The 2017 Dodgers WORLD SERIES!!! Thread

[Quake Griffin]

Tomorrow’s lineup should feature **** and Barnes for their RHB and Rich Hill being comfortable with the signs Austin puts down.

I’m trying to figure out where to put **** in the order.



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[Quake Griffin]

Is anybody interested in Andre Ethier in LF at this point?

#HowBadCouldHisLFDefenseBe

??


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[Neddy]

glad we won this game. it was not necessary to have gone down the way it did in the second half of the game. Sorry I missed the game thread, but I was watching the game with my family and was telling my wife at every turning corner of the game for the worse.... that Dave was messing up the game. now to list those...

#1. Granderson batting 6th. I did read about what Quake said, LOL I said the exact same thing except before he made the first out. I told my wife when his first at bat came up with no outs, I said "hey honey here comes the first out" and he made the first out. I don't need to have Curtis out, knowing he probably is the better defensive option over Andre just by being rusty and coming off a leg and back injuries... but bat him in the 8th hole. he can still take pitches and maybe able to take advantage of hitting in front of a pitcher, and maybe get on base and utilize his still above average wheels. but hitting in the 6 hole gives no protection to Puig and is just an automatic out and kills rallies especially when the next hitter is all or none Grandal.

#2. he brought Kershaw out for the 7th. it was obvious his stuff was starting to wane, and even in the previous 6th, he was starting to get hit hard although they were fouls. his pitch count was now in the 90s. it takes far more energy, intensity, and focus in the post season games. going 6 already with the lead that we had, having stinking 8 men bullpen, there was no need to keep Clayton in there for the 7th. after the first HR of the inning, he should have been pulled. yeah he would not have liked it but two HRs crushed his spirit and now mentally going forward, there will be a sense of 'here we go again' in his mind. situations like this is why Dave left Ryu off the roster to have 7 professional relievers plus Maeda. with Jansen and Morrow locked in the last two innings, there were 6 options (well, maybe 5 since Baez shouldn't be in this situation) to go with. come on Manager. you sucked here.

#3. which leads me to the next issue at hand. Dave Roberts stated that the reason to keep Kershaw to start the 7th was to keep Jake Lamb in the dugout as his lefty/righty split is extreme. in fact .144/288. well Doc, how about Tony #1 and Tony #2 when the game was stil 7-2? eventually Doc brought out Tony #1 for the second out then Morrow came in for 1 pitch 3rd out. if both Tonies were so untrustworthy to a point they can't be brought out to start the 7th inning with nobody on, well sherlock, maybe RYU would have been the perfect option here? we leave out one of the best options of the team because the DBacks hit lefties well, so we ended up having to leave a lefty starter in too long precisely because he didn't have good enough of a lefty off the bullpen to start the 7th inning with 5 run lead? SRSLY?

#4. Granderson was replaced by ****, for the defensive upgrade... so... Ethier is the better hitter but Granderson is the better defender, but **** is actually better with his glove than Curtis? so... only reason why Granderson started was because he hits left handed... but Ethier is not only the better hitter but also a lefty???? this is like a never ending logic full of holes... if you want the better bat, put in the better bat. but if your logic is to play the best defensive option over that better bat, put the best glove out there!

#5. so, Doc puts in Granderson because he is a better defender over Ethier but because he is still a lefty over a right handed **** against the right handed opposing starter... then where was Utley? Doc said because he wanted Utley to have a late inning at bat and also that Logan was the better defender.... and Logan is the one who committed an error(although it wasn't recorded as E) on that infield "dying quail" just in front of him. I'm sure Utley would have dove for that ball, knowing with Seager just next to him that even if he missed the catch, no way that ball makes it out to the outfield and turn that into a double. not even trying to make a play on that ball was infuriating.

I probably have another half a dozen complains but as of this morning, I don't remember anymore. just glad we won, I hope we don't need to have Clayton pitch another inning for the rest of this series.

[Neddy]

Is anybody interested in Andre Ethier in LF at this point?

#HowBadCouldHisLFDefenseBe

??


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YES

but not today against lefty Robbie Ray

[Neddy]

Tomorrow’s lineup should feature **** and Barnes for their RHB and Rich Hill being comfortable with the signs Austin puts down.

