Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion #5: A Serving of Irving?

[thamadkant]

barring injury, the Warriors will NOT lose to Cavs in the next 2-3 years assuming the Warriors keep their core, its not just talent... BUT, style of play.

Cavs don't play defense anymore and their offense is pretty much Lebron creating... and then Irving taking over when he's resting. No one else creates plays outside Lebron... consistently anyways. They got lucky last year and I was happy for them, hated the Warriors cockiness. I'm saying that because Irving KNOWS the team is sunk once Lebron leaves and Lue is still there....


Either way, to be honest,I think even if Suns get Irving I still really think Suns could use one of the big me in the upcoming draft... Len is crap and Chandler is done.... although I feel that there are some hidden gems that could flourish with minutes like John Henson.

[sunwillrise0304]

anyone like this???

Suns: mudiay, shumpert , denver 2018 pick
Cavs: gharris, bledsoe, faried, hernangomez
Denver: irving


maybe cavs can dump frye to us too if they want and we give back them millsap to cut salary

[Kerrsed]

anyone like this???

Suns: mudiay, shumpert , denver 2018 pick
Cavs: gharris, bledsoe, faried, hernangomez
Denver: irving


maybe cavs can dump frye to us too if they want and we give back them millsap to cut salary

If we couldnt find a better trade......i'd do it. Mudiay hasnt been good in Denver, but coming into the league he was known as a good defender, having good court vision, and a high basketball IQ. His only real knock was his shooting. He supposedly has been working on his shooting this offseason, and preformed GREAT in the NBA Africa game yesterday (22 points on 52%, 9 assists, 8 rebounds, and 3 steals) against some pretty elite NBA competition (Dirk/Porzingis/Cousins/Kemba/McCollum).

I'd take a shot on him, having a 6'5 defensive PG next to Booker would be ideal. So yeah....Bledsoe for Mudiay and a 1st, i'd be down.

[Mulhollanddrive]

That's worse than what we were offered at the draft.

Bledsoe is getting more lowballed than Irving.

[sunwillrise0304]

That's worse than what we were offered at the draft.

Bledsoe is getting more lowballed than Irving.

did denver really offer mudiay + 13 for bled to us???

i heard someone say we offer to denver and be rejected, really confused

i sure would do this deal now if so

[NavLDO]

Read on Twitter

First Wolfson says "the Suns are the team to watch" because our offer is pretty good even without Booker or Jackson. Now Gambo thinks that everyone else has a better offer

The problem with our offer is that Bender/Chriss are really raw.

Josh Jackson looks more NBA ready for a playoff team, he showed that on the Summer League. He can be a good option for them now as a backup and long term as a cornerstone if/when LeBron goes to another team.

I don't want to give up Jackson, so I would improve the pick that they are gonna get. I am pretty sure that with Irving and Jackson next year we are not gonna be bottom five in the league. There are so many terrible teams in the East, so we can trade our 2018 pick with some protection.

THANK YOU!! Finally, someone else who gets it.

Kyrie
Booker

...then, either, depending how Jackson/Bender develops, and how best goes...

Warren / Jackson
Bender / Warren (I keep putting him here, because I feel we put the best 5 players on the court, and with him now over 6'9" 240lbs, he at least has the required size!)
Chandler / Sauce

So, we have this team that starts playing pretty well. The trade deadline approaches in Feb and, just for 'shins and griggles', let's say we are 27-25,and currently in the 8th seed....I know, I know, all the nay-sayers say NO WAY...but we never know. Warren was killing it 'til he got injured. What is Jackson comes out playing like ROY? What if Bender makes that turn, and starts producing offensively, to go with his defense...a lot of 'what if's, but not all that has to happen.

Anyway, back to what I was saying; we are 27-25, and predictably, the 5 is our weakest area, and we are able to trade for one, because now, we are not a 'rebuilding' team, we are a 'developing/competing' team. Now, we still have the assets to trade to a rebuilding team with a nice Center (2021 Mia Pick, etc.)

Then, the draft comes along, and we traded the Mia pick for Irving, and they went from 41-41 to 28-54, and have now, via us, traded that 6th pick to the Cavs, while we made the 7th seed, and are drafting 17th.

Yeah, I know, not likely, but not near impossible, either. Point is, if we do not get Kyrie because of the pick we were willing to give, then that means our FO does not have a lot faith, and let a few slots in an unknown draft get in the way of acquiring an All-Star, who at the very least, will draw in talent to the team.

[King4Day]

That's worse than what we were offered at the draft.

Bledsoe is getting more lowballed than Irving.

did denver really offer mudiay + 13 for bled to us???

i heard someone say we offer to denver and be rejected, really confused

i sure would do this deal now if so

It was all rumors so no one will ever really know.
I heard the 13/Mudiay for EB as well. Never heard anything beyond that. In the end, it's better we didn't take it if he could potentially be a key cog in an irving deal

[BobbieL]

anyone like this???

