Season Speculation, Trade Ideas & Discussion Pt. 3

[LukasBMW]

We're easily bottom 5 talent wise. Especially if Booker or TJ sits for an extended period.

I'm down to tank one more year while the draft still favors tanking, but after this year we better at least offer nice 1 year deals to some quality vets to fill in holes in our lineup.

These guys want to win and they are getting frustrated.

[Mulhollanddrive]

There's a pretty good chance we may have something like pick 5, 16, 20, 35, 41, 52.

Miami doing well may help us keep the Milwaukee pick.

As it stands we have 4 roster spots and about $30m in cap space for next season.

[lilfishi22]

I am not expecting either player to turn into a star and Chriss' attitude and work ethic leave a lot to be desired. Nobody taken in that top 8 after three is looking any good yet. Sure we could have taken someone more ready like Sabonis who has looked good and is more of a sure thing but we went with the big risk big potential upside guys.

I am not saying I expect them to be great but I won't give up or proclaim they are a lost cause yet.

I agree after two years if those are their per 36 stats at a stretch of games near the end of their second year that it's not great.

I'm just not sure about the draft anymore. If we can get a Booker and TJ at #13 and #14 but Len at #4. I kind of feel like McD's draft record is at best, passable because of those two finds but outside of Booker/TJ, it's very spotty.

It's just tough that he had high picks in bad drafts. No matter who he took in that Len draft it would look bad unless he took Giannis or Gobert or McCollum that early but that would have been far higher than consensus.

As for the 16 draft, it might have been best to just keep the 13th pick and 27th pick and Bogdan and try your luck with those instead of packaging to move up. At least more shots at finding someone good.

Seems like Suns have often done well with late lotto or even picks into the early 20s. Going back to 94...

94 - Person at 23
95 - Finley at 21
96 - Nash at 15

No first round picks in 97, 98

99 - Marion at 9

25th pick in 00, no first rounder in 01

02 - Amare at 9

Sarver took over a couple summers later and we started selling and trading them.

Basically you can get good players anywhere and many top players will bust.

Our bigger problem right now is that we don't have any sort of semblance of a long term plan. Sarver goes from wanting McD to compete to being fine with a rebuild.

They don't have a firm long term coaching/development plan in place so the players have basically been in no mans land ever since last summer (16).

They simply gave Watson more than he could handle since he had only been a D league assistant coach and he was in over his head from the beginning.

I don't think we have a long term roster either which to me is equally troubling. Booker is a potential #1 option on a good team. TJ is really more of a 3rd option on a good team. But it's hard to argue that they are on the same level as a Embiid and Simmons. How Booker/TJ will continue to develop is unknown and the rest of the roster is pretty much still up in the air. I know I know we took a bit of a roundabout route to a rebuild whereas the Sixers went in hard and fast but a huge part of the frustration is that we've been on the rebuilding journey for what seems like a decade. You could argue we only just started a true rebuild a season ago but it just seems like we don't have much that's concrete we can point to and say, yes, they can take us to the promised land in due time.

It's obviously too late to do what the Sixers did now so we need to roll with what we have. In which case, we should be prioritizing proven talent acquisition because while Booker is young and his window is long, I think getting him a taste of legitimate competitive basketball earlier rather than later is as good as any move we make. Having playoff basketball as a goal seems lofty and many would argue is counter-productive to the rebuilding philosophy but there's no reason why we can't still make shrewd moves and improve from within even with a semi-competitive roster. I'm really just not convinced going through another 3-4 years of rebuilding will necessarily result in a better roster at the end of those 3-4 years especially if players like Chriss, Bender, JJ don't turn into serious contributors or whoever else we grab in the coming drafts.

I don't think we need to go out and sign a guy like Millsap or LMA but I think we could certainly look at cashing in on those million draft picks we seem to have and also the assets we have on the roster. Chriss is a prime candidate to be moved and I don't know what his market is but combined with a 1st round pick, we could grab a player who's more ready to contribute now.

[lilfishi22]

We're easily bottom 5 talent wise. Especially if Booker or TJ sits for an extended period.

