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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#641 » by Ayt » Wed Nov 8, 2017 10:00 pm

SupremeHustle wrote:
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coolhandluke121 wrote:
Really good post and thanks for a good overview of the Jabari era, which I hope will come to a merciful end soon. The most important part of this post is just that they would be fools to pay him a lot. It's much too risky. They're better off saving that salary slot to add an MLE player every year. As long as they don't go into the lux tax, they can use the full MLE, and as long as they have Giannis, some of the best MLE players will at least consider Milwaukee.

I agree that it's a little unfair to imply that his letter affected the Toronto series. I do have issues with the letter but that's not one of them. It's correct to point out why the letter was kind of inappropriate, but I doubt it affected the Bucks. It did leave me wondering about his agent's role, and I was really disappointed with the way he acted like he's still so important to the team and a leader. Did it not register at all that they were arguably better without him? Is it too much to ask for him to at least ONCE acknowledge that he needs to improve on defense? He did interject himself unnecessarily. I wish we had a more detailed account of what happened in that team meeting where all the vets shot him down for speaking up, but there's evidence (albeit circumstantial) of a MAJOR disconnect between what Jabari's actually place is on the team and what he thinks it is. Asking for a max deal in his situation doesn't help. He won't improve on defense if he's so delusional about his impact that he doesn't think he needs to. Just because he has a more likable persona than Big Dog doesn't mean he's any better on the court.

Where were you during all those debates? We could have used you. I had forgotten all about the Lillard debates very early on. Wow. What a miserable thing to think about at this hour. Other trade debates you forgot to mention include Porter/Gortat, Hood/Exum, Hood/Favors, the 2017 or 2018 BK pick, the Jaylen Brown pick, Jokic, Conley, and Cousins. They were almost all hated here, and there was a poll where something like 80% of people said they wouldn't trade Jabari unless they got a top 10-15 player in return. It was a really bad time to be here if you didn't have a thick pair of homer glasses to wear at all times.

I actually don't think it is unfair to say he had some part in the fiasco that took place in the Toronto series. That long self-promoting letter became a real distraction. It was all over the local and national media. Even during the National TV broadcasts the commentators were saying how much better the Bucks would be doing if Parker was there. If I was on the team and hustled my butt off only to take a backseat to a Diva, it could very well affect my focus and hustle. Then when we lost the series, everyone was saying if only Jabari was playing we would have won. This, after he had nothing to do with why the team was in the playoffs in the first place.

I would have no problem if he tweeted and one or two sentence post encouraging his teammates, but instead he wrote life story and became the story. This selfish act took away from how amazing and hard the Bucks played to earn a playoff spot. I do believe it was a distraction and did cause a lack of focus and hustle. After this letter the Bucks looked like a completely different team. You can't tell me players were not talking about it among themselves.


tl:dr Bucks blew a 2-1 lead because Jabari wrote a letter.


If he has such strong mental powers that he can decide the fate of a playoff series simply by writing a letter, he's worth the max even if he doesn't play.
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#642 » by FrieAaron » Wed Nov 8, 2017 10:24 pm

I don't know that I've ever seen people on this board bend over backwards so much to try to discredit anything about a player to the extent that some do with Jabari. Even some of the posts about his injuries seem like condescending told-you-so's (the guy's so bad he can't even not get injured!).

Jabari has been a real offensive threat when he has been healthy here in a way that no one else on the team has been aside from Giannis. I have not been a big believer in Carmelo Anthony being able to be "the guy" over his career, but as the #2 next to Giannis hell yes you add that player. The only question is his health.
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#643 » by humanrefutation » Wed Nov 8, 2017 10:33 pm

hege53190 wrote:
DingleJerry wrote:Yea no way i'd say the letter had anything to do with it. If anything it was a vote of confidence and encouragement in his team/friends. Anyone taking that narrative is grasping at straws and watches way too much Stephen A and Skip talking head BS on espn.


