Official Trade Thread -- Part XXXIV

[payitforward]

I agree with you that Favors is a significant upgrade over Gortat. However, there's no reason to think Favors will re-sign with us. So we could end up with nothing and lose the pick!

That's a legitimate concern, and if you don't think you can resign him then there is no way you should do the trade. That being said I don't think it's likely that another team signs him for whatever that is worth.

But... but... but... how does that make the trade more attractive?

If no other team is going to sign him, why ever would we give up a R1 pick to acquire him? Why not just sign him in the off season when no other team will be competing for his services?

[deneem4]

Its time for us to deal for cousins...

Say what you want about him but he fills our biggest weakness

A big man that can score in the post and out to open up lanes for wall and beal...draw fouls at a high rate..and rebound the basketball effectively...

Hes not a winner but he hasnt played with winners on our level...

Getting cousins is an instant ecf visit and theres no way the cavs can stop wall beal and cousins...

Use him with the bench along with beal while walla nd porter rest...

Let them 2 jackup shots for 10 mins a game and pray for the best.

But we cant ignore that cousins on that cousins on the wizards...is the best piece for our core not named lebron durant draymond giannas or porzingis...

[babyjax13]

I agree with you that Favors is a significant upgrade over Gortat. However, there's no reason to think Favors will re-sign with us. So we could end up with nothing and lose the pick!

That's a legitimate concern, and if you don't think you can resign him then there is no way you should do the trade. That being said I don't think it's likely that another team signs him for whatever that is worth.

But... but... but... how does that make the trade more attractive?

If no other team is going to sign him, why ever would we give up a R1 pick to acquire him? Why not just sign him in the off season when no other team will be competing for his services?

You have no cap space. People will be interested, but why would he sign with a bad team when he could stay with a good one where he fits? I get that you aren't interested, but you are being purposely dense.

[dckingsfan]

...Hes not a winner...

Agreed - after watching him dog it on D against us - don't want to see him on the Wizards...

[deneem4]

...Hes not a winner...

Agreed - after watching him dog it on D against us - don't want to see him on the Wizards...

I watch gortat dog it up on d alot...with zero offensive output

[gravytrain24]

People talk about getting boogie, what about Marc Gasol. Not a locker room problem, playoff tested, offensive game and maybe more capable of acquiring due to Memphis' season.

[dckingsfan]

...Hes not a winner...

Agreed - after watching him dog it on D against us - don't want to see him on the Wizards...

I watch gortat dog it up on d alot...with zero offensive output

Okay, that would be an argument to get rid of Gortat...

[bsilver]

Its time for us to deal for cousins...

Say what you want about him but he fills our biggest weakness

A big man that can score in the post and out to open up lanes for wall and beal...draw fouls at a high rate..and rebound the basketball effectively...

Hes not a winner but he hasnt played with winners on our level...

Getting cousins is an instant ecf visit and theres no way the cavs can stop wall beal and cousins...

Use him with the bench along with beal while walla nd porter rest...

Let them 2 jackup shots for 10 mins a game and pray for the best.

But we cant ignore that cousins on that cousins on the wizards...is the best piece for our core not named lebron durant draymond giannas or porzingis...

There's no deal that New Orleans would accept that doesn't include Beal or Porter. Maybe Oubre and 1st or just Oubre if NO gets desperate. But even if it doesn't include Beal/Porter, then we have four max contracts with a zillion $ luxury tax. (I assume this is within the rules)

I'd give up Beal or Porter if signing Cousins was a sure thing. He's the only player we could realistically get that could get us to the next level. The current team is going nowhere. We're 2nd tier, and will be for a while. Cousins has his faults and may not be the answer, but between having no chance, and some hope, I'd roll the dice.

[NatP4]

People talk about getting boogie, what about Marc Gasol. Not a locker room problem, playoff tested, offensive game and maybe more capable of acquiring due to Memphis' season.

Because Marc Gasol is terrible

[pcbothwel]

People talk about getting boogie, what about Marc Gasol. Not a locker room problem, playoff tested, offensive game and maybe more capable of acquiring due to Memphis' season.

