Did Phil fall asleep On Donovan Mitchell workout?

[Jeff Van Gully]

Not that anyone wants to hear this, but Mitchell was on Phil's short list. There were threads stating the fear that we were going to take him. IIRC there were reports about how well our workout with him went. In that thread I posted that I thought that it was a front for someone else with the same agency.

he was def on the short list. Thats why I had hope fo him outside of Frank if did not get him. There were a few reports with him and the Knicks.

Frank and Mitchell was the ones I wanted at that spot.

my dream was to get another pick somehow and end up with both frank and mitchell.

[eagle54]

I'm just gonna address the first part about the "true PG". Jazz actually play better when Rubio is on the bench and Mitchell is running the show. Last night was a good example, Mitchell brought the team back from double digit deficit and not only was he scoring but he was finding guys in transition with sweet dimes. He goes to the bench to get rest and Rubio (a true PG) replaces him and the Jazz lose the lead. Mitchell comes back and Rubio is benched and he brings his team back and they win the game. Mitchell is not some chucker, he's a play maker who's more than capable of running PG on the NBA level. Just because a guy has scoring ability doesn't mean he can't be a PG or considered a "true PG". What is a true PG in the modern NBA anyway? Rondo? Rubio? These guys have so many flaws on offense that it actually hurts their teams more than some people think. Also, if Frank is a "true PG" then people need to stop complaining about his lack of aggression, asking him to shoot more, attack the basket more, etc. because essentially your asking him to play like Donovan Mitchell

So you want to compare frank and rubio or rondo just because he want to pass in first ? So compare they moves, frank have it, not the two others... Rondo shoot the 3 in his career ? rubio too ? frank can like a rookie... They are lot of différences between be hesitant and have no shoot... Frank is a true PG like they are trained in Europe ( teodisic are the same profil in offense, just more polished to score but most of Pg in Europe have this profile because they are trained like that), he have all Fundamentals learned in Europe for a PG, the PG who score in Europe are use in SG position... European BB is more traditionnal than US BB, Combo who can score in europe are not use in Pg, not the US mentality so just remember that.

Mitchell is a first scorer, so two differents profiles. Maybe he is more a avery Bradley profile with good offense and it's good for Jazz but they are a lottery team now...

And you can't see the difference between a Nash and Marbury or a Billups and Rose ?

Once again we take a guy for our need. Michell is very good and have big potential like maybe 8-10 others players in this draft.
Be happy to have one of this guy and be patient.

It just incredible to see a lot of impatience in part of fanbase while we have been bad for years and now we can really rebuilt a solid team, they are impatience and lots of topics created after every goods perfs of a rookie just to clashed Pj or / and Frank.

[blueNorange]

this frank homer might make me hate frank.

[blueNorange]

here's a real post from me, playing the coulda woulda shoulda game is dumb af.

truth is, none of the pg's in this draft have been impressive. dsj and mitchell are scoring a lot on low efficiency and free reign on the offense to do whatever they want. ball is what i knew what he'd be, monk is garbage, fox is struggling, and dsj is showing the world why he's a gutless coward loser.

frank also is part of this underwhelming guard draft class, he's shown nothing so far other than playing defense and passing the ball to o'quinn because he's afraid to shoot the ball. the thing with frank though that the other guard don't have is the the 'project' title. frank wasn't drafted to contribute now or even next year, frank was always high upside pick.

does that mean frank will be good? no

this draft class is starting to look overrated, nobody has separated themselves from the rest of the pack ... and that's scary.

[HEZI]

I'm just gonna address the first part about the "true PG". Jazz actually play better when Rubio is on the bench and Mitchell is running the show. Last night was a good example, Mitchell brought the team back from double digit deficit and not only was he scoring but he was finding guys in transition with sweet dimes. He goes to the bench to get rest and Rubio (a true PG) replaces him and the Jazz lose the lead. Mitchell comes back and Rubio is benched and he brings his team back and they win the game. Mitchell is not some chucker, he's a play maker who's more than capable of running PG on the NBA level. Just because a guy has scoring ability doesn't mean he can't be a PG or considered a "true PG". What is a true PG in the modern NBA anyway? Rondo? Rubio? These guys have so many flaws on offense that it actually hurts their teams more than some people think. Also, if Frank is a "true PG" then people need to stop complaining about his lack of aggression, asking him to shoot more, attack the basket more, etc. because essentially your asking him to play like Donovan Mitchell

