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Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 1

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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#601 » by NavLDO » Mon Aug 28, 2017 11:23 am

AtheJ415 wrote:
NavLDO wrote:
AtheJ415 wrote:
I wouldn't say he's better than Fox offensively. His shooting numbers are worse than Fox's in college overall (TS and EFG). And with Fox you know he can get to the hoop at the NBA level due to his speed, which is very valuable. I can't see anything Smart does at a good level on offense in the NBA aside from FT%. He is a better defender, but he is so bad offensively 3 years in that I would much rather run the chance of Fox developing than Smart. Looking at his numbers he is shooting about the same from everywhere as his rookie year, with roughly the same shooting attempt rate, and with only improvement from the FT line. I would expect at least some legitimate minor improvement by now given how bad he was coming out on the offensive end. Besides, mindset matters and Smart straight chucks on offense. And when you watch him they aren't good shots. He almost has Brandon Knight's mentality imo (Knight takes a couple more shots a game/minute, but Knight is also a much better shooter than Smart sadly).

Another issue is he has a reputation as a winner
(similar to Knight), which means he will get paid a premium that might not be warranted (like Knight), and he is an FA fairly soon.

I honestly wouldn't trade any of our youngsters for him except maybe Peters. Maybe I am being too harsh there, but I would rather Ulis get those minutes. Imo Ulis will end up better than Smart within 2 years. I'd take a pick or Bled way above Smart.

If we could get him for one of the vets, like Dudley or Chandler, okay. Then I'd be alright taking the chance on him given his age with the hopes he becomes anything on offense.


And look at his Playoff Numbers. Stls --> ; eFG% --> ; 3PT% --> ; TRBs --> ; TS% --> ...point being, it these types of things that help portray that type of reputation. When you play BETTER in a 'higher amped' environment, that's a positive for a player, IMO. He didn't 'crumble' under the pressure; he embraced it. He didn't 'explode' or anything, but he did improve somewhat.


He was still at best a neutral player, and me saying that is generous.


Oh, I agree, just because he was BETTER in certain areas, doesn't mean he was actually GOOD in those areas...and no, I wouldn't want McD to trade any of our 'youngsters' for him, either, and I certainly wouldn't want Bledsoe traded for him, straight up. Doesn't matter anyway, the Kyrie trade will finalize. But if for some reason it didn't? Smart, IT, and the BRK pick for Bledsoe and the Mia Pick. :D
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#602 » by NavLDO » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:34 pm

cosmofizzo wrote:Keeping and playing Bledsoe isn't a bad idea at all. I bet JJ makes him better. And JJ is going to play a TON this year, make no mistake about it. He might just be the closest to a complete player we have.


Really?? I don't see that at all. Bledsoe, to me, is EASILY, the most complete player we have, and Bender, IMO, of the youngsters, has the most POTENTIAL to be the most complete player, with his ball-handling/passing skills, rim defense, agility to defend multiple positions, and actually has a nice stroke...as opposed to Jackson, who needs serious work.

Jackson can't shoot a FT. That's does not portend favorably for a Wing prospect. His 38% 3PT % is misleading; he made a whopping 34 in 35 games in 2.6 att/gm at Kansas; that's nearly Warren territory for att/gm his sophomore season in the NBA when he shot 40%. Is anybody clamoring about how great a shooter Warren is? No, because he followed that up with 1.7 att/gm and 26%. Yet Warren averages .20pts higher...in the NBA mind you, on FT%--75% compared to 55%.

Jackson is not a complete player; he has some issues he's going to have to fix/work on in the NBA like everybody else.

And I don't have a problem with him playing a lot this year; I just hope it is not at the expense of Warren...but this has been my argument all summer. If we are giving Jackson 'a ton of minutes', who is NOT getting those minutes? Ulis? Booker? Warren? Chriss? Bender? Jones Jr.? Sauce? Len (if he accepts the QO)? Then Reed comes back at some point. Then next year, we are going to draft 2 more? Ho on earth do we develop 8-9 top lotto picks? That is my biggest beef...

...oh, and calling a player who hasn't played a single minute in the NBA as our most 'complete player we have'.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#603 » by NavLDO » Mon Aug 28, 2017 12:47 pm

AtheJ415 wrote:Anybody claiming Bender and Chriss are busts needs to go back and look at other 18 year old's numbers like Kobe, or hell, just rookie numbers of certain stars like Jimmy Butler. Nobody knows anything regarding them as of yet. Hell, I don't see how anybody could reasonably say that Chriss wasn't better than expected as a rookie.


THANK YOU, AtheJ!! I cannot believe anyone is already saying that about them; then in a different post, you'll see them defending how players on other teams who haven't 'blossomed' yet, just need some time to develop, like Wiggins.