I'm down to tank one more year while the draft still favors tanking, but after this year we better at least offer nice 1 year deals to some quality vets to fill in holes in our lineup.

These guys want to win and they are getting frustrated.

It feels like never-ending cycle. If we whiff on this draft and grab this draft's version of Len (probably won't but...), we might be 2-3 seasons away from having this conversation again of "let's tank one more year". Even if the draft no longer favors tanking as much, tanking will still be your best opportunity to get a high pick and I think they would still be enticing if we're not where we need to be.

[kennydorglas]

Draft Ayton and hire Budenholzer.
Talent wise doesnt matter if we let Hornacek, Watson and Triano coach them.

Just look at the Celtics.
Imagine Jaylen Brown playing for anyone else but Stevens.

[bwgood77]

I don't think we have a long term roster either which to me is equally troubling. Booker is a potential #1 option on a good team. TJ is really more of a 3rd option on a good team. But it's hard to argue that they are on the same level as a Embiid and Simmons. How Booker/TJ will continue to develop is unknown and the rest of the roster is pretty much still up in the air. I know I know we took a bit of a roundabout route to a rebuild whereas the Sixers went in hard and fast but a huge part of the frustration is that we've been on the rebuilding journey for what seems like a decade. You could argue we only just started a true rebuild a season ago but it just seems like we don't have much that's concrete we can point to and say, yes, they can take us to the promised land in due time.

It's obviously too late to do what the Sixers did now so we need to roll with what we have. In which case, we should be prioritizing proven talent acquisition because while Booker is young and his window is long, I think getting him a taste of legitimate competitive basketball earlier rather than later is as good as any move we make. Having playoff basketball as a goal seems lofty and many would argue is counter-productive to the rebuilding philosophy but there's no reason why we can't still make shrewd moves and improve from within even with a semi-competitive roster. I'm really just not convinced going through another 3-4 years of rebuilding will necessarily result in a better roster at the end of those 3-4 years especially if players like Chriss, Bender, JJ don't turn into serious contributors or whoever else we grab in the coming drafts.

I don't think we need to go out and sign a guy like Millsap or LMA but I think we could certainly look at cashing in on those million draft picks we seem to have and also the assets we have on the roster. Chriss is a prime candidate to be moved and I don't know what his market is but combined with a 1st round pick, we could grab a player who's more ready to contribute now.

Oh yeah, you can't compare Booker/TJ to Embiid/Simmons. Simmons might be having the best rookie season ever and and Embiid probably has the highest upside in the game. Their only question is injury. It's not even worth talking about what option our guys can be.

You're right our roster is a huge concern. When you can't shoot or play defense in a league that relies upon great shooting and defense, you're in trouble.

That's why I'm glad we have a lot of picks. Because we need to find some decent shooters and defenders...hopefully some players that can do both.

Yes, it's easy to whiff in the draft. It's also the easiest way to add talent. Hopefully our picks are used wisely this year and next (I hate always looking in the future but those drafts will be in the past in no time). I don't think Chriss and a pick nets us much of a player. I don't think we have enough to where adding one player is going to turn fortunes much.

I'd love to have playoff basketball and not have to just pin our hopes on the draft. I didn't think this year we'd make the playoffs regardless of what we do, as young (or old) as most of our team is. Hopefully next year we get to where we are knocking on the door.

[bwgood77]

Draft Ayton and hire Budenholzer.
Talent wise doesnt matter if we let Hornacek, Watson and Triano coach them.

Just look at the Celtics.
Imagine Jaylen Brown playing for anyone else but Stevens.

So is Atlanta just going to get rid of Budenholzer? I saw it was rumored that he wasn't the right coach for a rebuilding team. If that's the case, if he was available, would he be right for us? Obviously he's a better option that what we have. Would we just be saying Atlanta is wrong? I wonder if he was perhaps on his way out if it had anything to do with him not wanting to be part of a rebuild.

