Welcome Douggie McBuckets!

[thebuzzardman]

So McDermott can't guard the 3? That's his story? That's why he's been traded twice in the past year? Lovely.

Use him like Novak (not sure he's that accurate w/o time to warm up). Hide him on D for 15-20 mpg, let him shoot a bunch of wide open 3's. Bonus - he has a more well rounded offensive game than Novak, so he can do some other things, but shouldn't be mistaken for someone other than a guy who can score but not defend for 15 mpg.

I mean, not the asset I was looking for for Carmelo, but he'll have some use.

[Fat Kat]

I would held out for a first or tferg...at least wait..
Really no upside to this trade.....worst case melo may walk. Terrible

So, as I put together the pieces catching up on reading (was out all day until 8 pm), I got that the Knicks couldn't get a lot for Melo, because not only the NTC, but he also has a player option, so a team (OKC in this case) could fear he'd go one and done. So, I get that limits the value. And then I thought - hey, Melo might have opted in on the Knicks (not definite) but they got Kanter, who only has 1 year left, so they clearly put themselves in a safety zone by not having to worry about 2 year Melo, and vs that scenario, "shed a year".

Then I find out, Kanter has a player option too! And is really not going to opt in for another 17 million? I mean, I get it's not max, but seems like more he might make somewhere else - if anything, seems like a sure thing he'd take for a year.

So, to recap, the Knicks traded Melo partly out of fear he might opt in, for a guy who probably will opt in?

I'm liking the deal a little less again.

But even old melo >>> Kanter though. Bench big vs allstar. We sold him short. Not even the big melo fan but we fd this one up. Oh well.

The trade leads to a team atmosphere more conducive to teaching. It's as simple as that. Melo was the problem child in the classroom that occupied too much of the teacher's attention. The team will now be more apt to move the ball and hustle on defense.

[NBA Fan 1234]

So McDermott can't guard the 3? That's his story? That's why he's been traded twice in the past year? Lovely.

Use him like Novak (not sure he's that accurate w/o time to warm up). Hide him on D for 15-20 mpg, let him shoot a bunch of wide open 3's. Bonus - he has a more well rounded offensive game than Novak, so he can do some other things, but shouldn't be mistaken for someone other than a guy who can score but not defend for 15 mpg.

I mean, not the asset I was looking for for Carmelo, but he'll have some use.

I consider Douggie to be more of a scorer who’s a good shooter rather than just a shooter (like Novak). Moves well off ball, great cutter to open spots, and can hit from well beyond deep.

As for his defense, yah, he’s not good but he does actually give effort.

I think we’ll have some fun watching him at the 4 and KP at the 5 for some stretches.

[thebuzzardman]

CLee, McDermott or Beasley, Frank or Sessions, Kanter or WHG, some Kuz, mean the scoring should be pretty decent off the bench.

Clearly defense is another issue, though if it's CLee and Frank coming in, that's not bad, in the backcourt.

[thebuzzardman]

So McDermott can't guard the 3? That's his story? That's why he's been traded twice in the past year? Lovely.

Use him like Novak (not sure he's that accurate w/o time to warm up). Hide him on D for 15-20 mpg, let him shoot a bunch of wide open 3's. Bonus - he has a more well rounded offensive game than Novak, so he can do some other things, but shouldn't be mistaken for someone other than a guy who can score but not defend for 15 mpg.

I mean, not the asset I was looking for for Carmelo, but he'll have some use.

I consider Douggie to be more of a scorer who’s a good shooter rather than just a shooter (like Novak). Moves well off ball, great cutter to open spots, and can hit from well beyond deep.

As for his defense, yah, he’s not good but he does actually give effort.

I think we’ll have some fun watching him at the 4 and KP at the 5 for some stretches.

So, he's sort of a Novak/Williams/Beasley blend, to combine shooting/first round disappointment bench Knicks of yore?

Beasley\McDermott\KP could be interesting for stretches too.

[Besart19]

Pluses to both of these guys: They are at least youthful.

Minuses: Kanter and McDermott aren't really that good and Kanter is pretty badly overpaid, even with the $ that mediocre traditional C's still command in a league that supposedly doesn't care about them anymore.

