All Things Luka Doncic

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Dr Positivity
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1881 » by Dr Positivity » Wed Nov 1, 2017 8:38 pm

J_T wrote:Haven't seen this one posted:
http://www.euroleague.net/features/interviews/euroleague-2017-18/i/8atfu4dgulkw4hsr/luka-doncic-real-madrid-you-have-to-find-the-motivation

He has played every position except C this season, definitely positive for development.

The last question was interesting:

There is a lot of hype around you and even greater expectations after this month that you had. How do you handle it?

"Yes, it is a little bit difficult. In the end, I try not to read so many things written about it, so much stuff said about me on the Internet. It is difficult, because you always get to read something, but I try not to do that too much. Except RealGM Draft forum, I read that every day. Sometimes I want to quit basketball, I'm too small and too big at the same time and I can't get ripped. Cause Euro.


His answers to media have always been very simple tbh, they show the age, he has no experience. He should learn quickly to start talking ****, and have one controversial statement every 14 days, LeBron style.


Damn I'm disappointed this wasn't a real quote :lol:
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1882 » by Cipoteman » Wed Nov 1, 2017 9:13 pm

Just another game analysis - notes in Spanish - about him... from the game in which he dominated the whole Armani Milano team (ft. Andrew Goudelock, Jordan Theodore, Pat Young as NCAA studs just to metion some of them and quite a few Euro international players)

[url][/url]
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1883 » by Mirotic12 » Thu Nov 2, 2017 12:25 pm

Cipoteman wrote:Just another game analysis - notes in Spanish - about him... from the game in which he dominated the whole Armani Milano team (ft. Andrew Goudelock, Jordan Theodore, Pat Young as NCAA studs just to metion some of them and quite a few Euro international players)


Patric Young isn't in that game. He's been injured for what seems like forever.

J_T wrote:No doubt. I think he has lost some already, he is slightly below 220 at the moment. Definitely not because he'd be losing muscle.


I read something recently that said he was about 230. And he looks easily that.

Wagonband wrote:Honestly i think it's the other way around. Most young prospects can play on a level higher than they are used to during the season (not doncic ofc, but regular prospects that aren't Euroleague MVP candidates at 17), they can learn from often the best players and coaches their country has to offer, and they have a chance to improve a lot.

It's not like they are regressing on these camps. And they still usually have a few months before the camps start to regenerate and work on their game.

The only problem is that they should take a summer off every few years to rest, but just for the resting part, not because they will suddenly improve if they don't play for the national team.


Doncic might be a EuroLeague MVP candidate at 19 (as in 2018), but definitely was not at 17.

On another note,

EuroLeague now has an entire website with advanced stats and metrics.

Here is Doncic's profile:

http://overbasket.com/rsplayers.php?tab=0&year=2017&pcode=005929&cmp=EL
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1884 » by J_T » Thu Nov 2, 2017 3:47 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:
J_T wrote:No doubt. I think he has lost some already, he is slightly below 220 at the moment. Definitely not because he'd be losing muscle.


I read something recently that said he was about 230. And he looks easily that.

I read during the summer that he was 218, down from 228. He has some some fat to get rid off, but my eyes tell me that he was chubbier in the past. If he really is 230 now, I think he added some muscles at least. Whoever has ever done any lifting (raises hand hesitantly) knows about the bulking and cutting phases. It looks to me like he is doing just that but probably in less efficient way than NBA wizards would manage.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1885 » by BoardCrusher » Thu Nov 2, 2017 4:09 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:
Cipoteman wrote:Just another game analysis - notes in Spanish - about him... from the game in which he dominated the whole Armani Milano team (ft. Andrew Goudelock, Jordan Theodore, Pat Young as NCAA studs just to metion some of them and quite a few Euro international players)


Patric Young isn't in that game. He's been injured for what seems like forever.

J_T wrote:No doubt. I think he has lost some already, he is slightly below 220 at the moment. Definitely not because he'd be losing muscle.


I read something recently that said he was about 230. And he looks easily that.

Wagonband wrote:Honestly i think it's the other way around. Most young prospects can play on a level higher than they are used to during the season (not doncic ofc, but regular prospects that aren't Euroleague MVP candidates at 17), they can learn from often the best players and coaches their country has to offer, and they have a chance to improve a lot.

It's not like they are regressing on these camps. And they still usually have a few months before the camps start to regenerate and work on their game.

The only problem is that they should take a summer off every few years to rest, but just for the resting part, not because they will suddenly improve if they don't play for the national team.


Doncic might be a EuroLeague MVP candidate at 19 (as in 2018), but definitely was not at 17.

On another note,

EuroLeague now has an entire website with advanced stats and metrics.