I thought Chriss fared amazingly last season, taking his history/age into consideration. Slashing 9/4 in 21MPG as a 19YO? Again, I know stats don't tell the whole story, but being asked to start in the NBA at age 19 with what, 3-4 total years experience playing basketball? Yep, he's a bust! :nonono:
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#604 » by Frank Lee » Mon Aug 28, 2017 1:46 pm

Neither bust nor boom
Story of most of our 'try out' youngsters.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#605 » by matt131 » Mon Aug 28, 2017 2:46 pm

Read on Twitter


Dang, can you imagine if Boston was forced to give up Tatum or Brown for Kyrie along with Thomas/Carroll/Brooklyn pick? wow
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#606 » by Qwigglez » Mon Aug 28, 2017 3:37 pm

Solomon Hill is out for most of the season. He wasn't a very efficient player last year shooting 38% from the field, but he did play 30 minutes a game. Doesn't look like the Pelicans have a lot of depth on their wings. I doubt they will make the playoffs, not just because Hill is out, but because they just don't have quality wings.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#607 » by Walt_Uoob » Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:13 pm

Qwigglez wrote:Solomon Hill is out for most of the season. He wasn't a very efficient player last year shooting 38% from the field, but he did play 30 minutes a game. Doesn't look like the Pelicans have a lot of depth on their wings. I doubt they will make the playoffs, not just because Hill is out, but because they just don't have quality wings.


Dudley for Asik and two future firsts? Fills a need for them, saves them a bit of money in the next two years, and Dudley expires a year sooner.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#608 » by Saberestar » Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:21 pm

Walt_Uoob wrote:
Qwigglez wrote:Solomon Hill is out for most of the season. He wasn't a very efficient player last year shooting 38% from the field, but he did play 30 minutes a game. Doesn't look like the Pelicans have a lot of depth on their wings. I doubt they will make the playoffs, not just because Hill is out, but because they just don't have quality wings.


Dudley for Asik and two future firsts? Fills a need for them, saves them a bit of money in the next two years, and Dudley expires a year sooner.

Dudley is not an SF anymore.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#609 » by ImNotMcDiSwear » Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:30 pm

Saberestar wrote:
Walt_Uoob wrote:
Qwigglez wrote:Solomon Hill is out for most of the season. He wasn't a very efficient player last year shooting 38% from the field, but he did play 30 minutes a game. Doesn't look like the Pelicans have a lot of depth on their wings. I doubt they will make the playoffs, not just because Hill is out, but because they just don't have quality wings.


Dudley for Asik and two future firsts? Fills a need for them, saves them a bit of money in the next two years, and Dudley expires a year sooner.

Dudley is not an SF anymore.


He's also injured to start the year.

No way the Pels give up two firsts to fill that hole. They'll be looking at cheaper options. I'm sure they'll try what they did this last year, grabbing guys like Terrence Jones and Donatas Motiejunas who were jettisoned from other squads.

An underwhelming season will make it hard to retain Cousins. Failing to retain Cousins will make it hard to retain AD. I'm not interested in Cousins, but I will be interested in AD when the time comes.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#610 » by Walt_Uoob » Mon Aug 28, 2017 4:46 pm

cosmofizzo wrote:
Saberestar wrote:
Walt_Uoob wrote:
Dudley for Asik and two future firsts? Fills a need for them, saves them a bit of money in the next two years, and Dudley expires a year sooner.

Dudley is not an SF anymore.


He's also injured to start the year.

No way the Pels give up two firsts to fill that hole. They'll be looking at cheaper options. I'm sure they'll try what they did this last year, grabbing guys like Terrence Jones and Donatas Motiejunas who were jettisoned from other squads.

An underwhelming season will make it hard to retain Cousins. Failing to retain Cousins will make it hard to retain AD. I'm not interested in Cousins, but I will be interested in AD when the time comes.


Ah, all good points. Thought about TJ instead but I don't think anyone here would want to do that, including me. I'll just wait for the next minor bit of NBA news to desperately try to connect to the Suns.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#611 » by Kerrsed » Mon Aug 28, 2017 6:42 pm

Anyone else find it a bit ironic and funny that whenever a Irving to PHX trade was discussed we would be overwhelmed with posts saying that We would have to add soooo much more to the trade because of Bledsoes injury history and half the posters would say they didnt even want Bledsoe due to the injury history, and yet here they are, stuck in limbo over a currently injured IT that cant pass a physical and who is reported to have a degenerative hip issue that has needed surgery that he refuses to have?

Read on Twitter


So if they havent asked for more in return now, but have put a halt to the trade going through......does that mean they are looking to just stop it all together? If so and Thomas ends up back in Beantown, how salty is he going to be playing for the team that he did everything for and yet was still traded (Or at least tried to).

And to add insult to injury (Literally!), wait till you read about how bad ITs issue is (Spoiler due to length):


Spoiler:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


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Thats pretty damn bad! Brinx Truck? Ambulance is more like it!
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#612 » by Frank Lee » Mon Aug 28, 2017 7:53 pm

It's official..... Noel and Paul are idiots
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#613 » by LukasBMW » Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:17 pm

Frank Lee wrote:It's official..... Noel and Paul are idiots


1 year and 4.6 mil

or

4 years and 70 milion?