So you want to compare frank and rubio or rondo just because he want to pass in first ? So compare they moves, frank have it, not the two others... Rondo shoot the 3 in his career ? rubio too ? frank can like a rookie... They are lot of différences between be hesitant and have no shoot... Frank is a true PG like they are trained in Europe ( teodisic are the same profil in offense, just more polished to score but most of Pg in Europe have this profile because they are trained like that), he have all Fundamentals learned in Europe for a PG, the PG who score in Europe are use in SG position... European BB is more traditionnal than US BB, Combo who can score in europe are not use in Pg, not the US mentality so just remember that.

Mitchell is a first scorer, so two differents profiles. Maybe he is more a avery Bradley profile with good offense and it's good for Jazz but they are a lottery team now...

And you can't see the difference between a Nash and Marbury or a Billups and Rose ?

Once again we take a guy for our need. Michell is very good and have big potential like maybe 8-10 others players in this draft.
Be happy to have one of this guy and be patient.

It just incredible to see a lot of impatience in part of fanbase while we have been bad for years and now we can really rebuilt a solid team, they are impatience and lots of topics created after every goods perfs of a rookie just to clashed Pj or / and Frank.

Look, I don't really care about what is traditional in Europe, it means absolutely nothing when talking about the NBA. It's irrelevant. So if your assessment of a what a PG is and isn't stems from European standards, then this argument can just end right there because it means nothing in regards to a discussion about the NBA. The best PG's in the NBA would not be considered "traditional" or "true PG's" by these European standards (which are actually outdated NBA standards) . Also, please don't tell me to be patient, you got the wrong one here since I've been preaching patience with Frank from the very beginning. This has nothing to do with patience, I addressed you on a specific claim you made about who is a "true PG" so stick to that subject.

[Red Vines]

If Anthony Davis doesn't go down to start the 4th quarter nobody is probably talking about Donovan Mitchell today, at least no more than usual.

[Rasho Brezec]

Not that anyone wants to hear this, but Mitchell was on Phil's short list. There were threads stating the fear that we were going to take him. IIRC there were reports about how well our workout with him went. In that thread I posted that I thought that it was a front for someone else with the same agency.

he was def on the short list. Thats why I had hope fo him outside of Frank if did not get him. There were a few reports with him and the Knicks.

Frank and Mitchell was the ones I wanted at that spot.

my dream was to get another pick somehow and end up with both frank and mitchell.

They would complement each other and form a great defensive back court.

[IllmaticHandler]

[Jeff Van Gully]

i want to see this person after all wins

[MaseInYourFace]

Frank Ntilikina is 19 years old. It hurts me this board isn't smarter but I know deep inside if we had Kobe, Greek freak, or Dirk here during their rookie years most would be giving up on them and looking to trade them. Not that I'm saying Frank will be that good but it's to illustrate a point

[Jalen Bluntson]

I would love to have Mitchell. He'd be starting for us already. I think we would also have a better record so...the tank would be long dead.

I'm happy with the Frank pick at the moment though. He's really raw but, you can the potential. On the defensive side of the ball he's got talent. Not just his effort and his length. His IQ is pretty high on that end as well. That's much tougher to teach/improve on than him getting his shot off.

Speaking of his shot. It's sweet. He's got a great looking shot. Just zero confidence. Zero desire to shoot. Passes up WIDE open looks. Hesitates and then looks to pass it off. He also refuses to drive the lane. I don't know what it is with him but, he just doesn't want to score at all. He CAN...he just doesn't want to.

As people have stated in this thread and I have been saying all season...he's 19. JUST turned 19. He's raw. It will take 2-3 YEARS to develop this kid. Not 2-3 months. Mitchell is 2 years ahead in development both physically and skills wise. Too soon to tell.

I'm down with Ntilikina though. He's a smart kid with a love for the game. A high IQ. Hard worker. Great length and he's still growing. Give him time.