Here is Doncic's profile:

http://overbasket.com/rsplayers.php?tab=0&year=2017&pcode=005929&cmp=EL

He is listed at 1.99 at the site you provided, but he is CLEARLY taller, even in an interview for Slovenian national tv this summer, he himself states he is 201, and that he hopes he wont grow much more, therefore the link you provide is inaccurate.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1886 » by SportsGuy8 » Thu Nov 2, 2017 4:18 pm

J_T wrote:
Mirotic12 wrote:
J_T wrote:No doubt. I think he has lost some already, he is slightly below 220 at the moment. Definitely not because he'd be losing muscle.


I read something recently that said he was about 230. And he looks easily that.

I read during the summer that he was 218, down from 228. He has some some fat to get rid off, but my eyes tell me that he was chubbier in the past. If he really is 230 now, I think he added some muscles at least. Whoever has ever done any lifting (raises hand hesitantly) knows about the bulking and cutting phases. It looks to me like he is doing just that but probably in less efficient way than NBA wizards would manage.

"Bulking and cutting" really isn't as necessary as once thought. The myth that you cannot build muscle and lose fat at the same time comes from bodybuilders, who are so close to their maximum muscle potential that there's no way going than down when they start cutting fat to get to those ridiculously low fat levels that's needed for their competitions. So of course they cannot add more muscle during this time, they even lose some because their bodies start to "panic" at such low fat levels.

For most athletes it should be the same as for most of us, though - you CAN lose fat and gain muscle at the same time. But even better are those co-called "lean-gains", where your fat stays pretty much the same, you just slowly add muscle. Those are probably optimal for basketball players, so that their bodies (and their games) don't hurt too much.

Doncic does need to cut, obviously, but now's not the time for it. Cutting now would even further deplete him of his much needed energy. He sadly needs to wait for off-season.

P.s.: There's another solution, though. Steroids. An organization like Real Madrid should have elite experts for that.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1887 » by J_T » Thu Nov 2, 2017 4:41 pm

SportsGuy8 wrote:
J_T wrote:
Mirotic12 wrote:
I read something recently that said he was about 230. And he looks easily that.

I read during the summer that he was 218, down from 228. He has some some fat to get rid off, but my eyes tell me that he was chubbier in the past. If he really is 230 now, I think he added some muscles at least. Whoever has ever done any lifting (raises hand hesitantly) knows about the bulking and cutting phases. It looks to me like he is doing just that but probably in less efficient way than NBA wizards would manage.

"Bulking and cutting" really isn't as necessary as once thought. The myth that you cannot build muscle and lose fat at the same time comes from bodybuilders, who are so close to their maximum muscle potential that there's no way going than down when they start cutting fat to get to those ridiculously low fat levels that's needed for their competitions. So of course they cannot add more muscle during this time, they even lose some because their bodies start to "panic" at such low fat levels.

For most athletes it should be the same as for most of us, though - you CAN lose fat and gain muscle at the same time. But even better are those co-called "lean-gains", where your fat stays pretty much the same, you just slowly add muscle. Those are probably optimal for basketball players, so that their bodies (and their games) don't hurt too much.

Doncic does need to cut, obviously, but now's not the time for it. Cutting now would even further deplete him of his much needed energy. He sadly needs to wait for off-season.

P.s.: There's another solution, though. Steroids. An organization like Real Madrid should have elite experts for that.

You are right that it's not needed, but it sure is simpler. It does look to me like he might be doing some of that, though.

Yes, steroids do solve all problems, you don't even need to lift and your fat will be replaced by muscles. A while ago I read one of the most interesting performance-enhancing related pieces. It was written by a guy who was an enthusiast cyclist and was fighting against doping his entire life. But at one point he decided to try all the stuff on himself, HGH, EPO, steroids, adding one after another. He spent $10000 and 9 months for the experiment and described every step of the process, feelings, performance etc afterwards. It sure was good read. I learned that these things most definitely and without many difficulties - work. And they work really really well. What he learned from it was that if he only had money, he would have kept taking HGH incjections, because it improved quality of his life so drastically in just couple of months (hair can start growing, he didn't have to use reading glasses anymore etc). Apparently it's the worst kept secret that 90% of Hollywood is on HGH therapy (after all it is COMPLETELY legal, it's just not allowed in sports and even in sports it's not forbidden because it would be enhancing performance - it doesn't on its own). Apparently steroids are also widely used by many famous people, but not the type of steroids athletes use. Athletes use certain types that work fast and have many bad side effects. Others use steroids that don't have bad side effects and are relatively harmless... but the trace stays in your body for 12 months. That's the only reason you won't see athletes using them.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1888 » by SportsGuy8 » Thu Nov 2, 2017 5:38 pm

J_T wrote:
SportsGuy8 wrote:
J_T wrote:I read during the summer that he was 218, down from 228. He has some some fat to get rid off, but my eyes tell me that he was chubbier in the past. If he really is 230 now, I think he added some muscles at least. Whoever has ever done any lifting (raises hand hesitantly) knows about the bulking and cutting phases. It looks to me like he is doing just that but probably in less efficient way than NBA wizards would manage.

