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Political Roundtable Part XV

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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1861 » by DCZards » Thu Nov 2, 2017 4:47 am

Benjammin wrote:

Absolutely. But calling huge groups of people evil and deplorables isn't going to advance anything either. Trump has definitely emboldened some very deplorable people and that must be met with robust resistance. Just watching the Hollywood sex abuse scandal has shown the moral bankruptcy of the elite left. But the truth is it really shows that brokenness and sometimes evil knows no bounds of race, creed, or sexual orientation.


What "Hollywood sex abuse scandal" are you referring to? Or are you taking the actions of one individual (Harvey Weinstein) and using it to tar-and-feather everyone in Hollwood?

It's a little like what Popper does when he claims there's "Rampant sexual exploitation in Hollywood" without presenting an iota of evidence to back that charge up.

Heck, there were more known sexual predators (Roger Ailes and Bill O'Reilly) at Fox News in NYC. I guess we'd have to call that "rampant" as well.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1862 » by AFM » Thu Nov 2, 2017 5:11 am

DCZards wrote:
Benjammin wrote:

Absolutely. But calling huge groups of people evil and deplorables isn't going to advance anything either. Trump has definitely emboldened some very deplorable people and that must be met with robust resistance. Just watching the Hollywood sex abuse scandal has shown the moral bankruptcy of the elite left. But the truth is it really shows that brokenness and sometimes evil knows no bounds of race, creed, or sexual orientation.


What "Hollywood sex abuse scandal" are you referring to? Or are you taking the actions of one individual (Harvey Weinstein) and using it to tar-and-feather everyone in Hollwood?

It's a little like what Popper does when he claims there's "Rampant sexual exploitation in Hollywood" without presenting an iota of evidence to back that charge up.

Heck, there were more known sexual predators (Roger Ailes and Bill O'Reilly) at Fox News in NYC. I guess we'd have to call that "rampant" as well.


It's way bigger than Weinstein--he was just what broke the dam

https://www.fastcompany.com/40489989/heres-the-ever-growing-list-of-men-accused-of-sexual-harassment-since-weinstein

Theres been over 50 men accused since Weinstein story broke.

edit-has very little to do w/ left vs right tho (seeing ben's post), just thought maybe you weren't aware
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1863 » by zero2hero » Thu Nov 2, 2017 6:21 am

#PizzaGate #GayFrogs
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1864 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Thu Nov 2, 2017 7:08 am

One of the Dartmouth professors implicated in a sex scandal looks a hell of a lot like Weinstein.

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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1865 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Thu Nov 2, 2017 7:09 am

Donald Trump will be in Waikiki this weekend. Going to be some kind of traffic for those heading to the beach.


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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1866 » by popper » Thu Nov 2, 2017 10:57 am

DCZards wrote:
Benjammin wrote:

Absolutely. But calling huge groups of people evil and deplorables isn't going to advance anything either. Trump has definitely emboldened some very deplorable people and that must be met with robust resistance. Just watching the Hollywood sex abuse scandal has shown the moral bankruptcy of the elite left. But the truth is it really shows that brokenness and sometimes evil knows no bounds of race, creed, or sexual orientation.


What "Hollywood sex abuse scandal" are you referring to? Or are you taking the actions of one individual (Harvey Weinstein) and using it to tar-and-feather everyone in Hollwood?

It's a little like what Popper does when he claims there's "Rampant sexual exploitation in Hollywood" without presenting an iota of evidence to back that charge up.

Heck, there were more known sexual predators (Roger Ailes and Bill O'Reilly) at Fox News in NYC. I guess we'd have to call that "rampant" as well.