[Jalen Bluntson]

I'm just gonna address the first part about the "true PG". Jazz actually play better when Rubio is on the bench and Mitchell is running the show. Last night was a good example, Mitchell brought the team back from double digit deficit and not only was he scoring but he was finding guys in transition with sweet dimes. He goes to the bench to get rest and Rubio (a true PG) replaces him and the Jazz lose the lead. Mitchell comes back and Rubio is benched and he brings his team back and they win the game. Mitchell is not some chucker, he's a play maker who's more than capable of running PG on the NBA level. Just because a guy has scoring ability doesn't mean he can't be a PG or considered a "true PG". What is a true PG in the modern NBA anyway? Rondo? Rubio? These guys have so many flaws on offense that it actually hurts their teams more than some people think. Also, if Frank is a "true PG" then people need to stop complaining about his lack of aggression, asking him to shoot more, attack the basket more, etc. because essentially your asking him to play like Donovan Mitchell

So you want to compare frank and rubio or rondo just because he want to pass in first ? So compare they moves, frank have it, not the two others... Rondo shoot the 3 in his career ? rubio too ? frank can like a rookie... They are lot of différences between be hesitant and have no shoot... Frank is a true PG like they are trained in Europe ( teodisic are the same profil in offense, just more polished to score but most of Pg in Europe have this profile because they are trained like that), he have all Fundamentals learned in Europe for a PG, the PG who score in Europe are use in SG position... European BB is more traditionnal than US BB, Combo who can score in europe are not use in Pg, not the US mentality so just remember that.

Mitchell is a first scorer, so two differents profiles. Maybe he is more a avery Bradley profile with good offense and it's good for Jazz but they are a lottery team now...

And you can't see the difference between a Nash and Marbury or a Billups and Rose ?

Once again we take a guy for our need. Michell is very good and have big potential like maybe 8-10 others players in this draft.
Be happy to have one of this guy and be patient.

It just incredible to see a lot of impatience in part of fanbase while we have been bad for years and now we can really rebuilt a solid team, they are impatience and lots of topics created after every goods perfs of a rookie just to clashed Pj or / and Frank.

Look, I don't really care about what is traditional in Europe, it means absolutely nothing when talking about the NBA. It's irrelevant. So if your assessment of a what a PG is and isn't stems from European standards, then this argument can just end right there because it means nothing in regards to a discussion about the NBA. The best PG's in the NBA would not be considered "traditional" or "true PG's" by these European standards (which are actually outdated NBA standards) . Also, please don't tell me to be patient, you got the wrong one here since I've been preaching patience with Frank from the very beginning. This has nothing to do with patience, I addressed you on a specific claim you made about who is a "true PG" so stick to that subject.

I think you 2 agree. Just seems like a language barrier. It was difficult reading his post but, I thought he was saying that Frank is NOT a "true" PG in the sense of Rondo/Rubio because he can shoot and score but, he's trained in Europe which is old school NBA PG basically. Which is completely relevant.

IDK...That's what I get out of it.

[Mecca]

here's a real post from me, playing the coulda woulda shoulda game is dumb af.

truth is, none of the pg's in this draft have been impressive. dsj and mitchell are scoring a lot on low efficiency and free reign on the offense to do whatever they want. ball is what i knew what he'd be, monk is garbage, fox is struggling, and dsj is showing the world why he's a gutless coward loser.

frank also is part of this underwhelming guard draft class, he's shown nothing so far other than playing defense and passing the ball to o'quinn because he's afraid to shoot the ball. the thing with frank though that the other guard don't have is the the 'project' title. frank wasn't drafted to contribute now or even next year, frank was always high upside pick.

does that mean frank will be good? no

this draft class is starting to look overrated, nobody has separated themselves from the rest of the pack ... and that's scary.

It was more of a depth class then a star draft in hindsight. Jordan Bell in round 1, Kuzma the tail end of round 1.. to a lesser extent Allen at 22 to the Nets and OG do the Raps all look good.

But yeah, even Fox hit a brick wall. Rookie PG's usually take a year to get acclimated so patience is key.

[Triple C]

Daily remember you don't have to hate o trash every other rookies to show your love for Frank, and don't make a thread for every great game of kids we passed up in the draft

[Dr. Detfink]

I mean, is Donovan Mitchell a good player? Yes.