I’m trying to figure out where to put **** in the order.



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1. R CF Taylor
2. L SS Seager --- would not mind putting **** here and give Seager a day off.
3. R 3B Turner
4. L 1B Bellinger
5. R RF Puig
6. R C Barnes
7. R LF **** ---- if **** was to play short and bat 2nd and we can watch Curtis get 4K
8. R 2B Logan

[Neddy]

Do you give Kershaw the 7th?


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of course not, and not unless his pitch count at the end of 6th is hovering around 75 to 82. never when it is 92 after pitching a gem until that point with only 3 hits given up with 5 run lead. ask yourself, with the playoff history and the reputation Clayton have built up to this point, would Tommy Lasorda have left Kershaw in to pitch the 7th? with 5 run lead? come on we all know what Tommy would have done. pull the kid, let him have a sense of pride in his game and be angry for getting pulled even, Tommy would have gone out to the post game interview saying it the kid was great, we had 5 run lead and with Morrow and Jansen each handling the last two innings, he needed the bullpen guys to have a warms up too or some Bull like that. protect the game but protect the player's psych. it is only the first game to the WS. can't have our ace with a mental block going forward.

[Neddy]

Turner is Ginger Jesus.

I think you just gave Justin our own RealGM official nick name. he shall be from now on be referred as the Ginger Jesus.

[Quake Griffin]

Do you give Kershaw the 7th?


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of course not, and not unless his pitch count at the end of 6th is hovering around 75 to 82. never when it is 92 after pitching a gem until that point with only 3 hits given up with 5 run lead. ask yourself, with the playoff history and the reputation Clayton have built up to this point, would Tommy Lasorda have left Kershaw in to pitch the 7th? with 5 run lead? come on we all know what Tommy would have done. pull the kid, let him have a sense of pride in his game and be angry for getting pulled even, Tommy would have gone out to the post game interview saying it the kid was great, we had 5 run lead and with Morrow and Jansen each handling the last two innings, he needed the bullpen guys to have a warms up too or some Bull like that. protect the game but protect the player's psych. it is only the first game to the WS. can't have our ace with a mental block going forward.

But you know he is aware of EVERY criticism and that he’s not going to feel content or pride that he can only go 6 IP every time he’s out there in October.

That’s why I understood Ranma saying he selfishly wants him to get the 7th. He wants it and it was the bottom 3rd of the order (just like it was in Game 1 2014 NLDS) but...


You’re right.
Pull him....

And moving forward, I no longer care about him “rewriting his postseason script” (as Orel says). I want the Dodgers to win the World Series and every decision about when to pull him should be made in the interest of the Dodgers winning the World Series...not getting him over the October hump, how mad he will be etc. etc.

And (get ready for an unpopular opinion).....


If we really can’t put the team over his bruised (pummeled into submission tbh) October ego, we need to consider trading him in the winter.

I don’t care. I brought it up last offseason.
No hard and fast rules.


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[Quake Griffin]

http://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/20926457/dodgers-learned-ever-want-disappoint-chase

Cool article on Chase in the Dodgers’ locker room.

Chris Taylor says his baseball IQ is very high and Morrow said he showed him where he might have been tipping his pitches.


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[Neddy]

And moving forward, I no longer care about him “rewriting his postseason script” (as Orel says). I want the Dodgers to win the World Series and every decision about when to pull him should be made in the interest of the Dodgers winning the World Series...not getting him over the October hump, how mad he will be etc. etc.

and that is really what this is all about, winning it all. if we win it all and Kersh has gone no more than 6 innings in any of this post season, he should still be happy to win it all. after having done this once or twice, then we can run Clay out there to his heart's content in similar situations but not this time around when he haven't won this since 1988.

If we really can’t put the team over his bruised (pummeled into submission tbh) October ego, we need to consider trading him in the winter.