"Bulking and cutting" really isn't as necessary as once thought. The myth that you cannot build muscle and lose fat at the same time comes from bodybuilders, who are so close to their maximum muscle potential that there's no way going than down when they start cutting fat to get to those ridiculously low fat levels that's needed for their competitions. So of course they cannot add more muscle during this time, they even lose some because their bodies start to "panic" at such low fat levels.

For most athletes it should be the same as for most of us, though - you CAN lose fat and gain muscle at the same time. But even better are those co-called "lean-gains", where your fat stays pretty much the same, you just slowly add muscle. Those are probably optimal for basketball players, so that their bodies (and their games) don't hurt too much.

Doncic does need to cut, obviously, but now's not the time for it. Cutting now would even further deplete him of his much needed energy. He sadly needs to wait for off-season.

P.s.: There's another solution, though. Steroids. An organization like Real Madrid should have elite experts for that.

You are right that it's not needed, but it sure is simpler. It does look to me like he might be doing some of that, though.

Yes, steroids do solve all problems, you don't even need to lift and your fat will be replaced by muscles. A while ago I read one of the most interesting performance-enhancing related pieces. It was written by a guy who was an enthusiast cyclist and was fighting against doping his entire life. But at one point he decided to try all the stuff on himself, HGH, EPO, steroids, adding one after another. He spent $10000 and 9 months for the experiment and described every step of the process, feelings, performance etc afterwards. It sure was good read. I learned that these things most definitely and without many difficulties - work. And they work really really well. What he learned from it was that if he only had money, he would have kept taking HGH incjections, because it improved quality of his life so drastically in just couple of months (hair can start growing, he didn't have to use reading glasses anymore etc). Apparently it's the worst kept secret that 90% of Hollywood is on HGH therapy (after all it is COMPLETELY legal, it's just not allowed in sports and even in sports it's not forbidden because it would be enhancing performance - it doesn't on its own). Apparently steroids are also widely used by many famous people, but not the type of steroids athletes use. Athletes use certain types that work fast and have many bad side effects. Others use steroids that don't have bad side effects and are relatively harmless... but the trace stays in your body for 12 months. That's the only reason you won't see athletes using them.

The harmless (at least if you're not overdoing it) ones don't really stay in your body for that long, at least not in detectable traces. Besides, most of Hollywood is probably just on a combination of testosterone, HGH, HCG (and something to decrease the estradiol levels), so basically all natural molecules. Testosterone, for example, is a bioidentical molecule, meaning it's exactly the same if it's produced by your own body or if you inject it, so the only way to "detect" it is if someone has very abnormal, unnatural levels.

Basically, testosterone, for example, is going to be impossible to detect once it drops to natural levels and that's going to happen very soon, sometimes in a matter of days, depending on the amount and the half-life of the ester. And even if it's a bit above, it's going to be hard to prove that it wasn't your own body that made it.

As for taking steroids and gaining muscle without working out. That's probably true for beginners, but if you really want great results, you still need to work out ... A LOT. And for an athlete, just adding muscle wouldn't really amount to that much. Strength gains are much more important to athletes.

There's one major downside to HGH ... If you're unlucky and get cancer, HGH is also going to vastly increase the growth of cancer cells, something you obviously don't want. And supposedly it also makes you sleepy.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1889 » by Wagonband » Thu Nov 2, 2017 7:29 pm

Mirotic12 wrote:Doncic might be a EuroLeague MVP candidate at 19 (as in 2018), but definitely was not at 17.


He "might" be? Really? He is the frontrunner for sure to being MVP in 2017/18.

He was MVP of the round 4 times last year? That's what i was hinting with MVP candidate
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1890 » by BoardCrusher » Thu Nov 2, 2017 8:36 pm

Doncic hasnt played in 2nd quarter yet and Real is down -12
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1891 » by tria » Thu Nov 2, 2017 8:43 pm

And then he enters, makes couple of great passes but teammates miss, forces foul and hits freethrows, hits step back three aand here we go, -3. Amazing how the game changes immediatly after he enters.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1892 » by J_T » Thu Nov 2, 2017 8:47 pm

BoardCrusher wrote:Doncic hasnt played in 2nd quarter yet and Real is down -12

He got them back in.