[Qwigglez]

Put me down for going the Twolves route. Add a star, hire an experienced and proven coach and let Booker experience the playoffs in our uniform.

Absolutely agree. I mean, the T-Wolves won only 31 games last year. Right now the Suns are on pace to win between 28-29 games so we aren't far off from where they were last year. They had two main budding stars as their building blocks with Wiggins/KAT. They also had Lavine who was looking solid before his injury. We got Booker/Warren and no one has stepped as a third wheel. Jackson has looked good defensively but his shot is horrible.

The Wolves were in an amazing situation this off-season where they capitalized on their cap space. A situation where I've been emphasizing we need to capitalize because we'll be in the same boat this off-season. They were able to sign both Teague and Gibson and then they gave Wiggins a max contract. Of course, they also traded for Butler during the draft. We can literally do almost the same thing.

We land a pick somewhere in the 5-8 range, trade it on draft day (and an additional pick(s) if needed) for Kemba Walker if the Hornets don't make the playoffs or have an early exit. Sign Boogie Cousins. Since we have Monroe's bird rights I say we sign him too after we go over the cap (I believe we can do this). Max out Booker.

Kemba/Booker/Warren/Bender/Boogie
Ulis/Knight/Jackson/Chriss/Monroe + Chandler

We have 4 guys in our starting lineup who can easily score 20 a game (3 who can give us 25 a game) and then Bender is the glue to it all with his passing ability and opens up the floor. Our bench looks solid if Knight can find happiness off the bench. Knight and Monroe are the microwaves and Jackson is the defender. We also have Chandler for veteran leadership.

I like it, except that we need to dump Chandler somehow, IMO. No need to carry him, Boogie, Monroe, and Williams, along with Bender, Chriss, and Dudley...he's cheaper, he's a big, and can shoot from 3...not 3 FEET, like Chandler, but from the 3 POINT LINE).

Then, Warren and JJ/Booker and Daniels or Reed. Yep let's dump Knight as well. And lastly Kemba Walker/Ulis.

BLUF...Knight and either Mia '18 pick or ours. Probably not enough, but maybe McD could swap one of our youngsters for one of theirs.

Maybe Lamb, Kemba, and Zeller for BK, Chandler, and Bender, plus a pick, or something.

Well in order to sign Boogie, we'd have to cut Alan Williams, as I believe he has a team option with us and a cap hold of 1mil. Also ASUdevil pointed out we need to also renounce Monroe so we won't be able to keep him either. I doubt a team will take on Tyson Chandler, but I'd look to trade him for cap space. Maybe GM Lebron wants help and we can trade Chandler and our 2nd round pick for Channing Frye. That gives us an extra 13mil in cap space so we'd be able to get Boogie. Trading for Kemba I would do Jared Dudley and 2 or 3 1st for him. This way, we don't give up any of our young guys such as Chriss/Bender. Though maybe we trade Chriss and keep a pick if we like someone in that picks' range. I think the Hornets may do this, again if they miss the playoffs or get beat early as Kemba Walker will be an upcoming free agent in 2019.

So our team could look like this...
Kemba/Booker/Warren/Bender/Boogie
Ulis/Knight/Jackson/Chriss/????

Maybe keep Frye around for vet leadership? We would need a big, but our wings would be fine as we'd still have Troy Daniels/Knight combo off the bench. IDK, seems like a solid team to me that is good for now and the future.

[Mulhollanddrive]

I don't think Michael Jordan would trade away his best player I can't imagine he loves draft picks.

[AtheJ415]

We're easily bottom 5 talent wise. Especially if Booker or TJ sits for an extended period.

I'm down to tank one more year while the draft still favors tanking, but after this year we better at least offer nice 1 year deals to some quality vets to fill in holes in our lineup.

These guys want to win and they are getting frustrated.

The problem is at 5 we are most likely to drop to 6. We need to jump to 4 to feel good about a top 5 pick. Luckily, Dallas is starting to show signs. I feel like Chicago will for sure be worse than us. Dallas, Atlanta, and maybe Sac (if their vets finally start to produce like Hill) can catch us.