Notice I didn't say either player is bad. They just aren't good. Melo got moved for a mediocre, overpaid C and a disappointing drafted SF who is basically also a mediocre guy. And a pick that'll be about 35, which is where you generally find...wait for it....mediocre players.

That said, at least the pick may have use in that you never know who might fall and maybe begins a practice of building up an asset base of picks. Have to start somewhere.

Would have been nice to get a #1 or young guy who actually retains potential instead of two guys who've proven they don't have any anymore, but oh well.

Best part of this trade is that we didn't have to take any long term contracts

Odds are, Kanter opts out after this year, or we can even trade him cause he actually has some value

I coulda lived with Leonard's contract, but I'd rather have Kanter honestly

And we didn't take back negative assets, so that's good too I guess

Yeah. Not having Leonard for 3 years is nice too. A lot of people (myself included at times) were willing to take Leonard to get the mighty Mo Harkless. What was I smoking? A nice athletic defensive forward, but not a great player, to have to take back a 11 million per year CRAP backup C, for three years, so the Knicks would have 31 million a year tied up in non effective backup C's? (Noah and Leonard) Glad that didn't happen.

What I'm saying, is the trade, in a vacuum of assets for assets, not that great. Just ok. From a "sets the youth movement, aids the tank" perspective, good.

Harkless can be had with KOQ and Lance heading in Portland.

I would also trade Lee, Kuz and a pick for Tobias... Knicks natives on stage

Willy/Kanter/Noah
KP/Harkless/Kornet
Tobias/DMD/Beasley
THJ/Baker/Dotson
Frank/Jack/Sessions

[thebuzzardman]

Best part of this trade is that we didn't have to take any long term contracts

Odds are, Kanter opts out after this year, or we can even trade him cause he actually has some value

I coulda lived with Leonard's contract, but I'd rather have Kanter honestly

And we didn't take back negative assets, so that's good too I guess

Yeah. Not having Leonard for 3 years is nice too. A lot of people (myself included at times) were willing to take Leonard to get the mighty Mo Harkless. What was I smoking? A nice athletic defensive forward, but not a great player, to have to take back a 11 million per year CRAP backup C, for three years, so the Knicks would have 31 million a year tied up in non effective backup C's? (Noah and Leonard) Glad that didn't happen.

What I'm saying, is the trade, in a vacuum of assets for assets, not that great. Just ok. From a "sets the youth movement, aids the tank" perspective, good.

Harkless can be had with KOQ and Lance heading in Portland.

I would also trade Lee, Kuz and a pick for Tobias... Knicks natives on stage

Willy/Kanter/Noah
KP/Harkless/Kornet
Tobias/DMD/Beasley
THJ/Baker/Dotson
Frank/Jack/Sessions

Those moves certainly rationalize the roster. I like that both Harkless and Tobias can move between the 3 and the 4; even Beasley can. I like Kuz, warts and all, and I think he could have looked better in his 2nd NBA year - still a bench guy, but McDermott and Beasley bring shooting and scoring at SF in a more proven way and basically, Kuz is looking at being 11th or 12th man, or not even dressing now.

[br7knicks]

McDermott sucks. Kanter is without question the talent in this trade. The problem is that the talent really doesnt fit. And what makes it work against the Knicks is that if Kanter has a great season he's going to opt out and force the Knicks to decide whether they want to spend huge money to bring back a very talented but hugely flawed player.

Pluses to both of these guys: They are at least youthful.

Minuses: Kanter and McDermott aren't really that good and Kanter is pretty badly overpaid, even with the $ that mediocre traditional C's still command in a league that supposedly doesn't care about them anymore.

Notice I didn't say either player is bad. They just aren't good. Melo got moved for a mediocre, overpaid C and a disappointing drafted SF who is basically also a mediocre guy. And a pick that'll be about 35, which is where you generally find...wait for it....mediocre players.

That said, at least the pick may have use in that you never know who might fall and maybe begins a practice of building up an asset base of picks. Have to start somewhere.

Would have been nice to get a #1 or young guy who actually retains potential instead of two guys who've proven they don't have any anymore, but oh well.