I don’t care. I brought it up last offseason.
No hard and fast rules.

well, it's not even about the ego thing, but the reality thing. I am not against trading Kershaw if the deal makes sense. Kershaw is 10 year vet already, and will be opting out of his contract at age 30, and if we bring him back for 2019 and forward, he is starting the new extension deal at age 31. if will want what, a 7 year deal minimum like what Greinke got? we are looking at paying him probably the highest salary ever in history of baseball at the time of extension, until he is 38 years old. how many lefty power pitchers keep up their talent level that far into their career?

of course we are a wealthy franchise in a great media market. we can afford to have a contract or two turn up bad, the way it happened with Gonzo, Ethier, Kazmir, McCarthy, and guys we are still paying not to play for us, like Crawford. but the point if what we might be able to get back in return that matters, since the other names I have mentioned wil bring back meager, if at all any return.

lastly, I think this really depends on this winter. if we get a kid like Shohei, the entire texture of our rotation will change. even if we do not bring back Yu, and Kershaw is traded away and say we get a superb position player in return, our rotation can still rock Hill-Shohei-Wood-Ryu-Maeda with McCarthy replacing whichever isn't performing if he can get his head right. if say, we trade Kershaw to the Angels and get Trout, who would say no to that? it is a complete hypothetical here but just by bringing in Trout, we can bump Taylor down to 2B and we fix two problems in our lineup with one move.
just imagine

1 R 2B Taylor
2 L SS Seager
3 R CF Trout
4 L 1B Bellinger
5 R 3B Ginger Jesus
6 R RF Puig
7 L LF Verdugo
8 R C Barnes

there is absolutely no hole in that lineup. it also makes Pederson/Grandal/Forsythe expandable and all can bring back value along with Kershaw.

[Quake Griffin]

While I understand this sentiment, I feel like this is OFTEN the story for him in the postseason, particularly Game 1s. He’s in there with a fastball, no curve and an average slider that can sorta function as a cutter depending on how he throws it.


He said himself no excuses.


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[Neddy]

your pitches come and go from start to start, but getting your feel for each pitch before the big game is still a part of being a pro.

[Ranma]

Turner is Ginger Jesus.

I think you just gave Justin our own RealGM official nick name. he shall be from now on be referred as the Ginger Jesus.

Read on Twitter

[Ranma]

your pitches come and go from start to start, but getting your feel for each pitch before the big game is still a part of being a pro.

Yeah, I got a sense that he was working on his pitches when Godley was batting as he was throwing curves and sliders at him only that Godley was actually getting his bat on the balls. Kershaw couldn't strike him out. There were moments in the game where his breaking stuff was really sharp, but the slider was MIA.

For the most part, Kershaw pitched a fine game. He was bailed out a couple of times by the defense, but he also beared down and induced ground balls when the defense let him down in letting men get on base.

As Quake noted, I wanted to see what Kershaw had left in the 7th inning but Quake was spot on in saying that he needed a short leash. While it was the sensible thing to pull him, I didn't fault Roberts for letting him try his hand in the 7th inning, especially with the temptation of Baez coming in with a big lead.

However, Neddy, you're right that Roberts' justification after-the-fact made little sense. We had both Watson and Cingrani as reliable left-handed options out of the bullpen. As you guys have said, Kershaw was beginning to falter at that point and his postseason track record indicated that he needed to be pulled.

I'm always going to selfishly want to give Kershaw the benefit of the doubt in giving him chances to "rewrite his postseason script" since I think he's earned the right given how much we've ridden him in the past, but at the same time, we can't blindly just give in. Closely monitoring such situations and exercising caution should be emphasized in those moments as well.

Kershaw's back ailments also warrant such precaution.

[Neddy]

Turner is Ginger Jesus.

I think you just gave Justin our own RealGM official nick name. he shall be from now on be referred as the Ginger Jesus.

Read on Twitter

ah, thanks for the correction. you know my only form of social media I participate in is RealGM. that's it. I get my Trump Tweets from Yahoo.com's troll littered news.

[Neddy]

I'm always going to selfishly want to give Kershaw the benefit of the doubt in giving him chances to "rewrite his postseason script" since I think he's earned the right given how much we've ridden him in the past, but at the same time, we can't blindly just give in. Closely monitoring such situations and exercising caution should be emphasized in those moments as well.

Kershaw's back ailments also warrant such precaution.

I don't know man. if we were like the Gnats with 3 banners in last 8 years, yeah sure. but we haven't even got there since 1988. I think nobody on this team has earned anything.