I didn’t think I had to attach links because it’s been such a prominent news item for weeks. I included the East Coast news media in my original post (which covers the Bill OReillys and Fox). I tried to identify one of the most damaging symptoms of a problem that’s destroying this country and you immediately go partisan and disengage from the real issue at hand (moral bankruptcy). We’d be better off taking an honest look at our problems and address them for what they are.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1867 » by TGW » Thu Nov 2, 2017 12:54 pm

Popper--I usually don't agree with you on most subjects but I absolutely agree with you on this particular topic. The Hollywood elite are completely devoid of morality. Denzel Washington, who's a devout Christian, said it years ago. That's why he rarely hangs out with anyone in Hollywood. They promote degeneracy and degenerate behavior. They sexually abuse women, children AND men. My brother in law's brother, who used to be an actor in small films, confirmed that a male MTV exec wanted sex in exchange for a spot on the Real World.

Hollywood is a disgusting place behind closed doors.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1868 » by Zonkerbl » Thu Nov 2, 2017 12:57 pm

Benjammin wrote:

Absolutely. But calling huge groups of people evil and deplorables isn't going to advance anything either. Trump has definitely emboldened some very deplorable people and that must be met with robust resistance. Just watching the Hollywood sex abuse scandal has shown the moral bankruptcy of the elite left. But the truth is it really shows that brokenness and sometimes evil knows no bounds of race, creed, or sexual orientation.


[/quote]

Calling huge groups of people libtards isn't helping anything either. At least calling Trump supporters deplorable Russian patsies is true. It's not nice but the time to be nice is over. You support Trump, prepare to get verbally punched in the face. The gloves are off and all your cherished heroes are going to jail, where they should have been long ago.

How dare you. How dare you defend huge mobs of people chanting "Lock her up!" while Trump and his cronies conspired against the United States with Russia? Deplorable doesn't even come close. Brainwashed fascist thugs more like.
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Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1869 » by Ruzious » Thu Nov 2, 2017 1:29 pm

montestewart wrote:
Benjammin wrote:
Zonkerbl wrote:I don't understand why the Trump supporting snowflakes are getting their panties in a bundle over an ad that accurately portrays how evil and despicable they are. Don't like the truth? Don't be evil and despicable.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/local/virginia-politics/virginia-ad-features-minority-kids-chased-by-truck-with-gillespie-sticker-confederate-flag/2017/10/30/7311fdda-bd6f-11e7-97d9-bdab5a0ab381_story.html?tid=magnet&utm_term=.e3b89a514064

Do you really believe that? Wow. I guess stereotypes only work one way?

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Seems like a fair response ad, considering Gillespie's sensationalized attack ads, which unfortunately seem to be working. Northam's gotta do the same if he wants to keep up. Gillespie brought the Confederate flag into the conversation first with an attack ad. Fair's fair.

Fwiw, I hope Northam crushes Gillespie. I've been impressed that several Republicans who said they used to be Gillespie fans have voiced their displeasure with his ads.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1870 » by closg00 » Thu Nov 2, 2017 1:41 pm

The negative ads Gillespie is running are effective and he has closed the gap, gonna be tight.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1871 » by popper » Thu Nov 2, 2017 1:52 pm

Some inside baseball in case anyone is interested. if not, skip to next post.

Donna Brazile SLAMS Debbie, Obama For Running The Party Into The Ground, Giving Hillary Control

JACK CROWE
Political Reporter 8:13 AM 11/02/2017

Interim Democratic National Committee (DNC) chair Donna Brazile placed blame for the party’s financial woes squarely on former President Barack Obama and Florida Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz in a Thursday column, excoriating the pair for handing over complete control of the party to the Clinton campaign almost a year before she secured the nomination.

Soon after taking over as interim chair, Brazile set out to determine whether the DNC had improperly assisted former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton in securing the party’s nomination, as leaked internal emails suggested.

She quickly determined that the DNC was in serious financial peril and the former chair, Wasserman Schultz, had relinquished control of the party to the Clinton campaign in exchange for a monthly allowance that would cover the operation’s day to day costs.

“Debbie was not a good manager. She hadn’t been very interested in controlling the party—she let Clinton’s headquarters in Brooklyn do as it desired so she didn’t have to inform the party officers how bad the situation was,” Brazile wrote in Politico Magazine.

