Is Center really the best position for John Collins?

[jayu70]

Miles Plumlee started at center in place of Dwayne Dedmon, as he has every game except one (at Cleveland).

Budenholzer said Plumlee would be the default starter until Dedmon returns, certain matchups notwithstanding. Plumlee played 23 productive and efficient minutes against the Heat: six points on five shots, four rebounds, two assists, one block, two turnovers. Two of Plumlee’ three field goals came on lob dunks.

myAJC


Does this mean that Collins is no longer being forced to play all his minutes at Center?

Or that Budenholzer is still trying to keep Collins out of the starting lineup at all costs?

Or just another part of the tank?

Yes

[Ball4life32]

And if we get Bagley?

Twin powers (forwards)?

I dunno, personally I would love a frontcourt of Prince/Bagley/Collins...specially with small ball in play.

That looks fun and will get some wins, but when youget to the better teams and the intensity goes up, those guys would get dominated in the post. Need a starting CENTER to make sure teams can't take over the basket zone. Bring in the small ball at key moments, but got to have a big guy.

Since Dedmon went down, games have been getting close to blow-out level.

We saw the same thing with Sap / Horf, looked good until it got shut down at the end of every season.

Bagley does have 3 inches on Sap. Ayton/Collins worries me because I think it will clog the paint. Power Forwards these days need to be able to pass and handle the ball and I’m not sure if Collins will ever do that effectively. I do think Collins will develop into a very good mid range/3 point shooter though.

[HMFFL]

John Collins is a power forward. I like him receiving experience at both the 4 and 5, but I prefer him to have his role established next season as our set 4, and we focus on finding talent to fill the holes at other positions.
It gets old being a Hawks fan and having undersized talent playing at the 5 when they need to be at the 4.

[Nathan2331]

Twin powers (forwards)?

I dunno, personally I would love a frontcourt of Prince/Bagley/Collins...specially with small ball in play.

That looks fun and will get some wins, but when youget to the better teams and the intensity goes up, those guys would get dominated in the post. Need a starting CENTER to make sure teams can't take over the basket zone. Bring in the small ball at key moments, but got to have a big guy.

Since Dedmon went down, games have been getting close to blow-out level.

We saw the same thing with Sap / Horf, looked good until it got shut down at the end of every season.

Bagley does have 3 inches on Sap. Ayton/Collins worries me because I think it will clog the paint. Power Forwards these days need to be able to pass and handle the ball and I’m not sure if Collins will ever do that effectively. I do think Collins will develop into a very good mid range/3 point shooter though.

Ayton plays like his name is Ryan Anderson half the time, so he's comfortable operating outside the paint. Schroder however needs to improve his jump shot so he can also provide spacing.

[ATL Boy]

That looks fun and will get some wins, but when youget to the better teams and the intensity goes up, those guys would get dominated in the post. Need a starting CENTER to make sure teams can't take over the basket zone. Bring in the small ball at key moments, but got to have a big guy.

Since Dedmon went down, games have been getting close to blow-out level.

We saw the same thing with Sap / Horf, looked good until it got shut down at the end of every season.

Bagley does have 3 inches on Sap. Ayton/Collins worries me because I think it will clog the paint. Power Forwards these days need to be able to pass and handle the ball and I’m not sure if Collins will ever do that effectively. I do think Collins will develop into a very good mid range/3 point shooter though.

Ayton plays like his name is Ryan Anderson half the time, so he's comfortable operating outside the paint. Schroder however needs to improve his jump shot so he can also provide spacing.

Schroder might be on his way out the door sooner or later, especially if he continues struggling with that 3 pointer.

[tbhawksfan1]

Bagley does have 3 inches on Sap. Ayton/Collins worries me because I think it will clog the paint. Power Forwards these days need to be able to pass and handle the ball and I’m not sure if Collins will ever do that effectively. I do think Collins will develop into a very good mid range/3 point shooter though.

Ayton plays like his name is Ryan Anderson half the time, so he's comfortable operating outside the paint. Schroder however needs to improve his jump shot so he can also provide spacing.

Schroder might be on his way out the door sooner or later, especially if he continues struggling with that 3 pointer.

I would like for Schro to become Bud's and the Hawks PG going forward. i'm starting to lran toxards moving him. He needs a team that is contending and has leaders.

If he isn't our PG of the future, then he is a great trade for the rebuild

[Jamaaliver]

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[jayu70]

One of the talking points from his college days were his defense or lack thereof and also his assists. Where does he stand now?
I love that he's no longer the foul master.
Whatever he and the staff did to curtail his defensive foul rate, kudos. I see less reaching, more feet movement, employing the vertically defense, his PnR defense has been solid enough.

[Jamaaliver]

A takeaway from the Suns/Hawks matchup:

John Collins didn’t get many chances on screen-rolls and had just five rebounds in 20 minutes. The Suns did a good job getting bodies on him when shots went up so he couldn’t get boards with his usual quick jumps. Coach Mike Budenholzer went with Plumlee (27 minutes) instead of Collins down the stretch.

I expect we'll see more teams take this approach to limit damage by Collins. I'm honestly surprised it took this long.

[tbhawksfan1]

Collins really needs to develop a mid-range and at least a little dribble. Teams can and will cut him off from the hoop. he has to have something else. Too small for C. Really needs to develop as PF

Is he a starter in the future? PF or C? Will he be an NBA average or better starter?

He's gotten by on pure athleticism. Really needs to develop offensive skills and define his position. Better be PF because he'll never be a C physically.

Very happy with the non-lott pick, but we need to be careful automatically seeing him as a future starter. So far, he looks like an energy back up.

[tbhawksfan1]

So, Collins is a C. Let's compare him to our possible #1 selection Ayton at C.....eh, no. Ayton is a foot longer, 30 lbs heavier and has inside and pop game that Collins will unlikely be able to develop. On D, no comp.

It is going to be very nice bringing in a couple of top of the draft talents the next two drafts.

[ATL Boy]

I agree with the notion that he needs to add a consistent jumper to add another layer to his offensive game.

I think the worst case scenario for Collins is becoming something like an Anderson Varejao type (without the injuries hopefully) when he was averaging 13 rebounds a game for the Cavs a few years ago. I'm not saying that John will ever bring down that many boards but like Varejao he constantly works on the glass and he doesn't really need to have plays draw a up for him to get buckets.


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[tbhawksfan1]

I agree with the notion that he needs to add a consistent jumper to add another layer to his offensive game.

I think the worst case scenario for Collins is becoming something like an Anderson Varejao type (without the injuries hopefully) when he was averaging 13 rebounds a game for the Cavs a few years ago. I'm not saying that John will ever bring down that many boards but like Varejao he constantly works on the glass and he doesn't really need to have plays draw a up for him to get buckets.


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Where does that put his ceiling? He really needs to progress offensively. Hawks are going to need a lot of present and future youth to develop. Prince and Collins look like possible average starter potential. Schro has only shown that he's an average starter so far.

It's going to have to come from the draft. We need a lot of lott pick next two years