How Good is Jokic?

[SoCalNuggsFan]

Guess we’re finding who the real troll is...but I guess that’s just my opinion

Everyone who has ever disagreed with you is a troll and you have never held a terrible opinion.

Actually Sky and I have disagreed and never called each other troll. Not sure I'd call this trolling, it's more like having blinders on. I strongly suspect you never watched the 1960s games. You might notice I've never said there were more athletic players back then, nor have I said there were a higher percentage of athletic players back then. What I have said is there were athletic players back then and some of them might even dominate today. If they played now, would they be GOAT today? A couple might even get consideration because they would do better today than they did back then. Remember that coaches also reigned in many of those players and back then coaches held the power, not the players. Some coaches would even bench superstars. Until the late 1980s, teams totally controlled players. There was no such thing as a free agent. If a team didn't want to trade a player, he was stuck with that team. It was a different world and if you weren't there, you'll probably never understand it.

Who are some players (besides the obvious wilt, Russell, Baylor) that you think would dominate today? Not asking sarcastically because i don’t agree to be clear haha

[NuggetsWY]

Everyone who has ever disagreed with you is a troll and you have never held a terrible opinion.

Actually Sky and I have disagreed and never called each other troll. Not sure I'd call this trolling, it's more like having blinders on. I strongly suspect you never watched the 1960s games. You might notice I've never said there were more athletic players back then, nor have I said there were a higher percentage of athletic players back then. What I have said is there were athletic players back then and some of them might even dominate today. If they played now, would they be GOAT today? A couple might even get consideration because they would do better today than they did back then. Remember that coaches also reigned in many of those players and back then coaches held the power, not the players. Some coaches would even bench superstars. Until the late 1980s, teams totally controlled players. There was no such thing as a free agent. If a team didn't want to trade a player, he was stuck with that team. It was a different world and if you weren't there, you'll probably never understand it.

Who are some players (besides the obvious wilt, Russell, Baylor) that you think would dominate today? Not asking sarcastically because i don’t agree to be clear haha

We're comparing apples and oranges, as I've pointed out before. It was a different league and individualism was stifled and players had no control over the destiny. Yet dominate players tend to be dominate players not based on athletic skills but based on will; although athletic ability is clearly needed in the NBA.

I remember the 1970s better than the 1960s and of course some players played in both decades. Here are some I remember as probably able to dominate even today.

Knicks had Willis Reed, Walt Frazier, & Earl Monroe
Some others would include Pete Maravich although he only played in the 1970s plus Oscar Robertson.
Let's not forget the ABA players who lived by showy athleticism and the earliest stars would have included Connie Hawkins and Spencer Haywood - both of whom could probably start on most modern NBA teams in my opinion.

[NuggetsWY]

A quick eye-ball of rosters shows at least 30 players in the NBA this year that out-weigh Jokic. He's going to have to get used to being hammered. Ticky-tack fouls are called outside and in favor of superstars.

[Alatan]

A quick eye-ball of rosters shows at least 30 players in the NBA this year that out-weigh Jokic. He's going to have to get used to being hammered. Ticky-tack fouls are called outside and in favor of superstars.

Thats 100% true and i hate it. Not because of Jokic but because it makes superstars unguardable. Totally unfair to the rest of the league...

[NuggetsWY]

A quick eye-ball of rosters shows at least 30 players in the NBA this year that out-weigh Jokic. He's going to have to get used to being hammered. Ticky-tack fouls are called outside and in favor of superstars.

Thats 100% true and i hate it. Not because of Jokic but because it makes superstars unguardable. Totally unfair to the rest of the league...

and that's been true for how many decades? I think I heard an announcer say that in the first NBA game I ever heard, which was probably in the early-to-middle 1960s

[Alatan]

A quick eye-ball of rosters shows at least 30 players in the NBA this year that out-weigh Jokic. He's going to have to get used to being hammered. Ticky-tack fouls are called outside and in favor of superstars.

Thats 100% true and i hate it. Not because of Jokic but because it makes superstars unguardable. Totally unfair to the rest of the league...

and that's been true for how many decades? I think I heard an announcer say that in the first NBA game I ever heard, which was probably in the early-to-middle 1960s

Since always probably. Sometimes i wonder how many players started out struggling and could never break out because they were in the non-star category. I watched a lot of FIBA tournaments and now when i watch the NBA i am amazed with how many violations the star players get away with. Travels, carries, charges, fouls, you name it... But i guess its how the people like it. Stars are like heroes and they battle each other while the rest of the guys are "role players"...

[NuggetsWY]

Thats 100% true and i hate it. Not because of Jokic but because it makes superstars unguardable. Totally unfair to the rest of the league...

and that's been true for how many decades? I think I heard an announcer say that in the first NBA game I ever heard, which was probably in the early-to-middle 1960s

Since always probably. Sometimes i wonder how many players started out struggling and could never break out because they were in the non-star category. I watched a lot of FIBA tournaments and now when i watch the NBA i am amazed with how many violations the star players get away with. Travels, carries, charges, fouls, you name it... But i guess its how the people like it. Stars are like heroes and they battle each other while the rest of the guys are "role players"...