[AtheJ415]

I don't think any PG trade makes sense except for MAYBE Schroeder and even then it would depend on the price. I think the better, more likely option is if we suck enough to get a top 5 big (one of Bagley, Ayton, Bamba) and then are able to package both the Mil and Miami picks to move up enough to grab Sexton or Duval in the mid lottery. If we grab Porter or Doncic though and want to play Porter on the wing, the only way it really works is with Point Booker imo to get the top 5 players on the court.

[lilfishi22]

I don't think we have a long term roster either which to me is equally troubling. Booker is a potential #1 option on a good team. TJ is really more of a 3rd option on a good team. But it's hard to argue that they are on the same level as a Embiid and Simmons. How Booker/TJ will continue to develop is unknown and the rest of the roster is pretty much still up in the air. I know I know we took a bit of a roundabout route to a rebuild whereas the Sixers went in hard and fast but a huge part of the frustration is that we've been on the rebuilding journey for what seems like a decade. You could argue we only just started a true rebuild a season ago but it just seems like we don't have much that's concrete we can point to and say, yes, they can take us to the promised land in due time.

It's obviously too late to do what the Sixers did now so we need to roll with what we have. In which case, we should be prioritizing proven talent acquisition because while Booker is young and his window is long, I think getting him a taste of legitimate competitive basketball earlier rather than later is as good as any move we make. Having playoff basketball as a goal seems lofty and many would argue is counter-productive to the rebuilding philosophy but there's no reason why we can't still make shrewd moves and improve from within even with a semi-competitive roster. I'm really just not convinced going through another 3-4 years of rebuilding will necessarily result in a better roster at the end of those 3-4 years especially if players like Chriss, Bender, JJ don't turn into serious contributors or whoever else we grab in the coming drafts.

I don't think we need to go out and sign a guy like Millsap or LMA but I think we could certainly look at cashing in on those million draft picks we seem to have and also the assets we have on the roster. Chriss is a prime candidate to be moved and I don't know what his market is but combined with a 1st round pick, we could grab a player who's more ready to contribute now.

Oh yeah, you can't compare Booker/TJ to Embiid/Simmons. Simmons might be having the best rookie season ever and and Embiid probably has the highest upside in the game. Their only question is injury. It's not even worth talking about what option our guys can be.

You're right our roster is a huge concern. When you can't shoot or play defense in a league that relies upon great shooting and defense, you're in trouble.

That's why I'm glad we have a lot of picks. Because we need to find some decent shooters and defenders...hopefully some players that can do both.

Yes, it's easy to whiff in the draft. It's also the easiest way to add talent. Hopefully our picks are used wisely this year and next (I hate always looking in the future but those drafts will be in the past in no time). I don't think Chriss and a pick nets us much of a player. I don't think we have enough to where adding one player is going to turn fortunes much.

I'd love to have playoff basketball and not have to just pin our hopes on the draft. I didn't think this year we'd make the playoffs regardless of what we do, as young (or old) as most of our team is. Hopefully next year we get to where we are knocking on the door.

It's good to have a lot of picks but the issue with picks is you need 2-3 seasons to really know what you have. Booker could take another season or two to truly come into his own as a Harden-esque player but he could also continue playing on this bottom feed team and just learn pads his stats. We've seen plenty of great young scorers in this league who because their team/roster is so bad, the only way they learn how to win games is to just try and score as many points as they can while ignoring other parts of the game to help them win. Not saying Booker is headed that way but it's certainly a dangerous possibility.

I really hope Booker continues to develop into a well-rounded player with just a good coach to guide his way but I'd like it a lot more if we have more experience on the roster to aid in that development. Whether playoffs is a goal or not, is less of a factor for me than our guys developing and playing the right brand of basketball. I feel like we're starting to see that with Triano but we're also severely constrained by the limitations on this roster (our lack of depth in most positions outside of the SG and SF). We say this every year and it's true every year but we need to kill it in this draft. In a stacked draft like this one and with potentially 3 first round picks, we need at least one star player from it.