00:14 DONCIC, LUKA Two Pointer (1/2 - 12 pt) 39 - 43
01:35 CAMPAZZO, FACUNDO Free Throw In (2/2 - 2 pt) 37 - 40
01:35 CAMPAZZO, FACUNDO Free Throw In (1/1 - 1 pt) 36 - 40
02:11 DONCIC, LUKA Three Pointer (2/2 - 10 pt) 35 - 40
02:16 DONCIC, LUKA Steal (1) 32 - 40
02:35 DONCIC, LUKA Free Throw In (4/4 - 7 pt) 32 - 40
02:35 DONCIC, LUKA Free Throw In (3/3 - 6 pt) 31 - 40
02:35 DONCIC, LUKA Foul Drawn (3) 30 - 40
03:52 TAYLOR, JEFFERY Two Pointer (3/4 - 6 pt) 30 - 40
04:12 DONCIC, LUKA Off Rebound (1) 28 - 40
04:12 DONCIC, LUKA Missed Two Pointer (0/1 - 5 pt) 28 - 40
04:33 DONCIC, LUKA In 28 - 40


Who let the dog out?
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1893 » by Thespianoid » Thu Nov 2, 2017 8:49 pm

I'm surprised Campazzo is still in. he was a big reason why Real went down 12, because he keeps playing at a wild breakneck pace and it feeds into Khimki's hands. allows them to bait Real into bad quick shots, live turnovers and transition opportunities.

Each possession Doncic controls yields a much higher % look as he slows the pace down back to how Real needs to play. Something you can't see through just boxscore watching is how he controls and manages the game as necessary.
Clementine9 wrote:Missed shots are unfortunate, but it's the trends throughout the game that matter.

Choker wrote:The swing in how Raptors fans have supported and turned on Powell is a good case study of human behavior.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1894 » by Thespianoid » Thu Nov 2, 2017 9:07 pm

not sure why he tries to break down Charles Jenkins off the dribble. never going to happen. already been forced into a contested 3 and two turnovers. has to post him up, use the size mismatch.

simple mismatch rules:

if smaller than defender, beat them with speed + change of pace/direction

if bigger than defender, beat them with size/strength = shoot over top or seal deep and call for entry
Clementine9 wrote:Missed shots are unfortunate, but it's the trends throughout the game that matter.

Choker wrote:The swing in how Raptors fans have supported and turned on Powell is a good case study of human behavior.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1895 » by BoardCrusher » Thu Nov 2, 2017 9:08 pm

Doncic is schooling Jenkins...

edit: although I gotta admit Jenkins is playing very aggresive
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1896 » by Thespianoid » Thu Nov 2, 2017 9:17 pm

bad transition push into traffic. makes sense but he's gotta pick his spots better.

then left the strongside corner on a gamble.

young player mistakes.
Clementine9 wrote:Missed shots are unfortunate, but it's the trends throughout the game that matter.

Choker wrote:The swing in how Raptors fans have supported and turned on Powell is a good case study of human behavior.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1897 » by J_T » Thu Nov 2, 2017 9:17 pm

If turnovers counted as a positive stat, Doncic might have had a chance for MVP of this round. What was that, 3 TOs in 5 minutes?
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1898 » by Thespianoid » Thu Nov 2, 2017 9:20 pm

J_T wrote:If turnovers counted as a positive stat, Doncic might have had a chance for MVP of this round. What was that, 3 TOs in 5 minutes?


yeah. 2 trying to drive on Jenkins, but why? don't have the speed advantage, a bigger player dribbling into a smaller player is always going to go poorly.

Not sure why Real didn't have him post up and clearout. use the size + passing ability if Khimki help.
Clementine9 wrote:Missed shots are unfortunate, but it's the trends throughout the game that matter.

Choker wrote:The swing in how Raptors fans have supported and turned on Powell is a good case study of human behavior.
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1899 » by BoardCrusher » Thu Nov 2, 2017 9:20 pm

Real is awfull today, 9asists/11to
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Re: All Things Luka Doncic 

Post#1900 » by J_T » Thu Nov 2, 2017 9:28 pm

Thespianoid wrote:
J_T wrote:If turnovers counted as a positive stat, Doncic might have had a chance for MVP of this round. What was that, 3 TOs in 5 minutes?


yeah. 2 trying to drive on Jenkins, but why? don't have the speed advantage, a bigger player dribbling into a smaller player is always going to go poorly.

Not sure why Real didn't have him post up and clearout. use the size + passing ability if Khimki help.

The rest of the team was making TO's very liberally as well. So it's more to it than just Doncic. Either bad strategy by Real, good strategy by Khimki, or both. They committed 7 turnovers in last 6 minutes and 28 seconds.

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