Why write the letter at that particular time? I just don't get it. It was just a pathetic attempt to stay relevant. They were coming off the best basketball game of the year. There was absolutely no reason for the public encouragement. Whatever I call it a d-bag move.


This is a pathetic opinion. The guy wrote an article praising his team, city, and culture, and you've got the audacity to call it a d-bag move?

Why did he write it? Maybe he didn't just want to sit around and mope during his recovery? Maybe - for a guy who had blown his ACL for a second time and was helplessly watching his team compete from afar - this was his way of contributing to a positive team culture by offering support and encouragement and belief in his team and city? Maybe, just maybe, he just wanted to express his appreciation for his teammates? Maybe it isn't for the nefarious reasons you're implying?
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#644 » by emunney » Wed Nov 8, 2017 10:33 pm

I would love to see the faces on Bucks players when you tell them that Jabari's letter distracted them from winning. I don't think any of them would have any idea what you're talking about.
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#645 » by LogitechBucks » Wed Nov 8, 2017 11:26 pm

humanrefutation wrote:
hege53190 wrote:
DingleJerry wrote:Yea no way i'd say the letter had anything to do with it. If anything it was a vote of confidence and encouragement in his team/friends. Anyone taking that narrative is grasping at straws and watches way too much Stephen A and Skip talking head BS on espn.


Why write the letter at that particular time? I just don't get it. It was just a pathetic attempt to stay relevant. They were coming off the best basketball game of the year. There was absolutely no reason for the public encouragement. Whatever I call it a d-bag move.


This is a pathetic opinion. The guy wrote an article praising his team, city, and culture, and you've got the audacity to call it a d-bag move?

Why did he write it? Maybe he didn't just want to sit around and mope during his recovery? Maybe - for a guy who had blown his ACL for a second time and was helplessly watching his team compete from afar - this was his way of contributing to a positive team culture by offering support and encouragement and belief in his team and city? Maybe, just maybe, he just wanted to express his appreciation for his teammates? Maybe it isn't for the nefarious reasons you're implying?
One problem with your argument. Jabari didn't write this article. His agent wrote this article to get him out there on the big stage with lots of National Exposure. The timing of the whole thing is so obvious.
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#646 » by FrieAaron » Wed Nov 8, 2017 11:31 pm

LogitechBucks wrote: One problem with your argument. Jabari didn't write this article. His agent wrote this article to get him out there on the big stage with lots of National Exposure. The timing of the whole thing is so obvious.


Do you have some actual source for this or is it just that it's "so obvious?" And why is it so obvious? Of course the articles go through an editor, but the whole idea of the player's tribune is it's supposed to be an outlet for players.
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Re: RE: Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#647 » by humanrefutation » Wed Nov 8, 2017 11:32 pm

LogitechBucks wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
hege53190 wrote:
Why write the letter at that particular time? I just don't get it. It was just a pathetic attempt to stay relevant. They were coming off the best basketball game of the year. There was absolutely no reason for the public encouragement. Whatever I call it a d-bag move.


This is a pathetic opinion. The guy wrote an article praising his team, city, and culture, and you've got the audacity to call it a d-bag move?

Why did he write it? Maybe he didn't just want to sit around and mope during his recovery? Maybe - for a guy who had blown his ACL for a second time and was helplessly watching his team compete from afar - this was his way of contributing to a positive team culture by offering support and encouragement and belief in his team and city? Maybe, just maybe, he just wanted to express his appreciation for his teammates? Maybe it isn't for the nefarious reasons you're implying?
One problem with your argument. Jabari didn't write this article. His agent wrote this article to get him out there on the big stage with lots of National Exposure. The timing of the whole thing is so obvious.

You don't know that. The article was under his byline, and wouldn't have been written if it wasn't at his direction. Regardless, it takes a special brand of cynic to read that article and think "what a d-bag!"
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#648 » by jute2003 » Wed Nov 8, 2017 11:36 pm

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Re: RE: Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#649 » by jakecronus8 » Wed Nov 8, 2017 11:54 pm

humanrefutation wrote:
LogitechBucks wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
This is a pathetic opinion. The guy wrote an article praising his team, city, and culture, and you've got the audacity to call it a d-bag move?