[Hesh]

A Hawk's fan posted these 3 trade proposals


ATL : Knight, Dudley, 2018 TOR 2nd, 2018 CHA 2nd

PHO : Schroeder, Belinelli

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ATL : Chandler, Dudley

PHO : Schroeder, Delaney
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ATL: Chandler, Dudley, Pondexter, 2018 TOR 2nd, 2020 PHO 2nd

PHO: Schroeder, Mirotic, Payne, 2018 HOU 1st, 2018 MIN 1st

CHI: Knight, Belinelli, Delaney, 2018 MIA 1st
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

He went on to say that Schroeder has soured in the eyes of Hawk's fans for pushing out Teague, not getting along with Dwight, character issues, etc.

If they're willing to off-load Schroeder for such little return, this is a major red flag in terms of his character. This guy actually prefers to have Brandon Knight. What the f***?!?!

[AtheJ415]

Lol. I'd do all of those trades, but doubt Atlanta, who is looking to rebuild, would want Chandler and Dudley for him. They'd want youth or picks or a combo of both. That said, similar to Bledsoe, there aren't that many teams who need PGs and Schroeder is not super elite, so he'd probably fetch far less than people expect on the open market.

[Mulhollanddrive]

Schroder might be the sexier high potential option but I think Dinwiddie or McConnell would make the team and our star players better.

Career Averages:

Assist to Turnover Ratio
Dinwiddie 3.4 to 1
McConnell 2.9 to 1
Schroder 2.0 to 1

3 Point %
Dinwiddie 33%
Schroder 33%
McConnell 31%

Steals Per 36
McConnell 1.9
Dinwiddie 1.4
Schroder 1.4

O-Rating
Dinwiddie 111
McConnell 105
Schroder 100

Also Schroder is likely to cost about $10m more.

[thamadkant]

Draft Ayton and hire Budenholzer.
Talent wise doesnt matter if we let Hornacek, Watson and Triano coach them.

Just look at the Celtics.
Imagine Jaylen Brown playing for anyone else but Stevens.

So is Atlanta just going to get rid of Budenholzer? I saw it was rumored that he wasn't the right coach for a rebuilding team. If that's the case, if he was available, would he be right for us? Obviously he's a better option that what we have. Would we just be saying Atlanta is wrong? I wonder if he was perhaps on his way out if it had anything to do with him not wanting to be part of a rebuild.

Budenholzer is a mini Popovic... when he had the players (Teague, Korver, Milsap, Horford and Carroll) they were so fun to watch. Very tactical, good ball movement, CLEAR roles for players.

Thats what Suns needs... a structure that maximises a player's strengths and minimizes his weaknesses. The Suns current offense and defense rely heavily on one on one and individuals creating and hitting tough shots.


I'd want him as Suns coach for sure.... but Suns must make moves to push for playoffs next season (I think its better to get a top 5 pick this season).... Go for Cousins, George, package some of the picks for future picks and veteran help)

[AtheJ415]

Why would Philly or Brooklyn trade either of those guys? They are on rookie deals and make nothing, and neither has a PG to replace them with who is healthy, while both are trying to win now. Schroeder at least makes some sense because he is paid a ton, which Atlanta may want to get out from under if they are indeed done with him, and are rebuilding so want to get picks.

[thamadkant]

Suns / Grizzlies
Monroe + Chandler + Chriss
for
Gasol + Wright




Suns / Hawks
Heat pick and Bucks pick for Schroeder



Hire Buldenholzer



C: Gasol / Wright / Williams
PF: Bender / Dudley
SF: Warren / Jackson / DJJ
SG: Booker / Daniels
PG: Schroeder / Ulis / James



Go for Paul George next season and maybe make a move for a PF (TJ Warren as trade bait??)

[Mulhollanddrive]

I'm happy to hold off on moves until the off-season because if we get a top 5 pick this season we're done with accumulating and can go perform.

[Frank Lee]

wait till memphis implodes.... sneak in a snag Conley for Monroe/chris/pick/pick. PG prob solved for the next 3 years