Brazile realized the extent to which the DNC had jettisoned its independence upon discovering a joint fundraising agreement, signed roughly one year before Clinton had officially won the nomination.

“The agreement—signed by Amy Dacey, the former CEO of the DNC, and Robby Mook with a copy to Marc Elias—specified that in exchange for raising money and investing in the DNC, Hillary would control the party’s finances, strategy, and all the money raised,” Brazile wrote. “Her campaign had the right of refusal of who would be the party communications director, and it would make final decisions on all the other staff. The DNC also was required to consult with the campaign about all other staffing, budgeting, data, analytics, and mailings.”

Obama and Wasserman Schultz are largely to blame for placing the DNC in such a perilous financial state that they were forced to rely on Clinton campaign money, according to Brazile. She points out that Obama “left the party $24 million in debt” and charges Wasserman Schultz with exacerbating the party’s financial strain by refusing to trim down the DNC staff during non-election years.
“The party chair usually shrinks the staff between presidential election campaigns, but Debbie had chosen not to do that. She had stuck lots of consultants on the DNC payroll, and Obama’s consultants were being financed by the DNC, too.”

Ultimately, Brazile claims to have identified a significant lack of grassroots enthusiasm surrounding the Clinton camp weeks before the election. When she called Vermont Sen. Bernie Sanders to report her findings on the entanglements between the DNC and the Clinton campaign, she issued a stark warning.

“I had to be frank with him. I did not trust the polls, I said. I told him I had visited states around the country and I found a lack of enthusiasm for her everywhere.”

http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/02/donna-brazile-slams-debbie-obama-for-running-the-party-into-the-ground-giving-hillary-control/
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1872 » by Zonkerbl » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:07 pm

You don't have a civil discussion with cancer. You shoot cancer with lasers, bombard it with chemicals, cut it with knives, burn it with fire. You do everything you can to keep the cancer from killing the patient. Civil discussion is for questions like, "whose life is more important, an unborn baby or the mother?" Not "should policy decisions be based on truth?" When a large portion of your society is advocating on the other side of that question, that decisions should be based on who shouts their lies the loudest, Democracy is about to die. There can be no shades of gray on that issue. We can have legitimate arguments about what the truth is. But whether decisions should be based on facts is an inviolable foundation of Democracy. It's the only way it can work.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1873 » by Ruzious » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:12 pm

Zonkerbl wrote:
Benjammin wrote:

Absolutely. But calling huge groups of people evil and deplorables isn't going to advance anything either. Trump has definitely emboldened some very deplorable people and that must be met with robust resistance. Just watching the Hollywood sex abuse scandal has shown the moral bankruptcy of the elite left. But the truth is it really shows that brokenness and sometimes evil knows no bounds of race, creed, or sexual orientation.



Calling huge groups of people libtards isn't helping anything either. At least calling Trump supporters deplorable Russian patsies is true. It's not nice but the time to be nice is over. You support Trump, prepare to get verbally punched in the face. The gloves are off and all your cherished heroes are going to jail, where they should have been long ago.

How dare you. How dare you defend huge mobs of people chanting "Lock her up!" while Trump and his cronies conspired against the United States with Russia? Deplorable doesn't even come close. Brainwashed fascist thugs more like.


I've never understood the logic of associating Hollywood scandals with politics. They're performers; not elected politicians. Just because a few of them occasionally speak on politics doesn't mean they have anything to do with actual politics.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1874 » by dckingsfan » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:16 pm


This is probably a very good thing for the Ds - if Brazile really faces down the corruption in the DNC - the party will be in much better shape.

I don't think this message could come from the outside - the partisans wouldn't listen otherwise.