Why did he write it? Maybe he didn't just want to sit around and mope during his recovery? Maybe - for a guy who had blown his ACL for a second time and was helplessly watching his team compete from afar - this was his way of contributing to a positive team culture by offering support and encouragement and belief in his team and city? Maybe, just maybe, he just wanted to express his appreciation for his teammates? Maybe it isn't for the nefarious reasons you're implying?
One problem with your argument. Jabari didn't write this article. His agent wrote this article to get him out there on the big stage with lots of National Exposure. The timing of the whole thing is so obvious.

You don't know that. The article was under his byline, and wouldn't have been written if it wasn't at his direction. Regardless, it takes a special brand of cynic to read that article and think "what a d-bag!"


I think it's entirely possible that the article was both genuine and at the same time extremely self serving and calculated. Not necessarily a Dbag move but let's not be naive as to why it was put out there.
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#650 » by Prez » Wed Nov 8, 2017 11:57 pm

Yeah, when I see a player article where he spends like 800 words going down the roster praising everybody the first thing that comes to my mind is how much of an attention whore he is. How dare he not STFU and pout on the bench while his teammates play their hearts out.
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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#651 » by humanrefutation » Wed Nov 8, 2017 11:58 pm

jakecronus8 wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
LogitechBucks wrote: One problem with your argument. Jabari didn't write this article. His agent wrote this article to get him out there on the big stage with lots of National Exposure. The timing of the whole thing is so obvious.

You don't know that. The article was under his byline, and wouldn't have been written if it wasn't at his direction. Regardless, it takes a special brand of cynic to read that article and think "what a d-bag!"


I think it's entirely possible that the article was both genuine and at the same time extremely self serving and calculated. Not necessarily a Dbag move but let's not be naive as to why it was put out there.

True, that is possible, but the rush to call him a d-bag or stupidly allege it was the cause of our playoff loss last year smacks of an anti-Jabari bias rather than a reasonable evaluation of the facts.

For example, Giannis has been interviewed and featured in several articles over the last couple weeks as the team has lost 4 in a row, and yet, I don't see a single person here blaming those articles for the losses, or calling Giannis self-centered or a d-bag.
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Re: RE: Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#652 » by LogitechBucks » Thu Nov 9, 2017 12:05 am

humanrefutation wrote:
LogitechBucks wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
This is a pathetic opinion. The guy wrote an article praising his team, city, and culture, and you've got the audacity to call it a d-bag move?

Why did he write it? Maybe he didn't just want to sit around and mope during his recovery? Maybe - for a guy who had blown his ACL for a second time and was helplessly watching his team compete from afar - this was his way of contributing to a positive team culture by offering support and encouragement and belief in his team and city? Maybe, just maybe, he just wanted to express his appreciation for his teammates? Maybe it isn't for the nefarious reasons you're implying?
One problem with your argument. Jabari didn't write this article. His agent wrote this article to get him out there on the big stage with lots of National Exposure. The timing of the whole thing is so obvious.

You don't know that. The article was under his byline, and wouldn't have been written if it wasn't at his direction. Regardless, it takes a special brand of cynic to read that article and think "what a d-bag!"
Read about the tactics that Mark Bartlestein has employed is the past and then consider his client was up for a 100 million dollar extension pre-injury and then do the math.
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#653 » by blazza18 » Thu Nov 9, 2017 12:13 am

The Jabari threads get derailed by the dumbest ****.
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Re: RE: Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#654 » by FrieAaron » Thu Nov 9, 2017 12:23 am

LogitechBucks wrote:
humanrefutation wrote:
LogitechBucks wrote: One problem with your argument. Jabari didn't write this article. His agent wrote this article to get him out there on the big stage with lots of National Exposure. The timing of the whole thing is so obvious.