Wow! Just wow! Risking 65 million??? WTF???
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#614 » by bwgood77 » Mon Aug 28, 2017 9:47 pm

LukasBMW wrote:
Frank Lee wrote:It's official..... Noel and Paul are idiots


1 year and 4.6 mil

or

4 years and 70 milion?

Wow! Just wow! Risking 65 million??? WTF???


On top of that, Kevin Pelton had an article about the fact that there will only be 6 teams next offseason with enough money to offer more than $17.5 million a year. The Lakers, who will likely be holding their cap space for two stars, the Pacers, who have Turner, the Jazz who have Gobert, the Sixers (of course not) and then the Hawks and Bulls. The latter two have Dedmon and Lopez, but also could very well be in the running for guys like Ayton, Bamba, Bagley, Robert Williams, etc, and may not want to blow a bunch of money on Noel. I guess we could probably create the space too, but same deal with us.

Then you also have a guy like Brook Lopez on the market, Cousins, then even potentially guys like Mason Plumlee and Alex Len who might play out the QOs and be cheaper.

Very dumb move by Noel and Paul.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#615 » by BVPN » Tue Aug 29, 2017 1:30 am

Any updates on Len? Did he pass the deadline without signing the QO?
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#616 » by lilfishi22 » Tue Aug 29, 2017 1:53 am

I thought the deadline was some time in October?
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#617 » by King4Day » Tue Aug 29, 2017 3:25 am

I believe the deadline is October first. He'll prob sign it
From what I read, Noel was offered 17mil per on the first night of free agency and wanted to see what other offers were out there. Dallas then pulled the offer.
So it's not like he still had the offer on the table and decided to take the QO.
Of course this is all assuming everything the experts say is accurate.
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Re: RE: Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#618 » by jredsaz » Tue Aug 29, 2017 4:37 am

Kerrsed wrote:Anyone else find it a bit ironic and funny that whenever a Irving to PHX trade was discussed we would be overwhelmed with posts saying that We would have to add soooo much more to the trade because of Bledsoes injury history and half the posters would say they didnt even want Bledsoe due to the injury history, and yet here they are, stuck in limbo over a currently injured IT that cant pass a physical and who is reported to have a degenerative hip issue that has needed surgery that he refuses to have?

Read on Twitter


So if they havent asked for more in return now, but have put a halt to the trade going through......does that mean they are looking to just stop it all together? If so and Thomas ends up back in Beantown, how salty is he going to be playing for the team that he did everything for and yet was still traded (Or at least tried to).

And to add insult to injury (Literally!), wait till you read about how bad ITs issue is (Spoiler due to length):


Spoiler:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Thats pretty damn bad! Brinx Truck? Ambulance is more like it!

That's amazing info. Thanks for sharing.

Maybe IT will miss the majority of next year. Wowza.

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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#619 » by jbk1234 » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:19 am

Kerrsed wrote:Anyone else find it a bit ironic and funny that whenever a Irving to PHX trade was discussed we would be overwhelmed with posts saying that We would have to add soooo much more to the trade because of Bledsoes injury history and half the posters would say they didnt even want Bledsoe due to the injury history, and yet here they are, stuck in limbo over a currently injured IT that cant pass a physical and who is reported to have a degenerative hip issue that has needed surgery that he refuses to have?

Read on Twitter


So if they havent asked for more in return now, but have put a halt to the trade going through......does that mean they are looking to just stop it all together? If so and Thomas ends up back in Beantown, how salty is he going to be playing for the team that he did everything for and yet was still traded (Or at least tried to).

And to add insult to injury (Literally!), wait till you read about how bad ITs issue is (Spoiler due to length):


Spoiler:
Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Thats pretty damn bad! Brinx Truck? Ambulance is more like it!


This feels like we're talking to other teams and are getting ready to void the trade tbh.
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Re: Trade & FA Ideas & Discussion 

Post#620 » by SideSwipe » Tue Aug 29, 2017 5:25 am

BVPN wrote:Any updates on Len? Did he pass the deadline without signing the QO?


At this point I will be surprised if PHX has anything but the QO on the table. They won't want to wrap up long-term salary and flexibility next summer if they don't want to. The other option is an upside contract that guarantees him his years and time to develop while still giving upside to PHX. Something like $21/3 He gets a raise, gets to stay in PHX, but PHX gets major value and a very trade-able/ usable asset down the line. If Len keeps his growth up from 2 years back, that would be a major win for PHX, if not, the outstanding balance on the contract would be movable. Len would be smart to take it if offered. Next summer looks like an FA $ wasteland. All that said, I think PHX may be pushing Len to take the QO and look to next summer, so that they keep financial flexibility.

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