Because Marc Gasol is terrible

Not quite terrible, but still agree. Offensively, I think he bounces back as it looks like his mid range game is the only thing down. He is converting at the basket and from 3...
That said, he has really fallen off from the elite defensive player he was 4-5 years ago. He has always been a below average athlete, but now age has caught him and he looks DONE.

[NatP4]

People talk about getting boogie, what about Marc Gasol. Not a locker room problem, playoff tested, offensive game and maybe more capable of acquiring due to Memphis' season.

Because Marc Gasol is terrible

Not quite terrible, but still agree. Offensively, I think he bounces back as it looks like his mid range game is the only thing down. He is converting at the basket and from 3...
That said, he has really fallen off from the elite defensive player he was 4-5 years ago. He has always been a below average athlete, but now age has caught him and he looks DONE.

Thought he would age better than he has. Would’ve been a great addition to this team 4 years ago

[deneem4]

Its time for us to deal for cousins...

Say what you want about him but he fills our biggest weakness

A big man that can score in the post and out to open up lanes for wall and beal...draw fouls at a high rate..and rebound the basketball effectively...

Hes not a winner but he hasnt played with winners on our level...

Getting cousins is an instant ecf visit and theres no way the cavs can stop wall beal and cousins...

Use him with the bench along with beal while walla nd porter rest...

Let them 2 jackup shots for 10 mins a game and pray for the best.

But we cant ignore that cousins on that cousins on the wizards...is the best piece for our core not named lebron durant draymond giannas or porzingis...

There's no deal that New Orleans would accept that doesn't include Beal or Porter. Maybe Oubre and 1st or just Oubre if NO gets desperate. But even if it doesn't include Beal/Porter, then we have four max contracts with a zillion $ luxury tax. (I assume this is within the rules)

I'd give up Beal or Porter if signing Cousins was a sure thing. He's the only player we could realistically get that could get us to the next level. The current team is going nowhere. We're 2nd tier, and will be for a while. Cousins has his faults and may not be the answer, but between having no chance, and some hope, I'd roll the dice.

I would be hesistant to trade beal but porter straight up n il be upset but il do...

We have to keep beal though...remember we skipped on harden to keep beal

[deneem4]

Gsw and hou..the only team with a backcourt better than ours

Wall beal cousins will be the best 3 in the east...

[bsilver]

That's a legitimate concern, and if you don't think you can resign him then there is no way you should do the trade. That being said I don't think it's likely that another team signs him for whatever that is worth.

But... but... but... how does that make the trade more attractive?

If no other team is going to sign him, why ever would we give up a R1 pick to acquire him? Why not just sign him in the off season when no other team will be competing for his services?

You have no cap space. People will be interested, but why would he sign with a bad team when he could stay with a good one where he fits? I get that you aren't interested, but you are being purposely dense.

"purposely dense" Like that one. We could have a list of PIF descriptions.

[CntOutSmrtCrazy]

Its time for us to deal for cousins...

Say what you want about him but he fills our biggest weakness

A big man that can score in the post and out to open up lanes for wall and beal...draw fouls at a high rate..and rebound the basketball effectively...

Hes not a winner but he hasnt played with winners on our level...

Getting cousins is an instant ecf visit and theres no way the cavs can stop wall beal and cousins...

Use him with the bench along with beal while walla nd porter rest...

Let them 2 jackup shots for 10 mins a game and pray for the best.

But we cant ignore that cousins on that cousins on the wizards...is the best piece for our core not named lebron durant draymond giannas or porzingis...

There's no deal that New Orleans would accept that doesn't include Beal or Porter. Maybe Oubre and 1st or just Oubre if NO gets desperate. But even if it doesn't include Beal/Porter, then we have four max contracts with a zillion $ luxury tax. (I assume this is within the rules)

I'd give up Beal or Porter if signing Cousins was a sure thing. He's the only player we could realistically get that could get us to the next level. The current team is going nowhere. We're 2nd tier, and will be for a while. Cousins has his faults and may not be the answer, but between having no chance, and some hope, I'd roll the dice.