You don't know that. The article was under his byline, and wouldn't have been written if it wasn't at his direction. Regardless, it takes a special brand of cynic to read that article and think "what a d-bag!"
Read about the tactics that Mark Bartlestein has employed is the past and then consider his client was up for a 100 million dollar extension pre-injury and then do the math.


OK, so there's no actual basis for it. :thumbsup:
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#655 » by DingleJerry » Thu Nov 9, 2017 1:16 am

Whatever, you can make an argument to try and judge his character on something like this, that it had contract motivations. I think it's an inaccurate and a dumb thing to judge someone on, and basically trying to find stuff to justify the way you're already thinking. Some pretty clear jumping to conclusions.

But to argue this in any way affected the teams performance in the games is a complete joke and makes absolutely no sense. A Skip Bayless level of horrible take. Makes me think of the Monix quote in Semi Pro: Does anybody here wanna talk about the effing game?
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Re: RE: Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#656 » by LogitechBucks » Thu Nov 9, 2017 1:24 am

FrieAaron wrote:
LogitechBucks wrote:
hThisumanrefutation wrote:You don't know that. The article was under his byline, and wouldn't have been written if it wasn't at his direction. Regardless, it takes a special brand of cynic to read that article and think "what a d-bag!"
Read about the tactics that Mark Bartlestein has employed is the past and then consider his client was up for a 100 million dollar extension pre-injury and then do the math.


OK, so there's no actual basis for it. :thumbsup:
Au contraire mon frere.... There is actually a compelling basis for it. Jabari in his long, self serving proclamation talked about how much he loved Milwaukee, the fans, his teammates and so on. He even said he wanted to raise his family in Milwaukee. To my knowledge, he did not have a girlfriend at the time but I guess he was referring to the future.

Now more forward a few months and this same individual who loves Milwaukee, loves the fans, loves his teammates is trying force the Bucks ownership into risking the teams ability to remain competitive and vie for a Championship by giving him a 5 year 20 million + contract not knowing whether or not he would ever be an effective basketball player again. These actions are not consistent with a person who loves Milwaukee, loves the fans and loves his teammates.

If his words of love were for real, he could have accepted a nice offer that contained team options for the first two years to confirm he has recovered from his 2 major knee surgeries and is no longer a huge health risk. was that ever an option? NO.. Jabari's actions came directly from his agent and it is so obvious it is hard to come up with any other plausible conclusion unless you are in denial.
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#657 » by xTitan » Thu Nov 9, 2017 1:44 am

I can't wait until Parker is back
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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#658 » by MickeyDavis » Thu Nov 9, 2017 1:48 am

Bartlestein is trying to get his client a lot of money? Shocking.

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Re: The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#659 » by xTitan » Thu Nov 9, 2017 1:51 am

MickeyDavis wrote:Bartlestein is trying to get his client a lot of money? Shocking.

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Oh he gets his clients a lot of money, that's why he gets the big bucks
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The Jabari Discussion Thread - Rehab, Game, Contract - NO DEAL, GOES TO RFA 

Post#660 » by M-C-G » Thu Nov 9, 2017 1:52 am

DingleJerry wrote:
hege53190 wrote:
DingleJerry wrote:Yea no way i'd say the letter had anything to do with it. If anything it was a vote of confidence and encouragement in his team/friends. Anyone taking that narrative is grasping at straws and watches way too much Stephen A and Skip talking head BS on espn.


Why write the letter at that particular time? I just don't get it. It was just a pathetic attempt to stay relevant. They were coming off the best basketball game of the year. There was absolutely no reason for the public encouragement. Whatever I call it a d-bag move.


That's a fair thing to say. Not one i'd agree with, but at least logical to use that as a sign he's full of himself a bit. But it's not logical to say that had any effect on the games themselves.


A show of solidarity and confidence about his teammates and our franchise. Only on realgm could this be considered a selfish d bag move. Christ guys, that opinion says way more about you than Jabari.


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