[Neddy]

glad we won this game. it was not necessary to have gone down the way it did in the second half of the game. Sorry I missed the game thread, but I was watching the game with my family and was telling my wife at every turning corner of the game for the worse.... that Dave was messing up the game. now to list those...

#1. Granderson batting 6th. I did read about what Quake said, LOL I said the exact same thing except before he made the first out. I told my wife when his first at bat came up with no outs, I said "hey honey here comes the first out" and he made the first out. I don't need to have Curtis out, knowing he probably is the better defensive option over Andre just by being rusty and coming off a leg and back injuries... but bat him in the 8th hole. he can still take pitches and maybe able to take advantage of hitting in front of a pitcher, and maybe get on base and utilize his still above average wheels. but hitting in the 6 hole gives no protection to Puig and is just an automatic out and kills rallies especially when the next hitter is all or none Grandal.

#2. he brought Kershaw out for the 7th. it was obvious his stuff was starting to wane, and even in the previous 6th, he was starting to get hit hard although they were fouls. his pitch count was now in the 90s. it takes far more energy, intensity, and focus in the post season games. going 6 already with the lead that we had, having stinking 8 men bullpen, there was no need to keep Clayton in there for the 7th. after the first HR of the inning, he should have been pulled. yeah he would not have liked it but two HRs crushed his spirit and now mentally going forward, there will be a sense of 'here we go again' in his mind. situations like this is why Dave left Ryu off the roster to have 7 professional relievers plus Maeda. with Jansen and Morrow locked in the last two innings, there were 6 options (well, maybe 5 since Baez shouldn't be in this situation) to go with. come on Manager. you sucked here.

#3. which leads me to the next issue at hand. Dave Roberts stated that the reason to keep Kershaw to start the 7th was to keep Jake Lamb in the dugout as his lefty/righty split is extreme. in fact .144/288. well Doc, how about Tony #1 and Tony #2 when the game was stil 7-2? eventually Doc brought out Tony #1 for the second out then Morrow came in for 1 pitch 3rd out. if both Tonies were so untrustworthy to a point they can't be brought out to start the 7th inning with nobody on, well sherlock, maybe RYU would have been the perfect option here? we leave out one of the best options of the team because the DBacks hit lefties well, so we ended up having to leave a lefty starter in too long precisely because he didn't have good enough of a lefty off the bullpen to start the 7th inning with 5 run lead? SRSLY?

#4. Granderson was replaced by ****, for the defensive upgrade... so... Ethier is the better hitter but Granderson is the better defender, but **** is actually better with his glove than Curtis? so... only reason why Granderson started was because he hits left handed... but Ethier is not only the better hitter but also a lefty???? this is like a never ending logic full of holes... if you want the better bat, put in the better bat. but if your logic is to play the best defensive option over that better bat, put the best glove out there!

#5. so, Doc puts in Granderson because he is a better defender over Ethier but because he is still a lefty over a right handed **** against the right handed opposing starter... then where was Utley? Doc said because he wanted Utley to have a late inning at bat and also that Logan was the better defender.... and Logan is the one who committed an error(although it wasn't recorded as E) on that infield "dying quail" just in front of him. I'm sure Utley would have dove for that ball, knowing with Seager just next to him that even if he missed the catch, no way that ball makes it out to the outfield and turn that into a double. not even trying to make a play on that ball was infuriating.

I probably have another half a dozen complains but as of this morning, I don't remember anymore. just glad we won, I hope we don't need to have Clayton pitch another inning for the rest of this series.

oh yeah, just remembered.

#6. when Puig got that triple with nobody out to start out the bottom of the 7th, and here comes Granderson and Grandal which neither is a good contact hitter... wouldn't this have been the perfect spot to pinch hit Barnes/Ethier/Utley? all 3 can put the ball in play, and Puig surely has the speed to leg it home. instead, Dave let both G's make worthless shallow fly to put all the pressure on the worst hitter in the lineup to come through, which Logan didn't.

[Quake Griffin]

Well, when will you give up on him Dave?


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[Quake Griffin]

Puig should be higher up in the order.


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[Neddy]

^what the hell

I am well aware of Puig's terrible split against lefties, but his career numbers are not bad, and it's not like Robbie Ray will pitch all 9 innings.