I’ve seen enough from Oubre that I could live with trading Porter. We need a young big in the worst way that I’d be willing to live with it but wouldn’t love it. A core of Wall, Beal, Oubre, and Cousins is a very tough team. Sprinkle in some Sato and some fillers and roll the dice.

[dckingsfan]

Its time for us to deal for cousins...

Say what you want about him but he fills our biggest weakness

A big man that can score in the post and out to open up lanes for wall and beal...draw fouls at a high rate..and rebound the basketball effectively...

Hes not a winner but he hasnt played with winners on our level...

Getting cousins is an instant ecf visit and theres no way the cavs can stop wall beal and cousins...

Use him with the bench along with beal while walla nd porter rest...

Let them 2 jackup shots for 10 mins a game and pray for the best.

But we cant ignore that cousins on that cousins on the wizards...is the best piece for our core not named lebron durant draymond giannas or porzingis...

There's no deal that New Orleans would accept that doesn't include Beal or Porter. Maybe Oubre and 1st or just Oubre if NO gets desperate. But even if it doesn't include Beal/Porter, then we have four max contracts with a zillion $ luxury tax. (I assume this is within the rules)

I'd give up Beal or Porter if signing Cousins was a sure thing. He's the only player we could realistically get that could get us to the next level. The current team is going nowhere. We're 2nd tier, and will be for a while. Cousins has his faults and may not be the answer, but between having no chance, and some hope, I'd roll the dice.

I’ve seen enough from Oubre that I could live with trading Porter. We need a young big in the worst way that I’d be willing to live with it but wouldn’t love it. A core of Wall, Beal, Oubre, and Cousins is a very tough team. Sprinkle in some Sato and some fillers and roll the dice.

Don't we have to wait a year to trade Porter - unless he consents?

[payitforward]

That's a legitimate concern, and if you don't think you can resign him then there is no way you should do the trade. That being said I don't think it's likely that another team signs him for whatever that is worth.

But... but... but... how does that make the trade more attractive?

If no other team is going to sign him, why ever would we give up a R1 pick to acquire him? Why not just sign him in the off season when no other team will be competing for his services?

You have no cap space. People will be interested, but why would he sign with a bad team when he could stay with a good one where he fits? I get that you aren't interested, but you are being purposely dense.

"Purposely" isn't a word -- I take it you mean "intentionally." But, it's not true. You are re-interpreting your own statement "I don't think... signs him..." to mean "once the Wizards were to acquire him." If you'd written that, then yes my response would have been dense.

But that's not what you wrote. In fact, you went on to share your list of teams & the reasons they wouldn't sign Favors next off-season -- a list & a set of reasons neither of which assumed his being a Wizard instead of on the jazz.

In fact, it's not that I'm not interested in Favors; it's that we can't afford to pay for the positive delta of his play over Gortat/Mahinmi at the cost of a R1 pick.

As you point out, we have no cap space (in fact we are in tax territory). The way to keep having no cap space is to trade away R1 picks. Every problem we have is caused by our having traded picks.

You're not a Wizards fan, so you may not be conscious of this, but out of the last 4.5 drafts (i.e. starting w/ R2 of 2013) we have exactly 1 player. Yet, rookie contracts are the only real bargain contracts in the league (except for the max contracts of true superstars like LeBron, KD, etc.), b/c they are on a schedule rather than being market driven.

If you have to pay market price for veterans it's not possible to build & sustain a good team (unless you have a particularly brilliant GM; we don't). The enormous salaries we have to pay Wall, Beal & Porter essentially negate the advantages they bring with excellent play. The reason is obvious: they force us to fill out the roster w/ mostly marginal players.

[dangermouse]

People talk about getting boogie, what about Marc Gasol. Not a locker room problem, playoff tested, offensive game and maybe more capable of acquiring due to Memphis' season.

It'd take attaching a first or Oubre to Mahinmi's contract + filler. It might even take both. Not worth it for someone age 31 with 3 more years left at like 25 million per.