Suns: mudiay, shumpert , denver 2018 pick
Cavs: gharris, bledsoe, faried, hernangomez
Denver: irving


maybe cavs can dump frye to us too if they want and we give back them millsap to cut salary

If we couldnt find a better trade......i'd do it. Mudiay hasnt been good in Denver, but coming into the league he was known as a good defender, having good court vision, and a high basketball IQ. His only real knock was his shooting. He supposedly has been working on his shooting this offseason, and preformed GREAT in the NBA Africa game yesterday (22 points on 52%, 9 assists, 8 rebounds, and 3 steals) against some pretty elite NBA competition (Dirk/Porzingis/Cousins/Kemba/McCollum).

I'd take a shot on him, having a 6'5 defensive PG next to Booker would be ideal. So yeah....Bledsoe for Mudiay and a 1st, i'd be down.

give the Suns Harris
Give Cleveland the Denver pick
take on Fryes contract if need be to facilitate

[ThunderBolt]

what do you guys think?

PHX out: Bledsoe, Chandler
PHX in: Adams, Christon, Singler

We get our center of the future. If we get Ayton or Bamba in the draft, we can always deal Adams to another team pretty easily.

OKC out: Adams, Christon, Singler
OKC in: Aldridge, Chandler

OKC goes all in on the Westbrook era, adding a guy who can be pretty dangerous in the playoffs.

SA out: Aldridge
SA in: Bledsoe

SA gets Bledsoe in exchange for their disgruntled star.

so we get an old school center (who is an average rebounder for his position at best- averaged about 4 less rpg than Chandler last year) who is due 100 million over the next four years (his contract doesn't make him easily tradeable), a 2nd round draft pick with dyslexic parents (try spelling his first name backwards), and 3 more years of a tweener forward who averages 2.75 ppg and dons a school shooter haircut. to me, this a prime example of a 'just because' trade. unless there's an incoming 1st included, and this is the best the Suns can acquire for Chandler and Bledsoe, it would be wiser to just let them expire.

Semaj and Singler are two of the worst players in the league but Adams is a better than average rebounder. The numbers on him aren't representative of his rebounding skills. He conceded multiple rebounds per game to Westbrook.

[NavLDO]

Spoiler:

With the shady stuff McD has been pulling, it wouldnt surprise me if Jones has been DMing Irving on the side. Sure its against the rules, but eh... whos to know? And they were just former teammates like months ago, so who says a friend cant call a friend and say "Hi, whats new?" every once and a while?

Welcome to the McD Grey Zone!

Just want to make it clear that I approve McD

Well, at least the Kyrie talk kept us busy for a few weeks, however, I'm done. Football season is here, desperation time is training camp for Cleveland. After all of the dust-up Kyrie has caused, I dare them bring him back to camp. Lebron won't be the only person that would have issue with him; heck, the city of Cleveland has already put out at video of disgust towards the guy.

Bledsoe, Miami, and Chris not Bender.... take it or leave it. Nothing changes for me. I still can't wait to see Jackson and Booker and Bender play.....and suck at the same time getting a great pick next year.

I just want to enjoy watching my team play, and that doesn't have to and won't involve winning a title in the next few years.....I could care less right now.

Again, I just don't dig being in the wondering and begging situation for players. You are Sun or you are not a Sun. Jackson and Booker and Chriss and Bender are Suns for a long time if the FO wants them to be Suns. If they develop like they can, I think they would want to be Suns too.

Cleveland and Kyrie can jump in a Lake Erie.

QFTMFT

Maybe the Cavs really do have better offers from everyone else, but if that's the case, then I think it's best to walk away.

Giving up Bender in this deal would be a real blow IMO.

Gilbert did this franchise a favor. We get to keep Bender

I am sure glad we didn't give up Alex Len after his first year. Of course he was picked at 5 rather than 4.

Yeah, I have high hopes like most for Bender. However if we are honest he looks more like a bust than a legit NBA player at this point in his career. I imagine the Cleveland fans want no part of Bender.

But remember. Len was 20, and had a college season under his belt; Bender was 18 and did not, so a little bit of a difference there. Plus, Bender has shown some elite athleticism, not to mention, he was out for 2 months.

Anyway, I'm not discounting what you are saying; Bender could bust out, but I wouldn't use Len as a good Comparison. Plus, I still think Len has a spot in this league, if a team would commit to give him starter minutes every day, I think he might turn out to be better than most feel.

[JMac1]

Spoiler:

Just want to make it clear that I approve McD



QFTMFT



Gilbert did this franchise a favor. We get to keep Bender

I am sure glad we didn't give up Alex Len after his first year. Of course he was picked at 5 rather than 4.

Yeah, I have high hopes like most for Bender. However if we are honest he looks more like a bust than a legit NBA player at this point in his career. I imagine the Cleveland fans want no part of Bender.

But remember. Len was 20, and had a college season under his belt; Bender was 18 and did not, so a little bit of a difference there. Plus, Bender has shown some elite athleticism, not to mention, he was out for 2 months.

Anyway, I'm not discounting what you are saying; Bender could bust out, but I wouldn't use Len as a good Comparison. Plus, I still think Len has a spot in this league, if a team would commit to give him starter minutes every day, I think he might turn out to be better than most feel.