If Kanter can somehow become even average defensively he has good value.

i don't think that's likely, but it'd be nice. if a strong, defensive minded coach comes in that demands defense and effort, it'd be different. that's been a major problem with the knicks the last decade or so. no coach has held them accountable for their defense

[NoStatsGuy]

im in for dougie mcbuckets, welcome my friend!
may you bless us with many corner threes and some microwave performances

[HarthorneWingo]

So McDermott can't guard the 3? That's his story? That's why he's been traded twice in the past year? Lovely.

He's a second unit player for sure. Don't worry, he won't be matched up against Lebron, KD and PG.

[XxMisterFreakXx]

Doug definitely has some offencive talent/potential and has versatility on the offencive end who doesn't need the ball in hands to really contribute. He's very good at back cutting (cutting in general) his man and getting easy layups and has the ability to post-up when he has the advantage in the post to go along with his off the ball movement and shooting.

Doug was one of the players that i liked in the 2014 draft and on the right team he could be a reliable offensive threat in a good system the downside for him is on defense but i think getting passable on defense is a realistic target for him. Athletically Doug is a decent run/jump athlete and had a 36.5 max vertical and had good agility/run times as well at the combine but defensively he struggles to move his feet for whatever reason at times. A lot of it just could be him not just being able to react quick enough to certain plays mostly one on one defense but watching Doug at times defensively he has an awkward stance and weird positioning which can be realistic factors on why he struggles in that area. People have Doug more as a 4 then a 2 or a 3 which for the most part is true but doesn't have the strength for the 4 but can probably be a full-time 4 if he bulks up and faster with less pounds for the 2 or 3.

There is potential there with Doug we see it all the time players finding their niche and rhythm late in their careers and adjusting and getting a feel for the NBA game. TBH i'm optimistic about Doug he really never got a legit chance at CHI or OKC to show his offencive game and was used mostly as a floor spacer. Doug i would have to think is gonna get a chance to compete for a starting job (better as a bench player) it's there for him if not he'll be someone he can be used as nice offencive treat off the bench.

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[MDDN48]

best part of the deal. he might end up starting. certainly, he will have lots of chances this year.

At the 3, there's Beasley and Kuzminskas. I see him jumping in front of Kuz, but he'll have a Training Camp battle on his hands to start at small forward ahead of Beaz. Neither one have been known for their defense, but Beasley gets the edge, cause he can score in many ways, plus he's the vet.

At the 4, he'll be competing for playing time with Willy, O'Quinn, Kristaps, and Lance Thomas. KP6 and Willy, willing definitely go before McDermott.

Hopefully this offseason, he added some things to his game, and surprise a few people. Gonna be interesting..

[duetta]

He's likely a 1 year Knick, given his contractual situation - assuming he doesn't get dealt before that. Hard to believe in went ahead of Saric.

[drekwins]

best part of the deal. he might end up starting. certainly, he will have lots of chances this year.

At the 3, there's Beasley and Kuzminskas. I see him jumping in front of Kuz, but he'll have a Training Camp battle on his hands to start at small forward ahead of Beaz. Neither one have been known for their defense, but Beasley gets the edge, cause he can score in many ways, plus he's the vet.

At the 4, he'll be competing for playing time with Willy, O'Quinn, Kristaps, and Lance Thomas. KP6 and Willy, willing definitely go before McDermott.

Hopefully this offseason, he added some things to his game, and surprise a few people. Gonna be interesting..

Why would you assume that Beasley gets the edge? He's a flawed journeyman that won't be here very long. McBuckets may actually be here a while. Beasley's points mean nothing. It's all about the development of our guys long-term.

[SelbyCobra]

What happened to McDermott? Why has he stalled? I remember when he was drafted there was that undercurrent of hype about him being a potential top-tier steal. DX loved how incredible all his advanced metrics graded out at Creighton:

Doug McDermott had one of the best statistical seasons as a scorer in NCAA history. He ranks 2nd to only T.J. Warren using 22 possessions per-game and leads all players in this draft class regardless of position scoring a tremendous 1.18 points per possessions. His 8.1% turnover rate is the lowest in this group despite his onerous role, while his 52.2% overall shooting from the field in the half court (1st) evidences how difficult he was to contain all year long.

