiler:

[Moochthemonkey]

so we get an old school center (who is an average rebounder for his position at best- averaged about 4 less rpg than Chandler last year) who is due 100 million over the next four years (his contract doesn't make him easily tradeable), a 2nd round draft pick with dyslexic parents (try spelling his first name backwards), and 3 more years of a tweener forward who averages 2.75 ppg and dons a school shooter haircut. to me, this a prime example of a 'just because' trade. unless there's an incoming 1st included, and this is the best the Suns can acquire for Chandler and Bledsoe, it would be wiser to just let them expire.

Cmon, thats not cool!

Spoiler:

oh good he changed it...

Spoiler:

was my remark in poor taste for these forums??

[Kerrsed]

Spoiler:

was my remark in poor taste for these forums??

Eh, not really, maybe a bit questionable. I just wanted to use it so i could post his new goofyass picture. For some reason his new one makes him look German in my opinion.

[DirtyDez]

If McD ups the ante for the next round of negotiations I think he'd also part with the 21' Mia pick as his "max" offer. For a general manager there's no loyalty to draft picks and he probably doesn't want the young guys' names out there in rumors for too much longer. Bledsoe is a pros pro so he can handle it but it's hard to say how we think Bender and Chriss are taking it.

Can we protect the 21' pick top-3?