Len is definitely a decent starter. A lot of people are upset he isn't better than Gobert or Gianni's because he went before them so because of this he should be discarded. I'm totally cool with giving him starter minutes. He's mobile, he can rebound, he can shoot freethrows, and defend adequately enough for me. He is extremely young for a Center too.

That is another reason I'm ok trading Chriss. I'd prefer Bender and Len at the 4 and 5, with JJ at the 3 and Booker at the 2..... totally solid for a rebuilding team.

[Hesh]

Len has shown what his potential can be and it's damn good. In my opinion, if he were on another team with more structure, better development coaches and a system that truly utilizes it's players to their strengths, Len would most likely flourish. At the very least, they would teach him how to catch a pass

[darealjuice]

What potential has Len showed? He's the just about the exact same player he was when he came into the league. Dude is still an FA for a reason.

[TOO]

anyone like this???

Suns: mudiay, shumpert , denver 2018 pick
Cavs: gharris, bledsoe, faried, hernangomez
Denver: irving


maybe cavs can dump frye to us too if they want and we give back them millsap to cut salary

That's a terrible deal for the Suns.

[Hesh]

I don't think many teams are willing to throw big money at "potential" this point in time considering the cap has gone down, bad contracts from last season and since he's also a RFA they would have to overpay just a bit.

He rebounds fairly well and is always going after boards, his size and length alone give him the advantage over opponents. Has a soft touch around the rim, decent mid-range game with a nice stroke, just needs to work on becoming consistent. He's shown in the previous season that he can protect the paint fairly well, his second season was an indication of that, even though he's regressed from that point. I just think there's more factors that have hindered his development such as the state of the team these past 2 seasons.

[BobbieL]

Len has shown what his potential can be and it's damn good. In my opinion, if he were on another team with more structure, better development coaches and a system that truly utilizes it's players to their strengths, Len would most likely flourish. At the very least, they would teach him how to catch a pass

So far , do not love Len - but I am okay with a two year deal 15m plus a team option in year 3.

[darealjuice]

He honestly doesn't have soft touch or a decent mid-range game, and his terrible hands make him an inconsistent roll man. He shoots like 30% on jump shots for his career, and he'll never be a good shooter until he stops fading back every time he shoots. I'm fine keeping him since the market appears to be pretty dead for him and he'll likely be cheap, but I think he's destined to be a career back-up if all he brings is rebounding and interior defense in the current NBA.

[BobbieL]

He honestly doesn't have soft touch or a decent mid-range game, and his terrible hands make him an inconsistent roll man. He shoots like 30% on jump shots for his career, and he'll never be a good shooter until he stops fading back every time he shoots. I'm fine keeping him since the market appears to be pretty dead for him and he'll likely be cheap, but I think he's destined to be a career back-up if all he brings is rebounding and interior defense in the current NBA.

Defense and rebounding can be good things to bring to the team and court. But his terrible hands like you said make him tough to pass too. He brings the ball to the court and it gets stolen

He probably turns it down by 3/25 - third year option is probably about the best he will get. Granted, he can take the QO of 4.5m and best on himself - or he can negotiate a realistic three year deal that gets him money and the Suns a nice price tag

[ImNotMcDiSwear]

He honestly doesn't have soft touch or a decent mid-range game, and his terrible hands make him an inconsistent roll man. He shoots like 30% on jump shots for his career, and he'll never be a good shooter until he stops fading back every time he shoots. I'm fine keeping him since the market appears to be pretty dead for him and he'll likely be cheap, but I think he's destined to be a career back-up if all he brings is rebounding and interior defense in the current NBA.

Defense and rebounding can be good things to bring to the team and court. But his terrible hands like you said make him tough to pass too. He brings the ball to the court and it gets stolen

He probably turns it down by 3/25 - third year option is probably about the best he will get. Granted, he can take the QO of 4.5m and best on himself - or he can negotiate a realistic three year deal that gets him money and the Suns a nice price tag

A Len discussion!

I think Len will turn out to be a valuable defender as better bigs come into the game. There are some bigs who have a field day with him - Gobert - but there are several others that do not.

We're probably not the right place for him. He needs a team that can hide him better on offense and a coach that can get him to sacrifice more on defense. I think Josh might be able to help a bit with the former, as his movement is so desperately needed. But for the latter, I think Alex needs to go find some great coach's third string to work up from. It ain't here.

... Funny. When I went to list the teams that I thought Alex might do better on, this was the list I came up with: Spurs, Celtics, Cavs, Warriors.

Huh.

[NavLDO]

People calling Bender a bust or implying just because we gave Len a chance, we shouldn't give Bender a chance at 19........wow.

Man oh man you guys make a mountain out of mole hill.

I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I repeat I said I have high hopes for him. I have supported him more than most people since we drafted him. However I am a realist and do not put my head in the sand just because I like him and he wears a Phoenix Sun jersey.

His numbers were abysmal by all standards and he was injured for most of his first year in the league, or at least part of it. He also is Euro big man whom have not exactly taken the NBA by storm as of late.

.

Dude...stop while you're behind...

Gobert
Jokic
Porzingis
Valanciunas
Giannis Antetokounmpo (ok, so he's SF/PF hybrid...so is Bender)
Nurkic

Need I go on...