I guess I like it because it reinforces what I (outcome bias?) was saying - Trump didn't win - Hillary and the DNC lost - I guess we should add Obama into the mess now - I didn't see that coming.
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1875 » by dckingsfan » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:18 pm

Zonkerbl wrote:You don't have a civil discussion with cancer. You shoot cancer with lasers, bombard it with chemicals, cut it with knives, burn it with fire. You do everything you can to keep the cancer from killing the patient. Civil discussion is for questions like, "whose life is more important, an unborn baby or the mother?" Not "should policy decisions be based on truth?" When a large portion of your society is advocating on the other side of that question, that decisions should be based on who shouts their lies the loudest, Democracy is about to die. There can be no shades of gray on that issue. We can have legitimate arguments about what the truth is. But whether decisions should be based on facts is an inviolable foundation of Democracy. It's the only way it can work.

And we had it in spades in this last election cycle. The Russians (or anyone else) can really propagate fake news on the digital platforms. Google, Facebook, etc. a collective shrug.

I am not forgetting Trump the serial liar :nonono:
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1876 » by dckingsfan » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:20 pm

Ruzious wrote:I've never understood the logic of associating Hollywood scandals with politics. They're performers; not elected politicians. Just because a few of them occasionally speak on politics doesn't mean they have anything to do with actual politics.

I think it is because they have had on outsized influence on elections and culture in the past, no?
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1877 » by Zonkerbl » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:26 pm

This is interesting, I wonder how effective these actually were in riling people up. They were pretty riled up already, and they targeted both sides.

Examples of Russian facebook ad buys:
https://www.politico.com/story/2017/11/01/social-media-ads-russia-wanted-americans-to-see-244423
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1878 » by Zonkerbl » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:29 pm

Ruzious wrote:
Zonkerbl wrote:
Benjammin wrote:

Absolutely. But calling huge groups of people evil and deplorables isn't going to advance anything either. Trump has definitely emboldened some very deplorable people and that must be met with robust resistance. Just watching the Hollywood sex abuse scandal has shown the moral bankruptcy of the elite left. But the truth is it really shows that brokenness and sometimes evil knows no bounds of race, creed, or sexual orientation.



Calling huge groups of people libtards isn't helping anything either. At least calling Trump supporters deplorable Russian patsies is true. It's not nice but the time to be nice is over. You support Trump, prepare to get verbally punched in the face. The gloves are off and all your cherished heroes are going to jail, where they should have been long ago.

How dare you. How dare you defend huge mobs of people chanting "Lock her up!" while Trump and his cronies conspired against the United States with Russia? Deplorable doesn't even come close. Brainwashed fascist thugs more like.


I've never understood the logic of associating Hollywood scandals with politics. They're performers; not elected politicians. Just because a few of them occasionally speak on politics doesn't mean they have anything to do with actual politics.


GOP is just sore because during the Reagan years Hollywood produced a ton of right wing propaganda - Rocky 2 through 4, Delta Force, Red Dawn, every Chuck Norris movie ever etc. etc. and now the script has flipped (haw!).

I don't pretend to understand it. I don't really trust Hollywood to not become enslaved to right wing billionaire interests again like they were in the eighties.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1879 » by Ruzious » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:30 pm

dckingsfan wrote:
Ruzious wrote:I've never understood the logic of associating Hollywood scandals with politics. They're performers; not elected politicians. Just because a few of them occasionally speak on politics doesn't mean they have anything to do with actual politics.

I think it is because they have had on outsized influence on elections and culture in the past, no?

No - it makes absolutely no sense, imo. What the f does a hollywood scandal have to do with the Dem party? We don't even know if clowns like Harvey whatshisname are Dems. For all we know, he's sleeping with Scott Baio. Wasn't there a guy named Ronald Reagan that was part of the Holywood elite? Clint Eastwood? Charlton Heston? The Cat Scratch Fever clown?
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Re: Political Roundtable Part XV 

Post#1880 » by Zonkerbl » Thu Nov 2, 2017 2:35 pm

What is truth? Have we, as a nation, lost our ability to know what is and isn't true? Have we, to put it more simply, lost our frigging minds?

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/11/2/16588964/america-epistemic-crisis
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