That's about the way things go and no doubt plenty of good players never make it because they can't accept that. Scott Hastings is a great example. In my opinion he was the perfect bench big. He knew what he could do and knew what he could not do. He started very few games and only average around 10 mpg but he accepted his role. There have been a few players that had talent, but thought they had more. They might have made starter, but they didn't last even though players with less skill did - and it was because they just could not accept their role.

It's the same reason some players never even attempt to play college ball (any sport). They know they aren't good enough to start and they aren't willing to be a college backup with no shot at the pros.

[Alatan]

and that's been true for how many decades? I think I heard an announcer say that in the first NBA game I ever heard, which was probably in the early-to-middle 1960s

Since always probably. Sometimes i wonder how many players started out struggling and could never break out because they were in the non-star category. I watched a lot of FIBA tournaments and now when i watch the NBA i am amazed with how many violations the star players get away with. Travels, carries, charges, fouls, you name it... But i guess its how the people like it. Stars are like heroes and they battle each other while the rest of the guys are "role players"...

That's about the way things go and no doubt plenty of good players never make it because they can't accept that. Scott Hastings is a great example. In my opinion he was the perfect bench big. He knew what he could do and knew what he could not do. He started very few games and only average around 10 mpg but he accepted his role. There have been a few players that had talent, but thought they had more. They might have made starter, but they didn't last even though players with less skill did - and it was because they just could not accept their role.

It's the same reason some players never even attempt to play college ball (any sport). They know they aren't good enough to start and they aren't willing to be a college backup with no shot at the pros.

Yeah, its a tough choice...

I wish that the NBA would tighten up the rules. It would make defense more important and we would see more skill or teamwork involved in scoring. They started out this season calling all the 1st step travels and illegal screens. I hope the trend continues, not because i like all the choppiness it brings but because i hope it makes players stop cheating and start playing better basketball. Taking away those Harden fouls is great as well.

[NuggetsWY]

Since always probably. Sometimes i wonder how many players started out struggling and could never break out because they were in the non-star category. I watched a lot of FIBA tournaments and now when i watch the NBA i am amazed with how many violations the star players get away with. Travels, carries, charges, fouls, you name it... But i guess its how the people like it. Stars are like heroes and they battle each other while the rest of the guys are "role players"...

That's about the way things go and no doubt plenty of good players never make it because they can't accept that. Scott Hastings is a great example. In my opinion he was the perfect bench big. He knew what he could do and knew what he could not do. He started very few games and only average around 10 mpg but he accepted his role. There have been a few players that had talent, but thought they had more. They might have made starter, but they didn't last even though players with less skill did - and it was because they just could not accept their role.

It's the same reason some players never even attempt to play college ball (any sport). They know they aren't good enough to start and they aren't willing to be a college backup with no shot at the pros.

Yeah, its a tough choice...

I wish that the NBA would tighten up the rules. It would make defense more important and we would see more skill or teamwork involved in scoring. They started out this season calling all the 1st step travels and illegal screens. I hope the trend continues, not because i like all the choppiness it brings but because i hope it makes players stop cheating and start playing better basketball. Taking away those Harden fouls is great as well.

Keep your day job, but that's not a bad start as a comedian.
Remember when they said, "We're going to start fining players for flopping?"
They've created a nightmare regarding hand-checks because they are so inconsistent.
They've created a nightmare regarding stepping under jump shooters because they are so inconsistent.
They've created a nightmare regarding slapping jump-shooters because they are so inconsistent.
I've heard plenty of talk, but the only thing they've done a good job at adjusting to is violence - and I thank them for that.

[Alatan]

That's about the way things go and no doubt plenty of good players never make it because they can't accept that. Scott Hastings is a great example. In my opinion he was the perfect bench big. He knew what he could do and knew what he could not do. He started very few games and only average around 10 mpg but he accepted his role. There have been a few players that had talent, but thought they had more. They might have made starter, but they didn't last even though players with less skill did - and it was because they just could not accept their role.

It's the same reason some players never even attempt to play college ball (any sport). They know they aren't good enough to start and they aren't willing to be a college backup with no shot at the pros.

Yeah, its a tough choice...

I wish that the NBA would tighten up the rules. It would make defense more important and we would see more skill or teamwork involved in scoring. They started out this season calling all the 1st step travels and illegal screens. I hope the trend continues, not because i like all the choppiness it brings but because i hope it makes players stop cheating and start playing better basketball. Taking away those Harden fouls is great as well.

Keep your day job, but that's not a bad start as a comedian.
Remember when they said, "We're going to start fining players for flopping?"
They've created a nightmare regarding hand-checks because they are so inconsistent.
They've created a nightmare regarding stepping under jump shooters because they are so inconsistent.
They've created a nightmare regarding slapping jump-shooters because they are so inconsistent.
I've heard plenty of talk, but the only thing they've done a good job at adjusting to is violence - and I thank them for that.

One can only hope.