McDermott scored from all over the floor in virtually every situation imaginable. He ranks 1st in this group using 24.7% of his possessions in the post, but also ranks above average in the proportion of his possessions coming on cuts and off screens, as his father drew up plays to get him open by any means necessary. He ranks below average in spot-up and isolation usage, but ranks in the middle of the pack in the overall number of possessions he used in nearly every playtype.

McDermott's efficiency was also extremely well-rounded. He ranks as the most efficient off-screen and isolation scorer, while ranking in the top-3 scoring off put backs, post ups, and cuts. His multi-dimensional scoring ability is thanks to his tremendously high skill level. Ranking 1st or 2nd among small forward prospects scoring 1.37 points per shot around the rim, 1.15 points per pull up jump shot, and 1.31 points per catch and shoot jump shot, McDermott is a plug a play type offensively at the next level. His lack of athleticism may limit him to some degree around the rim (and we haven't discussed his defense), but his feel for the game and high level shot making ability should help him make an impact for a team offensively sooner rather than later.

I mean, that's some next level isht right there. They cited his lack of athleticism and defense, but also said the rest of the package was so good he'd still be able to make an impact right away. What has gone wrong?

[BernardKing]

[HarthorneWingo]

What happened to McDermott? Why has he stalled? I remember when he was drafted there was that undercurrent of hype about him being a potential top-tier steal. DX loved how incredible all his advanced metrics graded out at Creighton:

Doug McDermott had one of the best statistical seasons as a scorer in NCAA history. He ranks 2nd to only T.J. Warren using 22 possessions per-game and leads all players in this draft class regardless of position scoring a tremendous 1.18 points per possessions. His 8.1% turnover rate is the lowest in this group despite his onerous role, while his 52.2% overall shooting from the field in the half court (1st) evidences how difficult he was to contain all year long.

McDermott scored from all over the floor in virtually every situation imaginable. He ranks 1st in this group using 24.7% of his possessions in the post, but also ranks above average in the proportion of his possessions coming on cuts and off screens, as his father drew up plays to get him open by any means necessary. He ranks below average in spot-up and isolation usage, but ranks in the middle of the pack in the overall number of possessions he used in nearly every playtype.

McDermott's efficiency was also extremely well-rounded. He ranks as the most efficient off-screen and isolation scorer, while ranking in the top-3 scoring off put backs, post ups, and cuts. His multi-dimensional scoring ability is thanks to his tremendously high skill level. Ranking 1st or 2nd among small forward prospects scoring 1.37 points per shot around the rim, 1.15 points per pull up jump shot, and 1.31 points per catch and shoot jump shot, McDermott is a plug a play type offensively at the next level. His lack of athleticism may limit him to some degree around the rim (and we haven't discussed his defense), but his feel for the game and high level shot making ability should help him make an impact for a team offensively sooner rather than later.

I mean, that's some next level isht right there. They cited his lack of athleticism and defense, but also said the rest of the package was so good he'd still be able to make an impact right away. What has gone wrong?

I hear that, according to his dad/big-time bball coach, Bob McDermott, that it was a lack of consistent playing time. Apparently, he has little compunction letting the Bulls know how he felt. Then again, maybe he was right? He reminds me a lot of Bill Bradley.

Check this out about Doug's dad:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greg_McDermott

Early coaching career
McDermott began his coaching career as an assistant coach at North Dakota between 1989 and 1994, and during his tenure helped lead the Fighting Sioux to five consecutive NCAA Division II tournaments.[2] On March 29, 1994, he accepted his first head coaching position at Division II Wayne State College.[2] McDermott remained as the head coach at Wayne State College for six seasons and compiled an overall record of 116 wins and 53 losses (116–53) during his tenure there from 1994 to 2000.[3]

North Dakota State
In April 2000, McDermott resigned his Wayne State post and accepted the head coaching position at North Dakota State.[4] In his lone season with the State, he led the Bison to an overall record of 15 wins and 11 losses (15–11) en route to an eighth place finish in the North Central Conference.[5]

Northern Iowa
On April 3, 2001, McDermott was introduced as the new head coach at his alma mater, Northern Iowa.[3]

McDermott remained as the Panthers' head coach for five season between 2001 and 2006. During his tenure he led Northern Iowa to an overall record of 90 wins and 63 losses (90–63), the 2004 Missouri Valley Conference tournament championship, and to appearances in the 2004, 2005, and 2006 NCAA Tournaments.[6]

Iowa State
McDermott resigned his position with Northern Iowa on March 21, 2006, and accepted the same one at Iowa State.[6] McDermott was the Cyclones' head coach for four seasons between 2007 and 2010, and during his tenure led them to an overall record of 59 wins and 68 losses (59–68).[7] His marquee victory at Iowa State came on March 6, 2010, against No. 5 Kansas State. This was his only victory over a ranked team while with the Cyclones.