He's a very talented guard with a nice scoring touch.

Is he that "Je ne sais quoi" player? No.

Watched him live at MSG against the Knicks. Jarret Jack & Lee were perfectly fine allowing Rubio and Mithcell to score at will vs get his teammates involved. It was his teammate SG Rodney Hood who came off the bench, slit the throat of a chicken and became the Kurse collapsing the D and causing chaos on the court.

[nyk2017]

I don't see how we are going to ever look good with Frank. He may become serviceable, but does not have the superstar potential of Mitchell of Smith jr.

[Kurt Rambis]

I don't buy any negative story about Phil Jackson. People love to hate and media creates enemies to sell garbage.

It will take years before Frank development. Take look at Aaron Gordon.. one of those players who started as energy player and now turning into allstar talent in his 4th year.

Not everybody has Lebron,Shaq,Simmons,Drummond body to dominate at first year.

Take it easy with Jackson hating... take a look at OKC. Phil Jackson has been proven right. People calling even great Sam Presti got fleeced now trading Kanter & McBuckets. Melo is poison pill for anyone...and we made him the franchise here

[camillepd]

Yup, Prestige got taken on the Melo trade.

[Clyde_Style]

Frank Ntilikina is 19 years old. It hurts me this board isn't smarter but I know deep inside if we had Kobe, Greek freak, or Dirk here during their rookie years most would be giving up on them and looking to trade them. Not that I'm saying Frank will be that good but it's to illustrate a point

bunch of crackheads looking for their next fix

[HarthorneWingo]

I'm just gonna address the first part about the "true PG". Jazz actually play better when Rubio is on the bench and Mitchell is running the show. Last night was a good example, Mitchell brought the team back from double digit deficit and not only was he scoring but he was finding guys in transition with sweet dimes. He goes to the bench to get rest and Rubio (a true PG) replaces him and the Jazz lose the lead. Mitchell comes back and Rubio is benched and he brings his team back and they win the game. Mitchell is not some chucker, he's a play maker who's more than capable of running PG on the NBA level. Just because a guy has scoring ability doesn't mean he can't be a PG or considered a "true PG". What is a true PG in the modern NBA anyway? Rondo? Rubio? These guys have so many flaws on offense that it actually hurts their teams more than some people think. Also, if Frank is a "true PG" then people need to stop complaining about his lack of aggression, asking him to shoot more, attack the basket more, etc. because essentially your asking him to play like Donovan Mitchell

So you want to compare frank and rubio or rondo just because he want to pass in first ? So compare they moves, frank have it, not the two others... Rondo shoot the 3 in his career ? rubio too ? frank can like a rookie... They are lot of différences between be hesitant and have no shoot... Frank is a true PG like they are trained in Europe ( teodisic are the same profil in offense, just more polished to score but most of Pg in Europe have this profile because they are trained like that), he have all Fundamentals learned in Europe for a PG, the PG who score in Europe are use in SG position... European BB is more traditionnal than US BB, Combo who can score in europe are not use in Pg, not the US mentality so just remember that.

Mitchell is a first scorer, so two differents profiles. Maybe he is more a avery Bradley profile with good offense and it's good for Jazz but they are a lottery team now...

And you can't see the difference between a Nash and Marbury or a Billups and Rose ?

Once again we take a guy for our need. Michell is very good and have big potential like maybe 8-10 others players in this draft.
Be happy to have one of this guy and be patient.

It just incredible to see a lot of impatience in part of fanbase while we have been bad for years and now we can really rebuilt a solid team, they are impatience and lots of topics created after every goods perfs of a rookie just to clashed Pj or / and Frank.

Look, I don't really care about what is traditional in Europe, it means absolutely nothing when talking about the NBA. It's irrelevant. So if your assessment of a what a PG is and isn't stems from European standards, then this argument can just end right there because it means nothing in regards to a discussion about the NBA. The best PG's in the NBA would not be considered "traditional" or "true PG's" by these European standards (which are actually outdated NBA standards) . Also, please don't tell me to be patient, you got the wrong one here since I've been preaching patience with Frank from the very beginning. This has nothing to do with patience, I addressed you on a specific claim you made about who is a "true PG" so stick to that subject.

I think you're missing his point.