[bsilver]

But... but... but... how does that make the trade more attractive?

If no other team is going to sign him, why ever would we give up a R1 pick to acquire him? Why not just sign him in the off season when no other team will be competing for his services?

You have no cap space. People will be interested, but why would he sign with a bad team when he could stay with a good one where he fits? I get that you aren't interested, but you are being purposely dense.

"Purposely" isn't a word -- I take it you mean "intentionally." But, it's not true. You are re-interpreting your own statement "I don't think... signs him..." to mean "once the Wizards were to acquire him." If you'd written that, then yes my response would have been dense.

But that's not what you wrote. In fact, you went on to share your list of teams & the reasons they wouldn't sign Favors next off-season -- a list & a set of reasons neither of which assumed his being a Wizard instead of on the jazz.

In fact, it's not that I'm not interested in Favors; it's that we can't afford to pay for the positive delta of his play over Gortat/Mahinmi at the cost of a R1 pick.

As you point out, we have no cap space (in fact we are in tax territory). The way to keep having no cap space is to trade away R1 picks. Every problem we have is caused by our having traded picks.

You're not a Wizards fan, so you may not be conscious of this, but out of the last 4.5 drafts (i.e. starting w/ R2 of 2013) we have exactly 1 player. Yet, rookie contracts are the only real bargain contracts in the league (except for the max contracts of true superstars like LeBron, KD, etc.), b/c they are on a schedule rather than being market driven.

If you have to pay market price for veterans it's not possible to build & sustain a good team (unless you have a particularly brilliant GM; we don't). The enormous salaries we have to pay Wall, Beal & Porter essentially negate the advantages they bring with excellent play. The reason is obvious: they force us to fill out the roster w/ mostly marginal players.

You've purposefully and purposely managed to state incorrectly that purposely isn't a word in order to demean another poster. Not a good way to make a point.

[payitforward]

You have no cap space. People will be interested, but why would he sign with a bad team when he could stay with a good one where he fits? I get that you aren't interested, but you are being purposely dense.

"Purposely" isn't a word -- I take it you mean "intentionally." But, it's not true. You are re-interpreting your own statement "I don't think... signs him..." to mean "once the Wizards were to acquire him." If you'd written that, then yes my response would have been dense.

But that's not what you wrote. In fact, you went on to share your list of teams & the reasons they wouldn't sign Favors next off-season -- a list & a set of reasons neither of which assumed his being a Wizard instead of on the jazz.

In fact, it's not that I'm not interested in Favors; it's that we can't afford to pay for the positive delta of his play over Gortat/Mahinmi at the cost of a R1 pick.

As you point out, we have no cap space (in fact we are in tax territory). The way to keep having no cap space is to trade away R1 picks. Every problem we have is caused by our having traded picks.

You're not a Wizards fan, so you may not be conscious of this, but out of the last 4.5 drafts (i.e. starting w/ R2 of 2013) we have exactly 1 player. Yet, rookie contracts are the only real bargain contracts in the league (except for the max contracts of true superstars like LeBron, KD, etc.), b/c they are on a schedule rather than being market driven.

If you have to pay market price for veterans it's not possible to build & sustain a good team (unless you have a particularly brilliant GM; we don't). The enormous salaries we have to pay Wall, Beal & Porter essentially negate the advantages they bring with excellent play. The reason is obvious: they force us to fill out the roster w/ mostly marginal players.

You've purposefully and purposely managed to state incorrectly that purposely isn't a word in order to demean another poster. Not a good way to make a point.

You are so right, & I was so wrong! Where is that babyjax guy? Hey, babyjax, my apologies!

Moreover, this --

The enormous salaries we have to pay Wall, Beal & Porter essentially negate the advantages they bring with excellent play. The reason is obvious: they force us to fill out the roster w/ mostly marginal players.

is an overstatement as well. The high salaries negate some of the advantages of terrific players, but obviously not all of them.

Thanks b -- & Happy New Year everyone!