Creighton
On April 26, 2010, he resigned from Iowa State and accepted the same position at Creighton.[7] The contract with Creighton was a reported ten-year deal, worth well over one million dollars per season.[8]

[Polk377]

What happened to McDermott? Why has he stalled? I remember when he was drafted there was that undercurrent of hype about him being a potential top-tier steal. DX loved how incredible all his advanced metrics graded out at Creighton:

Doug McDermott had one of the best statistical seasons as a scorer in NCAA history. He ranks 2nd to only T.J. Warren using 22 possessions per-game and leads all players in this draft class regardless of position scoring a tremendous 1.18 points per possessions. His 8.1% turnover rate is the lowest in this group despite his onerous role, while his 52.2% overall shooting from the field in the half court (1st) evidences how difficult he was to contain all year long.

McDermott scored from all over the floor in virtually every situation imaginable. He ranks 1st in this group using 24.7% of his possessions in the post, but also ranks above average in the proportion of his possessions coming on cuts and off screens, as his father drew up plays to get him open by any means necessary. He ranks below average in spot-up and isolation usage, but ranks in the middle of the pack in the overall number of possessions he used in nearly every playtype.

McDermott's efficiency was also extremely well-rounded. He ranks as the most efficient off-screen and isolation scorer, while ranking in the top-3 scoring off put backs, post ups, and cuts. His multi-dimensional scoring ability is thanks to his tremendously high skill level. Ranking 1st or 2nd among small forward prospects scoring 1.37 points per shot around the rim, 1.15 points per pull up jump shot, and 1.31 points per catch and shoot jump shot, McDermott is a plug a play type offensively at the next level. His lack of athleticism may limit him to some degree around the rim (and we haven't discussed his defense), but his feel for the game and high level shot making ability should help him make an impact for a team offensively sooner rather than later.

I mean, that's some next level isht right there. They cited his lack of athleticism and defense, but also said the rest of the package was so good he'd still be able to make an impact right away. What has gone wrong?

I don't think anything really went wrong. He has been getting pretty consistent minutes over the last 3 years and has had some prolific scoring games from time to time. He has kind of just been floating under the radar since he doesn't stand out in any other categories and isn't a good defender. He has also never been a go to scorer in the NBA like he was at Creighton. Still he is a good addition to the bench or maybe even as a starter. He can scorer from just about anywhere on the court and doesn't turn the ball over. Ranked 7th the NBA in turnover percentage the last 2 years.

[GettinitDone]

Guy showed in the 30 pts vs Raptors and 31pts vs Grizzlies he can flat out score. I think he's been passive in his career so far mostly because of "juniority" but as he gets a few years, I don't see why he can't consistently put 18ppg, be a Wally Szczerbiak type of scorer (was an All Star). On our young team, our guys will be eager to pass him the ball when we're on a scoring drought and the fact he plays off the ball/ doesn't need the ball much in his hands to score.

I think he can be more exciting/ entertaining than Novak when he gets hot

[Polk377]

Guy showed in the 30 pts vs Raptors and 31pts vs Grizzlies he can flat out score. I think he's been passive in his career so far mostly because of "juniority" but as he gets a few years, I don't see why he can't consistently put 18ppg, be a Wally Szczerbiak type of scorer (was an All Star). On our young team, our guys will be eager to pass him the ball when we're on a scoring drought and the fact he plays off the ball/ doesn't need the ball much in his hands to score.

I think he can be more exciting/ entertaining than Novak when he gets hot

He can be a Korver type that can be moved around a lot. The difference is McDermott has a better all around arsenal than Korver and can post up or take it to the basket.